Alpha 19 Dev Diary

[Laz Man]

21 minutes ago, Perlin_Worm said:

The Blunderbuss and it’s generic gunpowder ammo are perfect as implemented in a19. Props! Why do we need yet another tier of firearms with these pipe guns? What gap does it fill? 
 

Early level is mostly about melee and it is refreshing. IMO, don’t mess with a winning formula.

 

Increasing more tiers and expanding the loot tables will put the game in the position where many will desire to start a new map before ever seeing the highest tier weapons.

There not increasing tiers, just fleshing out t0.  I feel that the blunderbuss made a huge comeback in A19.  The only problem is it's the players only ranged option in that tier aside from the prim bow.

 

They are also going to improve the t0 experience with more ranged variety and unifying ammo.

 

Its alot better then leaving it alone the way it is or removing it entirely....

[Jugginator]

4 minutes ago, Khalagar said:

You could drop a hippo or elephant dead in it's tracks with a good shot though.

Considering the largest recorded animal kill (single shot) was a grizzly bear I think you're exaggerating a little bit lol. An elephant was reported killed by one, but it took several shots. But yeah, the point Joel's making is if we add all this extra "flavor" gunnery into the game with different ammo types, not only does that add clutter to the game (more memory etc.), but it hogs up loot tables too.

[Blake_]

2 hours ago, madmole said:

We want to add a loot progression speed, so if you want it to take months to reach t3 and have extended primitive stage you can do that, independent of zombie game stage.

Special infected will spice it up too.

Tank zombies

Do "special infected" include the spider, cop, demolisher and screamer zds ?

 

Will they be the only type of zd to  drop legendary stuff like the "star" enemies in Fallout 4? 

 

I like the "pipe" stuff idea. I am not concerned about balance if you are the one doing it. 

[pregnable]

1 hour ago, madmole said:

Ahh but you will, 7 Days 2 my friend.

 

You still thinking about getting rid of the destructible ground?

 

Sounded like a good idea for the second game cause few people would honestly miss it and it would make it more pvp friendly along with the other gains. 

[Yopo]

From the pipe gun list MM put out 

.44 ammo pipe weapon was missing. 

Currently only two weapons use it. 

Magnum and vulture. 

Thinking a single shot pipe cannon 

that uses .44 could have potential 

as I imagine the pipe pistol could be 

a 1-5 shot or 1-3 shot. Something like that. It’s 9mm so wouldn’t be as deadly as one shot from a .44 mag round. 

 

Btw. Just gonna put this out there. 

The magnum revolver is personally my favorite weapon in game. Still favoring it over the vulture.  Glad to see it got a sweet update to it reload animate. Really sick looking (a good thing) should only be done in a game. You should never do that IRL 

 

[Khalagar]

20 minutes ago, Jugginator said:

Considering the largest recorded animal kill (single shot) was a grizzly bear I think you're exaggerating a little bit lol. An elephant was reported killed by one, but it took several shots.

 

Just depends on shot placement. An eye shot or shot to the heart would absolutely drop one. The one killed by 22lr was shot 4 iirc times but it doesn't mean a single well placed shot wouldn't have done it, it was just poachers being cruel and shooting it a few times before it died

 

 

There's a .22lr piercing through 20 layers of denim + a phonebook easily, even the 40 layers of denim didn't stop it punching right through the phonebook. Elephant hide is fairly thick, but it's not *that* thick it's less than inch usually even in the thickest spots. They aren't magic lol, they are just biological animals and the laws of physics are very hard to ignore. Depending on where you hit it, the elephant would definitely drop on the spot

 

I mean, I don't really think they should be added either, they'd either be OP as crap if they were accurate or totally useless if they weren't accurate to real life. I just don't like the dangerous mentality people have that .22lr are just bb guns lol. You could do a LOT of damage really quickly with a .22lr even at long range

[Thecolours]

1 hour ago, madmole said:

Ahh but you will, 7 Days 2 my friend.

7 Days 2 using same engine or unreal engine? 

[Perlin_Worm]

18 minutes ago, Laz Man said:

There not increasing tiers, just fleshing out t0.  I feel that the blunderbuss made a huge comeback in A19.  The only problem is it's the players only ranged option in that tier aside from the prim bow.

 

They are also going to improve the t0 experience with more ranged variety and unifying ammo.

 

Its alot better then leaving it alone the way it is or removing it entirely....

I get what you are saying about simply rounding out T0, but isn’t this going to put us back in the predicament where we are swimming g in guns on day 1? Isn’t this going to put bows in a bad way yet again early on? 
 

I felt the blunderbuss an bows were in good place as early ranged weapons and enjoyed being mostly reliant on melee for the first few days. It was different and a rewarding challenge.

[Adam the Waster]

40 minutes ago, MechanicalLens said:

Blueberry bushes got an... erm... upgrade? 🤔

 

you want terminators? because this is how you get terminators!  

28 minutes ago, Jugginator said:

 An elephant was reported killed by one, but it took several shots. 

i mean! poor poachers in Africa used makeshift guns that would make pipe guns from fallout look like factory made goods! and cavemen killed mammoths with Sharp sticks, rocks and clubs! 

 

 

Moral of the story: elephants are weak!    

[hiemfire]

24 minutes ago, Khalagar said:

 

Just depends on shot placement. An eye shot or shot to the heart would absolutely drop one

.... Bull. The density of the bone between the eye and the brain is thick enough to stop a .22 lr and there is allot more than just hide between the heart and the surface of the chest. Are you sure you aren't conflating .22 mag (rimfire or centerfire) with .22 lr?

 

25 minutes ago, Khalagar said:

I just don't like the dangerous mentality people have that .22lr are just bb guns lol. You could do a LOT of damage really quickly with a .22lr even at long range

Fair. They aren't just like bb guns and MM didn't say they were.

[JordanHameski]

from patch to patch i got the same situation, late game stage zombies too weak.

 

What if zombies HP and damage increased with game stage?

 

e.g.

Stage - HP | Damage

Player is under 5 level - 100% | 100%

First GS - 125% | 100%

Second GS - 150% | 175%

Third GS - 175% | 350%

Fourth GS - 200% | 500%

[Nugetti]

5 minutes ago, Adam the Waster said:

you want terminators? because this is how you get terminators!  

Poor T-1000, such blue balls.

Jokes aside, I'm experiencing the same with the blueberry bushes. Games4Kickz had black blueberry bushes on one of his YT videos.

[Onarr]

2 hours ago, Kosmic Kerman said:

The Devs have already discussed this. It's unlikely to change. Also "kills immersion" is an overused argument that I imagine most Devs completely tune out.

 

 

 

Yeah but try to use this argument when you want to kill a bear. Oh it will come to you, no problem. Well thats the thing I would like to avoid you know? And as Str guy I do not have much ranged options.

[MechanicalLens]

2 minutes ago, Onarr said:

Yeah but try to use this argument when you want to kill a bear. Oh it will come to you, no problem. Well thats the thing I would like to avoid you know? And as Str guy I do not have much ranged options.

You'll be fine.

 

[JordanHameski]

And for some reasons, critical hits too OP for my opinion

Max critical chance might be 7.5 or 10%

 

Blow up zombies flesh it's cool, but this ability looking better on close range weapons, like knife, machete, shovel (yeah! it's OP weapon!), or steel knuckles

[meganoth]

 

3 minutes ago, Onarr said:

Yeah but try to use this argument when you want to kill a bear. Oh it will come to you, no problem. Well thats the thing I would like to avoid you know? And as Str guy I do not have much ranged options.

 

Is there anything more pathetic than a STR player complaining about his weak shotgun? 😆

[Onarr]

1 minute ago, MechanicalLens said:

You'll be fine.

 

 

yeah ill be fine with Q6 combat shotgun 200HP and kickass armor. The shotgun doing no damage on range is stupid. Why not use falloff damage for it instead? 5m full dmg, 5-10m 75% dmg 10-15 50% dmg

1 minute ago, meganoth said:

 

 

Is there anything more pathetic than a STR player complaining about his weak shotgun? 😆

I almost never use my shotgun. Only for instances when I need to kill something from range. Even large lvl 5 PoI room I go in melee with moonshine. Thats why I was so suprised I spent almost half my ammo on trying to kill Princess from top of the hole. Like WTF? Until now I never realized I did no dmg at all. I just though they buffed her HP.

[MechanicalLens]

4 minutes ago, Onarr said:

yeah ill be fine with Q6 combat shotgun 200HP and kickass armor. The shotgun doing no damage on range is stupid. Why not use falloff damage for it instead? 5m full dmg, 5-10m 75% dmg 10-15 50% dmg

Once you put points into the shotgun perk you'll be decapitating their heads a good portion of the time. I've hunted bears in A19 before with a level 2 or 3 pump shotgun (and on foot), about 130 health, and with subpar armor, and even with only 3 points into Shotgun Messiah I was taking off their heads about one in every five shots.

 

Honestly, if shotguns had more range, they'd just outclass every other gun. If you're so worried about bears, carry a sniper rifle or a marksman rifle with you. Even unperked they can take down bears with ease, since you're at a distance. Keep it in your vehicle exclusively for hunting; that's what I always do as a shotgun build, since the pellets end up eviscerating the carcass anyway.

[meganoth]

14 minutes ago, Onarr said:

 

I almost never use my shotgun. Only for instances when I need to kill something from range. Even large lvl 5 PoI room I go in melee with moonshine. Thats why I was so suprised I spent almost half my ammo on trying to kill Princess from top of the hole. Like WTF? Until now I never realized I did no dmg at all. I just though they buffed her HP.

 

I think all NPCs in the game have telltale signs they are getting hit. The absence of those signs should have been a hint.

 

[Yopo]

2 minutes ago, MechanicalLens said:

Once you put points into the shotgun perk you'll be decapitating their heads a good portion of the time. I've hunted bears in A19 before with a level 2 or 3 pump shotgun (and on foot), about 130 health, and with subpar armor, and even with only 3 points into Shotgun Messiah I was taking off their heads about one in every five shots.

 

Honestly, if shotguns had more range, they'd just outclass every other gun. If you're so worried about bears, carry a sniper rifle or a marksman rifle with you. Even unperked they can take down bears with ease, since you're at a distance. Keep it in your vehicle exclusively for hunting; that's what I always do as a shotgun build, since the pellets end up eviscerating the carcass anyway.

Personally I believe shotgun are way OP in this game and have a bit too much range. But that just my opinion. 

Ill still use it if it fits a build I’m doing but if I’m building something else it (which I usually am) the shotgun won’t be used. And I do just fine without it. 

[MechanicalLens]

Just now, Yopo said:

Personally I believe shotgun are way OP in this game and have a bit too much range. But that just my opinion. 

Ill still use it if it fits a build I’m doing but if I’m building something else it (which I usually am) the shotgun won’t be used. And I do just fine without it. 

I think the current range is fine, that being 4-5 blocks for maximum effectiveness. I'm pretty sure the auto shotty has less range than the pump, but I could be incorrect about that.

[Khalagar]

33 minutes ago, hiemfire said:

Bull. The density of the bone between the eye and the brain is thick enough to stop a .22 lr and there is allot more than just hide between the heart and the surface of the chest. Are you sure you aren't conflating .22 mag (rimfire or centerfire) with .22 lr?

 

Elephant skulls are just like basically all skulls, they are thin behind the eyes and by the ears.  A .22lr can punch through the thin part of a skull

 

And no, all videos I linked are .22lr.  .22lr can punch through steel, cast iron, wood, denim, car doors, flesh etc way, way better than people seem to think, just google ".22lr Penetration test" and you'll find hundreds of videos of people shooting just about anything you can think of with a .22

 

People are probably getting tired of off topic posts about elephants though.

 

 

[Vechs]

The issue is that the IRL weakness of the shotgun isn't really an issue in 7 Days to Die -- namely, the weight and bulk of shotgun ammunition, and the fact of reloading the pump shotgun goes way too quickly because they don't simulate the tube, it's always just an animation of loading only 2 rounds and you're fully topped off.

 

So if you're not hindered by the weight and bulk of the ammo, and you reload it basically instantly compared to IRL, of course the shotgun is going to be god tier.

 

There is a reason a lot of guys when pressed would take something like an Remington 870 or Mossberg 590 in those "If you only had 1 gun" videos.

 

But it's incredibly jarring to shoot at a zombie and have nothing happen at all because he's just barely beyond some arbitrary range limit.  And not only is there a limit but it's also hard to tell when a zombie is within that limit or not.  I'd be satisfied with damage fall off, and I understand that a realistic simulation of a shotgun would indeed make it the best weapon in almost every videogame, because almost every videogame fight happens within 100 feet unless you're playing ARMA or something.

[meganoth]

On the other hand damage fall off means you never find out that you are shooting that gun at the wrong range and wasting ammo. The same happens now in melee, I'm never really sure I'm hitting the zombies correctly because a glancing hit does make them react too. Someone who doesn't know about glancing hits might get the impression that melee is totally useless because he needs 12 hits for a basic zombie, never realizing that most of his hits just make minimal damage.

 

[Darinth]

I get so much insight just into where the game is going by occasionally skimming through here for the dev posts.