Maynard69 Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 You didn't need to do ANY of that in A16 either. You could stay underground mining the ENTIRE time and level up your looting, armor, crafting, whatever you wanted. You got all the xp you wanted. You never had to go sit on a cactus or loot or do anything you don't want to. And you still don't. You still get xp and put it where you want. Gratz. What are you even talking about? Again, did you read? I have no mention of a16 or underground or any of this. Who cares if you could go underground? How exactly does that pertain to any of the points I made? Hint: It doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 Man, I feel dumb lol. I knew Darkness Falls was out.... now I'm curious of said rumor though lol All problems are solved. Ravenhearst is out for A17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HungryZombie Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 I watched a new player stream a few weeks ago and they seemed to be getting frustrated with so many zombies in random wilderness POI's and they said " it feels like a cheap fallout ripoff". I've never played fallout so I have nothing to compare it too but I found it funny because madmole mentioned at one point that he was heading in that direction. I always thought that 7 days had enough going for it on its own that it didn't need to be ripping off ideas from other games to make it "better". Maybe that's what doesn't sit well with people? That it feels like copy and paste from another game but it doesn't really seem to fit the theme? I don't think enemies inside a building is exclusive to Fallout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morloc Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 -Morloc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n2n1 Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 Because of the fact that A17 is such what it is - people even began to play my mod that was no one ever needed except me *************************** He might mean my shopping cart mod. ;-) !!! Great I've always thought about how to implement this in previous Alphas ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldranon Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 Everyone passed over one of the most interesting ideas I have read in a long time. I'm paraphrasing Roland: -Set your level before game start. -No experience gain, ever. -Go! This is a great idea! Most people will never be some super Rambo even after extensive combat. So this reflects your character's previous struggles in the apocalypse, reaching his max performance level and then trying to stay alive as long as possible. Yes, you'll do great in the beginning, but that wont last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 Can you post your thoughts on how the no xp PoC is going? I would be interested on what you think about it, and your conclusions so far. edit: be it a new thread or a pm. pls and ty. I played some last weekend but haven’t been able to play at all this past week. I hope to put some more time in today. I did make some changes. I changed all quests to grant a perk point instead of xp and then just went to getting 1 point a day if I didn’t die instead of progressing to 2 points per day. This change has felt favorable— almost like I’m getting some training from the trader in exchange for doing his task. Right now I have it set to tier one and two quests give 1 point, tier three and four give 2 points and tier five give 3 points. The challenge quests all give one point. I also changed the tutorial quest to give one point each for all eight tasks as well as the trader quest. So you start the game with 9 points to spend and then get one each day as long as you don’t die but can earn more for doing quests. Zero xp in the game means I only perform tasks that I want to do for the sole value that it gives me for my goals. Quests I do for training when I want something badly and don’t want to wait for the next morning. Zombies I avoid as often as I kill. There is no reason to go out of my way to kill them although I also upped the loot drop percentages to 8% 12% and 16% for regular, feral, radiated. Enough to get a yellow bag a bit more often but not enough to tempt me to go after zombies for the sake of farming. Gamestage is big problem. I need to figure out a way to increase my level so that GS doesn’t simply match the day I’m on.... I think I do like it enough to try learning about cvars so I can make the daily point gain be automatic instead of manuallly doing it using Royal’s daily quest object he made for me. (Thanks Royal). I think it has potential. I wouldn’t be against some accomplished modder taking my idea and making it their own.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldranon Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 I played some last weekend but haven’t been able to play at all this past week. I hope to put some more time in today. I did make some changes. I changed all quests to grant a perk point instead of xp and then just went to getting 1 point a day if I didn’t die instead of progressing to 2 points per day. This change has felt favorable— almost like I’m getting some training from the trader in exchange for doing his task. Right now I have it set to tier one and two quests give 1 point, tier three and four give 2 points and tier five give 3 points. The challenge quests all give one point. I also changed the tutorial quest to give one point each for all eight tasks as well as the trader quest. So you start the game with 9 points to spend and then get one each day as long as you don’t die but can earn more for doing quests. Zero xp in the game means I only perform tasks that I want to do for the sole value that it gives me for my goals. Quests I do for training when I want something badly and don’t want to wait for the next morning. Zombies I avoid as often as I kill. There is no reason to go out of my way to kill them although I also upped the loot drop percentages to 8% 12% and 16% for regular, feral, radiated. Enough to get a yellow bag a bit more often but not enough to tempt me to go after zombies for the sake of farming. Gamestage is big problem. I need to figure out a way to increase my level so that GS doesn’t simply match the day I’m on.... I think I do like it enough to try learning about cvars so I can make the daily point gain be automatic instead of manuallly doing it using Royal’s daily quest object he made for me. (Thanks Royal). I think it has potential. I wouldn’t be against some accomplished modded taking my idea and making it their own.... Ok, I didn't fully understand, but that way allows for some struggle in the early game too. Maybe make GS increment each day like GS = GS + day for example to indicate something is starting to get out of control where the player can do some mission to lower GS (I have no idea really, but I bet someone in the forums has good ideas on it). Edit: I like the natural way a person can then play the game without "having" to get exp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 I played some last weekend but haven’t been able to play at all this past week. I hope to put some more time in today. I did make some changes. I changed all quests to grant a perk point instead of xp and then just went to getting 1 point a day if I didn’t die instead of progressing to 2 points per day. This change has felt favorable— almost like I’m getting some training from the trader in exchange for doing his task. Right now I have it set to tier one and two quests give 1 point, tier three and four give 2 points and tier five give 3 points. The challenge quests all give one point. I also changed the tutorial quest to give one point each for all eight tasks as well as the trader quest. So you start the game with 9 points to spend and then get one each day as long as you don’t die but can earn more for doing quests. Zero xp in the game means I only perform tasks that I want to do for the sole value that it gives me for my goals. Quests I do for training when I want something badly and don’t want to wait for the next morning. Zombies I avoid as often as I kill. There is no reason to go out of my way to kill them although I also upped the loot drop percentages to 8% 12% and 16% for regular, feral, radiated. Enough to get a yellow bag a bit more often but not enough to tempt me to go after zombies for the sake of farming. Gamestage is big problem. I need to figure out a way to increase my level so that GS doesn’t simply match the day I’m on.... I think I do like it enough to try learning about cvars so I can make the daily point gain be automatic instead of manuallly doing it using Royal’s daily quest object he made for me. (Thanks Royal). I think it has potential. I wouldn’t be against some accomplished modder taking my idea and making it their own.... Cool. Yeah, I'm really keen on making a non xp driven mod. Just gathering ideas, on whats working or not, besides what ideas I already have on the list. I don't think I'll use the daily perk idea, but more event driven. Like: bm hordes and the like, get like 3-5 perks to distribute, or something similar. I am going to give the players a set amount of perks to be used up front, so they can build a starter class. Broken vehicles in gas stations/junk yards/autostore you need to repair on site. <- every town has at least one of these. mini bike will be the only one you can make at your base. ... might need to make a motorcycle business. NPC traders (just quest givers/ no loot to trade) can spawn in a prefab full of zeds. Save them and do their quest to get a perk. If you want to do more of their quest? better keep them safe. <- one of the ways I'm looking to keep perks flowing. Hopefully TFP will make traders able to be killed at some point, without needing to go a bit deeper. *based on looking through the xmls on things that still need to be hooked up: so probably won't be soon* just a few things I'm looking to do. I'm also getting rid of the radiated zeds.. I have no need for them, with what I have so far. Thanks for the rundown so far. Hopefully you can give us a running journey as you delve into it further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R0bb0b Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Disheartening to see there is no acknowledgement of the fact that a lot of players don't like the current perk system and there doesn't seem to be any plans to change them at all at this point or to at least see if the current system could be made better (not necessarily reversion to A16). Funny how they actually go as far as ridiculing those who are disappointed with it, as if, in they're own made up reality they are sitting on a gold mine, just people aren't aware of it yet. If they honestly want to know what is wrong with the game and why people are leaving, here's a thought, ask the people that are leaving already. This is not rocket science. This was my favorite game of all time, and I haven't played in about 2 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noompsie Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Sometimes in life you dont always get what you want. /endoflifelesson Cheers Ill answer your pointless comment with another pointless comment: Sometimes you have to fight for what you want. /endoflifelesson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noompsie Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 -Morloc I love that lol. I need it for my avitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingSlayerGM Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 The biggest problem with A17 is the perk system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaVegaNL Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 No it's performance. A17 is fine. It's mostly the same people complaining on here. That creates a bit of a bubble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prisma501 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Ill answer your pointless comment with another pointless comment: Sometimes you have to fight for what you want. /endoflifelesson. They are not mutually exclusive and both not pointless. You can still fight for what you want and not get it. It just seems some persistent group thinks that fighting is a guaranteed getting. Trust me its not. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostlight Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 No it's performance. A17 is fine. It's mostly the same people complaining on here. That creates a bit of a bubble. And on Steam. And on reddit. And on youtube. Always the perk system. But yeah, it's a bubble. You can still fight for what you want and not get it. It just seems some persistent group thinks that fighting is a guaranteed getting. Or perhaps they think the fight is worth fighting for until won or lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prisma501 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Or perhaps they think the fight is worth fighting for until won or lost. Exactly what im saying. Just the way of fighting seems to go south in very specific cases. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maynard69 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 No it's performance. A17 is fine. It's mostly the same people complaining on here. That creates a bit of a bubble. Ya, mostly the same 20 people vs mostly the same 4 people defending it. I have yet to hear any actual reason or facts from the people defending the perk system. Their main argument is that the system is similar in the way that we perk up. You actually never see "The new perk system is good because --blank--" It is always "I am still enjoying a17" or "It is good" those are not reasons or facts supporting it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumper Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Well as a newer player who started in late A16, I absolutely love A17. Looking forward to further enhancements Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meganoth Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Ya, mostly the same 20 people vs mostly the same 4 people defending it. I have yet to hear any actual reason or facts from the people defending the perk system. Their main argument is that the system is similar in the way that we perk up. You actually never see "The new perk system is good because --blank--" It is always "I am still enjoying a17" or "It is good" those are not reasons or facts supporting it.. I have posted why I like the perk system a few times, sorry if you didn't see any of them. I like that I can choose a perk freely without having to do specific grind tasks. I don't like auto-level designs in RPGs and always turn them off (there are some games that have autolevel to make sure no one is able to make a misspecced character that is not able to complete the game). LBD is not autolevel per se but quite similar in that you have to change your actions in the game to conform to your leveling plan. Otherwise, if you play organically (i.e. doing actions just because of in-game events and needs instead of playing a meta game of xp gathering) the game auto-levels you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maynard69 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 I have posted why I like the perk system a few times, sorry if you didn't see any of them. I like that I can choose a perk freely without having to do specific grind tasks. I don't like auto-level designs in RPGs and always turn them off (there are some games that have autolevel to make sure no one is able to make a misspecced character that is not able to complete the game). LBD is not autolevel per se but quite similar in that you have to change your actions in the game to conform to your leveling plan. Otherwise, if you play organically (i.e. doing actions just because of in-game events and needs instead of playing a meta game of xp gathering) the game auto-levels you. That is reason, good job. You say "without having to do specific grind tasks", except you are still doing specific grind tasks. That has not changed. The difference is your grind tasks have been reduced and regulated to a couple things instead of a variety. You get less reward for doing more limited tasks. I didnt mind the system at first either, it was fun doing the first couple playthroughs. After that the limitations and blandness start to shine. As far a "auto-level designs", never heard of it. Maybe give an example. But either way, to me it doesnt seem to me that LBD is even related to that, and the new system seems more auto since you dont have to actually preform a task to become a master at it. So, Ill pass on commenting further on your last paragraph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prisma501 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Ya, mostly the same 20 people vs mostly the same 4 people defending it. I have yet to hear any actual reason or facts from the people defending the perk system. Their main argument is that the system is similar in the way that we perk up. You actually never see "The new perk system is good because --blank--" It is always "I am still enjoying a17" or "It is good" those are not reasons or facts supporting it.. Maybe, just maybe its not defending. Just simply stating to have no problem with it or even like it is subjective as hell anyways. What you gonna do? Argue they shouldnt like it? Its allready in. There is no reason to put arguments on why you like it. But if it makes you happy, here we go. Im agreeing with meganoth above me, but most of all i like the semi class system. Not preset choose to be a "miner", "fighter", "builder" etc. But intermix with "strong", "smart", "agile", "perceptive" etc. So a class light sys. I totally dig it. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maynard69 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Maybe, just maybe its not defending. Just simply stating to have no problem with it or even like it is subjective as hell anyways. What you gonna do? Argue they shouldnt like it? Its allready in. There is no reason to put arguments on why you like it. But if it makes you happy, here we go. Im agreeing with meganoth above me, but most of all i like the semi class system. Not preset choose to be a "miner", "fighter", "builder" etc. But intermix with "strong", "smart", "agile", "perceptive" etc. So a class light sys. I totally dig it. Cheers Lol, wut? The difference between "defending", and stating you "dont have a problem with it" would be being able to grasp some sort of advantage, or good aspect of the change. You are right, in order to defend something you would need a reason. Just "not having a problem" would mean there is nothing you can state that is better about it. No, I dont plan on arguing against you liking it without any reason to like it. You are free to just like something for no good reason, that is on you. You could do a class or semi-class with LBD too. By working at whatever tasks your class does, and perking accordingly... So what you like about it was present with LBD too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prisma501 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Lol, wut? The difference between "defending", and stating you "dont have a problem with it" would be being able to grasp some sort of advantage, or good aspect of the change. You are right, in order to defend something you would need a reason. Just "not having a problem" would mean there is nothing you can state that is better about it. No, I dont plan on arguing against you liking it without any reason to like it. You are free to just like something for no good reason, that is on you. You could do a class or semi-class with LBD too. By working at whatever tasks your class does, and perking accordingly... So what you like about it was present with LBD too. With the big difference that i /had/ to do it to level up. I like it more to do whatever i want and spend the points into the attributes i need at a specific time to make my character "smarter", "stronger", "more perceptive" etc and then choose which perks i want to level. So i like the current system more than LBD. More freedom to shape your character without having to "craft 1000 stone axes" or "stand on a cactus". It just feels better. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fragtzack Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 And on Steam. And on reddit. And on youtube. Always the perk system. But yeah, it's a bubble. Or perhaps they think the fight is worth fighting for until won or lost. The new gates with a17 significantly slow down the progression of the game, which means better tools and building contructions are delayed. Most of the streamers do building a base episodes. The time spend on survival aspects, scavenging, poi clearing, exploring is very minimal in comparison. a17 significantly prolongs the end game and that is a good thing IMO. Sad for the streamers as they have to work more to get to a level where they can show building a fort videos, but this prolonging the end game is more in align with the stated purpose of this game: Survival, crafting, zombie hordes. Tis not billed as a constructions game with all other aspects a side show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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