Underground Debate #589

[Bolliz]

Really? Another discussion on underground threaths? Did we not have this discussion already 3 times or something during the past 1.25 years, during the development of a17? What's next.. children zombies?

 

So let the ppl that havent discussed it, discuss it...without u nagging like a zombie child

[Kalyori]

My strategy is to build a small 5x5x5 base on top, then dig down to the bottom and build an underground base. I have storage down there and on the top. I expand the top base and fight from it. I find it quite fun and it keeps my important loot protected. I can also retreat in emergencies.

[Janna3921]

Underground Debate #589

 

My strategy is to build a small 5x5x5 base on top, then dig down to the bottom and build an underground base. I have storage down there and on the top. I expand the top base and fight from it. I find it quite fun and it keeps my important loot protected. I can also retreat in emergencies.

 

That is a exploit and isn't allowed. Of course, if you dig down to bedrock, or even six or more levels down and place spikes on the ground and all around on the poles you have placed three from the wall, so the zombies can't touch you is okay. And don't forget to place three on top around the edges so the zombies can't fall down where you are standing, that means they can harm or even kill you.

 

After all, a pit that keeps you from being hurt isn't a exploit, is it?

 

(in case someone doesn't recognize it, it is sarcasm)

[skippy0330]

This was verified to be fixed a while ago.

 

Kinyajuu posts about micro-stuttering fixes

 

There are a couple of more recent posts about how they fixed it as well. Like changing the "center" to your player instead of 0,0

 

I've been told the shaking hands bug was fixed. they dynamically changed the center of the map so it doesn't do that anymore. it always happened as you went further from 0,0

 

Ah damn didn't see the other replies

 

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That is a exploit and isn't allowed. Of course, if you dig down to bedrock, or even six or more levels down and place spikes on the ground and all around on the poles you have placed three from the wall, so the zombies can't touch you is okay. And don't forget to place three on top around the edges so the zombies can't fall down where you are standing, that means they can harm or even kill you.

 

After all, a pit that keeps you from being hurt isn't a exploit, is it?

 

(in case someone doesn't recognize it, it is sarcasm)

 

Not an exploit. the game has no counter, doesn't make it an exploit. an exploit is using a bunch of chairs to stop zombies. digging a hole in the ground and surviving in it (just like people have and do in real life) isn't. Simply because you don't like the gamestyle, doesn't make it an exploit.

This is why digging zombies are being introduced, to counter it. (talking about digging a hole and hiding your stash)

 

 

kk.. when you meant sarcastic. was your whole post sarcastic, if so then i agree.

[Janna3921]

I've been told the shaking hands bug was fixed. they dynamically changed the center of the map so it doesn't do that anymore. it always happened as you went further from 0,0

 

Ah damn didn't see the other replies

 

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Not an exploit. the game has no counter, doesn't make it an exploit. an exploit is using a bunch of chairs to stop zombies. digging a hole in the ground and surviving in it (just like people have and do in real life) isn't. Simply because you don't like the gamestyle, doesn't make it an exploit.

This is why digging zombies are being introduced, to counter it. (talking about digging a hole and hiding your stash)

 

 

kk.. when you meant sarcastic. was your whole post sarcastic, if so then i agree.

 

All of it was sarcasm, get tired of hearing that underground bases are exploits and cowardly when I see and read lots of players talk about building a pit to kill zombies. What is the difference in being underground or digging a pit, put down spikes then place around it steel poles the zombies can't destroy and you are out of their reach? Most who have underground bases do so to have a "home" that they decorate like a home. Storage for items. Players build a base above ground and away from it a fighting/killing area that has them behind bars, on top of iron bars to keep themselves safe. Not all, but many. Read comments on youtube videos lets me see how a lot of players play.

Do some hide there, yes, some do. Some want the fun of the building that this game has that is much better than lots of other games, they like the realistic look of it over the "cartoonish" look of some games, or lousy graphics. But they see survival as making sure they aren't killed. We should be allowed to play the way we want, hide or use it as a home away from our fighting base. If TPS don't like it, they can fix it so it can't be done. I hope they don't. The will lose a lot of players who want everything else but horde night.

[Janna3921]

Just to clarify it so no one misunderstands, I don't see exploiting in how anyone plays unless they go into god mode and use that to stay alive. Any way you want to play, underground, on the ground, above ground, with a pit or any other way you want is YOUR choice and you DO NOT (emphasis) have the right to tell me how to play.

 

Not trying to start the underground gate again, was wanting to catch up and went to far back to start reading. Got pissed again at the "you have to play my way it is the right way or else you are cheating" attitude. Go screw yourself if you feel that way. Rude, crude, yep. Sometimes I feel like that, and right now, back aching, tired from no sleep, stressed from life I really don't care if I insult someone. Roland may want to delete it, and that is okay, if he feels I'm out of line he has that right.

[Retsof123]

Just to clarify it so no one misunderstands, I don't see exploiting in how anyone plays unless they go into god mode and use that to stay alive. Any way you want to play, underground, on the ground, above ground, with a pit or any other way you want is YOUR choice and you DO NOT (emphasis) have the right to tell me how to play.

 

Not trying to start the underground gate again, was wanting to catch up and went to far back to start reading. Got pissed again at the "you have to play my way it is the right way or else you are cheating" attitude. Go screw yourself if you feel that way. Rude, crude, yep. Sometimes I feel like that, and right now, back aching, tired from no sleep, stressed from life I really don't care if I insult someone. Roland may want to delete it, and that is okay, if he feels I'm out of line he has that right.

 

 

Well said @Janna3921, I totally agree. The attraction of this game is that you can play it any way you want, whatever the circumstances. It's the only game I have ever owned that has kept me on for nearly 6000 hours. In TFP we trust. Looking forward to whatever A17 brings, both good and bad, bugs and all. Especially looking forward to working out how to safely combat the dangers of life in the post-apocalyptic world of 7 Days to Die and SURVIVE.

[Doombringer101]

I don't think any of us devs want a happy safe place in the vanilla game. If you want to be safe, the main menu is a great place to be. If you want to play the game and be safe, then someone can made a mod of happy cloud city or indestructible blocks or zombie killer aura machine. Mod in your safety if you must, but apart from a super easy difficulty where you sneeze on zombies and they die, I would not expect safety from us.

 

This post seems relevant right about now.

[TSBX]

Any way you want to play, underground, on the ground, above ground, with a pit or any other way you want is YOUR choice and you DO NOT (emphasis) have the right to tell me how to play.

 

Not trying to start the underground gate again, was wanting to catch up and went to far back to start reading. Got pissed again at the "you have to play my way it is the right way or else you are cheating" attitude. Go screw yourself if you feel that way. Rude, crude, yep. Sometimes I feel like that, and right now, back aching, tired from no sleep, stressed from life I really don't care if I insult someone. Roland may want to delete it, and that is okay, if he feels I'm out of line he has that right.

 

 

Guess folks are going to have to be mad then.

 

Yeah static terrain will solve that Just teasing. Yeah eventually underground bases won't be as viable one way or another. Lack of oxygen, vitamin d deficiency, black lung from mining in enclosed spaces and better zombie pathing come to mind as the best solutions.

 

I don't think any of us devs want a happy safe place in the vanilla game. If you want to be safe, the main menu is a great place to be. If you want to play the game and be safe, then someone can made a mod of happy cloud city or indestructible blocks or zombie killer aura machine. Mod in your safety if you must, but apart from a super easy difficulty where you sneeze on zombies and they die, I would not expect safety from us.

[Tin]

Quote Originally Posted by faatal View Post

I don't think any of us devs want a happy safe place in the vanilla game. If you want to be safe, the main menu is a great place to be. If you want to play the game and be safe, then someone can made a mod of happy cloud city or indestructible blocks or zombie killer aura machine. Mod in your safety if you must, but apart from a super easy difficulty where you sneeze on zombies and they die, I would not expect safety from us.

 

This post seems relevant right about now.

 

Nah, some will just keep refusing to acknowledge it was even said or pretend it doesn't mean anything.

[Aldranon]

Well, if a person stays mobile and underground, they will be as safe as A17 allows for night hordes.

 

The downside is the massive amount of effort required in making a large subway system.

 

Most people will not want to expend that level of effort however and will simply clear roads for their SUV on horde night. Could be fun.

[wildaxeman1]

All of it was sarcasm, get tired of hearing that underground bases are exploits and cowardly when I see and read lots of players talk about building a pit to kill zombies. What is the difference in being underground or digging a pit, put down spikes then place around it steel poles the zombies can't destroy and you are out of their reach? Most who have underground bases do so to have a "home" that they decorate like a home. Storage for items. Players build a base above ground and away from it a fighting/killing area that has them behind bars, on top of iron bars to keep themselves safe. Not all, but many. Read comments on youtube videos lets me see how a lot of players play.

Do some hide there, yes, some do. Some want the fun of the building that this game has that is much better than lots of other games, they like the realistic look of it over the "cartoonish" look of some games, or lousy graphics. But they see survival as making sure they aren't killed. We should be allowed to play the way we want, hide or use it as a home away from our fighting base. If TPS don't like it, they can fix it so it can't be done. I hope they don't. The will lose a lot of players who want everything else but horde night.

 

i agree. everyone should have option to play as they want without being modder.

not sure, if we lose too many players, if underground or pole top bases are made impossible. players are smart and will find a way.

[Darkstardragon]

Theres always the go to a random poi away from my base on horde night way.

[Guppycur]

Theres always the go to a random poi away from my base on horde night way.

 

Naw, all blocks outside your bedroll area will act like traders on horde nights to force you in your base to face the hordes. =)

[wildaxeman1]

Well, if a person stays mobile and underground, they will be as safe as A17 allows for night hordes.

 

The downside is the massive amount of effort required in making a large subway system.

 

Most people will not want to expend that level of effort however and will simply clear roads for their SUV on horde night. Could be fun.

 

get auger from creative menu, gas cans and repair kits. you have pretty good tunnel system by day 7. i personally do not like auger. i do it old fashioned way and spend many nights to dig my underground highway. too many nights... but then again, i get a lot needed resources to build above ground hord base and i do not spend any hord night hiding underground.

[Tin]

i agree. everyone should have option to play as they want without being modder.

not sure, if we lose too many players, if underground or pole top bases are made impossible. players are smart and will find a way.

 

That's the crux of the issue (imo). From what I've read, and get the impression of, is some ppl are "assuming" TFP won't be putting in more options at a later time. Maybe I'm being overly optimistic again with the modding I have done but this game really lends itself to having a multitude of options eventually, that the individual player can adjust to suit their needs, without needing to be a modder.

Time will tell but I'll be amazed if it doesn't happen at some point.

[Roland]

I just want those who get upset by underground threats to understand that nobody at TFP has EVER phrased their comments in a way to say that they want to punish or prevent people from having underground bases. Those sorts of comments come from other gamers who have absolutely zero decision making power. Don't let their posts trigger you because they are meaningless.

 

The developers want threats and challenges in every biome so that every place in the game (sans the menu screen) is part of the survival game. They are NOT working to prevent anyone from building bases at bedrock and they are NOT trying to push everyone onto the surface during horde night. Joel has said in the past that eventually you might be able to rent a room at Duke's casino to completely bypass the horde night if you wish or become so accomplished at stealth that not even blood moon zombies will be able to detect you. All official communication coming from TFP points to allowing multiple playstyles (once they are done). It is only unofficial communication from fellow community members that dips into the realm of "we need to force people topside".

 

So the next time someone types, "If TFP wants to prevent people from building at bedrock they should...." don't get triggered. That person has no power, no influence, and no clue about what TFP wants. This is a voxel game. TFP chose this medium so that we would play underground.

[jprasch]

I would like to see unkilled zombie hordes linger around a players location when horde night ends. If a player is hiding underground or on a rooftop they would be milling around the entrance. Thus they would have to be dealt with. I also have suggested having the big hoard be a random event, not midnight the 7th day. The player then could make a run for the base or be force to take a stand at a closer location.

[Ouch Quit It]

Meaningless posts confirmed for A17!!! Thanks Ronald..

 

 

 

Coughs * VIDEO * Coughs

[KingSlayerGM]

I just want those who get upset by underground threats to understand that nobody at TFP has EVER phrased their comments in a way to say that they want to punish or prevent people from having underground bases. Those sorts of comments come from other gamers who have absolutely zero decision making power. Don't let their posts trigger you because they are meaningless.

 

The developers want threats and challenges in every biome so that every place in the game (sans the menu screen) is part of the survival game. They are NOT working to prevent anyone from building bases at bedrock and they are NOT trying to push everyone onto the surface during horde night. Joel has said in the past that eventually you might be able to rent a room at Duke's casino to completely bypass the horde night if you wish or become so accomplished at stealth that not even blood moon zombies will be able to detect you. All official communication coming from TFP points to allowing multiple playstyles (once they are done). It is only unofficial communication from fellow community members that dips into the realm of "we need to force people topside".

 

So the next time someone types, "If TFP wants to prevent people from building at bedrock they should...." don't get triggered. That person has no power, no influence, and no clue about what TFP wants. This is a voxel game. TFP chose this medium so that we would play underground.

 

Roland, what you said doesn't seem to fully fit with what faatal said..

 

I don't think any of us devs want a happy safe place in the vanilla game. If you want to be safe, the main menu is a great place to be. If you want to play the game and be safe, then someone can made a mod of happy cloud city or indestructible blocks or zombie killer aura machine. Mod in your safety if you must, but apart from a super easy difficulty where you sneeze on zombies and they die, I would not expect safety from us.

[eidobunny]

is there a possibility A17 will be ready before October?

 

no, they are going to do the stream event on friday and release experimental on the following monday, which means the very very earliest we'll have experimental is october 1st

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

Roland, what you said doesn't seem to fully fit with what faatal said..

 

that actually looks completely consistent to me

[KingSlayerGM]

that actually looks completely consistent to me

 

Well, it depends a lot on how you interpret words... to me, the inconsistency is Faatal saying no to safe places, and Roland saying Madmole said yes..

[Aurelius]

 

 

I don't think any of us devs want a happy safe place in the vanilla game. If you want to be safe, the main menu is a great place to be. If you want to play the game and be safe, then someone can made a mod of happy cloud city or indestructible blocks or zombie killer aura machine. Mod in your safety if you must, but apart from a super easy difficulty where you sneeze on zombies and they die, I would not expect safety from us.

 

I just want those who get upset by underground threats to understand that nobody at TFP has EVER phrased their comments in a way to say that they want to punish or prevent people from having underground bases. Those sorts of comments come from other gamers who have absolutely zero decision making power. Don't let their posts trigger you because they are meaningless.

 

The developers want threats and challenges in every biome so that every place in the game (sans the menu screen) is part of the survival game. They are NOT working to prevent anyone from building bases at bedrock and they are NOT trying to push everyone onto the surface during horde night. Joel has said in the past that eventually you might be able to rent a room at Duke's casino to completely bypass the horde night if you wish or become so accomplished at stealth that not even blood moon zombies will be able to detect you. All official communication coming from TFP points to allowing multiple playstyles (once they are done). It is only unofficial communication from fellow community members that dips into the realm of "we need to force people topside".

 

So the next time someone types, "If TFP wants to prevent people from building at bedrock they should...." don't get triggered. That person has no power, no influence, and no clue about what TFP wants. This is a voxel game. TFP chose this medium so that we would play underground.

 

 

 

Roland, what you said doesn't seem to fully fit with what faatal said..

 

There's a big difference between punishing and/or preventing a player from building an underground base, and ensuring there's no safe place in the game.

 

If you are referring to the room rental mechanic, then I think you are taking faatal's comment out of context.

 

-A

[JaxTeller718]

Well, it depends a lot on how you interpret words... to me, the inconsistency is Faatal saying no to safe places, and Roland saying Madmole said yes..

 

Renting a room for horde night is WAY different than digging a hole to bedrock and NEVER seeing any threat. Will they disallow you to build underground? No. Will your underground bunker be 100 percent safe? No.

 

Not sure where you are seeing the inconsistency. Bypassing a horde night is way different than being able to live underground with ZERO threats.

[GRizos]

I just want those who get upset by underground threats to understand that nobody at TFP has EVER phrased their comments in a way to say that they want to punish or prevent people from having underground bases. Those sorts of comments come from other gamers who have absolutely zero decision making power. Don't let their posts trigger you because they are meaningless.

 

The developers want threats and challenges in every biome so that every place in the game (sans the menu screen) is part of the survival game. They are NOT working to prevent anyone from building bases at bedrock and they are NOT trying to push everyone onto the surface during horde night. Joel has said in the past that eventually you might be able to rent a room at Duke's casino to completely bypass the horde night if you wish or become so accomplished at stealth that not even blood moon zombies will be able to detect you. All official communication coming from TFP points to allowing multiple playstyles (once they are done). It is only unofficial communication from fellow community members that dips into the realm of "we need to force people topside".

 

So the next time someone types, "If TFP wants to prevent people from building at bedrock they should...." don't get triggered. That person has no power, no influence, and no clue about what TFP wants. This is a voxel game. TFP chose this medium so that we would play underground.

 

So, the way I understand this, when you go for an above ground base you have stranglers/wandering hordes/uneven terrain and what else to challenge you in building said base. Since you can't have these exact threats when attemting to build underground, is it safe to assume that equivalent hindrances are planned for the underground base building?