Alpha 21 Dev Diary

[Matt115]

On 3/16/2022 at 7:02 PM, Roland said:

 

• Doors
  • Double Doors

What mean double doors? because... well in some POi there is double doors now

[BFT2020]

1 minute ago, Matt115 said:

What mean double doors? because... well in some POi there is double doors now

Crafting double doors

[Syphon583]

12 minutes ago, Matt115 said:

What mean double doors? because... well in some POi there is double doors now

As BFT said, crafting, but also (unless I'm mistaken) even though you see double doors in current POIs, they all function as single doors (one is usually locked) they never open together. The exception are the cellar doors, of course. What's teased in the video are functional double doors.

 

Also when it comes to crafting, you might think you could just place two doors side by side, but their hinges would both be either on the left side or the right (not opposite sides). You can rotate one of the doors, but then they wouldn't align properly.

Edited June 16, 2022 by Syphon583
addition/clarification (see edit history)

[wdnmd123456]

Let me ask, will the A21 version optimize the game? When I go to places with a lot of zombies, the frame will drop and become unstable😂

[Blake_]

On 6/13/2022 at 3:14 PM, Jost Amman said:

The models are not the important part IMO. We need different behaviors, different weapons/claws or whatever, and different path finding.

 

Example 1: let's say we get an Alpha Wolf. They could make it howl to call in a pack of normal wolves (much like the screamer), and the Alpha Wolf itself would stand back waiting for his pack to attack you and only come forward and hit you when you're already wounded (similar to vultures).

 

Example 2: a Stalker Crawler. It could hide inside normal dirt and come out suddenly when you walk on top of its block (or dig it). Then it would hide again inside dirt when it's been wounded to regenerate. After it's healed, it'll come back later to stalk you. It would be a great PITA for underground POIs too, IMO.

Both are awesome ideas. An alpha wolf fits perfectly, and a bear/ cougar with cubs (same model, a bit furrier and smaller?)that gives you a notion of why the heck are predators attacking you in some instances would add an incredible amount of depth to just a bunch of models.

 

Plus, cubs are a way to balance food on wheels as smaller animals have smaller resources.

 

The stalker crawler is just a must. A special entity that jumpscares us either by coming out of the ground or from a tiny closet or corpse can be the best thing since the hated zd vultures. It should be fast. Yes. A fast nightmare crawling on two arms. Beautiful.

 

I believe there were talks about an undertaker special zd that either revived or made entities come out of the ground? Well that's almost like a screamer. The stalker zd that also moves fast and can get to you even crawling against walls will definitely make Bioshock's crazy roof-crawling entities look away in fear.

 

 

 

 

[vergilsparda]

On 3/16/2022 at 2:02 PM, Roland said:

• Skill magazines can be found, bought, and/or received as quest rewards. The topic of the magazine matches the location you would expect to find it in the world.

 

 

Emphasis mine, is there a more in-depth explanation of this? Would it be like, finding farm-item (seeds, food, etc) magazines in shamways and guns/weapons/traps in shotgun messiahs and savage country's or is it something different?

[Laz Man]

56 minutes ago, vergilsparda said:

 

Emphasis mine, is there a more in-depth explanation of this? Would it be like, finding farm-item (seeds, food, etc) magazines in shamways and guns/weapons/traps in shotgun messiahs and savage country's or is it something different?

 

Yes.  Another example is finding food type magazines in kitchen cupboards.

[khzmusik]

On 6/13/2022 at 5:42 AM, RipClaw said:

The Behemoth, on the other side, was originally planned to be 5 blocks high. As far as I know there were problems with the pathing at this size.

 

 

There are mods that try to revive the Behemoth, and they reveal some of the problems with it. Pathing is only part of the problem.

 

The main issue is that the zombie AI is designed to target only two block heights for destruction: the one at "eye" level, and the one at ground level (so, two blocks high).

 

If any zombie is taller than two blocks high, they can be trivially blocked by placing a weak block three blocks above ground level. No matter how weak, it will block movement, because the zombie will never target it for destruction. You could make a three-block-high wall of wood frames and be totally safe.

 

So either the Behemoth needs to adjust its collision mesh so it clips through blocks higher than the second block (which looks ridiculous), or it will need to be shrunk so it fits within two-block openings (which makes it not so much a "behemoth" as a new zombie skin). The mods that try to bring it back have tried both approaches, and neither really makes for a compelling gameplay experience.

 

It would be cool if TFP made the AI changes necessary for enemies to destroy blocks relative to the entity's size. (I for one would like a 7D2D version of the Stranger Things mindlfayer.) But this is quite a bit of work, and I don't think they will push other things aside just for this.

[vergilsparda]

1 hour ago, Laz Man said:

 

Yes.  Another example is finding food type magazines in kitchen cupboards.

 

Y'know, that actually makes a lot of sense. The new system is slowly growing on me with that clarification—it'll actually make looting [insert type of gameplay theme here]-centered POIs way more worth it.

[Roland]

2 hours ago, vergilsparda said:

 

Emphasis mine, is there a more in-depth explanation of this? Would it be like, finding farm-item (seeds, food, etc) magazines in shamways and guns/weapons/traps in shotgun messiahs and savage country's or is it something different?

Exactly. But it should also be remembered that often the “treasure room” of a random POI can sometimes have a shotgun messiah crate or a sham way crate so you will still be able to randomly get those themes of magazines by exploring some of the generic houses  

[Laz Man]

41 minutes ago, Roland said:

Exactly. But it should also be remembered that often the “treasure room” of a random POI can sometimes have a shotgun messiah crate or a sham way crate so you will still be able to randomly get those themes of magazines by exploring some of the generic houses  

Yep, so targeting POIs that have specific crates should net players more magazines of a specific type.

 

From a level design perspective we use random store crates for generic POI loot rooms while we use more specific store crates for themed POIs (e.g. working stiff crates in working stiff POI loot rooms).

[NukemDed]

so theres a tick box somewhere when building pois that you can choose that box or random box?

 

[vergilsparda]

2 hours ago, Roland said:

Exactly. But it should also be remembered that often the “treasure room” of a random POI can sometimes have a shotgun messiah crate or a sham way crate so you will still be able to randomly get those themes of magazines by exploring some of the generic houses  

 

Of course, there was no confusion there for me, don't worry, my assumption was basically what Laz Man said underneath your reply!

[Matt115]

18 hours ago, Laz Man said:

Yep, so targeting POIs that have specific crates should net players more magazines of a specific type.

 

From a level design perspective we use random store crates for generic POI loot rooms while we use more specific store crates for themed POIs (e.g. working stiff crates in working stiff POI loot rooms).

Hm will be there  new POI connected with magasines? for example - hunting cabin, shooting range, thief's safehouse etc?

[Laz Man]

2 hours ago, Matt115 said:

Hm will be there  new POI connected with magasines? for example - hunting cabin, shooting range, thief's safehouse etc?

 

I believe all magazine types are already associated with POI specific loot containers, mainly store crates and some other loot containers.  Whether more specific POIs or loot containers are needed is yet to be determined.

 

Edit: It is also worth mentioning there are also plenty of loot containers that contain all types of magazines.

 

Edited June 18, 2022 by Laz Man (see edit history)

[Laz Man]

21 hours ago, NukemDed said:

so theres a tick box somewhere when building pois that you can choose that box or random box?

 

 

No, all loot containers are still managed by loot lists defined within the xmls.

 

However, level design has access to every loot container (including some helper variants) to place within POIs.

[meilodasreh]

On 6/16/2022 at 11:27 AM, Viktoriusiii said:

As always!
Great concept... but they had to f*** it up with scripted zombieSpawns/wake ups.
*sigh* why do I even bother

I think the concept itself is cool, but I can't really see how it fits into a fully destructible world.

-those could only be at places with e.g. high hp blocks around, so they can't just be bypassed very easily. Definitely something that has to be considered for the POI designers.

-what happens if I destroy the blocks around the burning pipe end? Will there just be a flame still burning, coming out of nowhere, or will it burn at a new place?

-fire would have to get a major damage impact when coming in touch, because if it behaves like now, well, you could just run through it, have a drink, and it's of no concern.

-If they changed it for fire in general, then you could build a rather safe hordebase just with surrounding your walls with campfires.

-And if they did change it only for the gas pipe fire...well, why would that one fire be so much more dangerous than any other fire?

 

 

I'm curious how they figure it out, so that it doesn't come out weird or meaningless.

 

[Jost Amman]

2 hours ago, meilodasreh said:

I think the concept itself is cool, but I can't really see how it fits into a fully destructible world.

-those could only be at places with e.g. high hp blocks around, so they can't just be bypassed very easily. Definitely something that has to be considered for the POI designers.

-what happens if I destroy the blocks around the burning pipe end? Will there just be a flame still burning, coming out of nowhere, or will it burn at a new place?

-fire would have to get a major damage impact when coming in touch, because if it behaves like now, well, you could just run through it, have a drink, and it's of no concern.

-If they changed it for fire in general, then you could build a rather safe hordebase just with surrounding your walls with campfires.

-And if they did change it only for the gas pipe fire...well, why would that one fire be so much more dangerous than any other fire?

 

 

I'm curious how they figure it out, so that it doesn't come out weird or meaningless.

I think if they use the same (new) mechanics they're adding for water, they can have flammable liquids run through pipe blocks and such.

[Matt115]

9 hours ago, Laz Man said:

 

No, all loot containers are still managed by loot lists defined within the xmls.

 

However, level design has access to every loot container (including some helper variants) to place within POIs.

So there is no chance for  bigger chance of finding grease monkey magasine on gas station, bigger chance of finding miner 69ier in tool shop etc? 😥

[BFT2020]

With the changes to crafting coming and perk books being adjusted because of those changes, are they also looking into changing the bundle crafting recipes?

 

Specifically, for example, by the time I collected all 7 Ranger books to unlock bundle crafting of arrows, there was no reason at that point to bundle craft stone arrows.

 

I have modded it in my SP game to unlock it earlier so I am actually now making use of that recipe.

[Laz Man]

2 hours ago, Matt115 said:

So there is no chance for  bigger chance of finding grease monkey magasine on gas station, bigger chance of finding miner 69ier in tool shop etc? 😥

Not sure if it needs bigger chance.  Its all a matter of balance.  You will have to play it to see how it feels.

[BFT2020]

2 minutes ago, Laz Man said:

Not sure if it needs bigger chance.  Its all a matter of balance.  You will have to play it to see how it feels.

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't the perks alter the drops of the magazines?  So if you wanted to try and gain magazines for say pistols, you would look for locations with a higher percentage of shotgun messiah crates.  You can also perk into gunslinger which improves the odds of those drops.  So the system as explained to us at this point (and subject to change before we get our hands on it) rewards those who specialize in specific perks, but doesn't lock that person out of the other crafting skills.

[RipClaw]

2 hours ago, Matt115 said:

So there is no chance for  bigger chance of finding grease monkey magasine on gas station, bigger chance of finding miner 69ier in tool shop etc? 😥

As far as I understand it, the magazines can also be found in crates. Therefore, I can imagine that in Pass-N-Gas crates the chance of finding Grease Monkey magazines is higher and in Working Stiffs crates for Miner 69 magazines.

 

Since gas stations always have Pass-N-Gas crates and tool shops always have Working Stiff crates, you are more likely to find the corresponding magazines there.
 

[BFT2020]

2 hours ago, Matt115 said:

So there is no chance for  bigger chance of finding grease monkey magasine on gas station, bigger chance of finding miner 69ier in tool shop etc? 😥

 

If I am understanding the system correctly (and we are only getting hints at it now), looting specific crates will reward magazines associated with those crates (i.e. weapon magazines for shotgun messiah crates).  If you perk into specific perks (say Gunslinger), you will see more gunslinger magazines when you loot the shotgun crates, but still see other weapon crafting magazines in those crates.  You won't be seeing magazines for crafting tools though unless you open a Working Stiffs crate.

 

The original question that Laz answered was about building POIs.  Some POIs are specific to a brand (for example Working Stiffs) which is why when you loot them today, you see a lot of Working Stiff crates in them.  Other POIs are more random (for example houses) so you should see more variation.  However, deep down it all depends on how the POI designer assigns the types of crates to that POI.

 

So if you are looking for magazines that would be found in a PassNGas crate (vehicle crafting for example), your odds of finding the PassNGas crate in a Shotgun Messiah store is low, but high if you are looting a Gas station or car dealership.  If the POI was setup with a random crate placeholder (for example a house POI), you would just have a random chance of getting the PassNGas crate.

[Slingblade2040]

Will the zombie loot bags be getting a nerf? They still feel like they drop way to often maybe if they dropped half as often? Just kinda silly having a ton of yellow or blue bags all over the place after Horde night.