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Alpha 21 Dev Diary

Roland

By Roland
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IzPrebuilt Survivor

IzPrebuilt

Posted
Posted
25 minutes ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

Personally I am shocked how many forum members actively down vote anything regarding communication or a timeline.

I find it really strange. You all are free to have your own opinion.

I feel it is time for the pimps to publish a timeline of what is expected to happen and when it’s expected to happen. Perfectly fine is deadlines change or are late, some sort of roadmap would be nice to have.

 

You give internet weirdos a timeline or a deadline, then change it? They're going to actually get death threats. Have you read the twitter replies and how toxic they are about console updates? Or have you read a youtube comment section about Alpha 21 news? Hell have you read some of the more insane comments in this very thread?

The stuff i've had to block on my channel because of how poorly the vocal minority of man-babies who plague this game take the changes, you would NOT believe.

 

-Wishing for developers to die.
-Wishing Sexual Assault on developers.

-Slurs

 

Hell, I get called all kinds of things and threats for not casting judgement on certain changes and i'm just the bloody messenger.


The reality is, that a small group of toxic psychos have ruined it for the rest of us. I say this as someone who is a fairly open critic of some of the changes to this game, and who has used some vulgar language and childish insults to do so. But death threats? sexual assault threats? You have to be a special kind of evil to say that stuff. All over changes to a video game, you can just mod anyway?

No wonder TFP doesn't communicate as much as we'd want them to. When they do, they get all kinds of @%$# thrown at them.
 

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Fanatical_Meat Reconstructionist

Fanatical_Meat

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Posted
17 minutes ago, IzPrebuilt said:

 

You give internet weirdos a timeline or a deadline, then change it? They're going to actually get death threats. Have you read the twitter replies and how toxic they are about console updates? Or have you read a youtube comment section about Alpha 21 news? Hell have you read some of the more insane comments in this very thread?

The stuff i've had to block on my channel because of how poorly the vocal minority of man-babies who plague this game take the changes, you would NOT believe.

 

-Wishing for developers to die.
-Wishing Sexual Assault on developers.

-Slurs

 

Hell, I get called all kinds of things and threats for not casting judgement on certain changes and i'm just the bloody messenger.


The reality is, that a small group of toxic psychos have ruined it for the rest of us. I say this as someone who is a fairly open critic of some of the changes to this game, and who has used some vulgar language and childish insults to do so. But death threats? sexual assault threats? You have to be a special kind of evil to say that stuff. All over changes to a video game, you can just mod anyway?

No wonder TFP doesn't communicate as much as we'd want them to. When they do, they get all kinds of @%$# thrown at them.
 

Those folks are obviously incapable of civil discussion. They should and can be banned.

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crazywildfire Colony Founder

crazywildfire

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

Personally I am shocked how many forum members actively down vote anything regarding communication or a timeline.

I find it really strange. You all are free to have your own opinion.

I feel it is time for the pimps to publish a timeline of what is expected to happen and when it’s expected to happen. Perfectly fine is deadlines change or are late, some sort of roadmap would be nice to have.

 

Nobody is denying that more information wouldn't be nice. I'm sure most of us here would love those things. What we are saying is agree or disagree with the way they do things it is up to them not us how they do and handle those things. Regardless how one feels about it, it obviously is working for them. Nothing when we bought the game did it say they must or have to do this or that. 

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Mister Forgash Survivor

Mister Forgash

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Posted

I find it hard to believe any of us would be actively against a timeline, but I think the issue at hand is any attempt to give one is pure speculation. There is no way to accurately speculate how long it'll take to resolve critical bug #137, or if doing so will actually squash the bug, or create 3 new ones. I bet the pimps would love to tell us "Hey, I think we can have this busted out by April" or whatever- but then the problem arises that they hit snags and a part of the playerbase gets thier undies in a bunch and they start going "You said we'd have A21 by April- REEEEEEEE!!"

I imagine it's kinda like asking a scientist when we'll have the next big breakthrough in ____ field of study. .. Except us gamers are far more rabid and obnoxious.

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Fanatical_Meat Reconstructionist

Fanatical_Meat

Posted
Posted (edited)
41 minutes ago, Mister Forgash said:

I find it hard to believe any of us would be actively against a timeline, but I think the issue at hand is any attempt to give one is pure speculation. There is no way to accurately speculate how long it'll take to resolve critical bug #137, or if doing so will actually squash the bug, or create 3 new ones. I bet the pimps would love to tell us "Hey, I think we can have this busted out by April" or whatever- but then the problem arises that they hit snags and a part of the playerbase gets thier undies in a bunch and they start going "You said we'd have A21 by April- REEEEEEEE!!"

I imagine it's kinda like asking a scientist when we'll have the next big breakthrough in ____ field of study. .. Except us gamers are far more rabid and obnoxious.

They must have goals and at least estimates. I cannot imagine any business not having those.

Admittedly the original estimate could be completely inaccurate but simply adjust the timeline if that’s the case or better yet build in a couple of months wiggle room.

 

ps you do bring up a very fair point

Edited by Fanatical_Meat (see edit history)
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crazywildfire Colony Founder

crazywildfire

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

They must have goals and at least estimates. I cannot imagine any business not having those.

Admittedly the original estimate could be completely inaccurate but simply adjust the timeline if that’s the case or better yet build in a couple of months wiggle room.

 

ps you do bring up a very fair point

 

Who says they don't have them? Just because they choose not to share them with anyone outside the team doesn't mean they don't. They used to say about when they thought it might be ready but they wouldn't hit that date because of game breaking bugs they had to fix. Or something not working the way they wanted and they refuse to give a half ass version of it. The list can go on for the reasons but the fact remains when they would say those things and missed it people got pitch forks out like you wouldn't believe. Not saying you or I or anyone specific. Just that people take it literally and they have no wiggle room. So they felt for their own sanity or whatever to start not saying anything besides when it’s done. 

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mstdv inc Ranger

mstdv inc

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, crazywildfire said:

 

Who says they don't have them? Just because they choose not to share them with anyone outside the team doesn't mean they don't. They used to say about when they thought it might be ready but they wouldn't hit that date because of game breaking bugs they had to fix. Or something not working the way they wanted and they refuse to give a half ass version of it. The list can go on for the reasons but the fact remains when they would say those things and missed it people got pitch forks out like you wouldn't believe. Not saying you or I or anyone specific. Just that people take it literally and they have no wiggle room. So they felt for their own sanity or whatever to start not saying anything besides when it’s done.

Confirmed the current state of the bandits: half ass.We are waiting for the full version 😁

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bdubyah Leader

bdubyah

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

They must have goals and at least estimates. I cannot imagine any business not having those.

The first page lists what they would like to get done to go gold. As stated, giving any kind of timeline is just inviting headaches and overreactions when something gets pushed. I would prefer if TFP just did set times each year for updates, and whatever makes it in makes it in, but that's not how they do things and that's fine with me also. You're getting downvoted because you are coming across as whiny and demanding over something that TFP has never really done(give dates). If they haven't done it for the past 9 years now, why would they start now? Rick is about the only one I ever see try and mention dates, and they usually never work out. But he also doesn't visit here like some of the other devs do.

 

MM used to pop in and give updates, but the endless whining and negativity from so many people seems to have driven him off for the most part. I'm sure he is also busy with other things/games, but it's clear he isn't as active here as a few alphas ago. And I can't say I blame him. I'd get tired of people coming just to post "Wow, 10 years and still alpha?!?" pretty quick too. Especially when people ignore that the game is basically done anyway. Not like it's been some half-baked product for all these years or something like plenty of other EA games. Outside of bandits and some other things that will likely be after gold, the game is mostly complete. They could have taken it out of EA years ago and called it a full game and people would've been fine with it. But somehow still calling it EA even though it's a mostly feature complete game seems to bother people.

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Fanatical_Meat Reconstructionist

Fanatical_Meat

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, bdubyah said:

The first page lists what they would like to get done to go gold. As stated, giving any kind of timeline is just inviting headaches and overreactions when something gets pushed. I would prefer if TFP just did set times each year for updates, and whatever makes it in makes it in, but that's not how they do things and that's fine with me also. You're getting downvoted because you are coming across as whiny and demanding over something that TFP has never really done(give dates). If they haven't done it for the past 9 years now, why would they start now? Rick is about the only one I ever see try and mention dates, and they usually never work out. But he also doesn't visit here like some of the other devs do.

 

MM used to pop in and give updates, but the endless whining and negativity from so many people seems to have driven him off for the most part. I'm sure he is also busy with other things/games, but it's clear he isn't as active here as a few alphas ago. And I can't say I blame him. I'd get tired of people coming just to post "Wow, 10 years and still alpha?!?" pretty quick too. Especially when people ignore that the game is basically done anyway. Not like it's been some half-baked product for all these years or something like plenty of other EA games. Outside of bandits and some other things that will likely be after gold, the game is mostly complete. They could have taken it out of EA years ago and called it a full game and people would've been fine with it. But somehow still calling it EA even though it's a mostly feature complete game seems to bother people.

Okay so you’d like updates too.

BTW not whining just saying I’d like updates. Pretty simple stuff and yes I agree there will be trolls but that just part of the business they are smart they’ll figure out a way.

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bdubyah Leader

bdubyah

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

Okay so you’d like updates too.

BTW not whining just saying I’d like updates. Pretty simple stuff and yes I agree there will be trolls but that just part of the business they are smart they’ll figure out a way.

I mean, I wouldn't complain if they did the Star Citizen style of weekly/monthly type updates, sure. But I'm not gonna come here if they don't and tell them they should. TFP has always had a "we'll tell/show you something when there's something worth mentioning" method, and I'm okay with that. If they are being quiet I assume it's because there's nothing noteworthy that they feel would make for a good update. And Roland has mentioned a handful of new things over the last few weeks, and faatal has added some new info as well, so that's good enough for me.

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Fanatical_Meat Reconstructionist

Fanatical_Meat

Posted
Posted (edited)
49 minutes ago, bdubyah said:

I mean, I wouldn't complain if they did the Star Citizen style of weekly/monthly type updates, sure. But I'm not gonna come here if they don't and tell them they should. TFP has always had a "we'll tell/show you something when there's something worth mentioning" method, and I'm okay with that. If they are being quiet I assume it's because there's nothing noteworthy that they feel would make for a good update. And Roland has mentioned a handful of new things over the last few weeks, and faatal has added some new info as well, so that's good enough for me.

First good points

Second this will be a long post which I hate on forums. Post ideally should be short & concise.

Finally:

I know I can be irritating about this so bear with me. Words are important missing words are important. The first words in your post are simplified to “I’d like updates too” important thing is typically the first words we all do this and we all screw it up so it is not a slight or meant to be demeaning all the stuff that follows the first sentence is stuff to justify something or appease someone.

Back to the Pimps and lack of words. Regardless of them not giving specific updates clearly the expectation on these forums was we’d see A21 by the end of the year. That didn’t happen. Managing expectations and disappointment is critical in the business world. Simple example is the pimps consistently fail to meet deadlines amongst my friends. This is not a reputation anyone wants to have. This can be prevented or minimized by managing expectations and admitting delays and/or failure. Nobody wants to be the person who is known for missing deadlines and not saying anything about missing it. Again a perceived deadline is still a deadline. Far better to simply be honest, “I missed the deadline and here’s where I’m at” or “I know I disappointed you, this is what’s being done” as opposed to the near total silence that is happening now.

Silence doesn’t mean incompetence it typically means someone doesn’t want to manage the disappointment and likely has some fear regarding it. Fear in the work world doesn’t lead to good things barring very specific jobs or tasks which programming is not one of them.

Pimps should celebrate that they have so many fans that are eager to consume yet another alpha. 

Edited by Fanatical_Meat (see edit history)
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zztong Colony Founder

zztong

Posted
Posted
11 hours ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

Personally I am shocked how many forum members actively down vote anything regarding communication or a timeline.

I find it really strange. You all are free to have your own opinion.

 

I appreciate communications. A timeline would be cool. But I don't think anyone is in a position to demand such things when they Devs are pretty clear about how they operate. I'd love candor and speculation, but I also recognize those things would be poorly interpreted by many. So if you want speculation then you're going to have to live with what you get from folks like me in the cheap seats.

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maxousara Survivor

maxousara

Posted
Posted
On 12/30/2022 at 3:11 PM, unholyjoe said:

"every member" of the team have families and we are ALL attending family needs thru this holiday season. you know.. like most of you are doing and most are probably off work as well. :) we are all human.

Sorry but unfortunatly people think only of themselves and dont care about tfp developper.

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Sinz Hunter

Sinz

Posted
Posted

Oh wow.

Jumped on to have a peek at when this might be dropping and saw a bunch of entitlement and winging in the thread. Internet social platforms one of the most toxic places in the world.

 

Anyway.

I look forward to playing a21 whenever.  Change list sounds great. Love your game TFP team. Merry Christmas and Happy new year.

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Fanatical_Meat Reconstructionist

Fanatical_Meat

Posted
Posted
15 hours ago, crazywildfire said:

 

Who says they don't have them? Just because they choose not to share them with anyone outside the team doesn't mean they don't. They used to say about when they thought it might be ready but they wouldn't hit that date because of game breaking bugs they had to fix. Or something not working the way they wanted and they refuse to give a half ass version of it. The list can go on for the reasons but the fact remains when they would say those things and missed it people got pitch forks out like you wouldn't believe. Not saying you or I or anyone specific. Just that people take it literally and they have no wiggle room. So they felt for their own sanity or whatever to start not saying anything besides when it’s done. 

Three posts above

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unholyjoe Leader

unholyjoe

Posted
Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, Lady Sakuyama said:

With bandits being added. Will we be able to earn the achievements that require us to kill other players by killing bandits? 

I venture to say no as they are NPCs not actual players. the achievement was designed to be earned by challenging live players as players arent restricted to ai scripts like npcs. :)

 

but anything is possible and can change.

Edited by unholyjoe (see edit history)
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