Alpha 18 Dev Diary!!

[josefdarks]

new gas masks it would be his relive the suit of materials dangerous the suit has been forgotten it is an apocalipse that's why they need gas masks and armor and how about a subway station as a base or bunker

fabulous work follow if this is my favorite game

[Guppycur]

I think most people would agree the following are true statements:

1.) Finding gun parts and not whole guns was stupid. It was merely a gamey mechanic to slow players down from getting great firearms too soon.

2.) Teaching new players how to assemble, repair guns or parts was confusing.

3.) Mods that don't do damage are largely uninteresting.

4.) The current system at its core is fine, its way better than repairing individual parts (clunky AF)

5.) It just needs some sort of random ranges and it could be interesting

 

Given the context of those mostly true statements you can see how we fell on the design we did. Fallout 4 has all sorts of gun mods and the only ones worth a crap are the ones that increase damage and the scopes. I just don't see how to make enough interesting mods without getting too gamey "adds extra damage to super mutants", again, its even damage and its totally meh. All you go for in Fallout is the incendiary legendary weapons and its game over. At the end of the day damage is the main thing players are after and we didn't want 5 damage mods and 100 meh mods.

 

1 - That's your entire game design though; you're already preventing players from doing feats, from finding good loot and from fighting hard creatures, so your argument isn't really consistent with the rest of the game. =) That being said, I'm fine with parts being taken out, but NOT quality levels. And sure, sure, yes we have quality levels, but they mean /nothing/ without mods, and by the time you can make/use mods you can make the weapons to USE them, so it's a wash. There is zero excitement level. You removed an entire mechanic ("real" quality) for the sake of what net gain? Mods would have been an interesting value add, but they're worthless as a replacement system. And yeh, you got a borderlands guy, so it's easy to see where you're going with this, but in the interim it's pretty "meh".

 

2 - Not too much confusion over that one; it was just like literally every other recipe.

 

3 - That's simply not true. Like, even a little bit.

 

4 - Agreed, at least on the repairing parts issue. We still repair items, so I don't know where you're going with that... hell I never need a new stone axe, I just use up a rock on the same one from day 1 to day 1000.

 

5 - Agreed, that would be an interesting thing to add, but a lot of times you guys "add" things, you're also taking something away, so the net gain of 0 is frustrating to your current player base.

 

...also, you don't get to say "given that everything I said is true" in a debate. =) Here, let me try: "Given everything I said is factual, you should design the game how I want it to be designed". See? Not a great argument. =)

 

And God, please will someone put a filter on the word "fallout" for the forum? I'm pretty sure I bought 7 Days to Die, not ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, and it was a very fun game until it started trying to replicate ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. Now it's just a clone of a bunch of other games that don't mesh well together.

[madmole]

Hey Madmole !

Are you fortunately going to add flamethrower into A18?

Any new traps, generators or mechanisms? Seems like electricity needs attention from a16.

 

thanks.

 

No we gave fortitude automatic weapons so the flamethrower idea is on hold.

[SnowDog1942]

I havent had much time lately to follow the forums much, or play. Are we still expecting a 17.3 with better performance and RWG or is it on hold till A18?

[madmole]

Except cold temperatures don't give you the common cold.

 

Yeah sure, tell that to the millions of grandma's that tell us to bundle up or we'll catch a cold. A runny nose from being in lower temperatures can happen, and you have germs on your hand you wipe your nose and boom, infected. So while the temperature isn't directly related to catching a cold, the runny nose from being cold opens up the gateways to catching stuff.

[madmole]

Your statement is a huge pile of misinformation mixed with some prejudices and self doubts. It's ok. Due to the lack of Official statements from TFP (I'm talking about Steam) and several badly timed posts along with some poison from the community and

lack of reasuring console posts (which are needed now and then) your opinion turns into a 10% valid one.

 

My advise though, is to praise them. The are the worst marketing guys I've ever seen but also the most honest, resilient, true to their values and communicative of all game developers (specially inside this forum) to walk the face of earth, and these days that's a good thing.

 

I mean it, just stay for a while. You might not like some ideas at first, but the game WILL have npcs eventually, WILL have campaign, random weapons, a better random gen, better dissapearing Zs, better quests, more hard POIs, easy POIs,tall POis, optimization,... better everything. It might still take close to two more years to complete but, above all that you will enjoy some future alphas and as for the game, it WON'T be abandoned.

 

How do I know all that? By lurking in here and reading.

 

Oh, and one more thing, learn by doing was a grindfest ("drops C4 and runs away in the distance").

Thank you for the support. Whats wrong with some old school tell it like it is honest truth? Beats snake oil marketing IMO.

[madmole]

Please tell me the railgun will have a trail like in Eraser.

 

Maybe, but that gives up your position as a sniper.

[madmole]

Heya TFP. Was curious about the stealth aspect. I miss the old system where if you were spotted (really good for behind "notices") then it would show "detected". I understand the new way, but thats more of a "you could be detected" if you were making noise/near lightsource, etc. Question is have y'all decided on method?

 

The new way is the way. There are perks that will notify you of danger you can buy though.

[madmole]

Do we really need another sledgehammer?

I get that its stone and to be crafted but seems redundant, variety would be better.

 

I’d rather see a crowbar. T1 Heavy weapon, breaks doors and safes, still not as powerful as Sledgehammer when killing zeds, but faster swing.

 

Hatchet. Katana. Baseball Bat.

I believe for a zombie game they are must haves.

 

Obviously you missed the memo about having three tiers of every weapon class. Stone sledge craftable in the first minute of the game will be good for sledge players. Now go file those TPS reports this Sunday at 8 am.

[FileMachete]

Really hoping that the current reduction in our toons hearing when crouched is on the list...

 

To me, "sneaking" means I'm being hyper aware of my surroundings, so if anything, hearing should go 'up', not down.

[madmole]

To be honest for me all 5 points are false.

 

1. Was not stupid and made sense that people also find Gunparts and not only assembled Guns. Also its not bad slowing people down to have on day 2 a Safe full of Guns cause it seems every House, Dungeon, Store was the last base for a Group of Soldiers.

 

2. Really? Dont think so we had no Issues on our Server with Gun Parts and new Players , was easy to explain and not really confusing . ok possible it is confusing for the "new" gamers this people only know how to play Social Games on a Smartphone or in Facebook.

 

3. Really? To be honest for me its the most stupid thing that every mod also if its only a different color add Damage to a Weapon that makes no sense and i would call it a really Easy and Lazy Way to have Weapon Mods withouth really thinking about it.

 

4. Also with parts there would be no need to Repair part by part. Part is broken so repair the gun not the part or exchange the part with a not broken one. The Current System i would not really call it fine it works yes but fine for me woudl be with parts with quality values so a Gun Quality gets up or down with the quality of the parts.

 

5. Random Ranges? You talk about random ranges for the damage values? if yes then no it does not need that to become interersting.

 

To make Weapons mods really interesting it would need more as only Damage DAmage Damage and more Damage for each Mod.

it woudl need mods with differnt effects.

Mod 1 woudl raise Damage

Mod 2 would give better handling

Mod 3 would give higher range but reduce Damage

Mod 4 ......

 

This would make Mods for Weapons interesting and People would have to think a little bit which Mods they add or craft for the different Weapons in this game.

 

Before i bought this game some years ago i read about it and thought its really a nice Game with some great ideas . The Game is still nice but it the great Ideas for me it looks like this great ideas more and more are removed from the game to make it more and more like a Skyrim, Fallout or Ark Game with Zombies and voxels.

So just copy fallout 4 then? TBH most of that crap was meh except damage. Range was ok. So there are 3 mods, now what?

Finding gun parts might have been an ok game mechanic, but from a realism standpoint it sucked. Hey dude have you seen my shotgun barrel? I seemed to have misplaced it. It was overcomplicated mess. We're not done yet, I'm sure we'll land on something good. I'm not a fan of damage on every mod either, I just need a full alpha to redesign mods that are interesting that don't do damage.

[Frekton]

Thank you for the support. Whats wrong with some old school tell it like it is honest truth? Beats snake oil marketing IMO.

 

With that being said. Are we still on track to have 17.3, 17.4 and 18 released by the end of June as previously advertised? That's essentially 11 weeks?

[madmole]

And thats the interesting thing , you say none of your gamer group would touch teh game until gunparts system was removed.

The people who play on my server and also others in my Friendlist hate that gunparts system is gone and wish it would come back.

 

and exactly thats the reason why i think it would be great if the pimps simply keep both systems and add a toggle in the server xml files and client menu for sp games. Or offer a way to add back this gunpart system with modding, cause currently you can add back gun parts as parts for crafting but gun quality stil has nothing to do with the part quality.

 

Sorry but it needs to be accessible. The original system with clay molds, nobody but a couple of us that worked on it actually knew how to make guns. It was too complicated. Then we did the find the parts thing, but it was too complicated to assemble and repair. I think we're where it needs to be now, but we need to look at mods and random values found on guns, and what does quality mean. Then we'll have something pretty good IMO.

[Morloc]

Spears are WAY too OP!!!

 

(I just want to be the first on record to say that)

 

Go spears!!

 

 

-Morloc

[madmole]

bring back log spikes please

 

No, but we might add a steel spike set that actually looks functional. A giant cone wouldn't hurt anyone unless the fell right on that one little tip.

[madmole]

+1

Exactly.

 

I'm assuming your talking about spikes that do more damage, and not the ugly aesthetics of the log spikes?

[KingSlayerGM]

I'm assuming your talking about spikes that do more damage, and not the ugly aesthetics of the log spikes?

 

I actually liked how they looked.

[Roland]

Yeah sure, tell that to the millions of grandma's that tell us to bundle up or we'll catch a cold. A runny nose from being in lower temperatures can happen, and you have germs on your hand you wipe your nose and boom, infected. So while the temperature isn't directly related to catching a cold, the runny nose from being cold opens up the gateways to catching stuff.

 

We need a nose drip icon to match the butt drip icon for dysentery.

[madmole]

@MadMole

 

Do you have any plan on making the number of zombies inside POIs more varied? And making more zombies wander in cities? Any comment on this thread?

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?114666-Zombie-Numbers

 

We are reducing counts indoors. If we can get performance up I can add more zombies outside.

[KingSlayerGM]

We are reducing counts indoors. If we can get performance up I can add more zombies outside.

 

Great! I'm so happy to read this!

[AlyssaFaden]

We are reducing counts indoors. If we can get performance up I can add more zombies outside.

 

I acknowledge that performance is pretty bad, at times hellacious, but also I've not personally seen it tied to zombie count. Sure, yes, horde nights and such FPS dips - to be expected - but I've also seen a 100-count frame build in my queue go ting-ting-ting-pause-ting-tingting-pause as something else - with no zombies around - chokes the system every x-amount of seconds or so. And solar panels and pressure plates are HELLISH on performance.

 

That said, I installed a mod to add wandering hordes of 32 zombies and see NO performance drop from them (and it's a thing of beauty, btw to get stuck in a building with one of these hordes pouring inside: gadamn!)

 

My point being, I don't think zombie volume is as much as a hit as several other things that cause much greater lag.

 

Appreciate everything you are working on, and *looks at game counter* I now think 7dtd is my most played game in my game list

[Ouch Quit It]

No, but we might add a steel spike set that actually looks functional. A giant cone wouldn't hurt anyone unless the fell right on that one little tip.

 

Its all fun and games...till someone falls on the tip!!

 

 

Coughs * RELEASE the KRAKEN !! * Coughs

[madmole]

1 - That's your entire game design though; you're already preventing players from doing feats, from finding good loot and from fighting hard creatures, so your argument isn't really consistent with the rest of the game. =) That being said, I'm fine with parts being taken out, but NOT quality levels. And sure, sure, yes we have quality levels, but they mean /nothing/ without mods, and by the time you can make/use mods you can make the weapons to USE them, so it's a wash. There is zero excitement level. You removed an entire mechanic ("real" quality) for the sake of what net gain? Mods would have been an interesting value add, but they're worthless as a replacement system. And yeh, you got a borderlands guy, so it's easy to see where you're going with this, but in the interim it's pretty "meh".

 

2 - Not too much confusion over that one; it was just like literally every other recipe.

 

3 - That's simply not true. Like, even a little bit.

 

4 - Agreed, at least on the repairing parts issue. We still repair items, so I don't know where you're going with that... hell I never need a new stone axe, I just use up a rock on the same one from day 1 to day 1000.

 

5 - Agreed, that would be an interesting thing to add, but a lot of times you guys "add" things, you're also taking something away, so the net gain of 0 is frustrating to your current player base.

 

...also, you don't get to say "given that everything I said is true" in a debate. =) Here, let me try: "Given everything I said is factual, you should design the game how I want it to be designed". See? Not a great argument. =)

 

And God, please will someone put a filter on the word "fallout" for the forum? I'm pretty sure I bought 7 Days to Die, not ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, and it was a very fun game until it started trying to replicate ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. Now it's just a clone of a bunch of other games that don't mesh well together.

I already stated that we're going to be looking at guns, quality, mods and random stats for A19. I don't like part, I was never on board with all mods increasing damage, it was just too much work to do guns, mods and a perk system. Hopefully A18 resolves perks. We're adding back reasons to loot with top tier weapons being find only or craft with a schematic like mods, and pinks are never craftable. It SHOULD be pretty kickass by A19.

 

Our original Pre Kickstarter elevator design was a survival game where fallout meets the walking dead in a minecraft tech voxel world, so deal with it. It doesn't mean fallout in the sense of power armor and future/retro vibe, it just means an open world RPG. We'll work the kinks out. I was doing art while we hired a guy for design, and sadly that turned out to be a mistake. I've retired from art 100%, so the game play is now all mine but its going to take time to correct everything. I think A18 will be huge improvements and 19 will be amazing.

[Damocles]

There seemed to be several employees you where unhappy about... not actually showing enough performance, or just different visions?

[Tin]

Obviously you missed the memo about having three tiers of every weapon class. Stone sledge craftable in the first minute of the game will be good for sledge players. Now go file those TPS reports this Sunday at 8 am.

 

I don't think it's so much of missing the memo of what you want to establish. It's more of, not seeing the need in having tiers for stone tools and weapons. Unless you are adding different types of stone/wood you can use in the game craft with? That would make sense in having tiers for them then, or you all, are actually going to set things up in such a way that you will be stuck with stone items for a longer period of time in the game.

 

It just seems counter intuitive, to want to hold onto them, when any poi you visit, has a chance to give you something better well within the first day of the game.

 

As it is, stone tools/weapons, just seems to relegate themselves as being a last resort, or starting items, but nothing you would want to stick with for any length of time. Basically, they are throw away items that you get rid of as soon as possible, for the more useful items.