Optimize this game

[rafineria888]

Can you focus on optimization instead of adding new features?

I have the best hardware you can imagine and this game runs on medium settings at 50-90 fps (70~75 avg while moving) in medium-big POI (Two Bit Tower).

It's unplayable while fighting more than 6 enemies at the same time.

 

People don't complain only because they play this game on a average computers and don't expect decent fps.

Those who play on better computers don't complain because the game is so good that the lags aren't the reason for uninstalling this game.
But anyone with great computers should cry hard and complain because the absolute minimal expectations aren't satisfied.

I literally can't get more than 85 stable fps with the lowest settings and resolution.
It's time to go back and fix your game engine. Each year people will have better hardware and each year this problem will strike harder. At some point 7dtd will be stigmatized on social media and communities as a unoptimized crap and that will be end of the story for you.

People won't buy this cheap argument that "7dtd was meant to be played at 60fps". This is 2024, not 2008. 144Hz monitors are absolute standard now and so should be fps.

[Riamus]

Have you read the A22 info?  One of the biggest improvements for town FPS will be not seeing (rendering) inside every window of every building in sight when you're not close to the windows.  You mention a bigger POI and this is likely to solve a good part of that issue for you.

 

Beyond that, optimizations are mostly done after all features are finished because otherwise you have to spend a lot of time redoing optimizations after adding each new feature, which isn't efficient.  Now that we are nearing gold, you'll start seeing more optimizations being done.  Also, they have kickstarter required features that they need to include and can't just ignore those, so they are still going to add the new features that are on that list.  Some might not be until after gold, but bandits will be before gold.

[rafineria888]

If done right that would be good because it would solve the biggest problem but it's not enough.

I can get 120 fps in the best possible scenario (I expect 200~300) so it's still a big problem that won't be solved with tricks.

Minecraft has some extremely cool mods that improve fps with super extreme render distance with more than 300 fps or with extreme TNT explosions.
7dtd need such "mods" in it's core. I can't imagine alpha 24 without major fps improvement.

Edited February 23 by rafineria888 (see edit history)

[YourMirror]

Yeh yeh. Doom and gloom. We heard it all before. Happy uninstalling.

[Cr0wst0rm]

11 hours ago, rafineria888 said:

Can you focus on optimization instead of adding new features?

I have the best hardware you can imagine and this game runs on medium settings at 50-90 fps (70~75 avg while moving) in medium-big POI (Two Bit Tower).

It's unplayable while fighting more than 6 enemies at the same time.

 

People don't complain only because they play this game on a average computers and don't expect decent fps.

Those who play on better computers don't complain because the game is so good that the lags aren't the reason for uninstalling this game.
But anyone with great computers should cry hard and complain because the absolute minimal expectations aren't satisfied.

I literally can't get more than 85 stable fps with the lowest settings and resolution.
It's time to go back and fix your game engine. Each year people will have better hardware and each year this problem will strike harder. At some point 7dtd will be stigmatized on social media and communities as a unoptimized crap and that will be end of the story for you.

People won't buy this cheap argument that "7dtd was meant to be played at 60fps". This is 2024, not 2008. 144Hz monitors are absolute standard now and so should be fps.

How do you think they can optimize the game? By removing features? While I can agree that the performance with higher zombie counts should be better, that doesn't mean that is is always possible. If you'd have any slight idea about programming, you would know that things like threading, async loading, pathfinding and other magic things can resort to much higher quantity of bugs and conflicts. Games from early 2000's were not as complicated as today. And be rest assured that they will not remove features because you want higher framerates.

[TWORDY]

18 hours ago, rafineria888 said:

People don't complain only because they play this game on a average computers and don't expect decent fps.

Those who play on better computers don't complain because the game is so good that the lags aren't the reason for uninstalling this game.
But anyone with great computers should cry hard and complain because the absolute minimal expectations aren't satisfied.

I literally can't get more than 85 stable fps with the lowest settings and resolution.
People won't buy this cheap argument that "7dtd was meant to be played at 60fps". This is 2024, not 2008. 144Hz monitors are absolute standard now and so should be fps.

What is the average PC in 2024 according to You? Because entry-level gaming PC nowadays is probably 32GB 5200Mhz DDR5, R5 7500F or i5 13500, RTX 4060 or RX7600? 

 

I think that the game is fairly optimized. I am getting over 100-165 (mostly 120-140FPS) at 1080p frames with all High details with 32GB DDR5 6000Mhz, AMD R5 7600X, nVidia ASUS RTX 4060Ti 8GB OC. The experience is smooth so far. A faster GPU would make a colossal difference in my case. And yes it's the average PC for 2024's standards! Playing on a slower machine than 32GB DDR4 3200Mhzm, AMD R5 5600X/Intel 11600K, nVidia 3060Ti/4060, or AMD RX6700/7600 is simply painful with 120Hz refresh rate monitors and higher...  

 

For the best gaming experience, I think anyone should go with AMD R7 7800X3D CPU and RTX4070/7800XT at least as GPUs! The optimization problem then is going to be resolved at 100% at 1080p/1440p. 

 

I first launched 7DTD on 8GB 1600Mhz, i5 4460, and GTX760 2GB... good old days, 60 frames, 720p at medium.

 

Devs already are cleaning up some old legacy code and are bringing more features for better frame times. I was salty (unfortunately, right or wrong doesn`t matter because it`s fixed for the past 3 alphas) every time a zombie's head popped off on my old rig with R5 3600X and Vega56, I was getting like a huge jitter (on the stable version of the game).

 

And yeah, huge POIs are killing frame times as hell and this probably can`t be resolved without upgrading a PC, cuz more than 12-16 zeds are being activated and they tend to hit many blocks while you're hitting with 3 other mates. Block of flats LVL4 and that big tower are the FPS killers for sure...

 

High-end PC or going back to Minecraft... only final solution! 🙃

[SnowDog1942]

On 2/22/2024 at 10:12 PM, rafineria888 said:

I have the best hardware you can imagine 

It's unplayable while fighting more than 6 enemies at the same time.

 

LOL — i gotta call BS here

 

i fight 32 without lag on PC from 2016.  GTX1080 on an ultra wide monitor.  

I do agree they need optimizations but BS like that wont help anything.

Cant wait to see the improvement on my PC being built now !!

 

 

 

 

 

[Gamida]

1 hour ago, SnowDog1942 said:

LOL — i gotta call BS here

 

i fight 32 without lag on PC from 2016.  GTX1080 on an ultra wide monitor.  

I do agree they need optimizations but BS like that wont help anything.

Cant wait to see the improvement on my PC being built now !!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wow, this must be serious.

Snowdog making a post and there not being any sexual innuendo...

Never thought I would see the day.

[SnowDog1942]

33 minutes ago, Gamida said:

 

Wow, this must be serious.

Snowdog making a post and there not being any sexual innuendo...

Never thought I would see the day.

 

Everyone has a weak moment

[BFT2020]

10 hours ago, Gamida said:

 

Wow, this must be serious.

Snowdog making a post and there not being any sexual innuendo...

Never thought I would see the day.

 

Sometimes the BS is piled so high even he has to comment on it.

[meganoth]

On 2/23/2024 at 7:21 AM, rafineria888 said:

If done right that would be good because it would solve the biggest problem but it's not enough.

I can get 120 fps in the best possible scenario (I expect 200~300) so it's still a big problem that won't be solved with tricks.

 

I doubt you will ever see 200-300 fps with your current hardware. 7D2D is not a shooter, it is a survival/shooter/crafting/... game mix that won't need 200 FPS to be played. If TFP finds more optimizing options I am sure they will try to get more graphics quality or more concurrent zombies into the game instead of reaching 200 FPS. In other words, they have different priorities than you.

 

Once this game is released, wait a few years for hardware with bigger caches, improved RAM and SSD speed. Maybe then you will see 200 fps

 

On 2/23/2024 at 7:21 AM, rafineria888 said:

Minecraft has some extremely cool mods that improve fps with super extreme render distance with more than 300 fps or with extreme TNT explosions.
7dtd need such "mods" in it's core. I can't imagine alpha 24 without major fps improvement.

 

Minecraft is a good comparison as it is one of the few other games with a fully voxel word. Now find a modder to push its graphics quality, physics (SI) and enemy AI to the level of 7d2d and then we can compare FPS.

 

Edited February 26 by meganoth (see edit history)

[stallionsden]

Comparing 7dtd to minecraft lol.

You can tell the difference in graphics  easily.

 

But optimising before adding all core features  etc is only gonna cause issues and those optimisations are useless then.

 

But some optimisations are done each alpha but the big optimisations will come after they finish implementing everything. 

[Syphon583]

I'm sorry. If any gamer thinks a game is unplayable at 60 FPS, then they have issues. The fact that it is 2024 also has nothing to do with it. Games will always push the boundaries of hardware, so just because "iT's ThE FutUre" does not mean you are guaranteed 120+ FPS. For me games are playable at 30 FPS anyway. Sure, 60 is better and preferable, but as long as it's steady, idgaf what the FPS is. Constant fluctuating is more annoying to me than a low FPS.

 

I'm not discounting that this game needs improvements, but it is still in Alpha and I don't expect the devs to have it perfectly optimized until content lock. Until then, I deal with it.

[retrogamingdev]

I have a RX6600, AMD 5600 CPU and 32 gigs of ram. Pretty middle of the road. I run with most settings on max and get average of 80-90 fps in cities. 

[TWORDY]

On 2/29/2024 at 1:40 PM, retrogamingdev said:

I have a RX6600, AMD 5600 CPU and 32 gigs of ram. Pretty middle of the road. I run with most settings on max and get average of 80-90 fps in cities. 

I used to have a similar setup but R7 5700X, RX6600, and 32 gigs 3600Mhz... ❤️

[zombiehunter]

On 2/22/2024 at 7:12 PM, rafineria888 said:

Can you focus on optimization instead of adding new features?

I have the best hardware you can imagine and this game runs on medium settings at 50-90 fps (70~75 avg while moving) in medium-big POI (Two Bit Tower).

It's unplayable while fighting more than 6 enemies at the same time.

 

People don't complain only because they play this game on a average computers and don't expect decent fps.

Those who play on better computers don't complain because the game is so good that the lags aren't the reason for uninstalling this game.
But anyone with great computers should cry hard and complain because the absolute minimal expectations aren't satisfied.

I literally can't get more than 85 stable fps with the lowest settings and resolution.
It's time to go back and fix your game engine. Each year people will have better hardware and each year this problem will strike harder. At some point 7dtd will be stigmatized on social media and communities as a unoptimized crap and that will be end of the story for you.

People won't buy this cheap argument that "7dtd was meant to be played at 60fps". This is 2024, not 2008. 144Hz monitors are absolute standard now and so should be fps.

Best hardware you can imagine?  Something's gotta be wrong with your setup.  Are you running 4K?

 

I just built a new machine:  i7-14700k, 32GB DDR5 RAM, SSD drives, RTX4070 Ti Super, 27" 144 Hz 2K monitor.   I'm getting ~200 frames driving around outside of cities and ~50-90 frames in cities and T5 buildings, with 90% settings on Ultra.  The game is playing silky smooth and my machine is not the "best hardware you can imagine."  It is the exact opposite of "unplayable."

[Old Coot]

On 2/22/2024 at 9:12 PM, rafineria888 said:

Can you focus on optimization instead of adding new features?

I have the best hardware you can imagine

Well why not post what your system is!  Tell us all what your pc hardware is!  (CPU, ram, gpu, your setting).   Maybe someone may be able to make some suggestions.  I am only running 1080p so I may not be much of a help but this forum is a good community and does give a lot of help to folks. 

[Gamida]

I have an older system from few years back.

 

 

I have since added an m.2 drive and updated to Win 10.

 

Even before the upgrades I was able to play it. Sometimes my mem usage use to grow so I was using 15 out of my 16 GB of ram.

With Win 10 it seems to have calmed down and it doesn't go nearly that high anymore.

I have vsync on and set to 60 and to be honest most times it is pretty close to it.

I also am running a crap load of mods.

The game so far as I can recall has always been pretty playable for me.

 

 

 

Edited March 15 by Gamida (see edit history)

[SylenThunder]

On 2/22/2024 at 10:12 PM, rafineria888 said:

Can you focus on optimization instead of adding new features?

I have the best hardware you can imagine and this game runs on medium settings at 50-90 fps (70~75 avg while moving) in medium-big POI (Two Bit Tower).

It's unplayable while fighting more than 6 enemies at the same time.

 

People don't complain only because they play this game on a average computers and don't expect decent fps.

Those who play on better computers don't complain because the game is so good that the lags aren't the reason for uninstalling this game.
But anyone with great computers should cry hard and complain because the absolute minimal expectations aren't satisfied.

I literally can't get more than 85 stable fps with the lowest settings and resolution.
It's time to go back and fix your game engine. Each year people will have better hardware and each year this problem will strike harder. At some point 7dtd will be stigmatized on social media and communities as a unoptimized crap and that will be end of the story for you.

People won't buy this cheap argument that "7dtd was meant to be played at 60fps". This is 2024, not 2008. 144Hz monitors are absolute standard now and so should be fps.

 

This is written by someone who obviously does not know anything about how a fully 3D Voxel game still being developed is different from a fully optimized and released game like GTA-V.
I would imagine they are also someone who is not very computer-smart, but knows enough to be frustrated when their inappropriate expectations aren't met. 

 

I am certain that if we treated this like a troubleshooting thread and got details on their setup we could fix them up. However, they have not been back in the past few weeks, so I doubt we will see them again anytime soon.

[morggin]

Not to flex but, I just built a nice machine for my 50th birthday present to myself. (doing some game dev myself).  MSI B650 Tomahawk MOBO, AMD Ryzen 9 7900X, 128 GB of RAM (DDR5 2400mhz)  4TB SSD, 14TB Traditional HDD.  1000watt Gold standard power supply and an ass load of Noctua fans as well as a Noctua double fan CPU cooler.  But ultimately I'm still a cheap ass and went with the XFX AMD RX 6950 XT 16GB video card.  Still using a somewhat dated Samsung CRG9 49" widescreen (first generation).

Edited March 26 by morggin (see edit history)

[n2n1]

 

On 2/23/2024 at 6:12 AM, rafineria888 said:

Can you focus on optimization instead of adding new features?

I have the best hardware you can imagine and this game runs on medium settings at 50-90 fps (70~75 avg while moving) in medium-big POI (Two Bit Tower).

It's unplayable while fighting more than 6 enemies at the same time.

 

People don't complain only because they play this game on a average computers and don't expect decent fps.

Those who play on better computers don't complain because the game is so good that the lags aren't the reason for uninstalling this game.
But anyone with great computers should cry hard and complain because the absolute minimal expectations aren't satisfied.

I literally can't get more than 85 stable fps with the lowest settings and resolution.
It's time to go back and fix your game engine. Each year people will have better hardware and each year this problem will strike harder. At some point 7dtd will be stigmatized on social media and communities as a unoptimized crap and that will be end of the story for you.

People won't buy this cheap argument that "7dtd was meant to be played at 60fps". This is 2024, not 2008. 144Hz monitors are absolute standard now and so should be fps.

First, they make the game and its features, and only after that they optimize it.

The game is not ready yet.

Edited March 26 by n2n1 (see edit history)

[Laz Man]

Lots of optimization has gone into A22.  When new features go online, more optimization becomes necessary at times as well.  

[n2n1]

To be honest, I'm very afraid of "optimizations".
After this, the game has fewer and fewer functions. Many useful features disappear and are simplified. Biomes are disappearing... water cans are disappearing...

[Jugginator]

13 minutes ago, n2n1 said:

To be honest, I'm very afraid of "optimizations".
After this, the game has fewer and fewer functions. Many useful features disappear and are simplified. Biomes are disappearing... water cans are disappearing...

 

Biomes aren't disappearing, in fact the burnt forest was put back in rwg.

 

[Arez]

On 2/22/2024 at 7:12 PM, rafineria888 said:

I have the best hardware you can imagine

No you don't, unless something is wrong with your set up.

I play in 1440p. I don't lower my graphics settings at all and there are times where I exceed 300 fps (though rarely). And I average 140+.