A20 Developer Diary Discussions

[dcsobral]

8 minutes ago, hiemfire said:

?

These do not exist in unmodded 7 Days to Die. You've invalidated your point.

 

They are in the configuration files, but not available in-game.  For example, the plasma baton:
 

<item name="meleeWpnBatonT3PlasmaBaton">

        <property name="CreativeMode" value="Test"/>

 

[MechanicalLens]

Regarding the Intellect build, just asking out of curiosity, has anyone tried to set up mini kill stations within tougher POI's to fall back to? (All you would need to bring along with you is some gas, a generator bank, some engines, a wire tool, a turret or two, and some ammo to fill them.)

3 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

You can not simply just compare Weapon A to Weapon B.  That is not how this is game was designed.  You have to understand how the setup you have chosen should be played effectively.  How you play a pure Strength build is different from how you would play a pure Agility build vs how you would play a pure Int build.  When I max my perks into strength build, I know I can stand toe to toe with zombies (Heavy armor, Club or Sledge, Shotgun) and tear them apart at close range.  When I spec into the agility build, I am all about mobility and getting in an initial sneak attack (Light armor, blades, archery, gunslinger, hidden strike, flurry of blows).  When I play Int, it is all about making use of my turrets with my baton as my backup should things get too hairy.

 

In all of these cases though, I am always using weapons outside of my primary builds (including sniper rifles and assault rifles - nothing is preventing me in my current Agility playthrough of using the sniper rifle, the shotgun, assault rifles, or turrets).  Heck, the last time I played Int as my primary build, I was using a compound bow to get sneak shots in when clearing out POIs even though I didn't put one point into the archery perk tree.

 

If you want to limit your weapons based on the tree you picked, that is your choice.  The game is not pushing you to do that and more power to you.  But you cannot claim that the game is unbalanced because you made those choices.  I have not seen any comments from TFP staff that should you perk into strength, you are not allowed to use pistols or assault rifles.  The same thing applies to Int builds.

 

My biggest complaint about the Int tree is obtaining the stun baton.  Right now in Alpha, I can be very unlucky and not get it for a long time.  That is why I am excited to see A20 with the pipe weapons and the pipe baton.

 

So you've obviously played an Intellect build before. Would you mind sharing some screenshots (or with just basic text) displaying the perks you personally selected? If anyone is still cautiously interested in trying said build (like yours truly), they could use it as a basic guide.  Ex. When you take perk A, when you take perk B, etc.

[hiemfire]

17 minutes ago, MechanicalLens said:

has anyone tried to set up mini kill stations within tougher POI's to fall back to? (All you would need to bring along with you is some gas, a generator bank, some engines, a wire tool, a turret or two, and some ammo to fill them.)

Being as once they're placed outside of a land claimed area they cannot be picked up (so the only thing you get to hold onto is any ammunition left over, the engines and the wire tool), that is a pretty large investment in time and supplies (even with the crafting material and times bonuses that higher level Int perks get) for something that you're effectively just going to throw away. Multiply that over several POIs and several resets of the same POI, compare that to what you can expect to pull out of the poi's, and compare that to what you need resource wise to maintain your horde base and main base if separate. Also isn't exactly a negligible allocation of the limited storage space the player has.

[MechanicalLens]

Just now, hiemfire said:

Being as once they're placed outside of a land claimed area they cannot be picked up (so the only thing you get to hold onto is any ammunition left over, the engines and the wire tool), that is a pretty large investment in time and supplies (even with the crafting material and times bonuses that higher level Int perks get) for something that you're effectively just going to throw away. Multiply that over several POIs and several resets of the same POI, compare that to what you can expect to pull out of the poi's, and compare that to what you need resource wise to maintain your horde base and main base if separate. Also isn't exactly a negligible allocation of the limited storage space the player has.

 

Then just carry a land claim block with you?

 

The real cons are, as you've mentioned, the time invested in setting up and then picking back up this hypothetical "kill kit" as well as the inventory space it takes up. But who knows? It might save your rear end a couple of times. I've never attempted an Intellect build (waiting for A20 experimental for that), so I'm completely new on the subject. I'm just spitballing really.

[hiemfire]

59 minutes ago, dcsobral said:

 

They are in the configuration files, but not available in-game.  For example, the plasma baton:
 

<item name="meleeWpnBatonT3PlasmaBaton">

        <property name="CreativeMode" value="Test"/>

 

So it effectively still doesn't exist outside of mods. Have you looked at the values more recently?

[hiemfire]

Just now, MechanicalLens said:

 

Then just carry a land claim block with you?

 

The real cons are, as you've mentioned, the time invested in setting up and then picking back up this hypothetical "kill kit" as well as the inventory space it takes up. But who knows? It might save your rear end a couple of times. I've never attempted an Intellect build (waiting for A20 experimental for that), so I'm completely new on the subject. I'm just spitballing really.

With good rng, have to have the damn schematic show up or have one drop, you can do it with the junk turrets (the ones that shoot, not the sledge turrets). But that ends up requiring room to reliably maneuver so that the turret has time to wear them down, and good rng getting the Tech Junkie mags to boost the baton, and allot of the harder POIs don't have that. Gets easier after you can have 2 of them active, not on par with an M60, tac rifle or the tier 2 or 3 shotguns though (Junk turrets are Steel tier). 

[dcsobral]

14 minutes ago, hiemfire said:

So it effectively still doesn't exist outside of mods. Have you looked at the values more recently?

I updated my post with 19.5 data. Also made it true DPS instead of damage per minute, sorted it, and replaced internal names with english localization where available.

[hiemfire]

13 minutes ago, dcsobral said:

I updated my post with 19.5 data. Also made it true DPS instead of damage per minute, sorted it, and replaced internal names with english localization where available.

For ease of reference for others who might be following since you did more than just update the chart 🙂 : 

Chart.

Quote

meleeHandPlayer              6.67
Flashlight                   7.80
Stone Shovel                 8.00
Torch                        8.50
Stone Spear                  9.44
Iron Shovel                  9.67
Bone Knife                  10.20
Knuckle Wraps               10.33
Stone Axe                   10.50
meleeToolFarmT1IronHoe      10.78
Iron Spear                  11.37
Iron Pickaxe                12.13
Hunting Knife               12.20
meleeWpnBatonT1JunkBaton    12.60
Plasma Baton                12.60
Stun Baton                  12.60
Wooden Club                 12.65
Candy Cane Knife            13.20
Impact Driver               13.75
Ratchet                     13.75
Wrench                      13.75
Claw Hammer                 14.00
Taza's Stone Axe            14.00
Steel Shovel                14.50
Stone Sledgehammer          14.58
Baseball Bat                15.08
Iron Fireaxe                15.10
Iron Knuckles               15.17
Candy Cane Club             16.64
Steel Spear                 17.05
Iron Sledgehammer           17.45
Machete                     18.15
Steel Pickaxe               21.27
Steel Axe                   22.64
Steel Knuckles              22.67
Steel Club                  22.71
Steel Sledgehammer          26.18
Dev: Hammer Of God        5833.33
Dev: Super Wrench         8333.33

 

Holy crap, no wonder I never feel pressed to upgrade from the Stone Sledge till long after Tier 3 loot starts dropping when I run strength. Don't have to get lucky on drops to do decent, just have to toss in some points and know how to control distance...

 

[Blake_]

4 hours ago, katarynna said:

 

Int tree by design encourages the use of guns outside of the int tree. Why would you rely on only turrets and stun batons when you lose no advantages by also using an ak or shotgun or w/e. 

 

Since the int tree ranged weapon is the turrets, which can be placed, it is obvious to me that you are also supposed to use the non-perked or minimally perked gun of choice from the other trees. Not doing so seems stupid to me.

 

As for no traps, traps are in the int tree. You should definitely be making use of your ability to make them cheap and obtain some experience from their kills. 

 

You are setting up arbitrary restrictions for no real reason that i can see. When you test strength builds, do you disallow the use of concrete since you get that by mining?

I completely agree with your point of INT encouraging other builds/use of other weapons . My point though, is that the baton is of no help to me with a full INT build, and that is not an arbitrary restriction, it's just that the weapon is a new age sharp stick with lacking electrical capabilities. When using the baton, I feel like a human sledge turret and I do not get the kills, granted those are for the electrical traps, but still. Even with Nerd candy I feel like I'm doing absolutely nothing vs even a plain electrical fence. So it's actually a matter of either bumping a little bit the dps to the baton or adding debuffs/mods to the weapon that make the player feel like he/she is DOING something. Also INT has a serious handicap when it comes to movility, so I wouldn't mind more MOD variety to enrich the baton.

 

With a weird weapon like the baton with its HUGE disadvantages, my question to Gazz was one of "what the hell will a baton tree/primitive baton" add to the equation ?

 

His answer was: Nothing. We just love to make sharp sticks (paraphrasing, lol).

 

 

[BFT2020]

1 hour ago, MechanicalLens said:

Regarding the Intellect build, just asking out of curiosity, has anyone tried to set up mini kill stations within tougher POI's to fall back to? (All you would need to bring along with you is some gas, a generator bank, some engines, a wire tool, a turret or two, and some ammo to fill them.)

 

So you've obviously played an Intellect build before. Would you mind sharing some screenshots (or with just basic text) displaying the perks you personally selected? If anyone is still cautiously interested in trying said build (like yours truly), they could use it as a basic guide.  Ex. When you take perk A, when you take perk B, etc.

You basically do that with the auto junk turrets, especially if you have it maxed out so both can fire at the same time.  I will place my regular one facing towards the direction I am moving forward and the one loaded with shotgun junk ammo facing backwards.  If I get oberwhelmed by the number or quality of zombies, I fall back so the zombies follow me.  Then my rear facing turret shoots them from behind.  Lots of moving around to keep the turrets constantly  firing with the baton strike when they get in close.

 

I don’t have screenshots as I am bad at taking them when I play, but I should be able to fire up the game in a bit and try to remember all that I took - I won’t be able to recall the order though since it was a few playthroughs ago.

 

[MechanicalLens]

Edit: I 100% suspect that the Feral Wight is going to be removed at some point or it'll be downsized to fit the standard zombie model.

Edited June 4, 2021 by MechanicalLens (see edit history)

[MechanicalLens]

I hope that the zombie corpses are added to the roads as deco to replace some of the traditional gore blocks.  Variety is the spice of life and all that.

[MechanicalLens]

4 minutes ago, dcsobral said:

Will the screamer and the wight be updated or removed?

 

The screamer is getting update. The wight's fate is unknown at this point.

[MechanicalLens]

2 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

You basically do that with the auto junk turrets, especially if you have it maxed out so both can fire at the same time.  I will place my regular one facing towards the direction I am moving forward and the one loaded with shotgun junk ammo facing backwards.  If I get oberwhelmed by the number or quality of zombies, I fall back so the zombies follow me.  Then my rear facing turret shoots them from behind.  Lots of moving around to keep the turrets constantly  firing with the baton strike when they get in close.

 

I don’t have screenshots as I am bad at taking them when I play, but I should be able to fire up the game in a bit and try to remember all that I took - I won’t be able to recall the order though since it was a few playthroughs ago.

 

 

Cool, thanks.

 

I might start it earlier than expected, since I just deleted my 7D2D world on day 5... I haven't made it past that point since late A18.

[Fanatical_Meat]

41 minutes ago, KindaCringe said:

@faatal is there any indication of car textures being added/reworked in A20?

 

The bit of car that’s shown in the above image looks new to me

[Gamida]

of course, it's only you SnowDog who can take undead zombie cleavage and turn it into something perverted.

[BFT2020]

2 hours ago, MechanicalLens said:

 

Cool, thanks.

 

I might start it earlier than expected, since I just deleted my 7D2D world on day 5... I haven't made it past that point since late A18.

This is what I typically choose when I go Intellect.

 

• Max out Electrocution
• Max out robotics
• Max out physician
• Max out Advanced Engineering
• I typically only go up to 4x4 with Grease Monkey, I wait to find the schematics for the gyrocopter
• Better Barter maxed to be able to get solar banks / cells ASAP

 

To help in combat, I typically take the first perk in Sex Rex and Flurry of Blows

 

Survival perks to help out, especially with SP

 

Turrets (Q6) - I go with Drum, extended barrel, auto trigger, and rad remover on the one I put the normal junk shells in and Drum, shotgun choke, semi trigger, and cripple mod for the turret I use the shotgun junk rounds for.  Some people prefer not to use the shotgun junk rounds since they don't work well long range, but I always use this turret for short engagements so I like the extra damage I get from it.

 

Oh, and you are not a melee god going this route.  The key is finding / building a junk turret ASAP and using it.  Mobility is key.

 

POTs will take longer as you will need to set turret(s) down, clear an area, pick them up, and repeat.

 

 

[Roland]

2 hours ago, SnowDog1942 said:

Damn....this is totally on topic. Can’t move it away. Can’t LOOK away....

[TWORDY]

10 minutes ago, Roland said:

Damn....this is totally on topic. Can’t move it away. Can’t LOOK away....

 

I was expecting some weapon sway while in zoom mode and moving from left to right... not this...

[ShellHead]

Looking at the chart, it looks like AGI and PER need a buff independent of STR and FOR needing nerfs.

i’m a little hesitant to say INT is in a good place because the AOE effect is from a consumable and not inherent to either the weapon or a mod. 
i get the argument that INT can just use other stat’s weapons without needing the perk and i agree with it. That being said, that’s true of every stat, not just INT. STR can use rifles to cover their shotgun’s lack of range, PER can use pistols for more flexibility, etc. So that argument doesn’t work so well by itself for saying INT is in a good place out of hand, you would have to make the argument that a fully perked set of turrets + an non-perked weapon is equivalent (taking into account the non raw dps benefits of the turrets and the reduced combat focus of the INT tree) to a fully perked ranged weapon of another perk, which i’m not really convinced of at the moment.

[hiemfire]

1 hour ago, BFT2020 said:

The key is

[SittingDuck]

4 hours ago, SnowDog1942 said:

can we harvest the silicon?

[ShellHead]

44 minutes ago, SittingDuck said:

can we harvest the silicon?

It’s now used to make the impact cushioning armor mod

[v3tro]

3 hours ago, hiddenyak said:

Please provide a setting to allow for strictly HOLD TO ADS or strictly TOGGLE ADS.

 

The current implementation of hold/toggle ADS in this game is terrible. There is a reason basically no other FPS games have this incredibly clunky hybrid system. Please at least give an option/setting to allow for an explicit hold to ADS, or toggle ADS. Please. I love this game but this specific function, that one has to perform thousands of times is not user friendly. It physically pains me every time I press the right mouse button for the wrong amount of time and get the wrong behavior. I'm sorry if I posted this in the wrong place. Thank you for your time. ❤️

 

While I agree that there should be key bind options for HOLDE/TOGGLE ADS, I hope that hybrid is also an option as I prefer current ADS hybrid system. Hold for ADS or simply click for toggle. Easy to use and practical.

P.S. I  play competitive FPS games and wouldn't call current system terrible. Suits this game. 

[Matt115]

10 hours ago, SnowDog1942 said:

Typical snowdog is typical XDDD  nihil novi but @Gazz PLEASE, I BEG YOU  ADD SNOWDOG' STRIP CLUB