What are you LEAST looking forward to.

[merlinfire]

wait, a level cap? why?

[SittingDuck]

I don't care for them either but if you are going to argue genre tropes then you have to admit that this game is becoming a RPG style game or at least as a hybrid game 7 Days has RPG elements as a major component and in the genre of RPGs whenever you meet a boss enemy it almost always has a HP bar even if no other enemies in the game normally do. So you are correct that this isn't a fighting game but be careful about saying that the game should stick to styles within its genre because that could come back to haunt...

 

as long as there is no "clear the rats out of my basement" Quest, this does not count as RPG!

[Deccypher]

now there changing unity. im least looking forward to all the mac and linux people who wont be able to play on my server because no textures load in

[KhaineGB]

picking up the broken pieces of Ravenhearst

 

^ This. But Darkness Falls

[Kelefane]

Tons of threads about the cool new features, but what are you LEAST looking forward to?

 

Me, it's the non container containers... Open cabinets or whatever...

 

I don't like pieces of the game becoming static.

 

What do you mean by this? Mind explaining? Or do you mean placing bags inside containers is being removed? For example, placing a bag full of items into a Cabinet wont be doable in A17?

[JaxTeller718]

What do you mean by this? Mind explaining? Or do you mean placing bags inside containers is being removed? For example, placing a bag full of items into a Cabinet wont be doable in A17?

 

When POIs spawn the sinks and cabinets etc will spawn as showing opened or closed depending on if their is loot inside of it, meaning you can easily look around a house and see if you need to loot certain containers.

 

So a cabinet with loot may show as closed and you can loot it, but a cabinet that has no loot will show as open and have no "E" text on it. This will be randomly generated by the house itself and once it generates it will stay that way for the duration of your game.

[Guppycur]

So ... A more static world.

 

Definitely being modded out.

[SylenThunder]

So ... A more static world.

 

Definitely being modded out.

Agreed. Will be interesting to see if we can make it random every time the timers are reset.

[Guppycur]

...that could be interesting for a few reasons... Somehow doubt it, though.

[Roland]

It would be interesting to see if the open versions could be converted into loot containers too. Then it doesn’t matter: the state is just for aesthetics but you can still interact with them all.

[Guppycur]

Yes, that would be fine... But alas...

[Kam R.]

It would be interesting to see if the open versions could be converted into loot containers too. Then it doesn’t matter: the state is just for aesthetics but you can still interact with them all.

 

I was thinking... wouldn't it be best and make most sense, if all container blocks could dynamically change their appearance instead? So emptied out containers appear as the "open, ransacked" version while those with something spawned or left in appear as the normal closed version? Or is that just not possible technically?

 

The current static solution seems so unecessary..

 

 

Oh and to stay on topic: Can't really think of a thing i'm least looking forward to. I would have said "The prospect of not being able to run the game anymore, as it will get too demanding for my potato", but I managed to acquire some of the needed hardware upgrades today and will build them in next week so I'm covered on that end :]

[A Nice Cup of Tea]

Instead of them being a surprise occurrence that you run into occasionally, I fear the majority of all POIs will be dungeons. This will make looting very tedious and make the dungeons themselves uninteresting much faster.

 

A bottom line for just about anything I "LEAST" look forward to is TFPs overuse of things. If virtually every POI is just a mini-game of sleepers and dungeons, i'm not going to be having a good time on vanilla. I already find sleepers themselves way overused in comparison to actual walkers and the amount of sleepers per some of the POIs immersion breaking. (6 zombies routinely in many of the 2 bed house for example)

 

Yeah, this, and the suspicion that base defence/rebuild will become the major objective of almost every 7 days activities.

 

I suppose the alternative, if the 7th day Z's can level a building with ease, is to simply accept that every 7 days my character will die, in which case the best strategy might be to lay a bedroll away from my base and just die, and die, and die until daybreak.

I'm hoping this won't be the case, but I'm expecting the 'balance' won't be properly achieved until quite a few patches into A17.

 

MM's pic of a building leveled by a horde was acknowledging better AI, but it should also have been taken as a warning, that the balance was now all effed up.

 

Nevermind boss zombie health bars! the very idea of "boss" zombies is straight up arcade hell!

At least give us options to turn em off. If you have to invent ways to destroy bases dont go the arcade route. My opinion only of course but i hates em! ya hears me i hates em!

 

Yeah, these pretty much sum up what I'm least looking forward to. It's hard to decide the one thing I'm least looking forward to, since there's a list, so I'll just give the list.

 

• I don't like the basic premise that there are factions of other people you are expected to do "quests" for despite your not being part of any of those factions. It turns you from being "stranded on my own, surviving by my wits" to being "too antisocial to be part of any of the communities, yet still relying on them".
  
• I don't like the addition of linear "dungeon" POIs, and definitely don't like the idea of "bosses" in any way, shape, or form.
  
• I don't like the fact that there have been extensive changes to the zombie AI specifically to prevent the playstyle I favour (that of exploring during the day and having a safe base to retreat to at night).
  
• I don't like the fact that people are emphasising having to fight zombies in melee every horde night. Fighting zombies in melee should be something you do reluctantly, when all else has failed and you are unable to flee or hide; not something you actively want to do for experience or loot.
  
• I don't like the way there's now so much emphasis on ablative defences that will need constant rebuilding with every passing horde. Time spent tediously rebuilding defences is time not spent having fun exploring, scavenging, and looting.

 

Generally, I'm not looking forward to A17 at all - I'm trying to remain positive, but I have the distinct feeling that I'll enjoy it a lot less than A16.

[pApA^LeGBa]

Bosses, Factions and static objects.

 

These are things that make the game going from it´s something special to it´s something generic.

 

Put those things in the Story mode and let us have a survival mode without them.

[A Nice Cup of Tea]

Bosses, Factions and static objects.

 

These are things that make the game going from it´s something special to it´s something generic.

 

Put those things in the Story mode and let us have a survival mode without them.

 

I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way.

[Guppycur]

Also wondering about this new quest system... If it "prepares" a poi for the quest, does that mean my 2ndary base where I /don't/ have an lcb or bedroll is in danger of being "prepared" (converted) to a quest poi?

 

...not looking forward to finding that out.

[Noctoras]

Hell yeah level cap! Nobody wants it

 

I second that notion, have yet to find a serious advocate for this

[Damocles]

Another iteration of the old Navezgane map. Its like dragging an old temporary artwork along, doing makeups to it.

Better would be to make a new topography of the worldmap, and placing the new/updated POIs on that.

[Scyris]

I was thinking... wouldn't it be best and make most sense, if all container blocks could dynamically change their appearance instead? So emptied out containers appear as the "open, ransacked" version while those with something spawned or left in appear as the normal closed version? Or is that just not possible technically?

 

The current static solution seems so unecessary..

 

 

Oh and to stay on topic: Can't really think of a thing i'm least looking forward to. I would have said "The prospect of not being able to run the game anymore, as it will get too demanding for my potato", but I managed to acquire some of the needed hardware upgrades today and will build them in next week so I'm covered on that end :]

 

I think the loot helper containers is just to save the player time myself, Insted of having to check everything you can open, you now know for the most part which things have something and which doesn't. It'll also give the illusion that there is other people around. Would be nice if there was multiple of these models though, as not everyone is going to leave the place wide open.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

Also wondering about this new quest system... If it "prepares" a poi for the quest, does that mean my 2ndary base where I /don't/ have an lcb or bedroll is in danger of being "prepared" (converted) to a quest poi?

 

...not looking forward to finding that out.

 

I would like to say say maybe it'll be smart enough to check for player placed stations like a forge etc, and if it finds one, it'll locate another POI to use instead, but, this is quests 1.0, so I get the feeling this may just happen. If it does, at least you know you can avoid it if you so choose as the quests are optional, they are just something to do, other than the main tutorial one anyway... Well you could skip that one too but why lose out on some skill points in 16.4 heh.

[JCrook1028]

I'm hoping the world isn't suddenly filled with mazes left by every single homeowner on the block leading to Bosses in every single POI. Those are (like the high rises) fun exactly once then they're just tedious. Swiss cheese landscape comes in a high 2nd on my lists of dreads. We'll see but I fear all the above are going to be facts of life.

[Scyris]

I'm hoping the world isn't suddenly filled with mazes left by every single homeowner on the block leading to Bosses in every single POI. Those are (like the high rises) fun exactly once then they're just tedious. Swiss cheese landscape comes in a high 2nd on my lists of dreads. We'll see but I fear all the above are going to be facts of life.

 

Thats why I feel the dungeon poi's aren't going to be that big of a hit, after you go thru it once, your just going to bash thru the walls insted of deal with the annoyances. Now if they were insted made to be a rare poi with good loot, that'd probally be better. From what I gather though the dungeon style poi's will be fairly common. When I explore a town in a16.4, I skip alot of the poi's I mean when you have 5 of the exact same poi's on one street and you know it has nothing good, why waste your time?

 

Not to mention like the current zombies, it gets boring fast in A16.4 when every town is pretty much the same poi's.

 

Can't really pass any real judgement on them until we can actually play A17.

[Roland]

I don't like the basic premise that there are factions of other people you are expected to do "quests" for despite your not being part of any of those factions. It turns you from being "stranded on my own, surviving by my wits" to being "too antisocial to be part of any of the communities, yet still relying on them".

 

Right now none of the quests are in the least bit required so you can play a whole game and never get the feeling that there are factions. Of course, that could also be due to the fact that factions haven't really been developed into the game yet. Hopefully, it will be something you can ignore.

 

I don't like the addition of linear "dungeon" POIs, and definitely don't like the idea of "bosses" in any way, shape, or form.

 

So far I like it the way it is implemented. the houses feel just more cluttered and more to them rather than linear at least to me. I mean you can follow the "light trail" which is really a dumb thing in my opinion but I have explored a few houses and never felt any of them were linear. I certainly didn't explore them in a linear gauntlet manner. Boss zombies do make exploration dicey as they can be present on Day 1 so you don't want to necessarily explore to the last room so to speak when you are still wearing grass clothes and using a wooden club. Yesterday I ran into an irradiated cop in the attic of a house on Day 1. Snuck away very quietly.

 

I don't like the fact that there have been extensive changes to the zombie AI specifically to prevent the playstyle I favour (that of exploring during the day and having a safe base to retreat to at night).

 

That play style is still very much in the game. The only night you aren't safe is horde night and only if you aren't actively fighting to defend your safety. 6 other nights you can hide in your home and if the zombies don't detect you they just run past your base none the wiser. You can still go outside and sneak around and be pretty safe and throwing rocks to distract zombies away from your path works like a charm and is quite fun. If you were to implement a mod that makes horde night happen only once a month then your play style would be golden.

 

I don't like the fact that people are emphasising having to fight zombies in melee every horde night. Fighting zombies in melee should be something you do reluctantly, when all else has failed and you are unable to flee or hide; not something you actively want to do for experience or loot.

 

Who is emphasizing melee on horde night? I haven't read anyone from TFP who emphasizes that as being something they are pushing. Closest I've read is just Gazz sharing that his favorite base is an open meadow and he stays outside fighting hand to hand on horde nights. But that was just his own style.

 

I don't like the way there's now so much emphasis on ablative defences that will need constant rebuilding with every passing horde. Time spent tediously rebuilding defences is time not spent having fun exploring, scavenging, and looting.

 

Actually every passing horde does less damage in A17 than in previous builds because their pathing is so much better. They won't get stuck on your wall and then just start beating on it because they are stuck and can't move forward. The pathing will have them move around it and zombies only attack blocks now when they have sensed a player and have switched to aggressive mode. So if you are hidden in your base and they don't detect you they will path around it and destroy zero blocks. (Provided everything works as intended)

 

I think it is pretty much Horde Night that is the fly in your ointment Cup. Mod out horde night and you'll have the game you want even with A17.

[A Nice Cup of Tea]

Right now none of the quests are in the least bit required so you can play a whole game and never get the feeling that there are factions. Of course, that could also be due to the fact that factions haven't really been developed into the game yet. Hopefully, it will be something you can ignore.

 

I'm hoping they'll be largely limited to Navezgane (I exclusively play RWG). I'm also hoping that as the game is re-balanced around the new mechanics doing quests for traders doesn't become the expected norm as the way to gain experience, and that playing the game without ever having to visit one remains viable (it's already annoying that some items can only be got from traders).

 

So far I like it the way it is implemented. the houses feel just more cluttered and more to them rather than linear at least to me. I mean you can follow the "light trail" which is really a dumb thing in my opinion but I have explored a few houses and never felt any of them were linear. I certainly didn't explore them in a linear gauntlet manner. Boss zombies do make exploration dicey as they can be present on Day 1 so you don't want to necessarily explore to the last room so to speak when you are still wearing grass clothes and using a wooden club. Yesterday I ran into an irradiated cop in the attic of a house on Day 1. Snuck away very quietly.

 

I'd rather not have them at all - they're too "videogamey". I don't mind having the occasional harder zombie that you need to avoid, but they should be randomly wandering around like the others rather than always lurking at the "end" or "top" of a building just waiting patiently for the PC to come and find them.

 

That play style is still very much in the game. The only night you aren't safe is horde night and only if you aren't actively fighting to defend your safety. 6 other nights you can hide in your home and if the zombies don't detect you they just run past your base none the wiser. You can still go outside and sneak around and be pretty safe and throwing rocks to distract zombies away from your path works like a charm and is quite fun. If you were to implement a mod that makes horde night happen only once a month then your play style would be golden.

 

It's not the horde night that's the problem. I spend horde nights away from my base on a specially constructed platform (although from what's been said my traditional "platform made of trussing blocks held up by concrete pillars above a sea of spikes" set-up will need replacing with something more sophisticated).

 

The problem is the normal random hordes that come by at night. In A16 I build bases designed for them to not detect me and just run past. These are either underground so they run over the top, or on stilts so they run underneath.

 

But from the sounds of the AI discussion, this won't be enough any more. They'll be able to detect me underground or above them even if they can't see me (apparently the new sensing code isn't blocked by solid blocks) and then either dig down or destroy the stilts. And this is by design in order to stop underground and stilt bases from being viable.

 

At least in A16 if they sensed me they'd just circle above my head or below my feet until morning when it was safe to come out and fight them. But in A17 they'll trash the base every time they sense me.

 

Who is emphasizing melee on horde night? I haven't read anyone from TFP who emphasizes that as being something they are pushing. Closest I've read is just Gazz sharing that his favorite base is an open meadow and he stays outside fighting hand to hand on horde nights. But that was just his own style.

 

It's not anything specific, just a general impression I've got. There's lots of glee at the thought of people's bases being destroyed or broken into, and it seems that unless the zombies are actively reaching the player and having to be fought off then the AI isn't "good enough".

 

Actually every passing horde does less damage in A17 than in previous builds because their pathing is so much better. They won't get stuck on your wall and then just start beating on it because they are stuck and can't move forward. The pathing will have them move around it and zombies only attack blocks now when they have sensed a player and have switched to aggressive mode. So if you are hidden in your base and they don't detect you they will path around it and destroy zero blocks. (Provided everything works as intended)

 

That's the behaviour that I currently rely on - exclusively building underground or stilt bases where they won't get stuck on it and they'll run straight through. But from the AI and perk discussions it seems that hiding is no longer going to be viable until you've "earned" it by being high enough level to buy stealth perks, so relying on not being sensed isn't going to be an option. And unfortunately, the base designs that prevent you being sensed are the ones that are most vulnerable if you do get sensed - thanks to the new AI specifically targeting the features that they use.

 

I think it is pretty much Horde Night that is the fly in your ointment Cup. Mod out horde night and you'll have the game you want even with A17.

 

Horde night isn't the problem. It's the random wandering hordes that are the problem. They get aimed straight at your base every night and - if you haven't managed to avoid their attention and build a base that they can run through without damaging it - that means lots of time repairing each morning and gathering the resources to repair.

 

I might be being overly pessimistic, but it's at the stage where I don't actually want to reveal some of the details of how I build bases to hide from the zombies in case someone starts shouting that the zombie-fooling features I rely on are "exploits" and the devs tweak the AI to make them no longer work. Again, it comes down to it feeling like an arms-race not between player and zombie but between player and dev where when a player finds a strategy that works other players will shout and scream until the devs change the code to block it.

[Guppycur]

@tea

 

You might have missed the post to ouch stating ONLY horde night/feral zombies can sense you underground automatically. You'd have to be making a clamor for wanderings to sense you underground.