10 years in development and it is still just a skeleton of a game.

[bdubyah]

5 hours ago, tdevine said:

Also, some of my complaints are being addressed in Alpha 21, so I guess some of my complaints are legit huh?

Wait, so you know some things you don't like are being changed in A21, yet you come here and complain about them anyway now? Uh...

[meganoth]

7 hours ago, bdubyah said:

Wait, so you know some things you don't like are being changed in A21, yet you come here and complain about them anyway now? Uh...

 

And he was made aware of them only AFTER posting his complaints if I remember correctly.

 

So he did not find the non-obvious first page of the dev diary, big deal.

 

 

 

[tdevine]

20 hours ago, bdubyah said:

Wait, so you know some things you don't like are being changed in A21, yet you come here and complain about them anyway now? Uh...

 

  Actually, my complaint with these A21 specific changes were that, one, they took way too long, two, the current skill system should have NEVER been put into the game as it is horrible.

Edited April 3, 2023 by tdevine (see edit history)

[Melange]

That its taken too long? Few would disagree. That changes in the skill system are not what was expected? You'll find many to agree with you there as well. Bash the base game if you will, but try some modded versions (yeah, makes vanilla players cringe). You may just find a variant you can enjoy. Otherwise, well, sorry for your experience. You do have options.

[NBornkilla]

On 3/21/2023 at 6:55 PM, Maharin said:

i knew i wasnt fat im just big boned  😛

[Old Crow]

On 3/20/2023 at 11:49 AM, meganoth said:

There are 5. One of each type (though minibike and motorbike could be called the same type). A tank would be overpowered. A truck would be useless as many players don't even use the additional inventory space of the 4x4 and prefer the motorbike for its better off-road handling. A boat may be in the future after water got an overhaul

 

What else would you propose that would really provide new capabilities? TFP does not like to put in lots of identical things into the game that only look different. It is a design principle. You may not like it, but then there's modding for that.

 

 

 

 

For me personally it's more about variety. I love bdubz vehicle mod for that. I don't have to build the same bicycle, minibike, motorcycle, 4x4, or gyro over and over. I can build a humvee, or a golfcart, or whatever.

Also kind of funny that the motorcycle is better at offroading than the 4x4 is... you'd think an offroad vehicle would be better and driving offroad.

[Ramethzer0]

On 4/1/2023 at 6:37 PM, tdevine said:

 

Bring something to the discussion or don't say anything at all.  We don't need a keyboard warrior or a useless troll on the forum.  Quit personally attacking me while hiding behind your screen.  Also, some of my complaints are being addressed in Alpha 21, so I guess some of my complaints are legit huh?  It is good that you don't decide where this game goes, and your opinion of my complaints are also worth ZERO.

 

Ahh, now we see the arrogance and the entitlement.   You not only wanna just make wild inflammatory comments towards the devs and other forumgoers, you also want to demand control on how they respond to you?  Good luck with that!   And, in case it's totally slipped your mind, some of the folks more nicer than myself HAVE been trying to help you, and here you are responding pretty much to mostly me.   So.. all that Mad got you what, exactly?   How is that working out for you?

 

Here is the help you actually need:  A forum discussion is not a one way  thing, and no one owes you the sort of expectations you have demanded.  There are actual living people from all over world that frequent this forum that have a multitude of experiences both similar and not-similar to yours, with much more experience than you. 

 

However, if you want to be treated like a mature adult you should definitely try that route first before posting like you did.  I guarantee you will get not only much further with 7 Days to Die discussions, but life in general.  And lastly, speaking about the worth of my comments being zero, you sure do seem to respond to them quite a bit.  I'd go so far to ask you which is it really, but I am getting the notion that if this is how you treat people IRL, it wont surprise me in the least that you likely have similar difficulties in other spaces.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Ramethzer0 (see edit history)

[Roland]

4 hours ago, Ramethzer0 said:

but I am getting the notion that if this is how you treat people IRL...

 

Do you mean to tell me that the mythical beast that acts the same online as in real life....ACTUALLY EXISTS!?!?!?!

 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Roland (see edit history)

[Melange]

On 4/3/2023 at 11:46 AM, Melange said:

That its taken too long? Few would disagree. That changes in the skill system are not what was expected? You'll find many to agree with you there as well. Bash the base game if you will, but try some modded versions (yeah, makes vanilla players cringe). You may just find a variant you can enjoy. Otherwise, well, sorry for your experience. You do have options.

Well, since the original post has been edited after I wrote this (and I don't recall mention of their modding...my mistake) - makes me look more like the doofus that I probably am.

 

However, if the OP has modded the game to their liking, perhaps that mod could be shared with the 7DTD community? Maybe its just a map, but sounds like it could be interesting to play. Either way, many hours must have been spent in tweaking....something I can not do.

 

His nephew does sound like quite the enterprising player though.  Lol. 👍

[Ramethzer0]

11 hours ago, Roland said:

 

Do you mean to tell me that the mythical beast that acts the same online as in real life....ACTUALLY EXISTS!?!?!?!

 

 

It's very popular these days, thanks to certain social media influencers.  😛

[edyonline]

Looks like I should have got some popcorn…

 

Whats wrong with the skill system? My only complaint is sex Rex is overpowered, which means you kind of have to get it… but that’s being resolved next patch.

 

I like to build pure DPS. It’s fun for me to become a glass cannon and just destroy all the zombies from day one, and enjoy the rush of knowing I could probably die from just one hit (if I get stunned in a mob). Other players like to spread out for survivability. Others like to build defensively. Others like to focus on crafting and building stats. That’s the beauty of the current skill system, you can build your character to suit your play style.

 

PlayStations skill system was boring. You had to spend your whole first night just bulk crafting to level up your tools. If you didn’t do it then you felt like you were handicapping your character. It made the game not worth starting new characters/builds. Although IMO, I think that system would suit some aspects, like mining or chopping down trees.

 

Some people just like moaning. Like my wife. She moans when I leave the toilet seat up, what’s the big deal. And especially when I fill up a whole chest with all my junk items, that I leave for sorting out later, at some stage, when I get round to it… but she usually beats me to it.

IMO, if you don’t like the game, then don’t play it. I hear Minecraft is pretty good these days.

[Ramethzer0]

5 hours ago, edyonline said:

IMO, if you don’t like the game, then don’t play it.

 

This.  So very much this.   The older I get more I realize just how little spoons I have for games that just aren't doing it for me.    I think the best examples of this were Shadowrun: Boston Lockdown, Mad Max Fury Road, and Outlaws of the OId West.

 

I really wanted to love these games but ultimately I had to let them go.  Eventually other games filled these holes and some of them were absolutely worth waiting for.  Esp, Shadowrun.  Up until SR: Returns there had been NO good IP's on that name since the old console editions from the early 90's.

 

I rather admire the fact that TFP have put this much muscle into their game.   I feel the same about Terraria and No Man's Sky.  It's okay to put games down for a bit, and doubly so if you are finding your arse getting chapped up pretty hard.

 

You know what game I am enjoying the hell out of at the moment?  I swear to you this isn't a joke but I waited 5 years for Fallout 76 to be in decent enough shape to spend 10 bucks on it, and I'm having a blast.

Edited April 5, 2023 by Ramethzer0 (see edit history)

[Matt115]

8 hours ago, edyonline said:

IMO, if you don’t like the game, then don’t play it. I hear Minecraft is pretty good these days.

It doesn't work that way since dunno 2015?  Game can be good but devs can change into terrible one during next update. So no - if game change and you don't like this - blame devs because it's only their fault. it's not longer 2004 when you bought a game on DVD and nothing would change

[bdubyah]

Except it absolutely still works that way. If devs make the game they want to make and it changes in order for them to do that, and it's now something you don't like, you go find something else. Not stick around whining and complaining about how it used to be. 

 

Sure, some that have been around like to take small jabs at certain changes, and to me that is fine. But the ones that have nothing to offer but doom and gloom need to just go on somewhere else. 

[BFT2020]

7 hours ago, Matt115 said:

It doesn't work that way since dunno 2015?  Game can be good but devs can change into terrible one during next update. So no - if game change and you don't like this - blame devs because it's only their fault. it's not longer 2004 when you bought a game on DVD and nothing would change

 

Game is in early development and when you purchase it, it specifically states that the game may change prior to final release.  If it does because that is what the developers want, you can't blame the developers because they didn't state that the game you buy today would be the same at the end of the journey,

[Pichii]

On 3/20/2023 at 12:11 AM, tdevine said:

EDIT:  I had posted my earlier content while frustrated and angry after trying to experience multiplayer with my friends and family.  I wanted to articulate my thoughts without those feelings, so I will try again.

    After getting to know the game, I started checking out mods, and thinking about things in the game that made no sense to me.  I could not enjoy the game at this point knowing what I had concluded to be major problems or missing features.  I stopped all of us from playing until I could mod it, including making my own mods.  And since I had no experience modding this game, I had to reverse engineer established mods first before making my own, which took about 2-3 weeks before I could start making multiple mods and changes with no errors, and were balanced within the game.  This also included making my own custom map and using the world editor, along with third party software to make it more realistic.   The offered default maps are a horrible example of what this game could actually be. 

    This all took me about 2 1/2 months of research, time, trial and error, and hunting down mistakes.  And what got me the most frustrated and angry was the fact that after 10 years, this game has very little info or help to make mods or use the editors that is easy to find or access.  On YouTube, most of the vids cover the same crap, and none of them are very detailed.      Those creators could not even answer some of the more basic world editor questions.  Now there are sources for info, do not get me wrong, but when you are looking for detailed or advanced info, it is very hard to find.  I have had some luck on a Discord I was pointed to, but the process of gaining a lot of knowledge to modify this game is a long frustrating road.  And some of the changes I needed to make before enjoying the game again, I think should have been addressed long ago, so I would not have to use my own time working on it instead of playing it with my friends and family.

    Another thing that was really frustrating was trying to add finished community mods to the game.  Almost all of them had to be customized as they were completely unbalanced, included features that made vanilla features useless, mixed quality content with crap content, had errors, were not really finished, were not thought out, ruined the survival aspect, etc... One vehicle mod was missing sounds, some vehicles drove like crap, some had the avatar in the wrong place etc...  More work for me again.

 

1.  Nothing is more frustrating than watching your nephew just climb up to a tier 5 POI roof, grab all the best loot and come back down.  But wait, I thought this was a semi hard core survival game?  Food is scarce, you start on foot, what is this?  "Don't Cheeze", is a poor excuse for bad design.  I know TFP have purposely patched out exploits in the past, so why not this?  They could have easily just taken the 50 or so tier 4s and 5s, removed the main loot from the roof, broken it up, and scattered it in 3-5 areas of each POI depending on size.  This would at the least make players search or fight through the POI to grab all the loot.  Even better if possible, make the loot respawn randomly around a POI.  Something similar to this or better should have been a priority.  I had to do this myself, and it works great.

 

2.  The skill system.  Who at FTP thought is was good to have only 5 crafting levels and immediately be able to craft stone, iron, steel, etc, at the same level that you have reached once the item was unlocked?  This takes a "semi hard core survival game" and turns it into a basic, easy mode crafting game.  You are telling me that once I am at level 5, get lucky and find the right schematic, I can now craft end game items at tier 5 within 30-60 days or even sooner?  You also can skip an entire crafting element like iron tools if you get lucky enough for example.  The real problem here is single player vs. multiplayer.  Since skill costs do not change from SP to MP, now all your team has to do is min-max diff skills your team needs, making the skill system a joke.  My job was to build vehicles.  Needless to say I was making the 4x4 in a few weeks of game time.  Not very fun, not challenging at all.  In single player, your skill choices matter much more as you advance much slower as you have to cover the entire skill system yourself, but multiplayer completely destroys this.

   The next patch will address this, but after 10 years, and the latest horrible system that should have never been part of the game in the first place.  You should never be able to make iron tools if you can't at least make tier 3-5 stone tools. 

 

3.  The game feels kind of empty and lonely.   Not many zombies around outside of POI's.  No civilians or survivors running from zombies.  One type of car to litter the world.  No roaming zombies in a POI that you have entered, you need to wake them all up, but can shoot most of them first.  Where is everyone?  Screamers and hordes are not much of a challenge.  And I was told that the POI spawns do not change with MP?  This can not be correct.  I get the same amount of spawns in a POI no matter SP or MP?  Please tell me this is not the case.  I had to combine and customize mods to make an occasional civilian/survivor either running from or fighting zombies to liven up the world.  I did the same to add a half dozen different vehicles that could spawn along with the default cars, giving more variety and life to the world.  I changed the skill system and spread it out to make more sense, while adding more content to fill it out better.  

 

Why has FTP not put more effort into optimizing this game?  They said because it is not finished, but 10 years and probably 5+ to go, this game and its players need more effort to optimize this as we go, not 5 more years from now, or even longer?

Why can't we zoom out to see more of the world map?

Why can't we share our explored parts of the map with the team in MP?

Why can't we craft a lower tier of an item if we don't have the parts to make a higher tier, or just don't need the higher tier item?

Why is it taking 12-24 months to get an update that should only take half as long?

Why can't I change the terrain in world editor mode and save it?

Why are most POI zombies set to active instead of attack, making them too vulnerable?

Why has it taken so long to fix water in the world?

Many other questions I forgot.

 

I actually like the idea of the game, and I see it has come a long ways from where it started.  But I still get frustrated at how far it is from the potential it has.

 

 

 

 

So odd that OP managed to find the accurate place to complain about things but neglected to read about feature updates that address most of his concerns.
"I play with a loot ninja and that makes me mad!" Awkward. Dont play with your nephew then? xD
Cheese and exploits exist in all games. Nobody is perfect. That being said; devs are indeed working on features to patch that out.
Its just odd. He couldve answered his own questions if he had chosen to read some posts first instead of creating an account just to instantly complain. A21 dev log even talks about fixing some of the things he complains about.
Just weird. Why not put this effort towards answering your own questions if youre so passionate about it?

So, in summary;
1-3 is answered in the A21 devlog.
The added questions at the end,
1,2,7,8 are all answered in A21 dev log.
3.4.5.6 are answered in threads pertaining to chunk system. (Its not possible in code unless you want to crash old systems and GPU. Make a mod.)

You cry alot. Try researching more. :D

PS: Water was stalled because they chose to completely rework it. Also included in A20 and A21 patch notes.

PPS: You can increase and decrease the amount of chunks players reveal on the map via XML settings but youll need an actual server with massive amounts of RAM to accomidate that change. Thus why its not in normal settings. Genuinely, some research would fix alot of your issues and/or waiting for A21. That and not playing with your Nephew if it makes you THAT mad. x'D

[Syphon583]

11 hours ago, Matt115 said:

It doesn't work that way since dunno 2015?  Game can be good but devs can change into terrible one during next update. So no - if game change and you don't like this - blame devs because it's only their fault. it's not longer 2004 when you bought a game on DVD and nothing would change

You're missing the point. A player can whine all they want about certain changes made to a game they love. While they can moan until they're blue in the face and place blame on the devs, the decision is on the player to stop playing the game if they don't like it. No amount of @%$#ing about the "bad, evil devs" is going to change that.

 

Don't like a game? Don't play it!

[FA_Q2]

14 hours ago, Matt115 said:

It doesn't work that way since dunno 2015?  Game can be good but devs can change into terrible one during next update. So no - if game change and you don't like this - blame devs because it's only their fault. it's not longer 2004 when you bought a game on DVD and nothing would change

Untrue.

 

Almost every single version of 7 days is available for you to revert back to should you be displeased with the new content.

 

[Rince]

6 hours ago, Syphon583 said:

You're missing the point. A player can whine all they want about certain changes made to a game they love. While they can moan until they're blue in the face and place blame on the devs, the decision is on the player to stop playing the game if they don't like it. No amount of @%$#ing about the "bad, evil devs" is going to change that.

 

Don't like a game? Don't play it!

And what you gonna do with the free time that you have since you're not playing the game anymore?

Complain about it online, of course!

[Matt115]

19 hours ago, bdubyah said:

Except it absolutely still works that way. If devs make the game they want to make and it changes in order for them to do that, and it's now something you don't like, you go find something else. Not stick around whining and complaining about how it used to be. 

 

Sure, some that have been around like to take small jabs at certain changes, and to me that is fine. But the ones that have nothing to offer but doom and gloom need to just go on somewhere else. 

 

18 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

 

Game is in early development and when you purchase it, it specifically states that the game may change prior to final release.  If it does because that is what the developers want, you can't blame the developers because they didn't state that the game you buy today would be the same at the end of the journey,

 

14 hours ago, Syphon583 said:

You're missing the point. A player can whine all they want about certain changes made to a game they love. While they can moan until they're blue in the face and place blame on the devs, the decision is on the player to stop playing the game if they don't like it. No amount of @%$#ing about the "bad, evil devs" is going to change that.

 

Don't like a game? Don't play it!

nope. I bought Mount and Blade with fire and sword. If devs change hood game into @%$# it's only their fault - yes they are bad devs. This thing with call of duty since 2019

 

11 hours ago, FA_Q2 said:

Untrue.

 

Almost every single version of 7 days is available for you to revert back to should you be displeased with the new content.

 

I wrote generaly about games -.- not about 7dtd

[Syphon583]

20 hours ago, Matt115 said:

nope. I bought Mount and Blade with fire and sword. If devs change hood game into @%$# it's only their fault - yes they are bad devs. This thing with call of duty since 2019

Holy hell, Matt. I'm not saying you aren't allowed to blame the devs for making choices that are bad (IN YOUR OPINION). The original point that @edyonline was making was that if a player does not like a game, it is up to them to simply stop playing that game. Yes, they can come on a message board and complain. Yes they can blame the devs. I'm not disagreeing with you. However, what do you think a dev team will respond to more?

1. Players complaining on a message board
   • Pros: Players voices are heard; valuable feedback loop if implemented correctly
   • Cons: Not trackable (not every player who plays is on the message board); emotions can get in the way (toxic players will often overstate or embellish issues to try and bring more contention to the discussion)
2. Players stop playing their game
   • Pros: Trackable (especially with a game in EA like 7DTD, TFP can track popularity and longevity of their releases based on player count)
   • Cons: Numbers don't directly tell them WHY players aren't playing

I'm not invalidating players who come here to complain. But it's almost meaningless if that same player chooses to still play the game.

 

Don't like a game? DON'T PLAY IT.

Edited April 7, 2023 by Syphon583 (see edit history)

[Slaasher]

I am constantly mystified by comments like the ones from the OP

Perhaps with the changing of definitions over the past 25 years, a new generation of console gamers who are so used to games that are "DONE" when you buy them off the shelf.. who knows what the reasons are.... but IMO a game like this should never be complete. It should always have expansions, changes to how things are done etc.

Granted, there seems to be some back-and-forth regarding some of the game's core mechanics which arguably should have been set in stone by now but I really don't see how anyone can call this a skeleton of a game. Hardcore gamers out there have logged thousands of hours over the past 10 years. That doesn't happen with games that only have the bare bones.

I would be very very happy if they earmarked an upcoming expansion as the completion of the basic game.

Future expansions will come out at irregular intervals of approximately 12 - 15 months.

Themes for future expansions may include:

- addition of mercenaries (make this its own thing - people have waited a long time and at this late stage it deserves to have its own circus built around it.

- other expansions might include "The fight for New York City", "Alaskan chapter" where the last organized community of people in the western hemisphere defend against the inevitable.....

whatever the @%$#, right?

I agree that the core gameplay has maybe gone on a bit too long but come on...... why do we ever use terms like "complete" in modern day survival games, MMO's, etc.

 

oh yeah, and future expansions will have a cost attached to them. Imagine that?

A company with a sustainability plan going into the future.

And before anyone attacks me for suggesting additional; costs for expansions and DLC's, I say this:

If you can't afford $20 USD every 12 - 15 months for a game expansion that will bring you hundreds or thousands of hours of entertainment then go sell your computer and build a better life for yourself before you come back.

....the price of a few chocolate bars and a bottle of coke......

That last part may sounds mean but it is excellent advice for anyone.

Something your parents should have taught you before you were 12.

Edited April 8, 2023 by Slaasher (see edit history)

[Slaasher]

On 4/1/2023 at 9:09 AM, OzHawkeye said:

 

Yes, on my (admittedly short) playthrough of A20, I felt locked into:

 

1. Get quest from trader.

2. Loot POI treasure room.

3. Reset POI via the quest.

4. Loot POI treasure room again.

5. Return to trader for reward.

6. Goto 1.

 

It just seemed like the fastest way to loot up (and XP too).

hmmmm. I only felt compelled to do that until I had the bicycle quest complete and THAT gave me the freedom to move further and faster which allowed me to explore more areas/POI's

It doesn't matter what the devs do people will always find the fastest way to get to the end, without a care in the world for how much content they blew past and never got to see. I don't think that is going to disappear, particularly in younger gamers.

Over the decades of online gaming I have had many conversations with myself over what drives me and everyone else to get to the end ASAP. Somewhat ironic when we take into account that , in most cases, were the only one on the server (at least in this games case)

We need to understand that game devs cant POSSIBLY create a game where there is no "most efficient way"

So, maybe it's on us. 

You want to get to the endgame ASAP?

There is a way (or maybe a couple of ways) to do that.

you want to experience all that you can?

There is a way (or a couple of ways) to do that.

Overtime I am more and more of the opinion that it's less on the devs and more on us

I think we have to realize that "we cant have our cake and eat it to.

How many games have tried and failed miserably.

we all have to decide: are we about the destination or the journey.

 

 

Edited April 8, 2023 by Slaasher (see edit history)

[Fanatical_Meat]

On 3/20/2023 at 12:11 AM, tdevine said:

EDIT:  I had posted my earlier content while frustrated and angry after trying to experience multiplayer with my friends and family.  I wanted to articulate my thoughts without those feelings, so I will try again.

    After getting to know the game, I started checking out mods, and thinking about things in the game that made no sense to me.  I could not enjoy the game at this point knowing what I had concluded to be major problems or missing features.  I stopped all of us from playing until I could mod it, including making my own mods.  And since I had no experience modding this game, I had to reverse engineer established mods first before making my own, which took about 2-3 weeks before I could start making multiple mods and changes with no errors, and were balanced within the game.  This also included making my own custom map and using the world editor, along with third party software to make it more realistic.   The offered default maps are a horrible example of what this game could actually be. 

    This all took me about 2 1/2 months of research, time, trial and error, and hunting down mistakes.  And what got me the most frustrated and angry was the fact that after 10 years, this game has very little info or help to make mods or use the editors that is easy to find or access.  On YouTube, most of the vids cover the same crap, and none of them are very detailed.      Those creators could not even answer some of the more basic world editor questions.  Now there are sources for info, do not get me wrong, but when you are looking for detailed or advanced info, it is very hard to find.  I have had some luck on a Discord I was pointed to, but the process of gaining a lot of knowledge to modify this game is a long frustrating road.  And some of the changes I needed to make before enjoying the game again, I think should have been addressed long ago, so I would not have to use my own time working on it instead of playing it with my friends and family.

    Another thing that was really frustrating was trying to add finished community mods to the game.  Almost all of them had to be customized as they were completely unbalanced, included features that made vanilla features useless, mixed quality content with crap content, had errors, were not really finished, were not thought out, ruined the survival aspect, etc... One vehicle mod was missing sounds, some vehicles drove like crap, some had the avatar in the wrong place etc...  More work for me again.

 

1.  Nothing is more frustrating than watching your nephew just climb up to a tier 5 POI roof, grab all the best loot and come back down.  But wait, I thought this was a semi hard core survival game?  Food is scarce, you start on foot, what is this?  "Don't Cheeze", is a poor excuse for bad design.  I know TFP have purposely patched out exploits in the past, so why not this?  They could have easily just taken the 50 or so tier 4s and 5s, removed the main loot from the roof, broken it up, and scattered it in 3-5 areas of each POI depending on size.  This would at the least make players search or fight through the POI to grab all the loot.  Even better if possible, make the loot respawn randomly around a POI.  Something similar to this or better should have been a priority.  I had to do this myself, and it works great.

 

2.  The skill system.  Who at FTP thought is was good to have only 5 crafting levels and immediately be able to craft stone, iron, steel, etc, at the same level that you have reached once the item was unlocked?  This takes a "semi hard core survival game" and turns it into a basic, easy mode crafting game.  You are telling me that once I am at level 5, get lucky and find the right schematic, I can now craft end game items at tier 5 within 30-60 days or even sooner?  You also can skip an entire crafting element like iron tools if you get lucky enough for example.  The real problem here is single player vs. multiplayer.  Since skill costs do not change from SP to MP, now all your team has to do is min-max diff skills your team needs, making the skill system a joke.  My job was to build vehicles.  Needless to say I was making the 4x4 in a few weeks of game time.  Not very fun, not challenging at all.  In single player, your skill choices matter much more as you advance much slower as you have to cover the entire skill system yourself, but multiplayer completely destroys this.

   The next patch will address this, but after 10 years, and the latest horrible system that should have never been part of the game in the first place.  You should never be able to make iron tools if you can't at least make tier 3-5 stone tools. 

 

3.  The game feels kind of empty and lonely.   Not many zombies around outside of POI's.  No civilians or survivors running from zombies.  One type of car to litter the world.  No roaming zombies in a POI that you have entered, you need to wake them all up, but can shoot most of them first.  Where is everyone?  Screamers and hordes are not much of a challenge.  And I was told that the POI spawns do not change with MP?  This can not be correct.  I get the same amount of spawns in a POI no matter SP or MP?  Please tell me this is not the case.  I had to combine and customize mods to make an occasional civilian/survivor either running from or fighting zombies to liven up the world.  I did the same to add a half dozen different vehicles that could spawn along with the default cars, giving more variety and life to the world.  I changed the skill system and spread it out to make more sense, while adding more content to fill it out better.  

 

Why has FTP not put more effort into optimizing this game?  They said because it is not finished, but 10 years and probably 5+ to go, this game and its players need more effort to optimize this as we go, not 5 more years from now, or even longer?

Why can't we zoom out to see more of the world map?

Why can't we share our explored parts of the map with the team in MP?

Why can't we craft a lower tier of an item if we don't have the parts to make a higher tier, or just don't need the higher tier item?

Why is it taking 12-24 months to get an update that should only take half as long?

Why can't I change the terrain in world editor mode and save it?

Why are most POI zombies set to active instead of attack, making them too vulnerable?

Why has it taken so long to fix water in the world?

Many other questions I forgot.

 

I actually like the idea of the game, and I see it has come a long ways from where it started.  But I still get frustrated at how far it is from the potential it has.

 

 

 

Without reading all the text, it is a bummer you don’t like the game. Learn from this lesson and avoid early access games going forward. Personally I enjoy the long development cycle, I enjoy how each alpha is mostly a new game. Feel free to disagree because it is an opinion thing.

Edited April 9, 2023 by Roland (see edit history)

[OzHawkeye]

7 hours ago, Slaasher said:

hmmmm. I only felt compelled to do that until I had the bicycle quest complete and THAT gave me the freedom to move further and faster which allowed me to explore more areas/POI's

It doesn't matter what the devs do people will always find the fastest way to get to the end, without a care in the world for how much content they blew past and never got to see. I don't think that is going to disappear, particularly in younger gamers.

Over the decades of online gaming I have had many conversations with myself over what drives me and everyone else to get to the end ASAP. Somewhat ironic when we take into account that , in most cases, were the only one on the server (at least in this games case)

We need to understand that game devs cant POSSIBLY create a game where there is no "most efficient way"

So, maybe it's on us. 

You want to get to the endgame ASAP?

There is a way (or maybe a couple of ways) to do that.

you want to experience all that you can?

There is a way (or a couple of ways) to do that.

Overtime I am more and more of the opinion that it's less on the devs and more on us

I think we have to realize that "we cant have our cake and eat it to.

How many games have tried and failed miserably.

we all have to decide: are we about the destination or the journey.

 

 

 

Oh yeah, I agree, it's definitely on me, particularly that A20 playthrough I did.

 

I guess it comes down to, at least in part, my own personal issues with A20. If I enjoyed it more, I would have probably felt less locked into "racing to endgame" than I otherwise would have.