Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow

[Riamus]

3 hours ago, Jost Amman said:

A News Update on Steam I think would go a long way with the community.

Most players don't even know there's an official forum.

I think Steam news updates would be good but they would have to be limited.  You don't want to have a news update every few days on Steam as that would just get annoying for people with many games who want to see the news from all of them.  So it isn't ideal for more than announcements and having news saved up and posted once every couple of weeks or something.  But that would still be a good thing to have, imo.

 

As far as "most players" not knowing there's an official forum, I have a hard time accepting that.  Anyone who plays games should expect that there is an official forum for the games they play.  It isn't always the case but there is usually an official forum unless the game is old enough that they removed the forum.  Most won't ever go to the forum except maybe to try to find help if something isn't working but that doesn't mean they don't know it exists.  It would be far more believable to say most don't know there's a twitter feed or a discord channel as those are far less frequently used by game companies, though more and more are using them these days. But a forum is very common.

 

4 hours ago, meganoth said:

 

I am pretty sure that Roland gave us all the info he was allowed to share when he was super mod. So a community manager could only change frequency of posting the same stuff again and again or style. Is it frequency or style that should be improved in your opinion?

 

Or is it a cleaner presentation of the facts you are after?

 

Since I read the forum almost every day and keep up on things, Roland's posts are great for me.  But for anyone who isn't regularly checking the forums, things disappear so quickly in these mega threads that it can be difficult to find things.  Yes, there is a list of changes at the beginning that is updated but those changes aren't really explained very well there.  If you had someone like a community manager, or if you just asked your super moderator to handle it, you could have a thread that only allows posting by them and they could list the changes and give explanations of what those changes mean.  We have those explanations in this thread but they are hidden among all the many, many pages.  If it was a thread only that person posted to, they could have all the details in one place that is easy to find.

[jorbascrumps]

9 minutes ago, Riamus said:

Anyone who plays games should expect that there is an official forum for the games they play.

 

I just wanted to correct this line of thinking. The vast majority of players do not visit or even know that games have forums, and I'd even go a step further and say that it is mostly enthusiasts who participate in forums. Mostly people rely on social media to follow news in aggregate for the games they play. Hell, I consider myself amongst the enthusiast crowd and I have been surprised to find out a game I've played for years has a whole underground community in their forums.

 

I think TFP knows this as well and that is why they only seem to post things like art updates on social media and not here on the forums; they know the enthusiast crowd here will find that information for themselves.

[Riamus]

1 hour ago, jorbascrumps said:

 

I just wanted to correct this line of thinking. The vast majority of players do not visit or even know that games have forums, and I'd even go a step further and say that it is mostly enthusiasts who participate in forums. Mostly people rely on social media to follow news in aggregate for the games they play. Hell, I consider myself amongst the enthusiast crowd and I have been surprised to find out a game I've played for years has a whole underground community in their forums.

 

I think TFP knows this as well and that is why they only seem to post things like art updates on social media and not here on the forums; they know the enthusiast crowd here will find that information for themselves.

I didn't say people visited the forums. I said they knew they existed.  Maybe the newest generation of gamers don't know about forums but I highly doubt that.  There is a big difference between not knowing they exist and not visiting them.  Most do not visit them as you said.  But most would know they exist.  If you have any data showing that this isn't the case, is be interested in seeing it but from all I've seen in decades of gaming, people know about forums even if they don't use them.

[Jost Amman]

6 minutes ago, Riamus said:

I didn't say people visited the forums. I said they knew they existed.  Maybe the newest generation of gamers don't know about forums but I highly doubt that.  There is a big difference between not knowing they exist and not visiting them.  Most do not visit them as you said.  But most would know they exist.  If you have any data showing that this isn't the case, is be interested in seeing it but from all I've seen in decades of gaming, people know about forums even if they don't use them.

Just to clarify... what I meant is that most people who buy the game on the Steam platform, expect to find the devs and the community there.

Because that's what a lot of indie Devs do nowadays. Many are mostly casual players who really probably don't know this forum exists.

 

You don't know how many times people on Steam were surprised, when I replied to one of their posts on Steam, since they were talking to the devs or asking questions to them, and I mentioned that they (the Devs) very rarely reply there.

 

Edited May 23, 2023 by Jost Amman (see edit history)

[Riamus]

Yeah, I didn't mean they shouldn't have a presence in other platforms, including Steam or that people didn't expect them to be there.  Just that they would know there is likely a forum.  The big thing is many people on Steam consider the Steam forum to be the official one, which is very often not the case even if the devs have a presence there.  Either way, improving the info here is good even if they are using other platforms as well.

[DocRussel]

I'm a casual mid-life gamer and I fully expect any game of any noticeable size to have an official forum in addition to Steam or other forums as those can go sideways and the devs have little control.  No different than many other products that have an official forum so they can monitor the chatter to their standards and directly interact with their customers as they see fit.  This is especially popular and expected with software.  There are forums for my recording studio software, various computer operating systems, video editing software, etc.   Most people in my demographic of life are aware of this.  When my nephew and niece (both in college) look for video game data they go right to the official forums for their games, whether Nintendo, PC, or mobile.  I had to point out to several family members that Steam even has a forum for each game.

 

In life, we tend to gravitate to people like us.  I can't think of any gamers in my family, friends, or co-workers that are not aware of official gaming forums.  Clearly others come from a different place in life.  Nothing wrong with either background, but let's be careful about casting a wide net supporting ignorance to the existence of official gaming forums.

[Aldranon]

As one of the older types (I saw JFK shot, everyone was crying) I know how to search for games I like and so found this forum.

For the younger folks, unless they are mentally incapacitated or live on a country that blocks this forum.  They just lurk, not interesting in typing anything or due to the mildly caustic nature of this forum.

 

If someone is interested enough, they will at least be lurking.

[Gamida]

I don't remember how I found out about this forum. I knew of forums, I had been on one for years before joining this one.

I had never had steam and had never really played a game on my computer before I got 7 Days.

To tell the truth I don't know if I would have knew of the forum first when I started playing but am pretty sure I found out about it quickly from some one I jumped on a server with

or from someone on Youtube.

I do know that if I just type 7 days to die into search this is what I get.

 

 

What it would have come up when I first started playing I couldn't say.

I am just glad that I did find it. Between all the info, hype and drama it's been a wild ride over these past few years

Hoping for many more to come.

[Riamus]

In all honesty, I avoid Steam's forums just as I avoid YouTube's comment sections.  They are both so full of vitriol that I want nothing to do with them.  This forum may have some sarcasm and such but it's a friendly place without all the anger and hate and rudeness you see on Steam and YouTube.  I know you can find good stuff in both places but it just seems you're more likely to find the bad than the good there.  I'd much rather a company use an official forum than to only make use of Steam's forums.  Nothing wrong with them using both, as well as other things like Twitter (ugh!) and Discord.  But if they are only going to use one forum, I'd just prefer they use their own than Steam's.  Of course, using Steam's forums doesn't require any effort to setup or maintain their own, which is a big reason why a lot of indie companies do that.

 

But official forums maintained by the company itself are common all over the place, not just in gaming.  And, as Gamida showed, Google results for a website will very often list the forum right there, making it obvious there is one and easy to access. 

[Jost Amman]

7 hours ago, DocRussel said:

I'm a casual mid-life gamer

Lol! For some reason, I was reading: "I'm a casual mid-wife gamer...". 

 

Regarding dev studios' official forums, what many people don't understand, is that since 7D2D is published and sold on Steam (mainly), means the customer base experience for many players is biased to that platform. That's why I've experienced first hand that most casual players there, only check on the game once in a while (or even after years) and they don't know and, frankly, don't care, about an official forum.

 

They bought the game there, and they expect the devs to be there.

It's not a question of "ignorance", like some hinted, it's a question of level of interest.

 

And even if this may surprise those of us who are passionate 7D players, most customers are probably just casual players who bought the game years ago and played the alpha available at the time for a bit and then left. The same ones, buy regularly on Steam and have many other games, so they don't have the time/patience/will to search deeper.

 

And that's that.

 

Edited May 24, 2023 by Jost Amman (see edit history)

[pApA^LeGBa]

A lot of people also don´t want to use forums anymore. Heck some younger ones propably never used one. Discord it is nowadays. A lot of indie games only have discord instead of a forum these days. Even gearbox shut down their forum and switched to discord.

 

People only use steam forums for 7 days because there is no discord. Look at every game that has a discord, their steam forums are dead compared to their discord.

 

I hate that personally tbh. Discord is just not structured well enough to have a whole forum for a game. Searching for something is a pain.

Edited May 24, 2023 by pApA^LeGBa (see edit history)

[dakravch]

 

Good day, when will alpha 21 be released? Nobody wrote about it? How much to wait?

Edited May 24, 2023 by dakravch (see edit history)

[Retsof123]

25 minutes ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

A lot of people also don´t want to use forums anymore. Heck some younger ones propably never used one. Discord it is nowadays. A lot of indie games only have discord instead of a forum these days. Even gearbox shut down their forum and switched to discord.

 

People only use steam forums for 7 days because there is no discord. Look at every game that has a discord, their steam forums are dead compared to their discord.

 

 

https://discord.gg/7daystodie

 

[NukemDed]

49 minutes ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

A lot of people also don´t want to use forums anymore.

i got told by a teenager this week that youtube is obsolete.

i asked him what happens when obsolete becomes obsolete. that phased him

[RipClaw]

1 hour ago, dakravch said:

Good day, when will alpha 21 be released? Nobody wrote about it? How much to wait?

There is no definite date yet. The latest information we got is that it will not be released next Monday and it is uncertain if it will be released the following Monday. I wouldn't hold my breath and expect at least another 2-4 weeks before the experimental will drop.

[Morloc]

5 hours ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

Discord is just not structured well enough to have a whole forum for a game. Searching for something is a pain.

 

Discord has waaay too many distractions between me and the info/discourse I'm looking for.

 

 

-Arch Necromancer Morloc 💀

[Mister Forgash]

16 minutes ago, Aerial said:

Am I crazy?  Has anyone else experienced these?

1: All the time, yes it's obnoxious, I don't know what's going on in the background, but it really does feel like it's giving you so many of the same locations, I know they've added a new quest, and made the changes to many PoIs so that there are more available as quest locations- Hopefully this'll help chase that same gas station from being in your quest locations 5-6 days a week. Otherwise, I'd agree that another look is needed to shuffle up what we get.

 

2: I've never noticed, really. Just the other day I just hit up a trader's vending the machine, then out in a PoI [First time I visited] found one stocked with a big list of goodies I'm certain the trader's didn't carry. You specify the first time is where you're encountering the problem- Could it be you're just finding most of them at lower gamestage and- assuming gamestage even plays a factor, you might have smaller lists? Otherwise I think it's just how the probabilities are weighted- Like I see boiled water and red tea common, skull crushers and canned foods moderately, healthbars and sugarbutts seem kinda rare.

 

3: I can't comment on LAN connections (Would that really change it??), but I was gaming with my buddies the other evening just through internet connection, and the weather effects have been dark, cloudy, hazy, or whatever else they're supposed to do.

[amazing25grace]

Hey fun pimps!

 

Got a new idea for a quest after watch GNS and Jawoodle how about making a POI that has a sound system that calls in a mini hoard to a known position of the poi. And your given supplies to fortify it and a few in game hours to complete your preparations and fight the mini hoard for a decent reward. 

 

What you guys think? 

[Rabbitslovecactus]

54 minutes ago, amazing25grace said:

Hey fun pimps!

 

Got a new idea for a quest after watch GNS and Jawoodle how about making a POI that has a sound system that calls in a mini hoard to a known position of the poi. And your given supplies to fortify it and a few in game hours to complete your preparations and fight the mini hoard for a decent reward. 

 

What you guys think? 

I wish they would change the stealth mode so that sound is a threat at all times. Even scent should be a threat the way that it used to be. Now stealth mode feels broken. I can break the door of a closet down with a zombie inside and it stays asleep.  

[sillls]

Water:  

 

[Roland]

I found out about this forum from the Steam forum since they talk and complain about its existence ALL THE TIME going back 9 1/2 years ago...lol

[Jost Amman]

1 hour ago, Roland said:

I found out about this forum from the Steam forum since they talk and complain about its existence ALL THE TIME going back 9 1/2 years ago...lol

Well, mostly, those who complain do it because they have issues having to register here.

I don't know what's their big problem, but they often start ranting about having to register "two times", one on Steam and one over here.

 

I understand how annoying it must be to buy something on Steam, and then have to create an additional account for each game you're interested in.

Some games even force you to create accounts with other entities for on-line rewards and profiles (e.g.: Ubisoft, EA), it never ends.

 

That being said, it wasn't difficult for me to register here. I could even connect my Steam account to this one, so that's a plus.

[sillls]

1 hour ago, Roland said:

I found out about this forum from the Steam forum since they talk and complain about its existence ALL THE TIME going back 9 1/2 years ago...lol

Ummm... Did you notice the date on the video? 😁

It's ok Roland. *pats Roland on his head*. 

[zztong]

3 hours ago, Rabbitslovecactus said:

I wish they would change the stealth mode so that sound is a threat at all times. Even scent should be a threat the way that it used to be. Now stealth mode feels broken. I can break the door of a closet down with a zombie inside and it stays asleep.

 

I don't know that I'd say stealth is broken, but I readily admit I come to that conclusion in a round-about way.

 

I do acknowledge stealth would become much more difficult if the sounds destroying something wasn't also muffled by stealth. As it stands right now, I can quietly destroy a metal door with a pick. That's kind of ludicrous.

 

Instead, a stealthy person might defeat a door using a variety of methods: an under-door tool, a traveler's hook, a J-tool, a hinge spring tool, magnets, and lock picks. Alas, only the lock picks are included in the game and they don't work on normal doors for reasons of POI design. Lockpicks collectively stand in for a great many of those tools as there are locks in the game which could never be defeated by lockpicks, yet are.

 

But the game isn't trying to be completely realistic. To be more realistic they could implement all of those tools, given the time and inclination. That would chew up a dozen inventory slots carrying the tools of the trade. They could get around that by having a "thieves' kit" item that you add the tools too, kind of like a portable workbench, but that feature doesn't exist, so more time and inclination required.

 

In the end, you kind of get the in-game equivalent of quietly knocking down the door with a pick. The only difference is with the thieves' tools you might still have a working door. Ludicrous or not, it kind of ends up with the same game play.

Edited May 24, 2023 by zztong (see edit history)

[Roland]

14 minutes ago, sillls said:

Ummm... Did you notice the date on the video? 😁

It's ok Roland. *pats Roland on his head*. 

 

Your video? Sorry, didn't open it. I was discussing the forums and the date I joined was February 9, 2014.

 

*karate chops sillls in the throat*