Alpha 18 Dev Diary!!

[Locusta]

Does "random encounters" of zombies in the wild mean they will spawn right behind the player and make no noise?

 

I’m assuming there will be a giant exclamation point to click on first...

 

 

Loc

[Kattla]

Crafting pockets for clothing is now a thing I love to do early game.

 

Complicated farming didn't make the game rich, it made it clunky AF. Just because you managed to learn it doesn't mean it was a good design for the game. I craft a ton of stuff, just not magenta things any more. Thank god, end game was way too early.

 

Getting the seeds still seem complicated. I hope i am wrong on this issue though.

[MechanicalLens]

The difference there, is that some changes are improvements and other changes are obvious setbacks. Apples and oranges.

 

To each their own. *Shrugs* Opinions exist after all.

[madmole]

I'm actually not a fan of this. I think the game is already too easy for my taste, and this will decrease the difficulty even further. That's even besides the other arguments of immersion into the game-world. It already felt too empty, now it's gonna be even worse.

 

I had 5 biome zombies after me last night, nobody will even notice. Max alive might have been preventing that former larger value from even spawning.

 

Yes I am against this change in theory, but in practice you barely notice, there are still zeds mulling about and sandwiching you in POIs, yet the game feels smoother and faster. Its a win win now, and will be a win win win later when we add random encounters. I did add more than 17 has to the wasteland though, so if you feeling frisky go there at night.

[Kattla]

The difference there, is that some changes are improvements and other changes are obvious setbacks. Apples and oranges.

 

Think we can farm apples and oranges?

[falloutcloud]

Yes, but rather than find solutions it's easier for them to remove the entire system.

 

Hyperbole doesn't help your argument. Farming isn't being removed.

[madmole]

I don't understand how this is viewed as a backwards, not lateral, step in complexity. The hoe isn't removed, the gate of forging or looting one is. Fertilizer has actually returned and we don't need a cement mixer to make the stuff. (still, RIP turds) Teaching new players is as simple as telling them to search for the recipe rather than all the steps.

 

Old farming was never immersive in my opinion. The hoe was instantly useless(this isn't even a tool I use IRL-shovels and trowels are sufficient and serve more purposes. I avoid uni-task tools.). There wasn't any "working the land". You just hoed and planted, then you were done. No weeding, soil testing, pest control, pruning, training, adding supports, on-going fertilization, watering or anything else that I do and enjoy everyday in real life.

 

Additionally, they look ♥♥♥♥ing great. My favorite part is not needing the extra area for the plates to cover the density gap. I foresee myself using these in places where I already decorate with plants and now I don't have to be annoyed by looking at a voxel gap OR making space for the plates surrounding them.

 

Finally, I love them because in this whole mess Madmole mentioned tentative plans for the hoe returning as a tool to manipulate density. Have you ever made a winding dirt road climbing a mountain in this game? I have wasted so much time hoeing each block to a certain HP, then fine-tuning with a chainsaw, all while occasionally going too far with some blocks and having to replace them and start from full HP. God I want a block density manipulator so badly.

 

Anway, just wanted to add some more noise to the shout-fest before farming is off-topic.

 

Yes. I love it because I decorate my yard with beautiful aloe, and when they grow in, I know my big farm is ready for harvest. No way in hell would I have an ugly voxel turd block sitting in my courtyard before. I can see castles with the decorative concrete texture as functional planters/gardens/window dressings already.

[madmole]

Plus it was also one of the more attractive points of the game, but who am I..

 

You mean ugly points. Its still involved doing it, but no clunky throw away hoe, and anyone can figure it out without a wiki now.

 

Edit: I thought you were on about farming.

 

Um read my other post, you can't even notice, I should have never even said anything.

[Guppycur]

In 18 they are already a helper block where the spawn % can be controlled by a single number without having to edit POI again.

 

Then what would be the point of those POI's other than aesthetics? Is that what we're going for, a pretty, but non-functional NON INTERACTABLE world? We already have cupboards we can't interact with, so now we're going to have farms we can't do anything with?

[madmole]

Having the ability for tool tips on the station icons in the craft list would be useful. As more stations are added, it can get challenging to work out where something is crafted. Not a major issue in vanilla, so maybe make an endpoint available for modders to access.

 

When you search a recipe it shows the workstation its made at.

[Locusta]

Think we can farm apples and oranges?

 

Not without a schematic.

 

 

Loc

[beerfly]

I had 5 biome zombies after me last night, nobody will even notice. Max alive might have been preventing that former larger value from even spawning.

 

Yes I am against this change in theory, but in practice you barely notice, there are still zeds mulling about and sandwiching you in POIs, yet the game feels smoother and faster. Its a win win now, and will be a win win win later when we add random encounters. I did add more than 17 has to the wasteland though, so if you feeling frisky go there at night.

 

You suddenly healed my grumpiness caused by that topic. Sounds better.

[madmole]

Please continue streamlining the game. We haven't streamlined enough. There are still guys with a few hours in the game who are dying. Can't have that!

 

Cheap deaths are not good for the game.

[Zombie_Jam]

Yes. I love it because I decorate my yard with beautiful aloe, and when they grow in, I know my big farm is ready for harvest. No way in hell would I have an ugly voxel turd block sitting in my courtyard before. I can see castles with the decorative concrete texture as functional planters/gardens/window dressings already.

 

That's nice for you and your builds, MadMole but you aren't everyone else.

 

Some people like crude designs and you shouldn't shut them out. You keep your beautiful flush boxes but give others the option to keep old style tilling of shaiyt mountains. When you going to get stuck in to this conversation re: the your sacrilege against farming? 😏

 

P.S - I must admit, your 'voxel turd block' remark was hilarious 😂🤣

[Locusta]

Then what would be the point of those POI's other than aesthetics? Is that what we're going for, a pretty, but non-functional NON INTERACTABLE world? We already have cupboards we can't interact with, so now we're going to have farms we can't do anything with?

 

You can still interact with them...just have to press ‘E’ once now and poof, harvested.

 

 

Loc

[madmole]

I didn't miss it. I know how the system with random encounters works (see Elder Scrolls, or to a certain degree the Witcher series). Those are repetitive very quickly.

 

And random guys spawning isn't? 85% of them aren't seen and are wasting cpu, and like I said, I tried it last night, brand new game and it felt the same to me, I had 5 jerks harrassing me, I felt like I was still on the forums

[MechanicalLens]

That's nice for you and your builds, MadMole but you aren't everyone else.

 

Some people like crude designs and you shouldn't shut them out. You keep your beautiful flush boxes but give others the option to keep old style tilling of shaiyt mountains. When you going to get stuck in to this conversation re: the your sacrilege against farming?

 

P.S - I must admit, your 'voxel turd block' remark was hilarious

 

Then they could just dig a one block deep "pit" in the ground, fill it with plant boxes, surround them with upgraded wood frames and paint the frames to look like gravel or a part of their base (of the farm is inside). Problemo solved (for those who are old school).

[madmole]

Yeah yeah we get it.. You only like the shooting aspect of the game. I'm struggling to get my mind over the fact that you want to reduce the amount of zombies in the game. A game which is pretty much an empty world anyways, besides the FPS-style POI's now and again.

 

Oh I don't know, most the team dying 10 times in the first 3 days might have something to do with it. We changed the default difficulty to adventurer because 18 is a lot harder. Rather than beat down the difficulty lessen the number of active jerks and improve the fps dramatically. Rational thought. Did you forget that there are rage zombies now?

 

You guys are reacting out of context. You are thinking oh they are making it easy. No we made it dramatically harder, and now we dont' need 10 zombies in your face to feel a threat, 5 will suffice. When you run around at 4% health for 2 hours you will thank me, don't complain out of context it just wastes my time.

[mr.natural]

And random guys spawning isn't? 85% of them aren't seen and are wasting cpu, and like I said, I tried it last night, brand new game and it felt the same to me, I had 5 jerks harrassing me, I felt like I was still on the forums

 

At least you haven't lost your sense of humor, can't wait for A18 to try out too.

[Guppycur]

Regardless, you have to look at two sides. 500 players vs 1 million new players. And I'd hate to say it, but the majority of new players to any game are noobs. Idiots. Just saying. *Shrugs*

 

It's not that farming was too hard; it's just that it was too overly complex for something so simple.

 

Farming is not simple. And it shouldn't be in game.

[The Gronk]

Will there be anything triggering my Trypophobia in A18?

 

(If so, please remove all of it. It's unfair that I need to suffer just to usher in some new feature.)

 

 

 

-Morloc

 

Apparently the core engine has a lot of small holes where the playable mechanics should be.

 

Hope that doesn't trigger you too badly :-)

[RipClaw]

Let's begin morning prayer with the mantra "Hommm, I have to experience it myself before commenting, hommmm", but overall I don't mind the changes. If they are detrimental, there is a long A19 dev cycle to complain about them.

 

 

 

I think I've got a solution to this (and it seems yes, there are players who want grindy activities to "support" others and it might make sense to not ignore them). While it is absolutely too early to post this idea, well, before I forget it:

 

Basic farming should be like in A18, non-grindy and just costing materials. Because lets face it, most players probably see farming as a grindy necessity, nothing more (*). But there should be a further optional level where you get more resources from your field by regularily tending to your farm plots (watering or tilling).

 

It could work like this:

 

1) harvesting a plant produces a plant OR a seed (ration 5:1). The crafting of seeds from plants is either gone or a rare recipe.

 

2) Watering/tilling your plant produces more plants (and maybe gives a different ratio of plant versus seed).

 

Result: The majority of players will not see much of a change from now, a few will decide to be farmer and trade time and grind and get more out of the farm and be self-sufficient earlier in the game. "Farmville"-type players will rejoice, everyone else will not be bothered (except players with OCD)

 

 

(*) 4 players on a co-op server, none wants to be the farmer. Not a representative sample, just what I see.

 

I like your suggestion. However, I don't know if it is technically possible to either harvest seeds or crops.

The only disadvantage I see is that you accumulate a lot of seeds that you don't need anymore when the garden has reached its final size.

 

I am surprised that nobody wanted to be a farmer. Then probably nobody wanted to be a miner as well.

[madmole]

Oh no

But if it is for better FPS I can live with it.

 

 

 

Disclaimer, this not an insult.

I dare you to do that in RL. I DO grow my own vegetables in RL btw.

 

We have rage zombies, so its for the better. If we didn't do it, there would have been massive weeping and endless rage quitting. Should we remove rage zombies the coolest thing I've seen in years? No lets just thin the herd a little noone will even notice and pacing is important, running into a zed every 30 feet isn't fun its monotonous. The woods are still crawling with zeds, the change isn't really noticeable and I have 1000's of hours in. Least not if your on the run, I see them constantly.

[MechanicalLens]

I'm wondering, are the old-school quests still going to be in A18? (Where you have to read a note, go to x location, activate a waypoint, kill the zombies that spawn, and get paid at any trader.)

[madmole]

Why don't people start with a gun, and a mod, and a bunch of bullets in their inventory? That way they can start shooting straight away, and we don't need to have all this annoying survival stuff in between?

 

You need to take a chill pill before you join your disgruntled friends on the other side of the fence, this is just being sarcastic out of context. Read what I wrote about it this morning.