How do you like A17 experimental?

[giKoN]

This literally always happened. In every alpha. There came a point where there was no point doing anything. Your base was up and running. You don't care about screamers. You don't need loot. Without any end-game goals or a "win" state, eventually the game grinds to a halt because you've got all the things.

 

This is not new.

 

BUT: Alpha 16 never had the zombie AI. In fact, Alpha 16 had no threat from zombies. So how about testing the previous version with that threat?

[PoppaTot]

BUT: Alpha 16 never had the zombie AI. In fact, Alpha 16 had no threat from zombies. So how about testing the previous version with that threat?

 

I know nothing about modding games as a disclaimer, but I have been wondering if there is a way to bring over the old leveling system, gun system, ect from A16.4 to replace the level lock system and perk system of A17e. Just something I have been curious about. Because that would be the PERFECT game for me..... note that I said for me everyone so it doesn't turn into a flaming "this is better than that" ect ect lol

[LuckyStar]

This literally always happened. In every alpha. There came a point where there was no point doing anything. Your base was up and running. You don't care about screamers. You don't need loot. Without any end-game goals or a "win" state, eventually the game grinds to a halt because you've got all the things.

 

This is not new.

 

Yeah this is why Colonies are going to be the way to go for longer games.

 

Once you've got a base set up, let's see how many people you can keep fed and safe.

Maybe trading/politics/research could come into play?

 

Whatever TFP come up with, there's got to be something to keep us playing past day 45 or so.

 

All that work and effort to get established shouldn't be the goal.

It should be the means by which you can now tackle the end game.

[beHypE]

I know nothing about modding games as a disclaimer, but I have been wondering if there is a way to bring over the old leveling system, gun system, ect from A16.4 to replace the level lock system and perk system of A17e. Just something I have been curious about. Because that would be the PERFECT game for me..... note that I said for me everyone so it doesn't turn into a flaming "this is better than that" ect ect lol

 

This would absolutely be amazing indeed.

[Boa_2K7]

I know nothing about modding games as a disclaimer, but I have been wondering if there is a way to bring over the old leveling system, gun system, ect from A16.4 to replace the level lock system and perk system of A17e. Just something I have been curious about. Because that would be the PERFECT game for me..... note that I said for me everyone so it doesn't turn into a flaming "this is better than that" ect ect lol

 

Maybe this would at least help with the level gates. Many more mods in that sub-forum too.

 

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?98570-MODLET-Remove-Levelgates-alltogether&p=896236&viewfull=1#post896236

[PoppaTot]

Maybe this would at least help with the level gates. Many more mods in that sub-forum too.

 

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?98570-MODLET-Remove-Levelgates-alltogether&p=896236&viewfull=1#post896236

 

Thanks for that, I may give it a try! I was more talking about quite literally having A16.4 with the new AI, graphics, and POIs though.

[Boa_2K7]

Thanks for that, I may give it a try! I was more talking about quite literally having A16.4 with the new AI, graphics, and POIs though.

 

I didn't thoroughly browse all current mods, but never know, might be something there for that or very similar.

[Krougal]

Hahahaha yup.

 

Man I was thinking the exact same thing.

 

 

 

 

That's like saying you want a means to an end but... are ignoring the end.

 

What would be the point then?

I just want some clarification.

 

Is this so Modders can make perpetual night or day on their server, kind of thing?

[That actually would be sorta fun.]

 

Well, I could still see some wanting the additional challenge of them running for a short time every day but minimalizing it without turning it off altogether. If they let us make the "night" even shorter, then that would be pretty easy. Midnight madness! 12-1!

 

If it's because of just not liking the darkness, then no it doesn't help.

 

Perhaps I've been unclear in some way. All I'm saying is the ability to adjust daytime length without that affecting nighttime length. ARK for example would allow independent settings of daytime period vs nighttime period. For example, I could have a 12 hour real-time day and a 12 minute nighttime period. I could then change to 1 hour real-time day period and that would not affect the nighttime period, and vice-versa. Currently the 24 hour period day and night lengths are linked in 7DtD, so a change in one inextricably affects the other.

 

How about I ask exactly what settings in the dedicated serverconfig.xml I would use to achieve 2 hour days from 4AM-10PM and a 20 minute night from 10PM-4AM?

 

  <property name="DayNightLength"            value="60" />                <!-- real time minutes per in game day: 60 minutes -->
 <property name="DayLightLength"            value="18" />                <!-- in game hours the sun shines per day: 18 hours day light per in game day -->

 

I'll leave this point there as I cannot be any clearer. Again, thanks for the feedback all.

 

I don't think it's an option, certainly not in that section of config. It would also likely be problematic for a lot of the timers in the game, like plant growth, hordes etc...but then without looking under the hood, who knows. I don't play ARK so I have no idea how it affects the gameplay there or why it was chosen to be done that way.

 

I also don't know what setting it to a value out of range from the GUI will do. Like if you set DayLightLength=23, it would either revert back to the max of 18 or it would give you an hour of "night" from 2200-2300. It also isn't going to affect the sun rising and setting, which is still the same no matter the setting, "night" in 7DTD not being defined as night in the traditional sense but as "zeds gone wild time".

 

Don't forget Roland did spill that we are getting oodles of new sliders for zombie running, so there's always hope that other things will get sliders and maybe you'll get your wish too.

[giKoN]

I know nothing about modding games as a disclaimer, but I have been wondering if there is a way to bring over the old leveling system, gun system, ect from A16.4 to replace the level lock system and perk system of A17e. Just something I have been curious about. Because that would be the PERFECT game for me..... note that I said for me everyone so it doesn't turn into a flaming "this is better than that" ect ect lol

 

In terms of the perk system you will currently have the problem, that everything has changed to be XP based. Thus, there are no attribute improvements from doing in the base code and base xmls. If at all possible to link progression to an XP proxy you would have to define next to the existing actual XP, the effort to mod something that comes close is so tremendous that I am waiting for stable to hit to then decide if I will be pausing my development around the game or if I will work on it for our server.

 

So it might be possible, it's not likely that its possible for most modders, if it is, it's a tremendous sh*tload of work.

 

***that of course is a statement respecting EAC. if you mod dll's you can do anything you want - just that then you're stepping outside of the boundaries the game is providing you.

[Hek Harris]

5/6. Things I don't like are work in progress or things I can mod. Now, I want DLC cause sometimes I am embarrassed to have only spent 20 bucks for so many hours of play and fun

[Krougal]

5/6. Things I don't like are work in progress or things I can mod. Now, I want DLC cause sometimes I am embarrassed to have only spent 20 bucks for so many hours of play and fun

 

Shut your dirty mouth!

It's because you're so used to getting ♥♥♥♥ed by AAA game publishers that you expect DLC!

 

I know though really, indy games really do give me more for my money, even if it means perpetually playing an alpha release...

[Master_Elizibs]

Zombies

 

You'll be glad to know that in the next update there will be new options for zombie speed. Speeds can be selected for zombies during the day and night, for ferals, and for bloodmoon. Four speeds for now: Walk, Jog, Run, Sprint. All but Sprint are slower zombie speeds with sprint being the default run speed. They are planning a fifth speed which would exceed the player's speed for higher difficulty.

 

With these options you'll be able to have zombie walk all the time but ferals run but everyone runs on bloodmoon. Or Run during the day but walk at night. Or Everyone jogs to increase POI pressure. or whatever strikes your fancy.

 

Roland, I think that is a good solution for those who want more extreme challenges, I personally think the amount of zombies in the game more then make up for their speed. not to mention the traps, unique POI generation is awesome.

[PoppaTot]

In terms of the perk system you will currently have the problem, that everything has changed to be XP based. Thus, there are no attribute improvements from doing in the base code and base xmls. If at all possible to link progression to an XP proxy you would have to define next to the existing actual XP, the effort to mod something that comes close is so tremendous that I am waiting for stable to hit to then decide if I will be pausing my development around the game or if I will work on it for our server.

 

So it might be possible, it's not likely that its possible for most modders, if it is, it's a tremendous sh*tload of work.

 

***that of course is a statement respecting EAC. if you mod dll's you can do anything you want - just that then you're stepping outside of the boundaries the game is providing you.

 

I honestly didn't think it would be easy to haha. Was just curious if it is possible. I would even re-pay my $20ish for the game to have the option lol. Most likely it won't happen, but it would be cool

[AnsontheToad]

A17 has brought in some really great features and improvements. But also some changes that I personally haven't cared much for.

 

One major improvement for my friends and I has been the party system. Being able to group up with friends and share xp is a very welcome addition and adds to the enjoyment of the game.

 

The Zombie AI although not perfect is also a good change in the right direction. The increased damage done to blocks by zombies maybe not so much and increasing the health of wooden blocks but removing a break stage from concrete for balance was confusing for me.

 

The new vehicles and vehicle physics is a nice upgrade some improvements could still be made but heading in a good direction.

 

Progression system still needs work a good blend between the old system and the new would be nice. I liked the old get better at what your doing system better than the new just kill zombies for xp system. But I like the newer perk tree a bit better.

 

Like the weapon mods system a lot. It adds customization and more things to build and search for. customization is always great in games.

 

Greatly dislike the random gen right now its extremely limited and nearly pointless without mods.

 

But so far really my favorite change has been with the introduction to xpath for the modding community. This is a very crucial change to the longevity of this game and the more they add to make modding easier and more powerful the better this will allow the community to keep this game going for a long time.

[Kِbi1588034159]

Hello! First time poster here. (Only played since 16, not hc 7dtd gamer, under 300 hours) How do I feel about it:

 

Honestly it feels now a bit like a "cheap cellphone paywall" strategy kinda game. Except with no pay to win. You know like those thrash games that make you wait 2 hours and then you get some more xp, or just buy them. Thats generally my feeling. Like propably great for gamers that have hundreds of hours to spend (like wow gamers) or so.

 

I feel like I have lost a ton of freedom in the game. I mean what about teams that want to split up spezialisations? (I only play single, but still.) I feel funneled into idk... Why do I have to be a certain level to get things? What about if I want to do my (stupid) way and stay weak in one area (and propably die, but on my terms) but have a car and be happy?

 

Why cant I find a (totally out of level) gun or tool that excites me (as far as I understand it, for example a level 5 guns impact is only determined by the holder, and not by the gun... And I think that pretty much defies the purpose of levels for guns... I totally loved the excitement when I found a certain level object! And was able to combine level-up my things!

 

I like looting and leveling! Turns out I like looting more... But clearing a building for like 2 hours for some... Loot. Its just not worth it anymore...

 

I dont think I will ever get to the point where I will try out all those building blocks... In fact I propably wont even stick around untill I get to make blade traps and turrets... I mean if I have to kill 20 ferels, 10 radiateds, and 40 zs just to get the brass for 10 bullets, then its just not worth it

 

It feels now like an uphill battle that you never can win (because when you get better, the zs get better and twice as much). It feels like everything is AI tailored to your character, and strapped to keep you in your "zone". (Like when you have level 1 or 2, every drop or loot is automatically level 1 or 2, etc.)

 

It kinda feels like it is for zombies now. Dont be creative, dont deviate from the line! Just pour as many hours into it as you can... Just lika any modern media trap. Keep the customer as long as possible and waste as many hours of him as you can... Sucess! - Or is it?

 

I feel like you let us "run the gauntlet" just for "running the gauntlets" sake... But whats the point?

 

 

Ok that all sounded a bit negative, as I have to confess, as I re-read it. - I was honest.

But dont get me all wrong. I still like it. (Dont love it anymore though.) I think the new AI will make tower defence possible, that I always dreamt of! Vehicles are great! I had a great time figuring out all the new mechanics, etc!

Loved 17 at first! But tbh... I think those people are right. Overall the feel is not as cool anymore. (Even if gameplay, graphics, pois, and a lot of stuff is way better.)

[joeevaristo]

Got to say, as a dev (and a one time game dev at that!), I know you shouldn't read overly negative opinions of your work. It's so tempting though to see if there is genuine feedback or just ill advised shade being given. After going through this thread a little, there are a lot of people losing their sh*t over what are minor things that are fairly easily fixed and/or balanced. Many provide explicit claims that are questionable at best or simply subjective dislikes and throw them up as examples of the game going to hell in a handcart. You'd think TFP had taken your grandmother out to dinner and not only refused to call her back the next night but pissed in her drink when she wasn't looking.

 

Ultimately I hope TFP enjoy this thread, not for the negatives (or even the positives) but for the sheer lunacy some of the fan base can adopt.

 

Before A17e, the last time I came around to the forums was for A16e. I'm reasonably sure I recognize the most vehement "A17 is the worst ever, A16 was the best!!11one!!" commenters making the same claims about how "A16e is the worst ever, A15 was the best!!!one11!!"

[Stranded_Napkin]

Has anyone else had weird aiming issues with the compound bow? I aim directly at the zed's heads and when I release the button it shoots wide right. I thought it might be me but it does it nearly every time despite me making sure my mouse does not move at all. It's like it starts the animation of moving the bow back to its rest position before the shot is actually taken. Couple this with the game's instability with the minibike and things have gotten frustrating.

[meganoth]

Because of the way the settings work. The shortest you can set nighttime to is 6 hours, which no matter how long you set the day length to, the night is 25% of that.

 

Well, that might be true for the SP options menue. But if you start a dedicated server and edit serverconfig.xml you can go higher. Just tested it. Started a new game with a night of only two hours. At 22:00 the night began, at 0:00 the night ended. And not only did the zombies not run anymore, but the sun really came up.

 

How about I ask exactly what settings in the dedicated serverconfig.xml I would use to achieve 2 hour days from 4AM-10PM and a 20 minute night from 10PM-4AM?

 

  <property name="DayNightLength"			value="60" />				<!-- real time minutes per in game day: 60 minutes -->
 <property name="DayLightLength"			value="18" />				<!-- in game hours the sun shines per day: 18 hours day light per in game day -->

 

I'll leave this point there as I cannot be any clearer. Again, thanks for the feedback all.

 

You are right that you can't have a clock that runs faster at night. But if all you want is 2 hours of light and about 20 minutes of darkness and running zombies, then DayNightLength=140 and DayLightLength=20 will give you 23.3 minutes of night. DayLightLength=21 will give you 17.5 minutes of night.

[BloodDeacon]

Went with "mixed" because there are a lot little steps forward, or at the very worst lateral in nature, one major step forward with zombie and combat mechanics, and one giant step backwards with the dumbed-down...er streamlined progression system. I'd almost certainly be in the "general love" category were it not for that particular issue.

[Vomkat]

I average 2 levels per game day, and worry that it will take 100+ hours just to get to where I feel like I'm at "end game" with electricity, traps, turrets, and a nigh-impregnable base.

 

Try creative mode.

[calebelt]

Why is everyone afraid of zombies? Very primitive AI. I've been waiting a year and a half for 17 to come up with a new AI.

 

Impregnable base can be built very quickly if you understand how to work AI zombies. They're stupid and direct. They're also very slow. Even from running zombies you can easily strafe and make them get stuck in objects and other zombies.

 

You can make ladders and laugh by shooting stupid zombies. You can dig a cave at the bottom, and put on top of the cage and barbed wire that would shoot at the stuck zombies. You can put spinning traps on top of each other to the top hit on the head, and the bottom on the legs. You can make the base triangular and one wall next to the seller. It is possible to dig out a hole and from above a lattice through which to shoot. You can dig a mine in which zombies will fall and just forget about them. And you can just climb on the roof of a stone building and jump on the stairs sideways (zombies do not know how), they will destroy a few blocks in the walls and all you can live there forever.

 

Personally, I want the game to focus on AI zombies, from which it is impossible to hide and impossible to build an indestructible base. I don't understand "survival" for a spoon in vanilla yogurt. "Oh, please make it scary, but behind the fence".

 

The player must always build and rebuild the base. Each time the Horde must become stronger and sweep away any obstacles on its way. This is what makes sense: 7 days to prepare. And then to the last bullet, the last trap, the last block of the wall and eventually fight with a chainsaw.

 

I want like in the movies. To adrenaline boiled.

[InSanity]

So far so good overall, I have some gripes with the quality system and loot tables as far as early game tools and especially weapons are concerned, however, I have been enjoying this iteration quite a bit and look forward to playing more as the game progresses further. Glad to finally have gotten the new alpha and will absolutely play when I can in the future.

[HerrKingsley]

Try creative mode.

Try to be in a creative mode when replying.

[Kam R.]

Mention of creative mode reminds me:

No more fast flying and weird wobbling/jittering of the vision when strafing – what's up with that?

[Vedui]

Overall I like it, it's got a number of things that opens up possibilities which are fantastic! Mods? xpath modlets? New buffs? Yummy!

 

What I dislike are generally things that can be tweaked and balanced, but some significant ones are:

 

1) Slow tedious progression. Can be fixed by increasing resource yield, and bumping xp for actually non-killing stuff.

 

2) Zombie AI. The new pathing is great.. for POI's. For hordes it's terrible. A ramp/stilt base or maze/pathing base works 100x a base design from previous alphas. A bunker? nah sucks. Make a ramp up instead and see them lemming and fall. - This is a bit harder to fix, I'd start by keeping the new ai pathing to poi sleepers, but hordes stop pathing the crazy way they do now, stop them all digging and detecting players 100 blocks underground. Let us have our bases please! They all run to the same place and bash through now, or gang up and do so much damage to walls that have less HP than before. It's a disaster in combination.

 

3) Difficulty scaling seems off. I like idea of harder/easier POI's to explore, but it seems as you gain levels it becomes the same problem as A16, meaning radiated cops/wights/ferals in every room, with 30 in a house. If it was 5 in the house with 1 radiated fine, but people literally enter rooms and see multiple radiated. That makes exploration mid-late game pointless and tedious, as you're not gonna find 200 bullets in loot, and you'll use that to kill the zombies.

 

4) It seems there's been great thoughts to negate players playstyle so people who play a certain way can't. As opposed to expanding the way people like to play. I think that causes issues, as people play differently.

 

Like to build? Sorry. Zeds tear the base down during hordes.

 

Like to solo? Sorry, level gating is real.

 

Like to mine and gather? Sorry, no xp for you! (or resources for that matter)

 

Love underground city building? Sorry, zeds WILL dig down and wreck it, no place is safe.

 

Love to explore and fight? Wonderful! Just don't be too high level, or too low level, or lack weapons, or lack stamina, and you're good!

 

So the "foundation" in A17 is great. But it requires tweaks to bring back possibility for people to play the game they way they want to, like they could in previous games. So I'm optimistic!

 

/V -