A20 Developer Diary Discussions

[MechanicalLens]

Is anyone else finding the A9.5 Twitch stream (advertised on the first page of this forum) isn't loading up? Is it no longer available for viewing?

[Morloc]

2 hours ago, Laz Man said:

Good things come to those who wait.  😄

 

My customers at work have dedicated sticks and straps they hit me with when I try to tell them that.

 

 

-Morloc

[Roland]

3 hours ago, dcsobral said:

First came big momma's underbritches. Then hawaiian's belly jiggle. Now rad-man's popping pustules... where is it going to stop? WHEN IS IT GOING TO END??? 

Until Trader Jen gets improved it should not end. Although...we could talk about priorities....

24 minutes ago, Morloc said:

 

My customers at work have dedicated sticks and straps they hit me with when I try to tell them that.

 

 

-Morloc

 

That's the nice thing about the internet. We can all be Unwelcome Motivational Statement Keyboard Warriors. You would never say uplifting team building things face to face with cynical employees but you can to the avatar masses on the internet.

 

Carpe Diem, Morloc! I believe in you!!!

[Morloc]

1 hour ago, Roland said:

You would never say uplifting team building things face to face with cynical employees but you can to the avatar masses on the internet.

 

 

True...and the virtual sticks and straps hurt a lot less than the real ones! 🤔

 

 

-Morloc

[meganoth]

23 hours ago, Blake_ said:

Well... except traders. They are far down in the "non-priority" issue list though. In the meantime, we should tag it "Almost fully destroyable" or "You can destroy everything within the sandbox from bedrock upwards, 'butt' not really".

 

As soon as Call of Duty tags its game as "Almost rail shooter" or "You can shoot except when we show you a cut scene".

 

And while we are at it TFP should not call 7D2D a "zombie horror crafting tower defense game" but a "zombie horror except when you see bandits or are in the options menue crafting except if you find the stuff while scrounging tower defense except for 6 out of 7 days game".

 

Edited June 27, 2021 by meganoth (see edit history)

[meganoth]

16 hours ago, Matt115 said:

well, yesterday was deppresing day so sorry for that 😅 well changing game in this same series sometimes can be soo good like - resident evil 4 and 8 . well honestly 7dtd have a "chance" to have something like resident evil. i mean - 7dtd as sandbox , 7 hour to die - linear shooter focused on story like = you are marine and you have quiet easy job - transport some docs somewhere. but something going wrong - duke take off convoy and zombie outbrake is begun. well honestly i don't remember what i wanted when i was making older post but it was just bad day

 

No problem, everyone can post his opinion, even on a bad day. I was just pointing out that you will have a hard time convincing the current players of such a massive redesign of the game since they follow this game because of what it is.

 

And that it is virtually impossible that TFP will follow your advice as it would practically mean extending the development of the game by a few years when they actually want to finish this one as soon as possible. AND they would get all the people who backed them on kickstarter up on barricades because at least fully destroyable terrain was promised as early as that.

 

The story is just one part of what makes a game great. If TFP copies Resident Evil's story it doesn't mean there will be a game just as good as RE. Look at movies where the story is even more important. A movie like "Die Hard" immediately generated a whole genre of copycat movies who tried to have the same success by simply following the same story with a few changes. But with a few exceptions the copies are just uninspired and largely boring action movies. It is the whole package of a movie or game that makes it good or bad, not just the story or some other part that seems important for THAT game.

 

 

 

[meganoth]

21 hours ago, DanLW said:

I suppose they can still be engineering if they are feature locked, but that means they are only engineering features that they have a high degree of confidence they can deliver on for this Alpha.

 

See the first page of the dev diary, only features that they have a high degree of confidence of them being in A20 are listed there. And you also can see some of them are pushed back to A21 because the degree ultimately wasn't high enough 😉 ). But many of those features are probably still in development, at least I would guess the random gen update isn't completely finished yet and might be the part that is keeping A20 from being dropped on us.

 

21 hours ago, DanLW said:

 

If they aren't feature locked, that means that the door is still open for new features to be added.

 

If they are debugging, that would mean features are locked and engineering is finished or almost finished and all they are doing is getting the already engineered features to work reliably and performantly.

 

All you can say is that when features are locked and engineering is finished, THEN they are only debugging. But you usually can't deduce from debugging activity that they are finished with all else. Not in reality, not in the gaming industry. There is no such strict adherence to ideal development philosophies.

 

[Matt115]

19 minutes ago, meganoth said:

 

No problem, everyone can post his opinion, even on a bad day. I was just pointing out that you will have a hard time convincing the current players of such a massive redesign of the game since they follow this game because of what it is.

 

And that it is virtually impossible that TFP will follow your advice as it would practically mean extending the development of the game by a few years when they actually want to finish this one as soon as possible. AND they would get all the people who backed them on kickstarter up on barricades because at least fully destroyable terrain was promised as early as that.

 

The story is just one part of what makes a game great. If TFP copies Resident Evil's story it doesn't mean there will be a game just as good as RE. Look at movies where the story is even more important. A movie like "Die Hard" immediately generated a whole genre of copycat movies who tried to have the same success by simply following the same story with a few changes. But with a few exceptions the copies are just uninspired and largely boring action movies. It is the whole package of a movie or game that makes it good or bad, not just the story or some other part that seems important for THAT game.

 

 

 

honestly i'm glad they decided to cut dt because it would be waste of time . Well i know it is too late for redesign. and quiet forget what was in kickstarted so i think what could be the best solution :  Just put two mods - sandbox  - current gameplay style with lore stuff  like : crashed helicopters with scientists , notes on walls  and story mode - limited destoyable map ( bunkers,  lore builidings) focused on story -quests, factions  like stalker for example.  Well i think  7dtd could be have a big problem with story like re - open worlds make more problems - so ds and the forest style could be the best option with add of l4d2 drawnings on walls, notes ( death center hotel) photos etc.  but 7dtd universe can be quiet realistic option - i see now 3 types of new games in this world . 1. another 7dtd but in diffferent place - big city , island , more swampy terrain 2. more typical fps with zombie and bandits 3 something like shery parts mixed with last of use from re7 - you play as survived orphan and you are trying to get somewhere because something.

[samljer]

On 6/25/2021 at 11:52 PM, unholyjoe said:

glad for your excitement and for others there with you.

 

a20 almost finished... uh no.. lots to do, we are just getting closer tho.

 

when it is ready it will be posted here on our forum , probably in twitter and facebook.

 

no dates (been that way for a long time and not changing) closest thing is soon or the old ... never mind i wont say it

 

next game(s) top secret and heavily guarded (our own artists dont know what they are creating) the best surprise is the one kept secret until its time to spill the beans.

 

sorry... but keep the hype going

 

 

 

 

 

What about the unstable public release?

Cant be more then a month away, can it... I want to cry.

[Blake_]

6 hours ago, meganoth said:

 

As soon as Call of Duty tags its game as "Almost rail shooter" or "You can shoot except when we show you a cut scene".

 

And while we are at it TFP should not call 7D2D a "zombie horror crafting tower defense game" but a "zombie horror except when you see bandits or are in the options menue crafting except if you find the stuff while scrounging tower defense except for 6 out of 7 days game".

 

Call of Duty does not claim to be "fully" anything. Rather, videogames these days "describe" what you can or cannot do. As for 7dtd, no need for "excepts". 7dtd IS a zombie crafting tower defense game with rpg elements, but NOT fully destroyable (yet).

 

In my mind, that asumption (fully destroyable) is akin to calling The Witcher 3 an Open  World. An open world does not have transit limitations. It needs to be seamless to be truly Open. That's why they created the term Sandbox, which applies to anything really, as long as you are in a scenario doing things and can move in all directions. 

[meilodasreh]

1 hour ago, samljer said:

 

What about the unstable public release?

Cant be more then a month away, can it... I want to cry.

If it takes longer I'm going to release something unstable in public🤢🤮

[dcsobral]

3 hours ago, samljer said:

 

What about the unstable public release?

Cant be more then a month away, can it... I want to cry.

Since faatal said early fall as a crude estimate, I'd take early fall as the earliest for alpha 20 experimental.

[Junuxx]

 

7 hours ago, meganoth said:

 

See the first page of the dev diary, only features that they have a high degree of confidence of them being in A20 are listed there.

Oh, you mean the post that says "Edited May 20 by Roland"?  🤔

Edited June 27, 2021 by Junuxx (see edit history)

[Matt115]

1 hour ago, dcsobral said:

Since faatal said early fall as a crude estimate, I'd take early fall as the earliest for alpha 20 experimental.

omg.... honestly i think it will came a little bit earlier maybe in next 40 days 

[samljer]

47 minutes ago, Matt115 said:

omg.... honestly i think it will came a little bit earlier maybe in next 40 days 

Early fall puts it to almost a year of dev time doesnt it? They announced what they were doing in OCT so they had to be working on it

a month or two prior.

[Matt115]

1 hour ago, samljer said:

Early fall puts it to almost a year of dev time doesnt it? They announced what they were doing in OCT so they had to be working on it

a month or two prior.

that would mean 1 alpha per year xd

[Blake_]

1 hour ago, samljer said:

Early fall puts it to almost a year of dev time doesnt it? They announced what they were doing in OCT so they had to be working on it

a month or two prior.

Yes. We are talking a new milestone here. RWG is basically being upgraded from the bottom up, most blocks revisited. New assets, new modular groups of assets, etc. Basically only assets made from a17 onwards make the cut, and even then, they can get tweaked to match standard. It's necessary if they are going to make a solid world in order to bring in npcs. I'm not counting the new quests, loot progression, the 100+ new POIs, new Zds, weapons, vehicle mods.... etc etc.

 

If they don't do this, it would become hell to integrate stuff gradually later on. 

 

So yeah. I'm up for 16 months of development if it brings in quests, armours and bandits sooner. An alpha release usually slows things down by 2 months on average (patching, streamings, backporting...etc).

[meganoth]

5 hours ago, Blake_ said:

Call of Duty does not claim to be "fully" anything. Rather, videogames these days "describe" what you can or cannot do. As for 7dtd, no need for "excepts". 7dtd IS a zombie crafting tower defense game with rpg elements, but NOT fully destroyable (yet).

 

In my mind, that asumption (fully destroyable) is akin to calling The Witcher 3 an Open  World. An open world does not have transit limitations. It needs to be seamless to be truly Open. That's why they created the term Sandbox, which applies to anything really, as long as you are in a scenario doing things and can move in all directions. 

 

 

I didn't say EA claims CoD to be a rail shooter with videos. It is obvious EA would not claim that, especially the part about the "rail".  But that is exactly my point: For me CoD is a full shooter, even though there are some video sequences in it where you can't shoot. And I would similarily say that 7D2D has a fully destructible world.

 

And so, you have your definition, I have mine. The trader limitation is for game play reasons, not because of some inherent limitation of the program. And it is a marginal part of the world and the game.

 

 

Edited June 28, 2021 by meganoth (see edit history)

[Matt115]

5 minutes ago, Blake_ said:

Yes. We are talking a new milestone here. RWG is basically being upgraded from the bottom up, most blocks revisited. New assets, new modular groups of assets, etc. Basically only assets made from a17 onwards make the cut, and even then, they can get tweaked to match standard. It's necessary if they are going to make a solid world in order to bring in npcs. I'm not counting the new quests, loot progression, the 100+ new POIs, new Zds, weapons, vehicle mods.... etc etc.

 

If they don't do this, it would become hell to integrate stuff gradually later on. 

 

So yeah. I'm up for 16 months of development if it brings in quests, armours and bandits sooner. An alpha release usually slows things down by 2 months on average (patching, streamings, backporting...etc).

well honestly i'm not so sure about npc. more likly they gone work in mix of traders - friendly guys sit in warm safe place and bandits  are  animal and zombie - they probably will attack zombies and diffrents bandits .  Well there will be only 1 new zombie - radioative in a20 and some of the rest will get just new model that all. ofc the biggest problems now will be ... containers like garbage to spawn good loot - i mean it could be stupid if you find rocket lanucher in bin and in toilet armor right?

[samljer]

On 6/26/2021 at 7:29 PM, MechanicalLens said:

In Alpha 20 with the breakdown system removed, does this mean that if the shotgun one shots wood blocks they are removed completely? 

Probably, its going to be savage.

[Roland]

On 6/14/2021 at 7:11 AM, Jost Amman said:

@The Dev who's Working on the Drone:

someone posted these interesting questions on Steam... 

 

question 1. what can the drone do once you have built one?
question 2. can you build more than one drone?
question 3. can you have more than one drone follow you
question 4. what is its function?
question 5. how long does his battery last and how can you recharge it?
question 6. how do the zombies react to the drone when it is shooting zombies? or how they generally react when they see the drone?
question 7. does the drone have mods? if so how many and which mods
question 8. does the drone have built-in or mod cammera with which you can use the drone to explore the environment

 

Thanks

 

 

I tested the drone a bit today and can answer some of these without stealing the thunder of any future dev stream.

 

1) It follows you around and increases your storage. For those who already mod their storage to huge capacity, the drone will seem underwhelming and unnecessary. However, for those who play it straight the drone will be a nice bonus backpack.

 

2) You can build multiple drones and pass them out to friends and family.

 

3) Only one will follow you. When trying to place another I was informed that I was at the capacity of drones following. I maxed everything out and read all the tech books and still only one was allowable.

 

4) Extra storage in its basic unmodded version

 

5) As of now there is no option to recharge or refuel.

 

6) They ignore it and it generally hovers out of their reach anyway.

 

7) The drone does have mods. How many and which mods will surely be the subject of a future dev stream.

 

8. There is not a built in camera nor any switching perspectives or taking over the controls of the drone and flying around viewing the world from its perspective. Whether a mod camera will allow that functionality in the future is unknown.

 

Bonus: The drone paths extremely well. I used Godmode to quickly move through a building to a room somewhere in its interior and the drone flew around finding its way through the building to get to me. If it got blocked because a closed door was between us then it flew around in circles seemingly agitated like a puppy separated from its beloved master. It always stays behind you and never once got in the way when shooting enemies. I would say that your expectation for it should be that it is a bonus backpack which--again-- if people have been spoiling themselves for years by modding for themselves huge backpacks then the drone won't seem very spectacular. Of course there are mods for the drone and those mods turn it into a backpack with benefits. But those benefits will be shown at a later date.

 

 

 

 

[IzPrebuilt]

On 6/25/2021 at 6:52 PM, MechanicalLens said:

Will the increased gamestage across different biomes affect horde nights?

IDK If they've changed this but back in one of those livestreams in either November or October they said it wouldn't affect hordes. (Unfortunately IMO)

 

8 hours ago, Roland said:

 

I tested the drone a bit today and can answer some of these without stealing the thunder of any future dev stream.

 

1) It follows you around and increases your storage. For those who already mod their storage to huge capacity, the drone will seem underwhelming and unnecessary. However, for those who play it straight the drone will be a nice bonus backpack.

 

2) You can build multiple drones and pass them out to friends and family.

 

3) Only one will follow you. When trying to place another I was informed that I was at the capacity of drones following. I maxed everything out and read all the tech books and still only one was allowable.

 

4) Extra storage in its basic unmodded version

 

5) As of now there is no option to recharge or refuel.

 

6) They ignore it and it generally hovers out of their reach anyway.

 

7) The drone does have mods. How many and which mods will surely be the subject of a future dev stream.

 

8. There is not a built in camera nor any switching perspectives or taking over the controls of the drone and flying around viewing the world from its perspective. Whether a mod camera will allow that functionality in the future is unknown.

 

Bonus: The drone paths extremely well. I used Godmode to quickly move through a building to a room somewhere in its interior and the drone flew around finding its way through the building to get to me. If it got blocked because a closed door was between us then it flew around in circles seemingly agitated like a puppy separated from its beloved master. It always stays behind you and never once got in the way when shooting enemies. I would say that your expectation for it should be that it is a bonus backpack which--again-- if people have been spoiling themselves for years by modding for themselves huge backpacks then the drone won't seem very spectacular. Of course there are mods for the drone and those mods turn it into a backpack with benefits. But those benefits will be shown at a later date.

 

 

 

 

Long shot, but are you allowed to let us know the exact stats of the drone storage at all? like how many slots it has. Probably not but just thought I'd ask for further clarification just in-case.

[Roland]

3 hours ago, IzPrebuilt said:

Long shot, but are you allowed to let us know the exact stats of the drone storage at all? like how many slots it has. Probably not but just thought I'd ask for further clarification just in-case.

 

Details will come in an upcoming dev stream.

[JCrook1028]

17 hours ago, Matt115 said:

well honestly i'm not so sure about npc. more likly they gone work in mix of traders - friendly guys sit in warm safe place and bandits  are  animal and zombie

Wrong. Bandits will be exactly that - Human Bandits. Not friendly traders and not zombies. They will not be in A20 but A20 does a lot of stuff needed for them to be in later.

[Matt115]

13 minutes ago, JCrook1028 said:

Wrong. Bandits will be exactly that - Human Bandits. Not friendly traders and not zombies. They will not be in A20 but A20 does a lot of stuff needed for them to be in later.

i mean npc - traders guards radioman etc - you can talk with them in safe place like traders post. Bandits - mobs like  zombie or animals xd