Steam reviews - I kinda figured

[Exxodous]

It could be just as simple as that I suck.

 

I can't melee a radiated either (especially those damn spiders) But I know I suck at melee.

[meganoth]

@meganoth nope not talking about myself here. The mods here do represent TFP and should act like it. And it doesn´t matter that they are not employed by TFP, they still represent them.

 

And what do they do? Answering in a way that would get a user at least a warning. If you can´t take on with customers in a polite way no matter what happens you maybe shouldn´t be a mod.

 

(Had to search a bit to guess the post of mine you were replying to, it helps to quote at least the part you are replying to)

 

I have been in many forums and in every one at least the volunteer moderators could post their opinion as a normal forum user, but had the separate function of enforcing forum rules. Naturally this is a problem if the moderators themselves violate the rules and I also have seen moderators lose their "job" over this.

 

I'm quite sure you won't get any volunteer moderators if you don't allow them to speak their opinions too, thats one point where you definitely expect too much. But I expect other moderators or a developer to step in if a moderator violates rules.

 

Now THIS forum has very lax rules. People can put a lot of "emotions" into their posts before a moderator really steps in. Show me the post where a moderator would have deserved a warning (and which rule it violates!!). You can also PM me if you don't want to make a thread out of it and we'll discuss it privately.

 

But don't expect me to agree that moderators should be moderated by special rules. The only special rule a moderator has is to NOT misuse his powers. Apart from that he is bound by the same forum rules as everyone else.

[WolfyBlah]

I did not call him an ass, i said using that specfic word makes him come across as one, that me saying he isnt one more than anything.

 

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Casual

 

Scroll through a few of these and tell me again how it cant be used as a derogatory term.

[lord_ahriman]

The XP slider just slows the game down for those who have more time to play, and speeds it up if they think early game feels too grindy.

 

What balance issues? Its up to the player to make good perk choices for their play style. If you go all into INT for a super nerd crafter build and don't choose any ranged or melee perks, then its on you to deal with that. You can be a jack of all trades, or pure melee/tank, or nerd or stealth assassin, whatever you like. Its player choice. I've played games where I made unbalanced builds and paid the price. Don't jump off a cliff, dude, its bad for your ankles. So is making totally lopsided builds because your too impatient and think you need INT10 and all crafting perks ASAP.

 

There is nothing derogatory about the word casual. All it implies is that you have less time to invest into a play through than someone else. Get off your high horse, your the one being offensive here.

 

About balancing, SMG should get some love: Perception 7, Boom Headshot 3, lvl 6 fully modded SMG and I still need 12 ~ 14 rounds to kill a radiated fat lady. Btw, I'd love to get effective exploding bolts and pipe bombs again, because relying on 7.62/9mm isn't a good idea: we need better crowd control besides molotovs.

[Jackelmyer]

Why can't you get out there and tank with all the heavy armor perks and a sledge or fireaxe? You only take 10% damage. I fell out of my base a few times before release and just back pedaled and axed in the face and wiped out a whole blood moon horde that way. I'm playing a legit long term game so I will be tweaking things as I go, but so far I haven't seen anything too punishing. If you took some grandpa's moonshine, I think you could do some mass damage with melee on a blood moon. I think we stop regen if you hit something, so as long as you keep hitting it, it should die. But I've never faced on yet, so they could be OP, I have no idea.

 

This has long since been a problem with pretty much every game that has items that buff a player... Having them at all makes things a pain in the ass for the development team in making people happy. You basically get two situations.

 

1. Without the items which buff a character, the character is notably nerfed by itself. Perhaps functional, but players can feel how nerfed they are without, Grandpa's Moonshine or whatever buff from whatever item. Players can end up frustrated because for whatever reason, and in a RNG based game it's really only worse, because they can't find that item to buff themselves or the items required to craft that item.

 

2. With a plentiful supply of items or minimal effects (both basically play out the same way), a player can end up wondering why they just don't have those buffs as base stats and skip the extra grindiness or hassle of collecting those buffing items.

 

 

Which usually ends up where most games don't really put too much emphasis on buffs from items. Or when they do, they back pedal. If you look at the majority of the games out there, buffs from items "can" be used, but it's so optional that many go without the potions/super food/etc. Min Maxers and Collectors will still go out of their way, happily so, to get those buffs just the same. Which then usually means they need 2-4 items buffing them to have notable gains.

 

Kinda wish you guys would have stuck with a more KISS approach and avoided the Item/Buff Trend. Buffs are great and can come from a variety of things. Better they be situational as opposed to mandatory or near mandatory.

[Roland]

I did not call him an ass, i said using that specfic word makes him come across as one, that me saying he isnt one more than anything.

 

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Casual

 

Scroll through a few of these and tell me again how it cant be used as a derogatory term.

 

I just want everyone to know that if you put the phrase “come across as” in front of every insult, it will not fool us moderators.....

[Hek Harris]

We're looking options like xp slider, zombie block damage, Blood moon frequency: every day, every 3 days every 7 days, every two weeks, every month, random, never. I think never would be good for the adventuring types who like to explore, and good for pvp, and for casuals who just like to build and don't want their stuff getting wrecked.

Thanks ! Really. Not for me, cause like a lot of players I appreciate the game as it is or can take the time to modify some values in xml, but for the good health of this forum. I come here to read ideas, stories, and feel good vibrations. We need to get rid of whiners and terrible players that can't handle the basis of a survival game and the process of game development.

[madmole]

Im not being offensive.

 

And you do realise that what you wrote can litteraly be re-wrote as: i want players that can craft advanced materials to face the same combat challanges as someone who invests into more health, damage, stamina.

 

Its litteraly punishing people with tougher zombies for not choosing to spend points in melee skills. They are facing tougher enemies with weaker player stats and getting a more difficult experience because they dont take perks related to combat.

 

So sure you can 'choose' to make the game harder on yourself if you want to be able to craft XYZ recipe, or you can choose to make the game eaiser by taking the melee perks.

 

Lopsided much?

 

Also your damn right im impatient: im dont have the patience to sit through your crappy 70 level grind to make a steel fireaxe, let alone doing it in every single new game of 7days i play.

 

Ask yourself this: Should the game be significantly harder for crafters/builders vs 'nomads'? because thats the reality of what these 'choices' boil down to right now.

 

Even bloody runescape makes a distinction between combat and none combat skills. 7D2D right now: you leveled up cooking so your desrve to fight tougher zombies.

In real life and in the game, if you suck at something you suck at it. Don't like it? Train and get better. Its not good to cater to someone's flaws.

 

By your logic if I don't buy barter perks I should just get a better deal because its not fair Rekt is bending me over.

By your logic if I buy all melee perks, hell I should just be able to craft high tech weapons and armor because TFP is discriminating against stupid bruisers.

And clearly by your logic or lack thereof, you think that high INT characters should get pushover zombies to fight?

 

The game is not significantly harder for crafters/builders. You don't have to fight zombies. You can outrun any zombie in the game. Fighting them is a choice. Just like building INT 10 recipes is your choice. Combat players can't craft get the best gear. Go craft a chainsaw you don't need to be great at melee to saw zeds up. Craft traps and pipe bombs. There are ample tools for the crafter to succeed.

 

I like the game to represent that life and choices do have consequences. Don't like sucking at life? Study and train to improve. A fully modded gun does plenty of damage with no perks. Eugene in TWD finally learned how to fight, his brains weren't enough to keep on surviving. I have significant crafting abilities at game stage 105, and I also have significant melee ability. I don't understand the problem. Get on your vehicle and drive off if you can't win a fight.

[WolfyBlah]

I just want everyone to know that if you put the phrase “come across as” in front of every insult, it will not fool us moderators.....

 

Did or did not madmole just describe everyone who doesnt want thier base wrecked by the blood moon horde as 'casual'?

 

Given that wanting that or not has nothing to do with ammount of time a person has to play I can only assume he meant it as an insult.

 

My intention was not to insult him: it was to point out that maybe his wording could be a little better (and a little less of a veiled insult).

[Guppycur]

This has long since been a problem with pretty much every game that has items that buff a player... Having them at all makes things a pain in the ass for the development team in making people happy. You basically get two situations.

 

1. Without the items which buff a character, the character is notably nerfed by itself. Perhaps functional, but players can feel how nerfed they are without, Grandpa's Moonshine or whatever buff from whatever item. Players can end up frustrated because for whatever reason, and in a RNG based game it's really only worse, because they can't find that item to buff themselves or the items required to craft that item.

 

2. With a plentiful supply of items or minimal effects (both basically play out the same way), a player can end up wondering why they just don't have those buffs as base stats and skip the extra grindiness or hassle of collecting those buffing items.

 

 

Which usually ends up where most games don't really put too much emphasis on buffs from items. Or when they do, they back pedal. If you look at the majority of the games out there, buffs from items "can" be used, but it's so optional that many go without the potions/super food/etc. Min Maxers and Collectors will still go out of their way, happily so, to get those buffs just the same. Which then usually means they need 2-4 items buffing them to have notable gains.

 

Kinda wish you guys would have stuck with a more KISS approach and avoided the Item/Buff Trend. Buffs are great and can come from a variety of things. Better they be situational as opposed to mandatory or near mandatory.

 

Agreed. Buffs/Perks should be just that, a buff/perk, not a necessity.

[HungryZombie]

I haven't died on a horde yet, just made it through day 21. I just use 3 rows of spikes and drop molotovs on the big clusters of them, and I have 24 zombies. I use no cheese tactics. Just a box with iron bars to walk on. I expand it as I go so I have fallback areas. I don't think they do tons of damage, but maybe some things have changed.

 

I don't expect a melee weapon to be 100% effective against a feral or a radiated. I haven't seen many ferals yet and no radiated at all. If its poorly balanced we'll make adjustments.

 

I don't think he was talking about combat during horde night when you have your defenses up. Many people are saying walking into a POI with a bunch of radiated ferals is an issue for melee. Might be the regen is an issue.

 

I am too scatter brained to get to a high game stage lol. I get a new idea and start over constantly. I'm like this in all games so don't take it personal Have yet to get near the final quest in Skyrim with 100's hrs played.

[madmole]

Thanks ! Really. Not for me, cause like a lot of players I appreciate the game as it is or can take the time to modify some values in xml, but for the good health of this forum. I come here to read ideas, stories, and feel good vibrations. We need to get rid of whiners and terrible players that can't handle the basis of a survival game and the process of game development.

 

Its sad how toxic the internet has become. Back in the day it was just elite nerds and most people felt blessed to be online and share mods and stories about their gaming experiences. Normies would be like "what are you doing on that machine?" and didn't comprehend FTP/MIRC or forums in their infancy. Now every idiot with a phone has a toxic opinion. Before it took knowledge and effort to even know how to post online and where.

 

A few options can give the game legs for more people so its good for everyone. The default is how we envision it to be played, but if adding more options makes the game enjoyable in a lot more ways then its good.

[Hek Harris]

Just for information, I am currently playing a game with a close combat character. I put together the right skills, of course. Difficulty "warrior" BUT I set all the zombies in "run" (the new run, which is slower than the old one). The irradiated zombies are massacred (as long as there are no more than 3 or 4 on my back at the same time). And I have a lot of fun. So yes, it's perfectly playable and after training well, I'll increase the speed.

It is not by spending their days on the forum that "survivors" will learn to play well ^^.

[HungryZombie]

They had this idea of a genre mix from the beginning, see the kickstarter where they already talked about RPG. Naturally if you are looking for a "clean" survival game you will not find it here. Sandbox players have found this out a lot of versions earlier than survival players.

 

But it also seems TFP always goes to far in any direction at first when they balance the game. Even for me, who likes the RPG aspects, the perks seem to have too much influence compared to the items and the few mods.

 

I think a lot of the problem with people's perception is caused by two things. The tagline at the top of the forum and in the game is "The Survival Horde Crafting Game" I know it might say it elsewhere but this does not invoke Tower Defense or RPG which is a big part of what the game developers seem to want to blend in.

 

The 2nd thing was the long pause between A16 and A17. This got a very large group of people used to playing a Survival Horde crafting game and they all were shocked by the Tower Defense and RPG's.

[WolfyBlah]

In real life and in the game, if you suck at something you suck at it. Don't like it? Train and get better. Its not good to cater to someone's flaws.

 

By your logic if I don't buy barter perks I should just get a better deal because its not fair Rekt is bending me over.

By your logic if I buy all melee perks, hell I should just be able to craft high tech weapons and armor because TFP is discriminating against stupid bruisers.

And clearly by your logic or lack thereof, you think that high INT characters should get pushover zombies to fight?

 

The game is not significantly harder for crafters/builders. You don't have to fight zombies. You can outrun any zombie in the game. Fighting them is a choice. Just like building INT 10 recipes is your choice. Combat players can't craft get the best gear. Go craft a chainsaw you don't need to be great at melee to saw zeds up. Craft traps and pipe bombs. There are ample tools for the crafter to succeed.

 

I like the game to represent that life and choices do have consequences. Don't like sucking at life? Study and train to improve. A fully modded gun does plenty of damage with no perks. Eugene in TWD finally learned how to fight, his brains weren't enough to keep on surviving. I have significant crafting abilities at game stage 105, and I also have significant melee ability. I don't understand the problem. Get on your vehicle and drive off if you can't win a fight.

 

Train and get better might be a valid argument for LBD, it dosent really work for a super generic XP grind where the 'training' is farming X ammounts of XP so you can level up and click a box to magically be better at whatever you choose.

 

The game is harder for crafters, they have less damage, health and stanina than someone who specialised in those stats.

 

Being able to craft the best weapon in the game means jack ♥♥♥♥ when you do less damage than someone with a lower tier weapon and higher stats.

 

Now if there was more depth to the crafting so that intelligent play was actualy a substitute for the combat stats... but that isnt what we have.

 

So its really not unbalanced in your opinon that a crafter has to level (read: grind XP) significantly more to unlock those higher tier recipes and still ends up doing less damage with thier spiked club than someone with lower tier club and 'the right perks'.

 

 

Want to a spiked club?

Grind 30 levels or find it as loot/buy from trader.

Want to actually be able to use it?

Better not have spent your points on actualy unlocking the thing.

[Roland]

Just for information, I am currently playing a game with a close combat character. I put together the right skills, of course. Difficulty "warrior" BUT I set all the zombies in "run" (the new run, which is slower than the old one). The irradiated zombies are massacred (as long as there are no more than 3 or 4 on my back at the same time). And I have a lot of fun. So yes, it's perfectly playable and after training well, I'll increase the speed.

It is not by spending their days on the forum that "survivors" will learn to play well ^^.

 

 

Woah...if you are going to refer to people like me who spend all day on the forum as sarcastically quoted “survivors” please at least say that we only come across as such. Big difference.

 

#justjoshingwolfyblah

[WolfyBlah]

Woah...if you are going to refer to people like me who spend all day on the forum as sarcastically quoted “survivors” please at least say that we only come across as such. Big difference.

 

#justjoshingwolfyblah

 

You know that part where i said you bring it on yourself that people are rude to you ect?

This post is exactly the sort of ♥♥♥♥ i mean.

[Royal Deluxe]

We're looking options like xp slider, zombie block damage, Blood moon frequency: every day, every 3 days every 7 days, every two weeks, every month, random, never. I think never would be good for the adventuring types who like to explore, and good for pvp, and for casuals who just like to build and don't want their stuff getting wrecked.

 

I would like 2 Slider

One with fixed dates as you write

and one random you can set 2 Values, min and max

would love to set a random value between 2 and 4 weeks

 

But really nice to hear that you have that on your wish/to do list

[Hek Harris]

You know that part where i said you bring it on yourself that people are rude to you ect?

This post is exactly the sort of ♥♥♥♥ i mean.

It's time for close combat

[Roland]

You know that part where i said you bring it on yourself that people are rude to you ect?

This post is exactly the sort of ♥♥♥♥ i mean.

 

Yeah but I’ve decided to live with the burden. You don’t laugh at yourself much do you?

 

If it helps at all I sincerely agree with you and disagree with Madmole that “casual” is an appropriate word to use as it does carry negative connotations even if Madmole didn’t mean it to be derogatory.

[WolfyBlah]

If what madmole is driving at is that crafting higer tier recipes is of equal value to dealing more damage or having more health.

 

This is not true whilever there exsists alternate paths to get the item beyond crafting it.

 

Whilever someone can find the best club in the game as loot or from the trader the 'can craft this' skill is nowhere near as powerful as 'deal more damage with whatever weapon you are holding'

 

To get decent combat perks that will make the game easier on you requires just one or two points in the relevant skills.

 

To be able to craft an item strong enough to offset this? You cant. Even if you dump all your points into crafting all you get is the ability to make the exact same item someone else got through looting/crafting.

 

If you are going to lock things away as endgame then actualy do it: make only weapons/tools people can actualy craft be findable as loot.

[meganoth]

Train and get better might be a valid argument for LBD, it dosent really work for a super generic XP grind where the 'training' is farming X ammounts of XP so you can level up and click a box to magically be better at whatever you choose.

 

The game is harder for crafters, they have less damage, health and stanina than someone who specialised in those stats.

 

Being able to craft the best weapon in the game means jack ♥♥♥♥ when you do less damage than someone with a lower tier weapon and higher stats.

 

Now if there was more depth to the crafting so that intelligent play was actualy a substitute for the combat stats... but that isnt what we have.

 

So its really not unbalanced in your opinon that a crafter has to level (read: grind XP) significantly more to unlock those higher tier recipes and still ends up doing less damage with thier spiked club than someone with lower tier club and 'the right perks'.

 

The ultimate goal is surely that a crafter is able to built a lot more walls and (electric) traps to overcome the weaker weapon handling.

 

Whether that's true at the moment, well, at least doubtfull, needs to be balanced.

[madmole]

I think a lot of the problem with people's perception is caused by two things. The tagline at the top of the forum and in the game is "The Survival Horde Crafting Game" I know it might say it elsewhere but this does not invoke Tower Defense or RPG which is a big part of what the game developers seem to want to blend in.

 

The 2nd thing was the long pause between A16 and A17. This got a very large group of people used to playing a Survival Horde crafting game and they all were shocked by the Tower Defense and RPG's.

 

You've got to be kidding. What part of "The Survival HORDE Crafting Game" implies there isn't tower defense? The worde HORDE implies it IMO. The very first videos and KS, steam and every build of the game had hordes every 7 days. Even the game implies you will die in 7 days. The game isn't going to become a full on RPG, its always been "A survival game with RPG elements".

 

Straight from the steam store: "7 Days to Die is an open-world game that is a unique combination of first person shooter, survival horror, tower defense, and role-playing games. Play the definitive zombie survival sandbox RPG that came first. Navezgane awaits!"

[WolfyBlah]

The ultimate goal is surely that a crafter is able to built a lot more walls and (electric) traps to overcome the weaker weapon handling.

 

Whether that's true at the moment, well, at least doubtfull, needs to be balanced.

 

Dosent that assume that the crafting player is *always* in thier base?

Like a player that prefers crafting still has to be out in the world gathering resources, food, ect

 

Now if crafting leveling unlocked some cool ♥♥♥♥ like a boombox you could place outside a house to draw all the sleepers out... i can get on board wih more cool crafting recipes, especialy if they add intresting mechanics.

 

As it stands though being a crafter feels like you are grinding levels and going against tougher zombies just so you can craft somthing a looter/trader will find long before you craft it and they will deal way more damage with it to boot.

[meganoth]

Dosent that assume that the crafting player is *always* in thier base?

Like a player that prefers crafting still has to be out in the world gathering resources, food, ect

 

Do you assume that a crafting player can't shoot a gun? I'm able to kill zombies as a level 0 player, why shouldn't I be able to when I have a kickass modded gun?

 

Do I think they need to nerf perks a bit and put a bit more oomph into mods? Sure, I said exactly that a few pages before. But I also said I expect more and better mods to arrive in the coming months. Still the fighter type MUST be better at fighting than the builder, there is no way around that.