Anybody miss the Hoe?

[Darkonox]

i find it a bit strange that TFP decided to remove the hoe and make getting plants going expensive, at very least they could have made rotten flesh a bit easier to gain in higher quantities, But this is just my take on it. anybody else kinda wish there was a hoe in the game again?

[Jugginator]

Nah not me. I mean idk, kinda sorta but I definitely don't really miss it. I def don't miss taking 190 hours to make 1 fertalizer in the cement mixer lol.

 

You should be swimming in rotten flesh. Grab gore blocks and buzzard with a knife when you see em. I rarely have below 500 rotten flesh by day 18 and I don't go on a whim to farm for it. I usually throw out flesh that I loot lol

[Ramethzer0]

I do not miss it. I spent more time setting up a massive garden than I ever did actually tending it.

I'd spend full in game days on it, and then put the hoe away and never look back. It seemed barely worth keeping once you established yourself in one spot.

[Roland]

I’m glad there is a resource limiter on the size of farms now. The huge farms of the past needed to go. Crafting the plots at a cost instead of being able to hoe as much ground as you wanted without limits is better for food balance.

 

Don’t get me wrong, there is still a food abundance problem but at least the farm size component has gotten a much needed nerf.

 

Tilling the ground with the hoe was more interesting and engaging and satisfying than having a new recipe to craft but the resulting garden sizes are a welcome change.

 

But....maybe requiring daily hand watering of crops could have been a different way to limit farm sizes.

[Birkenhoff]

I just miss the principle of creating a farm and fertalizing the ground. It was more fun rather then putting points into the perk.

It doen't make me feel optimistic about the future of farming when the reason of implementing farm plots is to limit the farm sizes. Possible next steps would be tweaking the resource drops of rotten flesh, reducing the number of gore blocks, increasing food poisoning or simply nerving the food effect of crafted food from 30ish to maybe 10.

 

It looks like TFP wants to make food to be a challenge and farm plots is the first step into this. I'd just prefer something else than the 'You want food? go loot it!' thing.

[Spider]

I don't miss her. She always left bras hanging around and money would always come up missing. Good riddance.(couldn't help it)

[Sjustus548]

I don't miss the hoe. I find the farm plots to be a much better option. I like being able to use them to create my field how I want to. The cost of making the plots is at a good level where I don't have a full farm of food growing in the first week but it doesn't take me so long that it makes it not worth it. I agree with Roland that there is still an issue of having too much food though. I have my farm completed and now I harvest it for the xp and then throw out or sell what I harvest because I have so much. Might be worth it to look in to adding in a spoil timer for food or possibly a chance that your crops will wither before fully growing. We could still break them and get the small plant again but it would add in a chance to get less of a harvest.

[Scyris]

I’m glad there is a resource limiter on the size of farms now. The huge farms of the past needed to go. Crafting the plots at a cost instead of being able to hoe as much ground as you wanted without limits is better for food balance.

 

Don’t get me wrong, there is still a food abundance problem but at least the farm size component has gotten a much needed nerf.

 

Tilling the ground with the hoe was more interesting and engaging and satisfying than having a new recipe to craft but the resulting garden sizes are a welcome change.

 

But....maybe requiring daily hand watering of crops could have been a different way to limit farm sizes.

 

Kinda like stardew valley and rune factory games, at first you gotta water your crops by hand, later on in the game you get ways to automate it, sprinklers for stardew valley and in rune factory you can use tamed monsters to water your plants for you. Darkness Falls in a17 had it where you need a water block within 3-4 blocks of the plant, and there was a 30% chance each plant around that block could use up the water when it goes up a stage. Mind you if you set it up right with the right block, you usually do not need to worry about it. Learning how to do it properly though takes some trial and error if your not following a guide.

[Scyris]

I don't miss the hoe. I find the farm plots to be a much better option. I like being able to use them to create my field how I want to. The cost of making the plots is at a good level where I don't have a full farm of food growing in the first week but it doesn't take me so long that it makes it not worth it. I agree with Roland that there is still an issue of having too much food though. I have my farm completed and now I harvest it for the xp and then throw out or sell what I harvest because I have so much. Might be worth it to look in to adding in a spoil timer for food or possibly a chance that your crops will wither before fully growing. We could still break them and get the small plant again but it would add in a chance to get less of a harvest.

 

Problem is, there is so much food in the game you don't even NEED a farm, even in A16, A17 and in A18 I rarely ever had a farm going as I just had no need for it. I actually care more about growing aloe vera plants than I do any crop used in food. Food is just too common, even in a16/17 I used to eat the canned food i'd find even with its chance of food poisoning, so I never really needed to craft much.

 

Loot in general in A18 is too good though, day 19 with lucky looter 1 and thats it I fairly often find tier 5 things, IMO by day 19 I should be extremly lucky to find anything tier 3. This is why every build I make is a 0 int build. Mind you thats also partially as int is not a global controller of what tier you craft anymore. I'm patient I can wait, my current game day 19 still no chem lab schematic or crucible yet, but my trader during 1 restock had TWO chem labs at once, which I bought both. I had the 4 beakers i'd have needed in storage already if I found the recipe, but meh, i'll take it anyway I can get it. I rarely craft things, as usually by the time I gather the parts to make say a steel tool, i'd have already looted one as good or probally better than i'd make.

 

About the only stuff I craft often is: Glue, duct tape, bandages, gun powder, weapon/armor mods, and sometimes ammo. However my ammo stockpile right now is half a storage chest full so i've kinda stopped ammo production as I am just finding more than I use. I cooked up a bunch of sham chowder, fish tacos and such, but I've not had to use any of it, due to how common food is in pretty much every poi.

 

You may say: "Won't you run out of poi's to loot?" My reply? It'll never happen as I can just take a quest from a trader which when I get to the poi resets it so I can loot it, due to this you can pretty much live in the same little town and not need to leave it. Even on a no loot respawn game it'd be like this, as long as you take a trader quest the poi you have to go to will reset and refill with loot.

 

My games sadly usually end before day 21 though, as I just get too powerful and too bored to bother keep going. I'm lv 43 all my armor is t5-6 already from loot, and most of my weapons are t4-6. I have pretty much endless food already, water as well. I can't find any reason to keep going as there is no real endgame yet. Like I said, the loot especially how often you find anything above tier 1, needs a serious nerf hard. I shouldn't have a full set of t5-6 gear by day 19 with no points in lucky looter at all. Even with it, I should only have 1 t5 item at most from loot by that point. thats how it was in a16. By day 50 in a16 without lucky looter, I was lucky to find quality 300 ish items.

 

I honestly don't know how people can go till day 40 or 60+ in a17/18 and not get bored out of their skull as there just is nothing to do or strive for once your established.

[OzHawkeye]

I prefer A18 farming over all others, mainly for, as Roland stated, it's eliminate the insta-mega-farms that essentially trivialised hunger by day 3 or 4 previously.

[Scyris]

I prefer A18 farming over all others, mainly for, as Roland stated, it's eliminate the insta-mega-farms that essentially trivialised hunger by day 3 or 4 previously.

 

Umm looting poi's trivialised hunger on day 1 in A18. I usually find more food than I can carry on default settings. Cept difficulty I set to warrior. If anything a18 is the easiest for food, you do not even need a farm to have more than enough. Think about it: all the cabinets etc, traders, vending machines both in trader and the poi's. There are so many sources that you don't even need a farm really. Hell only reason I even make farm plots is I really have nothing better to use rotten flesh for. Even in A16 and such, it always blew my mind how people somehow managed to starve or dehydrate to death with all the sources of food and water that exist. It was honestly much harder before traders/vending machines were around. Mind you I love the traders they add a nice little economy to the game, something most survival games lack. I have 3300 hours total in 7dtd, and i've never, not once, ever died from stravation or dehydration, i've never even gotten close. Closest I got was A18 when food poisoning hit me and my char purged like almost all her food. But without that happened? My food rarely drops below full. Water on the other hand seems to be used up much faster, mostly due to the drugs and such. But even so, there is so many sources.

 

TL: DR I don't miss the Hoe much, as i've never really needed to have a farm in the last few alpha. Always was more than enough food from other sources.

[eXSe]

Maybe looting can trivialize farming, but I like me a home cooked meal after (or during) a hard days work, so I always enjoy a steak and potato, or a hardy meat stew... even with their food poisoning chance

 

Farming has always been a pleasurable side thing for me in 7d2d, especially in a16 when we had wellness gains, so I kinda like it kinda "streamlined" like this AND the farm plots look much better placed in single rows with walkways in between than those wonky spiky dirt tiles

[Scyris]

Maybe looting can trivialize farming, but I like me a home cooked meal after (or during) a hard days work, so I always enjoy a steak and potato, or a hardy meat stew... even with their food poisoning chance

 

Farming has always been a pleasurable side thing for me in 7d2d, especially in a16 when we had wellness gains, so I kinda like it kinda "streamlined" like this AND the farm plots look much better placed in single rows with walkways in between than those wonky spiky dirt tiles

 

The literal only reason I had a farm when I did in a16 was due to the wellness system. As the canned food you could loot didn't add any. At least in regards to food, I always tend to have a aloe vera farm going at the minimum for first-aid bandages... Which I really wish they'd up the stack size on those, first aid kits as well, actually many items could use a bigger stack size.

[Sjustus548]

Problem is, there is so much food in the game you don't even NEED a farm, even in A16, A17 and in A18 I rarely ever had a farm going as I just had no need for it. I actually care more about growing aloe vera plants than I do any crop used in food. Food is just too common, even in a16/17 I used to eat the canned food i'd find even with its chance of food poisoning, so I never really needed to craft much.

 

Loot in general in A18 is too good though, day 19 with lucky looter 1 and thats it I fairly often find tier 5 things, IMO by day 19 I should be extremly lucky to find anything tier 3. This is why every build I make is a 0 int build. Mind you thats also partially as int is not a global controller of what tier you craft anymore. I'm patient I can wait, my current game day 19 still no chem lab schematic or crucible yet, but my trader during 1 restock had TWO chem labs at once, which I bought both. I had the 4 beakers i'd have needed in storage already if I found the recipe, but meh, i'll take it anyway I can get it. I rarely craft things, as usually by the time I gather the parts to make say a steel tool, i'd have already looted one as good or probally better than i'd make.

 

About the only stuff I craft often is: Glue, duct tape, bandages, gun powder, weapon/armor mods, and sometimes ammo. However my ammo stockpile right now is half a storage chest full so i've kinda stopped ammo production as I am just finding more than I use. I cooked up a bunch of sham chowder, fish tacos and such, but I've not had to use any of it, due to how common food is in pretty much every poi.

 

You may say: "Won't you run out of poi's to loot?" My reply? It'll never happen as I can just take a quest from a trader which when I get to the poi resets it so I can loot it, due to this you can pretty much live in the same little town and not need to leave it. Even on a no loot respawn game it'd be like this, as long as you take a trader quest the poi you have to go to will reset and refill with loot.

 

My games sadly usually end before day 21 though, as I just get too powerful and too bored to bother keep going. I'm lv 43 all my armor is t5-6 already from loot, and most of my weapons are t4-6. I have pretty much endless food already, water as well. I can't find any reason to keep going as there is no real endgame yet. Like I said, the loot especially how often you find anything above tier 1, needs a serious nerf hard. I shouldn't have a full set of t5-6 gear by day 19 with no points in lucky looter at all. Even with it, I should only have 1 t5 item at most from loot by that point. thats how it was in a16. By day 50 in a16 without lucky looter, I was lucky to find quality 300 ish items.

 

I honestly don't know how people can go till day 40 or 60+ in a17/18 and not get bored out of their skull as there just is nothing to do or strive for once your established.

 

If there is too much loot then turn down how much you get. If the game is too easy then turn the difficulty up. Sounds like you are playing it on too high of loot and too easy of zombies if you are getting bored before day 21. That or maybe it is time for you to just go find something new to play. Sounds like you really aren't enjoying yourself much anymore.

[pApA^LeGBa]

I really don´t miss that akward hoe. So annyoing to work with it tbh. Rotten meat isn´t sooo hard to get, roadkills are basically everywhere. Also the amount of canned food is riddiculous tbh. Waiting for years now to actually get problems with food in this game.

[Scyris]

If there is too much loot then turn down how much you get. If the game is too easy then turn the difficulty up. Sounds like you are playing it on too high of loot and too easy of zombies if you are getting bored before day 21. That or maybe it is time for you to just go find something new to play. Sounds like you really aren't enjoying yourself much anymore.

 

This is on default loot settings, The only 2 settings I change is difficulty (I set it to warrior) and mark air drops to on, other than that all defaults. There might be a bug with the loot abundance thing, as anytime I lowered it below 100%, 90%+ of things I opened were empty. Even lowering it 1 setting below 100% will make it so you get empty containers almost 90% of the time. I feel its kinda bugged right now, thats why I leave it at the base of 100%. I just feel we get way to much loot compared to previous alpha's on the base setting, in previous ones you'd need to set loot abundance to 200% or more to get even close to the amount you get in a18 on its default loot abundance.

[Sjustus548]

This is on default loot settings, The only 2 settings I change is difficulty (I set it to warrior) and mark air drops to on, other than that all defaults. There might be a bug with the loot abundance thing, as anytime I lowered it below 100%, 90%+ of things I opened were empty. Even lowering it 1 setting below 100% will make it so you get empty containers almost 90% of the time. I feel its kinda bugged right now, thats why I leave it at 100. I just feel we get way to much loot compared to previous alpha's on the base setting, in previous ones you'd need to set loot abundance to 200% or more to get even close to the amount you get in a18 on its default loot abundance.

 

But that would solve your problem with having too much good loot wouldn't it lol. On A16/17 I played on 25% loot. It helped with the amount of loot that we found and made for a good challenge. You should give it a try for this one and increase the difficulty to Insane. I think that would make a good challenge for you that hopefully would stop the boredom from kicking in too early.

[Scyris]

But that would solve your problem with having too much good loot wouldn't it lol

 

Yeah but you need to try it to see what I mean, it goes from too much on 100%, to virtually nothing on any setting below it. One game it took me almost a entire game day to find a SINGLE feather to finish the newbie quest, I opened about 30+ birds nests, on 50% or 75% loot abundance, and they were empty. I ended up getting my feather when I looted a car of all places, it just happened to have 1. Like I said start a new game and try it, set it to 75% and look at how almost everything is now suddendly empty, which is a much bigger amount that just 25% less.

 

Like I said I feel its kinda bugged, as it was never that extreme in a16 or a17.

[Kattla]

If i were to make a list of the things i miss in 7d2d, the hoe would be there, but neither on the top nor bottom.

[gwensparkle]

I'm of both minds.

 

Why I like the new system - I often planted in planters anyway, and this way I don't have to struggle with figuring out how to make the sides of the planter boxes on inner corners where the wood plates would interfere with each other. I don't mind the early struggle for resources. My ability to make farm plots is kind of matching my coming across seeds in the early game.

 

Why I miss the hoe - I used to beautify the area surrounding my base and enjoyed hoeing the ground and planting the odd flowering plant or bush along the roadside. I also liked taking a flat area and making a small garden in the ground. If there's a way to do these things now, I haven't found it.

 

I wouldn't mind if both versions were still available in some form.

[Katitof]

With how farming is now?

The moment you could get your first seed, you could expand into infinity with no effort at all.

 

Now its much better and balanced.

[SickPuppy]

Don't miss it. The balance feels much better with farm plots, you'll still end up with a giant farm if u want to and it's not like they completely removed farming it's just a tad different.

 

Not 100% sure but I read the old hoe farming had performance issues.

[jdm311]

I don't miss the old way of farming, but finding seed schematics (not wasting a point on living off the land) and getting farm plot ingredients has definitely slowed down my farmed goods production compared to the previous few alphas. That and finding copious amounts of canned foods while looting as previously mentioned by others. In the past, the wellness system helped motivate me to farm in the first place. Now I can get food poisoning with all the extra effort. The only real benefit of eating a produced meal is saving a few clicks and some time (unless you get food poisoning). But the good news is that vitamins are finally useful.

[Ghostlight]

i find it a bit strange that TFP decided to remove the hoe and make getting plants going expensive, at very least they could have made rotten flesh a bit easier to gain in higher quantities, But this is just my take on it. anybody else kinda wish there was a hoe in the game again?

 

I thought I would at first but I really like the Farm Plots. You can easily relocate them which is a godsend for players like us that like to build new bases and move on when we have strip-mined an area. They do look pretty ugly and out of place though. It would be better if they were flat like a wooden plate, and not raised like a full block.

[Roland]

I thought I would at first but I really like the Farm Plots. You can easily relocate them which is a godsend for players like us that like to build new bases and move on when we have strip-mined an area. They do look pretty ugly and out of place though. It would be better if they were flat like a wooden plate, and not raised like a full block.

 

The crops would float above the planters if they weren’t full blocks.