omegarte Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Although my post count doesn't reflect it, I have been playing 7d2d since I believe Alpha 9 and been lurking these forums for a number of years. Virtually every time a new alpha comes, a vocal minority (sometimes majority) complains about some new or changed mechanic but eventually adapts and then forgets that they complained about whatever as the months/years go by. Here are some examples off the top of my head: -I remember people crying when TFPs got rid off the minecraft-style crafting GUI. I don't think I have heard anything about this in years. -I remember when you could make a crossbow and stone bolts within 15-20 minutes and have this kick-ass silent zombie sniping weapon very early game. When TFPs made the recipe more difficult and took away stone bolts (which are now back), lots of people complained. Nobody really complains about the crossbow recipe anymore. -I remember when the TFPs got rid of gun molds and transitioned to gun parts and everyone complained. Now they have transitioned to full guns with mods and some people want the gun parts back! The point is this game constantly evolves and while we may not like every single little change, we gamers always adapt to the changes and adjust play styles accordingly. I hope everyone keeps this in mind for this A17 release too. At its core, the game is still the same it has always been: you scavenge, you kill ♥♥♥♥, you craft, you build, you improve your character and try not to die in the process. Its not like they took out zombies and put in unicorns or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omegarte Posted December 11, 2018 Author Share Posted December 11, 2018 member 7 days to minecraft and gun molds? I do... https://imgur.com/a/IwaX55Y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feycat Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 "Bring back sticks!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secateurs Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 At its core, the game is still the same it has always been. At their cores, Diablo III is the same game as Diablo 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoppaTot Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 At their cores, Diablo III is the same game as Diablo 2. at it's core Mario Brothers from original NES is the same game as Super Mario Odyssey for the Switch lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Although my post count doesn't reflect it, I have been playing 7d2d since I believe Alpha 9 and been lurking these forums for a number of years. Virtually every time a new alpha comes, a vocal minority (sometimes majority) complains about some new or changed mechanic but eventually adapts and then forgets that they complained about whatever as the months/years go by. Here are some examples off the top of my head: -I remember people crying when TFPs got rid off the minecraft-style crafting GUI. I don't think I have heard anything about this in years. -I remember when you could make a crossbow and stone bolts within 15-20 minutes and have this kick-ass silent zombie sniping weapon very early game. When TFPs made the recipe more difficult and took away stone bolts (which are now back), lots of people complained. Nobody really complains about the crossbow recipe anymore. -I remember when the TFPs got rid of gun molds and transitioned to gun parts and everyone complained. Now they have transitioned to full guns with mods and some people want the gun parts back! The point is this game constantly evolves and while we may not like every single little change, we gamers always adapt to the changes and adjust play styles accordingly. I hope everyone keeps this in mind for this A17 release too. At its core, the game is still the same it has always been: you scavenge, you kill ♥♥♥♥, you craft, you build, you improve your character and try not to die in the process. Its not like they took out zombies and put in unicorns or something. Yeah it's almost like... Wait a minute!!! That wasn't like that. You changed something. I hate it! Change it back!!! Even if it might be better it's new and that's scary and I want my thing the way it was!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerrKingsley Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Here's a list of a few things I miss. Non levelgated forge 0.0 hub city with endless hordes! Zombies that run in doors/shadows/mines Caves The other two snow zombies Books Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowDog1942 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Roland posted a list of each Alphas #Gates I think around when A16 was coming out. I wish I could easily find it. For A17 its: #DifficultyGate #LevelgateGate #GunpartsGate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morloc Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Here's a list of a few things I miss. Non levelgated forge 0.0 hub city with endless hordes! Zombies that run in doors/shadows/mines Caves The other two snow zombies Books Yes to the nasty city. Yes to zombies that run indoors....but I think I like the feral/regular mix we have now. Yes to the snow zombies (why take those out?). The level gating of the forge....hmm....I seem to recall thread after thread about Forge Ahead... "The game doesn't begin until you find that book!" "It's day 61, still no book." "You can't leave something so important to the game to the RNG!!" "I quit!!" "You're ruining the game" (paraphrased from memory, but I think we recall the "discussions"). Might be fun to have ~both~ the book ~and~ the ability to purchase the perk! -Morloc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ld-airgrafix Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Just because people stop complaining about a removal of a feature, it doesn’t mean the devs made a step in the right direction, it just means, we accepted the change and moved on. I still want minecraft like crafting and i still want sticks to be brought back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Yes to the nasty city. Yes to zombies that run indoors....but I think I like the feral/regular mix we have now. Yes to the snow zombies (why take those out?). The level gating of the forge....hmm....I seem to recall thread after thread about Forge Ahead... "The game doesn't begin until you find that book!" "It's day 61, still no book." "You can't leave something so important to the game to the RNG!!" "I quit!!" "You're ruining the game" (paraphrased from memory, but I think we recall the "discussions"). Might be fun to have ~both~ the book ~and~ the ability to purchase the perk! -Morloc Yeah! Or Calipers? That nightmare. Didn't Guppy post something about a MP server past day 100 and NOBODY found a Caliper yet? Ugh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junuxx Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Roland posted a list of each Alphas #Gates I think around when A16 was coming out. I wish I could easily find it. All the #gates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktoriusiii Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I love how people assume that because people aren't complaining about it anymore, they are fine with it. You know what happens when you currently make a post about what is wrong with A17? Everyone says "omg another post shut up" And so we shut up and hope that it will get better in the next alpha. I am still mad about the concrete upgrade beeing removed. I'm still mad about there not beeing Hope City anymore. I'm still mad about A16 levelgating steel and chemstation (and other perks) I was mad for about 2 Alphas about the gunmold change (but I came to accept the new system as they balanced it a lot more... until they REMOVED THAT) Just because people don't write everyday "I still hate 'xxx'" doesn't mean they like it now. The only thing I accept where I was really wrong was the old UI. It was very stylized, which made the game have a unique look. The new one is way more streamlined, BUT it definatly helps finding items and all that. So yeah. Sorry for that. But nearly every other point I ever tried to make is still a point of contention for me to this day. I just accepted that this won't change anymore. But with the levelgates, I will, for the first time, not buckle down and actually mod them out of my game. I always loved the base game so I never had to mod/change xmls (except for that one time where gunpowdercrafting was broken ). But that system is so absolutely retarded and no good game should ever use it (if a good game has levelgates its either an MMO or it would be better without it #changemymind) So yeah... while I might accept weaponmods and the new poi's stupid zombieplacement (not difficulty but the forced jumpscare in places, where there should be no zombies), I will NEVER accept levelgates and the only reason why I wasn't on about it in A16 was that it was constantly said (even though I don't remember if by someone official or not) that this was only a temporary fix and would not stay in the game... and now they made them even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicUs5000 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Unicorns! I knew they were missing something! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I love how people assume that because people aren't complaining about it anymore, they are fine with it. You know what happens when you currently make a post about what is wrong with A17? Everyone says "omg another post shut up" And so we shut up and hope that it will get better in the next alpha. I am still mad about the concrete upgrade beeing removed. I'm still mad about there not beeing Hope City anymore. I'm still mad about A16 levelgating steel and chemstation (and other perks) I was mad for about 2 Alphas about the gunmold change (but I came to accept the new system as they balanced it a lot more... until they REMOVED THAT) Just because people don't write everyday "I still hate 'xxx'" doesn't mean they like it now. The only thing I accept where I was really wrong was the old UI. It was very stylized, which made the game have a unique look. The new one is way more streamlined, BUT it definatly helps finding items and all that. So yeah. Sorry for that. But nearly every other point I ever tried to make is still a point of contention for me to this day. I just accepted that this won't change anymore. But with the levelgates, I will, for the first time, not buckle down and actually mod them out of my game. I always loved the base game so I never had to mod/change xmls (except for that one time where gunpowdercrafting was broken ). But that system is so absolutely retarded and no good game should ever use it (if a good game has levelgates its either an MMO or it would be better without it #changemymind) So yeah... while I might accept weaponmods and the new poi's stupid zombieplacement (not difficulty but the forced jumpscare in places, where there should be no zombies), I will NEVER accept levelgates and the only reason why I wasn't on about it in A16 was that it was constantly said (even though I don't remember if by someone official or not) that this was only a temporary fix and would not stay in the game... and now they made them even worse. That is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktoriusiii Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Wow. Thanks. You completely debunked everything I said and retorted with such elegance, that I have to rethink my lifes choices. Thank you for gracing me with your elegance and nobility. I feel truely enlightened now. And the gif completely sold me on your hyperintelligence, because only intelligent people use gifs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Wow. Thanks. You completely debunked everything I said and retorted with such elegance, that I have to rethink my lifes choices. Thank you for gracing me with your elegance and nobility. I feel truely enlightened now. And the gif completely sold me on your hyperintelligence, because only intelligent people use gifs. Wooohoo thanks!! That's what I was going for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowDog1942 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 All the #gates. NICE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morloc Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 And so we shut up and hope that it will get better in the next alpha. Can we skip to the part where you do that plz? (Thank you) -Morloc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktoriusiii Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Sure. Why don't you start then? I will follow up, once I see the game I love finished as an endproduct with my ideas as structural support. And this, Lucky is why I reacted that way. It's absurd. Luckily, I'm not alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimpy Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Virtually every time a new alpha comes, a vocal minority (sometimes majority) complains about some new or changed mechanic but eventually adapts and then forgets that they complained about whatever as the months/years go by I love how people assume that because people aren't complaining about it anymore, they are fine with it. You know what happens when you currently make a post about what is wrong with A17? Everyone says "omg another post shut up" And so we shut up and hope that it will get better in the next alpha. I don't think that this principle applies to Vik or any of his complaints about the game. The question is, how anomalous is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morloc Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Sure. Why don't you start then? Because.... You know what happens when you currently make a post about what is wrong with A17? Everyone says "omg another post shut up" And so we shut up and hope that it will get better in the next alpha. ....I'm not one of those guys making posts about what's wrong with A17! Now, if you're backing down, then LuckyStar must be correct, and.... Seriously though, (IMHO) there are ~way~ more people posting about what's wrong with A17 than those telling them to shut up. There's one poster who averages 1 post every six hours since his account was created a couple months ago. I am SERIOUSLY fed up with having to sift through what can only be described as whining (not you incidentally Vik; you have complained about A17, but I believe you've also offered constructive conversation in addition to helping those who are frustrated.) Keep the bitching to a thread or two. Keep the legitimate criticism and suggestions to a different thread or two. That way we don't need to read the useless threads. Of course, it doesn't work that way, because the "You ruined the game, I quit!!!" crowd thrives on being heard...spamming dramatically titled threads because they have the right to be heard, and TFP has hurt their feelings, disappointed them, screwed up their strategies, failed to adopt their suggestions, etc. etc. etc. State your issues with the experimental, offer suggestions where possible. Move on. Revisit and make a better case for your issues if they are being dismissed (NOT the same as being ignored, which may very well mean they've been acknowledged). Avoid the use of drama. Creative use of adjectives is OK, but don't make it sound like you're charging a machine-gun nest. Make comments about others' suggestions and issues. Treat them with the same respect as they treated you when they posted. -Morloc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzHawkeye Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I'd +Rep Morloc for that post, but apparently, I must have done so recently enough to prevent me from doing so again. The constructive naysayers are probably the most valuable on the forums, and as much as it might boost TFP's happy-factor to hear "Everything is perfect, don't change a thing" every now and then, it doesn't provide much guidance for improving the product. Unfortunately, there's a tendency amongst some with complaints to be anything but constructive. But it is only some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorne Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I think the ones offering more constructive criticism tend to be the more experienced (and maybe more mature). I started in A16, and they just completely changed the game on me because why. I'm actually a pretty reasonable person (ironically strong-willed and outspoken as well), but without any experience or explanation to ground you, it feels pretty unreasonable, and that's compounded by the wait and expectation between updates. I for one look to this repeating phenomenon of whining about unexpected/unwelcome deviations in game design to finally come to an end, and I think we have Morloc to thank for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyris Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Yes to the nasty city. Yes to zombies that run indoors....but I think I like the feral/regular mix we have now. Yes to the snow zombies (why take those out?). The level gating of the forge....hmm....I seem to recall thread after thread about Forge Ahead... "The game doesn't begin until you find that book!" "It's day 61, still no book." "You can't leave something so important to the game to the RNG!!" "I quit!!" "You're ruining the game" (paraphrased from memory, but I think we recall the "discussions"). Might be fun to have ~both~ the book ~and~ the ability to purchase the perk! -Morloc Thats how valmod did it in a16.4, you could wait to find the book, or spend skill points to learn it. Me? I wait for the book, and the level 20 gate in a17e is not a issue with how you can find forges in random poi's besides, you can't even craft item tools without that perk, but you CAN however repair anything even if you can't craft it yet. As for getting forged iron I know of several sources: wrenching a destroyed workbench nets you 20 when its destroyed, working stiff boxes, and cars can have some, not to mention traders quite often stock it. Iron tools are also very easy to find, I usually have half a set or a full set by day 2 or 3 from looting. That said, I care the most about finding a sledgehammer in a17e more than anything else, good for smashing heads, and busting into Poi's, well sledgehammer and a cooking pot are my 2 most desired items at the start of a new game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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