Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[Spiked_Coffee]

I'm not going to single anyone out in this thread, but I will say this:

 

I find the attitude of some people disgusting and majorly disrespectful when they say certain updates don't count or acting as such were not delivered or updates. Heck, some are so rude they don't even count the changes done after a version has reached experimental.

 

To those people who act as though a particular update does not count, I say "How Dare you turn to The Fun Pimps and say their work and effort was worthless?". That is exactly what you say when you decide to ignore changes because they didn't make enough impact for you. Some are so incredibly rude that they don't even credit the work from the time Alpha 16 hit experimental till when 16.4 was released as valid work. There were a lot of changes from the first day Alpha 16 hit the experimental branch to the time 16.4 came out. It is disappointing to me and I do not work for, nor have I done any code for The Fun Pimps.

 

To The Fun Pimps: please ignore those who would discredit the value of your time and efforts. Thank you again for all your hard work and continued efforts.

 

I often think to myself "I hope TFP see these comments as passion and not as attacks on their hard work" I know I'd be disheartened if I read some of these comments.

 

Keep on makin, we'll keep on playin

[Maharin]

TFP have thick skins. Or heads. Or... both?

[Roland]

I'm not going to single anyone out in this thread, but I will say this:

 

I find the attitude of some people disgusting and majorly disrespectful when they say certain updates don't count or acting as such were not delivered or updates. Heck, some are so rude they don't even count the changes done after a version has reached experimental.

 

To those people who act as though a particular update does not count, I say "How Dare you turn to The Fun Pimps and say their work and effort was worthless?". That is exactly what you say when you decide to ignore changes because they didn't make enough impact for you. Some are so incredibly rude that they don't even credit the work from the time Alpha 16 hit experimental till when 16.4 was released as valid work. There were a lot of changes from the first day Alpha 16 hit the experimental branch to the time 16.4 came out. It is disappointing to me and I do not work for, nor have I done any code for The Fun Pimps.

 

To The Fun Pimps: please ignore those who would discredit the value of your time and efforts. Thank you again for all your hard work and continued efforts.

 

This needed to be your 3000th post.

[meganoth]

I think they were referring to "virtual intelligence" which is slightly different from standard "artificial intelligence", I may be wrong though. What do I know? I've only programmed simple neural nets so far and that was enough for me. :-)

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_Intelligence

 

I guessed he meant "virtual" with the "V", but didn't expect that "VI" meant combining a virtual world with AI. After reading the article I suspect VI is another try at creating a hype word.

[toores]

TFP have thick skins. Or heads. Or... both?

 

That's true, but it is worth to point out that no one appreciates rude behaviour.

Especially when less communication by TFP is the result of certain types coming here, demanding stuff and accusing developers.

[Maharin]

That's true, but it is worth to point out that no one appreciates rude behaviour.

Especially when less communication by TFP is the result of certain types coming here, demanding stuff and accusing developers.

 

Agreed... just pointing that out because, well, I like to pick on people.

[Xeen]

Agreed... just pointing that out because, well, I like to pick on people.

 

lol!

[Faded]

Why not keep brass as a rare resource?

How much would their actually be around that could be made into casings?

If we go by lore, the 7d2d world just came out of the 3rd WW and then the dead started to raise.

Wouldn't any extra brass production actually be diverted to the military?

Wouldn't it be conceivable that there's a brass shortage and the average person would need to use an alternative?

 

The above sounds like you're advocating keeping it rare. I've seen you post about this in the past, too.

 

I'm not going to single anyone out in this thread, but I will say this...

 

This seems like a bit of an overreaction. I hope whomever and whatever triggered it was informed via PM.

 

That's true, but it is worth to point out that no one appreciates rude behaviour.

Especially when less communication by TFP is the result of certain types coming here, demanding stuff and accusing developers.

 

I don't think that is it. madmole himself has said he doesn't let the negative posts affect him, and there's been a lot of negative posters banned over the years. Could just be madmole and team is buckling down and working to get A17 to experimental in time for the summer.

 

You have to be thick skinned to be a developer in this age of social media.

 

Unless progression meant balancing gun resources with other ways of dealing with the hordes of zombies. Going Rambo shouldn't be the only successful approach to the end game.

 

Trap use is another, but that is already very effective. Buying ammo from traders is tedious, I'd rather be able to craft it en masse late in the game.

 

Running and hiding would be option 3, if the 7th day hordes didnt have GPS, but a lot of players here seem to have issues with wanting to let other players do this.

[Guppycur]

The biggest "lack of challenge" to the game IMO is the ability to craft. Don't get me wrong, you want to nail some spikes through a baseball bat, fine... but creating a cement mixer out of a shopping cart is a little ridiculous. That, and overall, crafting via perks takes away any real need for scavenging, once you have a stockpile of the requisite generic parts.

[Valisius]

I don't know why, but today I felt compelled to express how much I enjoy 7days...

 

From the countless hours of looting, chopping trees, digging holes and sploding zombies to the time spent in creative mode stacking massive castles and mazes then watching friends run through them often falling into pits filled with blade traps, shotguns, snakes and dire wolves... I'm looking forward to alpha 17!

[toores]

I don't think that is it. madmole himself has said he doesn't let the negative posts affect him, and there's been a lot of negative posters banned over the years. Could just be madmole and team is buckling down and working to get A17 to experimental in time for the summer.

 

You have to be thick skinned to be a developer in this age of social media.

 

It's not about having thick skins.

It's just hard to talk about unfinished concepts when any idea or even a hint of an idea is taken as a promise. If TFP later decide to go different direction, we have bunch of children crying on the forums, "whose candy was taken away". As a result we are only told things that are almost certain to make it in the game.

[Faded]

It's not about having thick skins.

It's just hard to talk about unfinished concepts when any idea or even a hint of an idea is taken as a promise. If TFP later decide to go different direction, we have bunch of children crying on the forums, "whose candy was taken away". As a result we are only told things that are almost certain to make it in the game.

 

I've seen this sentiment expressed before, but I don't think it is warranted. Most of the discussion here is actually quite productive; the moderation team does a good job of keeping things in line.

[qprophet]

The biggest "lack of challenge" to the game IMO is the ability to craft. Don't get me wrong, you want to nail some spikes through a baseball bat, fine... but creating a cement mixer out of a shopping cart is a little ridiculous. That, and overall, crafting via perks takes away any real need for scavenging, once you have a stockpile of the requisite generic parts.

 

You are working on a mod with dragons...right Gup?

[beerfly]

I've seen this sentiment expressed before, but I don't think it is warranted. Most of the discussion here is actually quite productive; the moderation team does a good job of keeping things in line.

 

All Rolands are doing their job just fine.

[Tin]

The above sounds like you're advocating keeping it rare. I've seen you post about this in the past, too.

 

Don't know how it can be construed that way, when I offered an alternative to acquire more in an alternative way, just not as brass.

[Aldranon]

I guessed he meant "virtual" with the "V", but didn't expect that "VI" meant combining a virtual world with AI. After reading the article I suspect VI is another try at creating a hype word.

 

The two terms only seem virtually alike. So allow me to elucidate.

 

If a fully functional Artificial Intelligent program wanted to fool people into thinking its just a Virtual Intelligent computer program, it would be called a: Artificial Virtual Intelligent program.

 

Now if it was 99.99% AI, trying the same thing it would be called a: Virtually Artificial Virtual Intelligent program.

[Guppycur]

You are working on a mod with dragons...right Gup?

 

Yes, and crafting is going to be severely limited to what makes sense... if you want a sword, fine, you can make a piece of crap; but if you want a GOOD sword, you better go find one. And uh, "appropriate it" somehow.

[Cop4Terminator]

Another possible cool idea, add ghosts Or some sort of paranormal activity system that only happens in certain POI's. That will spruce up the creepiness and make you even more scared to go in the said POI to loot it.

[Xtrakicking]

Running and hiding would be option 3, if the 7th day hordes didnt have GPS, but a lot of players here seem to have issues with wanting to let other players do this.

 

I'm not sure it's players not wanting others to do this, but the fact that it's hard to come up with a way for this to work. How does a horde know you're trying to hide?

 

As an example, maybe I built a huge fortress with traps and want to test them out with the horde, but then it doesn't show up because apparently being inside my base waiting is considered hiding from the horde.

[Justice68]

 

I don't think that is it. madmole himself has said he doesn't let the negative posts affect him, and there's been a lot of negative posters banned over the years. Could just be madmole and team is buckling down and working to get A17 to experimental in time for the summer.

 

You have to be thick skin

 

The problem is that is a bit of a cop out - specifically in this social age. Developers, project managers, companies or company owners or any one that has 'fans,' can just rely on them to act like a sponge that sucks up all the feedback and then fire back right at the people giving it, doing it in such a negative and vile way, that it makes people not want to have anything to do with the company, product and/or it's ventures.

 

White knighting is worse than someone being rude. Because it's retaliatory, committing the same wrong act you just watched someone else do.

 

What concerns me most, is when normal, well thought out feedback (even if given with a 'negative' tone [not sure how you qualify tone with text, sounds like an excuse to conveniently ignore comments]), is disregarded because simply people don't want to hear something that isn't clearly positive.

 

If a developer or a creator or an author is simply in it for adoration and adulation, then no one wins.

Holding their feet to the fire is the best thing for everyone involved. We do it for politicians, police officers and teachers, so why not business men and authors, inventors and etc?

Do you know what happens when we don't? Of course we do, we've all felt it before. The consumer becomes disgruntled and feels disenfranchised by faceless companies and corporations that can make mistakes and never be held accountable.

 

What I expect intelligent and savvy developers to do is, be able to stay objective 99.9% of the time, and thus take every feedback as an opportunity to find something that could improve their product no matter whom gives it or how they give it.

 

Saying 'I don't take your views on board, because you were rude' is petulant and makes you as bad as the party you are ignoring. Don't worry about the customer's negativity, worry about your own.

 

Having said that, thank you to the Fun Pimps for creating a game that scratches our itch to wander an apocalyptic wasteland, with survival elements and doesn't require me to continue suffering paying Fallen Earth since it went F2P.

 

Looking forward to A17

[Faded]

I'm not sure it's players not wanting others to do this, but the fact that it's hard to come up with a way for this to work. How does a horde know you're trying to hide?

 

As an example, maybe I built a huge fortress with traps and want to test them out with the horde, but then it doesn't show up because apparently being inside my base waiting is considered hiding from the horde.

 

Right now it is easy enough to hide down at bedrock level and the hordes won't reach you. But apparently playing that way annoys people.

 

I was matching the spirit of Maharin's post and not advocating for any particular playstyle for endgame - I believe all should be viable.

[Faded]

The problem is that is a bit of a cop out - specifically in this social age. Developers, project managers, companies or company owners or any one that has 'fans,' can just rely on them to act like a sponge that sucks up all the feedback and then fire back right at the people giving it, doing it in such a negative and vile way, that it makes people not want to have anything to do with the company, product and/or it's ventures.....

 

Well, sure. However, if you're unfortunate enough to attract a "troll" (speaking colloquially, I am aware of what the term used to mean until quite recently) or two, dealing with their vitriol can be pretty annoying and I can see how that would be draining over a long time period. Apparently this effect is why Notch sold Minecraft, for example.

[Aldranon]

I'm not sure it's players not wanting others to do this, but the fact that it's hard to come up with a way for this to work. How does a horde know you're trying to hide?

 

As an example, maybe I built a huge fortress with traps and want to test them out with the horde, but then it doesn't show up because apparently being inside my base waiting is considered hiding from the horde.

 

As a sandbox game (where A16 is) it doesn't really matter if there is a "why" to anything.

But, if the game is to evolve past a sandbox, some type of plot will have to explain why the 7 days hordes attack the players location like clockwork.

 

Adding a string of missions that begin to reveal what is happening and ideally how to stop the 7 day horde and progress to confronting the group(s) responsible would be great.

[Justice68]

Well, sure. However, if you're unfortunate enough to attract a "troll" (speaking colloquially, I am aware of what the term used to mean until quite recently) or two, dealing with their vitriol can be pretty annoying and I can see how that would be draining over a long time period. Apparently this effect is why Notch sold Minecraft, for example.

 

Agreed, and this is where good leaders, managers, owners etc.(or even dare I say, 'normal' staff) stand apart from others as they can do their job and also excel by showing competency in extracting useful information from poor communications.

 

IT people do it all day long!!!

 

Ultimately, being offended is not an excuse to ignore concerns or complaints.

 

What I find disheartening is too often they don't even let those people become trolls, they just cut them off for disagreeing or having a dissenting opinion.

 

 

Hey, has anybody ever noticed that there's no huge pile ups of cars on most of the roads, like we see in Dying Light, Walking Dead, Fallout or other countless other forms of Zombie/dystopian/apocalyptic media?

 

I was hoping this would be a staple of 7 days, as well as some more elaborate road layouts, overpasses, on ramps, etc.

The under motorway tunnels in Dying Light are really cool.

 

As a sandbox game (where A16 is) it doesn't really matter if there is a "why" to anything.

But, if the game is to evolve past a sandbox, some type of plot will have to explain why the 7 days hordes attack the players location like clockwork.

 

Adding a string of missions that begin to reveal what is happening and ideally how to stop the 7 day horde and progress to confronting the group(s) responsible would be great.

 

 

Yes! What a wonderful mystery that has been. I'm almost sad to consider the idea of it ever being explained.

[Aldranon]

Yes! What a wonderful mystery that has been. I'm almost sad to consider the idea of it ever being explained.

 

Using the magic of DLC's and player mods, there could be a near infinite number of plots, each having a different explanation (or not) of the different whys and hows of the game.