beHypE Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 A shotgun does not have the DPS of a machine gun. The ammo is super cheap and even if you only hit a feral soldier in the chest, a single shot knocks it on it's arse. Basic shells are not good against armor but you can even fix that with the Penetrator perk. Shotguns do AOE crowd control like no other weapon. This can be improved with the sawed off or duckbill mod. (the scale of the effects could still be improved) Even if shotguns are your "main weapon", nothing stops you from picking up a rifle or MG and use up all that 7.62mm ammo that is piling up. Did you actually play a game with shotguns ? Not trying to discredit your knowledge but my perception of your theory and the feel I get in practice when I play my shotgun guy are worlds apart. The base double barrel is hands down the most underwhelming gun in the game even when perked into. My biggest gripe with the double barrel isn't even the damage in itself, but its effective range coupled with its 2 bullet mag size, making every missed shot a troublesome situation and not providing much towards dealing with multiple foes at close-combat. If we're talking about a single zombie in a hallway it's doing fine, but then again my sledgehammer does just fine in that situation aswell and I don't need to spend the ammo. For those "oh s***!" moments, it's all good if it's a single animal or whatever (and provided you don't miss), but send a pack of wolves and you're in a world of hurt, whereas a simple unmodded pistol with no perks can keep them at bay with a single mag no problem. There's just no reason risking to play with 2 bullets in your mag that provide nothing specific when you can have 15. BTW the knockdown of a double barrel shot is definitely not 100%. I understand you stated that the slugs fill the gap of effective range. In practice though, you probably can't craft slugs when you're still stuck with the double barrel, because it's precisely an early-mid game weapon and you either don't have the schematic for slugs yet or you can't expand all those ressources needed for making a decent amount of them. Let's just nerf the wooden bow into the ground and tell people to craft steel arrows so that it does its job, and see how the community reacts. It's effectively the same argument. The pistol, the mag, the AK, they all effectively work at close and midrange. The sniper is subpar at close range but excels at long range. The double barrel just fails at doing its job in its own niche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay_ombie Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Yer those mines are nasty. I did a quick test with full steel armor and they still one hit kill me. The Infiltrator perk really helps on permadeath runs or get lucky with Urban combat book 5 and you won't trigger mines. Same here, been wiped out by not noticing a mine a fair few times. Once was outside an army camp after trying to be clever and lead zombies over them. Can’t say I ever used mines as a base defence. I guess they more for pvp play maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palikkamaa Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 @Devs Now that we have shape menu for building block, can that be expanded to basic electrical things (like relays/switches etc)? It is really easy and fun to do electrical stuff in creative- and god mode because you dont have to worry about how many things you need, just take a whole stack. But in survival these do feel like the pre a18 building blocks. Million different things and in a tight budget either craft one by one and always be waiting or craft a stack of them and end up not using all of them, wasting resources. It was a pain in the as to run between an unfinished horde base and the main base where are all the recourses and crafting stations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kipster Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 New experimental, new, fresh game and hooboy what a start i had. Settings are default difficulty, 120min days, marked airdrops. RWG 8k generated by nitrogen. Spawned in the forest. After the initial gathering, i started to head out towards the trader. First entity i encouter is a direwolf! RUN! Marked it on the map, for future meat. After that all went well until i saw dead trees in the distance, oh crap, i gotta go trough wasteland, oh well, challenge is a challenge, so i'll take it! Got to the edge of wasteland and in the distance i saw that the forest biome continues, yay! Sneaking like a snake trough the wasteland, carefully scouting for landmines, zombiebears and whatnot, i spotted a dog. I'm not afraid of them, until they jump on me. Sneak attack with bow, dog runs. But then i mess up and everything started to go downhill. I accidentally scrolled one too far from my stone sledge and started drinking that one water i had in my hotbar, mistake. Dog came and bite me couple of times, while i was calmly drinking my water. Finally i was able to switch to sledge. One powerattack to the mutt's head and it exploded. Whew, i'm safe! Or that's what i thought.... I had missed that 3 vultures were circling me and that dog had nibbled my healt low enough for them to start attacking. First vulture made me bleed, killed it, then quick bandage and off to dispatch the other two. Waited for awhile so the health regen'd back to near full and continued towards the forest where i got safely. At the edge, there was a military POI. First though, landmines, be careful! I thought i was, while sprinting, until i heard faint *click*......KABOOM! FFFFuuuuuuu.....dge. 8 health left, thank god those mines has a delay now! It was so well hidden in the forest drass that i completely missed it. 300M left to the trader, now i can see it in the distance! Sprinting on and then one....more....challenge. A fricking bear, right next to the trader... Luckily, there was this one zombie, which distracted it just enough for me to get a SS and to get in the safety of the trader. Trader had only working workbench, no schematics in any of the broken ones. Now, here i am, shivering with my primitive bow and 4 stone arrows, thinking "what would jesus do?" while bear bangs the front door of the trader... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SickPuppy Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Same here, been wiped out by not noticing a mine a fair few times. Once was outside an army camp after trying to be clever and lead zombies over them. Can’t say I ever used mines as a base defence. I guess they more for pvp play maybe. That's a good strat, risky but ballsy. Pre a17 I used to clear the grass around the army camps so I could see the mines better. Used that for the first horde night carrying a torch lol. A18 is a different beast though, I gotta go full safe/survival mode in the first week now. It's the ones in pois that get me, I get tanky and cocky and start running through quests only to have my legs blown off. Once I see barbed wire I just stop and slow right down now. I tend to use the ones I find early on when I don't have stacks of supplies yet. I usually build a funnel system and place the mines where I can shoot them, once the blood moon horde group up it can be a nice xp earner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyLee298 Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Whats the plan for future weapons, gun related. I believe weapons are a huge part of this game but the animations are just bad, like really bad. Will we be seeing professional weapon animations in A19. i mean heck the MP5 reload does nothing to the gun, the magazine doesnt move the action doesnt lock back. It cant be that hard to rig up a skeleton in unity for the guns. The single shot rifle should say in the game (because more gun is more fun) but you should also make a 5 Round Bolt Action version, just rig up animations and your set, you already have the model to do so (even tho using the same model would look cheap). The 5rd bolt action rifle can be a T2 rifle and the MR10 can be a T3 but make it hold 10rds instead of 5. I love the M4 you fellas worked on, i use it in all my games even tho its not released yet! i would love to see more guns added in every update just to keep thing fresh, like a m14, aa12, glock, salvaged guns and more. I know people are waiting for a T3 shotgun everyone wants a AA-12 or some sort of semi/full auto shotgun, i made a mod the uses the Ak-47 model and turns into a Saiga-12 shotgun and its great not that OP eather depending on how you do the recoil, range and rpm All im saying is, we need more guns, the m60 is great and so is the M4 but we just need more diversity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 I wonder if there should be a journal entry or some sort of way to imply in-game on focusing skill points into a specific build early game. As the main complaint I've seen from returning and new players that decide to play on the server, I'm on is that weapons and killing zombies take a bit of time. On this point:: 1. Server I'm on is @ 5/6 difficulty so, obvs we do less damage overall to zombies 2. I'm just assuming but a player might not understand that speccing early game is necessary Point 2, I feel that there should be a journal entry that just goes over a general overview on which skill tree would suit a player and then its all up to the player at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Is that for default settings and do you mean 100% knock down or high %? Actually, the game is balanced for Nomad difficulty. That is the base line. We just call the next lower one "default" because - changing this text is easy enough - whatevs And no. No weapon is as effective on Insane as it is on Nomad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0ldman Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Place your bets, folks. How long will I survive? 60 sec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaxTeller718 Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Is that for default settings and do you mean 100% knock down or high %? I've been trying to make them work on Insane/nightmare but they don't knock things over as much as I'd thought even with 4 levels in the perk. I just gave up and drank some fergitin elixir. Pump does ok but definitely not op feels, or are you secretly holding off that aa12 for xmas?? Balancing will and should never be done based on any setting but default. Do you know how whacked balance would be if they balanced for insane? shotguns would be one shotting irradiated on normal. Why do people play on insane and then complain about sponges and difficulty. It boggles the mind. - - - Updated - - - I wonder if there should be a journal entry or some sort of way to imply in-game on focusing skill points into a specific build early game. As the main complaint I've seen from returning and new players that decide to play on the server, I'm on is that weapons and killing zombies take a bit of time. On this point:: 1. Server I'm on is @ 5/6 difficulty so, obvs we do less damage overall to zombies 2. I'm just assuming but a player might not understand that speccing early game is necessary Point 2, I feel that there should be a journal entry that just goes over a general overview on which skill tree would suit a player and then its all up to the player at that point. Suggesting a certain build to a player means that build is the best one to go with. Im sure they are trying to make every build viable not just one or two power ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onarr Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Actually, the game is balanced for Nomad difficulty. That is the base line. We just call the next lower one "default" because - changing this text is easy enough - whatevs And no. No weapon is as effective on Insane as it is on Nomad. Just out of curiosity, is dismemeberment chance the same? For example knifes with their fast attack speed might be quite desirable on bulletsponge zombies on insane. - - - Updated - - - That's a good strat, risky but ballsy. Pre a17 I used to clear the grass around the army camps so I could see the mines better. Used that for the first horde night carrying a torch lol. A18 is a different beast though, I gotta go full safe/survival mode in the first week now. It's the ones in pois that get me, I get tanky and cocky and start running through quests only to have my legs blown off. Once I see barbed wire I just stop and slow right down now. I tend to use the ones I find early on when I don't have stacks of supplies yet. I usually build a funnel system and place the mines where I can shoot them, once the blood moon horde group up it can be a nice xp earner. shooting the mine gives xp from dead zombies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inmyh3ad Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Am I the only person who generates an 8k map under 10 minutes? Does the forest biome always have little elevation and no flat sections? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay_ombie Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 That's a good strat, risky but ballsy. Pre a17 I used to clear the grass around the army camps so I could see the mines better. Used that for the first horde night carrying a torch lol. A18 is a different beast though, I gotta go full safe/survival mode in the first week now. It's the ones in pois that get me, I get tanky and cocky and start running through quests only to have my legs blown off. Once I see barbed wire I just stop and slow right down now. I tend to use the ones I find early on when I don't have stacks of supplies yet. I usually build a funnel system and place the mines where I can shoot them, once the blood moon horde group up it can be a nice xp earner. Another top strategy I need to try one day. The fact this game provides so many different approaches to defence is flipping top stuff !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrton Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Madmole, you didn't tell me anything about this https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?111778-Alpha-18-Dev-Diary!!&p=1055831#post1055831 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Survager Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrton Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! what are you talking about? What version do you play? What happened to the iron ore? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Suggesting a certain build to a player means that build is the best one to go with. Im sure they are trying to make every build viable not just one or two power ones. Would it though? The way I would have the journal entry would be like this: - Perception: Useful for spears and rifles - Strength - Useful for clubs and shotguns - Fortitude - Useful for fist and machinegun - Agility - Useful for bows and pistol - Intellect - Useful for stun baton and turret Just a general overview, not a full on guide like, use Agility if you want to be a badass stealth ninja. If the text was like that, a player would get a hint on what skills goes with what weapons and then plan accordingly. - - - Updated - - - Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Return the iron ore!!! Iron is still in the game. - - - Updated - - - Actually, the game is balanced for Nomad difficulty. That is the base line. We just call the next lower one "default" because - changing this text is easy enough - whatevs And no. No weapon is as effective on Insane as it is on Nomad. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the only difference in terms of difficulty is that the player does less damage to the zombies? The zombies still have the same health. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay_ombie Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Kipster - excellent read and I thought I had it rough. I think to get a workbench schematic you have to wrench the workbench. Well worked for me anyways. Apart from they of course can’t be a traders workbench as everything is flagged protected in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gareee Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 it happens with the 4x4 as well. the work around is pick it up, then replace it back on the ground and you should be able to repair the vehicle. you may have to log out then log in. Tried that and it didn't work. I'll double check that again today though. I also just reported the junk turrets are no longer showing icons on the map or compass. I;ve had to waste a full day or two retracing steps to recover my tier 6. Man, I really want to name them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locusta Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Iron is still in the game. He’s talking about iron ORE. They removed iron ore so now when you mine you don’t get ore, you get straight iron. More simplification... sigh. Loc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weazelsun Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Kipster - excellent read and I thought I had it rough. I think to get a workbench schematic you have to wrench the workbench. Well worked for me anyways. Apart from they of course can’t be a traders workbench as everything is flagged protected in them. You can find a workbench schematic sometimes, when looting a the destroyed variant. That's how I finally was able to craft my own workbench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedo Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 He talking about iron ORE. They removed iron ore so now when you mine you don’t get ore, you get straight iron. More simplification... sigh. I find it hilarious. It isn't as if it is particularly immersion breaking, like removing cotton and just having cloth lying around in the fields. You still have to smelt it to use it, and it already basically was 1:1 (1200 stack v. 6000 stack; 5 seconds v. 1 second). What changed was an icon which couldn't be used for anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay_ombie Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 You can find a workbench schematic sometimes, when looting a the destroyed variant. That's how I finally was able to craft my own workbench. Ohhh simple looting can produce a schematic as well, I stand corrected then. - - - Updated - - - He’s talking about iron ORE. They removed iron ore so now when you mine you don’t get ore, you get straight iron. More simplification... sigh. Loc I swear I found iron ore last night. I think it was from a destroyed forge though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fox_kirya Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Have TFP fixed that I have to switch Windows interface from Ru to En to use ingame inventories? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locusta Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 I find it hilarious. It isn't as if it is particularly immersion breaking, like removing cotton and just having cloth lying around in the fields. You still have to smelt it to use it, and it already basically was 1:1 (1200 stack v. 6000 stack; 5 seconds v. 1 second). What changed was an icon which couldn't be used for anything. While you still have to smelt it to use it, it still removes a whole step of smelting. Before you smelt the ore into iron. Now you don’t. It removes choice and priorities. Before you had to make a decision. Do I need to make forged iron to repair before the horde, or do I need iron for turret ammunition? Now I can do both at the same time. I dunno...some of these changes just seem to be made just for the sake of it without deeper understanding on how it can affect fundamental gameplay imo. I never had an issue with any forging recipes, so I’d like to know where this one came from. Loc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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