An in depth discussion on zombie loot in alpha 17

[Colin248]

I did not know that. How USA-centric of me.

 

Colin, if you're British or at least watch Dr. Who, I retract my tongue-in-cheek spelling correction.

 

 

Especially since I was wrong: the spelling I was thinking of was septic...Dammit Jim, I'm a Math Teacher

 

oh ♥♥♥♥..... huh... i mean lets be honest it does make sense. il give you americans credit on this one, thats a spelling change i am very much ok with. the rest of the ♥♥♥♥ you pull is just downright barbaric how you butcher our fine language.

 

besides, i wont grill ya for the spelling mistake. just so long as the reader understands im perfectly fine with it. never has to be perfect. XD

[RestInPieces]

Only if you're American. Over here where we use British English they're both "sceptical".

 

Anyway, on the actual subject, for a while now I've been shouting (well, politely saying) that killing zombies should be a necessary evil where you expose yourself to danger in order to survive; rather than something you do for loot and experience.

 

So I'm very happy with #lootgate and I'm waiting for the xp rewared to be removed from them as well...

 

Oh yeah, exp is even worse. At least loot can be rare and thematic like the loot on that cheerleader that Brimstone found.

[Burakin]

I'm needing to see how it turns out. it's been such a base mechanism i'm having trouble thinking through how it would turn out. Less loot from zombies means It needs to appear somewhere else, at least part of it. I always play with no loot respawn (SP mind) - so if the amount dropped 90% you'd be starved, especially in early game. However like said trash cans etc could have a bit more.

 

You could have an industrial 'waste dump' POI - etc to compensate a little for specialty stuff (Why would someone run around with 7 isolators in their pockets:P). Alternatively for non-generalised loot perhaps a 'former survivor' skin zombie - that would explain both the backpack and an increased amount of loot on that particular zombie.

 

It's a balance thing, and some thought needs to go to suspension of disbelieve, but how it works out in game mechanics is really hard to judge without playing.

 

B

[badgerpns]

and all the huge people that play this game.

 

Too many IRL meat stews and cornbread, I'm guessing??

[pApA^LeGBa]

Or those people are just their target demographic and they are nailing it perfectly.

 

He is kinda right tough. The regular forumusers are a minority. I mean there are like 10K people playing right now. How many regular forum posters are there again? a few hundred? not even that i guess.

[pApA^LeGBa]

Understandable edit @Roland. But only understandable if you would delete the asslickers from his post also....

 

aaand damnit, wanted to edit, not doublepost.

[A Nice Cup of Tea]

He is kinda right tough. The regular forumusers are a minority. I mean there are like 10K people playing right now. How many regular forum posters are there again? a few hundred? not even that i guess.

 

But how many of those 10k would agree with her? And how many would agree with us?

 

The answer, of course, is that there is no way of knowing.

 

So while she's kind of right in that we don't represent the majority (although I don't think anyone has ever claimed that we do), her unstated implication that she does represent the majority (and "common sense") and that said majority would disagree with us is completely unfounded.

[pApA^LeGBa]

That´s why i said "kinda right".

[Jedo]

He is kinda right tough. The regular forumusers are a minority. I mean there are like 10K people playing right now. How many regular forum posters are there again? a few hundred? not even that i guess.

 

It's not in dispute that the forum users and the feedback that they give represents a minority. What is in dispute is the demographics of the larger player base. People on here frequently want to claim that the larger player base identifies with their perspective. They may even cite their server with its massive amount of players as evidence. In the end, though, we can't really know. TFP would have to do more market research and surveys (and release that to us) in order to know.

 

That leaves the question of which demographic is TFP targeting: Hardcore gamers (a la Dark Souls), casual gamers (a la Sims), or something in between?

 

Edit: Bah, A Nice Cup of Tea! I got interrupted while composing my message.

[Roland]

Actually the majority in this poll are saying they will reserve judgement until they play with it and if the vast majority of all players don't use these forums and so won't even be aware of the change until their game updates then I guess this poll is a good representation.

 

I'm calling it now. The vast majority of the player base will have no judgement on this change until after they play with it.

[Jedo]

I'm calling it now. The vast majority of the player base will have no judgement on this change until after they play with it.

 

As it should be, no doubt.

[SylenThunder]

I voted that I'm fine with "It's a good decision". Truly cleaning up after the horde becomes a real PITA. After the second or third horde night, I don't even care about 90% of the drops in there. Almost everything is either scrapped for base components, or tossed on the floor. Then there are all the corpses to clean up. It's just tedious, and a waste of game time that could be put to better use.

[pApA^LeGBa]

again. that´s why i said "kinda right". Maybe someone google kinda? i thought it´s a common word... i wish i would get answers on why the gamestage can replace a drop down menu that fast and many.

[Colin248]

Actually the majority in this poll are saying they will reserve judgement until they play with it and if the vast majority of all players don't use these forums and so won't even be aware of the change until their game updates then I guess this poll is a good representation.

 

I'm calling it now. The vast majority of the player base will have no judgement on this change until after they play with it.

 

honestly the result of the poll is reassuring. everyone seams to be the dont know it till you try it kind of mentality and thats good. no extreme just middle of the road.

 

im just worried when it does come out that people react... very... whats the right word for just outright rage... at this specific change. i was just concerned for the rep to go from this game i adore... more then the lengthy develop time already does to it. XD

[TheStoryteller01]

Imho there is one answer option missing (that at least I would take):

 

- I don't really care because so far I've modded the heck out of the game and I will do the same with A 17 anyway

[eidobunny]

fwiw I've probably raised the most concerns about the loot and I voted that I'll reserve judgment. Like, how can you tell if it's good or bad until you've tried it? Still, you can have something explained to you and have a gut feeling on whether or not it's a good idea. If the developers said "whenever a dog bites you all of your weapons in your inventory and in your hand drop to the floor" and most people will read that and say it's a bad idea, even without trying it. That doesn't mean it's a bad idea, that just means it sounds like a bad idea. Maybe it will be the most fun thing imaginable.

[Roland]

honestly the result of the poll is reassuring. everyone seams to be the dont know it till you try it kind of mentality and thats good. no extreme just middle of the road.

 

im just worried when it does come out that people react... very... whats the right word for just outright rage... at this specific change. i was just concerned for the rep to go from this game i adore... more then the lengthy develop time already does to it. XD

 

Not rage at first. First it will be bug reports. Then disbelief. Then rage.

[Scyris]

Right, the "zombies aren't a resource" argument. Please explain to me the point of defending a base against a zombie horde when you could just ride a minibike instead.

 

That's all I want to know.

 

I really loved the tower defense aspect of the game and now unless TFP has a trick up their sleeves, I don't see the point in even bothering with it.

 

TBH I've never liked the gpsing zombies every 7 days, in A16 I usually go underground or on the 2nd floor of a poi and knock the stairs out and ignore them. Might shoot a few thru the floors. I also find running zombies stupid, but I can see night/horde night being even more of a joke if I shut running off, though I do think with running off ferals still run regardless.

 

At least zombies still give exp so they have a reason for me to kill them, otherwise i'd just avoid them other than ones I have to kill which for the most part would be the sleepers in poi's. I'm worried more about possibly losing them as a bone source.

 

I voted on the reserve judgement till I try it myself. rng is a fickle thing. Also, there will be several experemental patches most likely so stuff like the loot is bound to change

[Jedo]

As of this post, I am the lone vote for "I don't care." Figures.

 

Four brave souls now. Amazing.

[eidobunny]

TBH I've never liked the gpsing zombies every 7 days, in A16 I usually go underground or on the 2nd floor of a poi and knock the stairs out and ignore them. Might shoot a few thru the floors. I also find running zombies stupid, but I can see night/horde night being even more of a joke if I shut running off, though I do think with running off ferals still run regardless.

 

At least zombies still give exp so they have a reason for me to kill them, otherwise i'd just avoid them other than ones I have to kill which for the most part would be the sleepers in poi's. I'm worried more about possibly losing them as a bone source.

 

I voted on the reserve judgement till I try it myself. rng is a fickle thing. Also, there will be several experemental patches most likely so stuff like the loot is bound to change

 

For sure but now zombies are going to have better AI that targets SI, and also the ability to dig so there's likely not going to be a way to ignore them other than to ride around on a minibike.

 

My main concern is that as the hordes get extreme - I'm talking like maximum gamestage hordes with like 50 simultaneous zombies all night, half radiated cops the other half radiated ferals - that you're going to spend more than 6 days recouping your losses for the 7th night. My greatest fear here is that as the game progresses, you'll be able to spend less and less time doing anything other than preparing for the horde - unless you avoid the horde completely. With zombie loot in A16.4 you generally recoup your losses in about 1-2 days which leaves you 5-6 days to go looting, gather resources, build structures, make progression, etc. If zombie loot is drastically more rare I'm worried that 1-2 days will turn into 3-4 days and by the time gamestage is maxed out it might take longer to prepare for a 7th night than 7 days. If I'm chewing through 5,000 bullets and a bunch of landmines and spikes and concrete walls on a 7th night I can't imagine being able to recoup that in a reasonable amount of time through anything other than zombie loot. I'm sure there are other solutions to this problem I just hope the developers have implemented at least one method of reward for 7th nights otherwise it would make more sense to me to ride around on a minibike so I can spend my 6 days doing other things I would like to do.

[Brimstone]

Right, the "zombies aren't a resource" argument. Please explain to me the point of defending a base against a zombie horde when you could just ride a minibike instead.

 

You can have more stuff in a base and the zombies want to eat you?

 

I really loved the tower defense aspect of the game and now unless TFP has a trick up their sleeves, I don't see the point in even bothering with it.

 

I'm just confused. You love the tower defense aspect of the game, just not as much as digging for loot through corpses instead of just picking up the dropped packs?

[Roland]

There's a classic story of an old geezer who would always chase the neighborhood boys away from from playing on his front lawn to no avail. For whatever reason they loved playing in his yard. One night he came outside and the boys got ready to run away but he called them over and said, "Boys, tomorrow I actually want you to play in my yard and I'm going to pay you a quarter right now to do it"

 

The boys were overjoyed and for two weeks straight the old man paid them a quarter every night to play in his yard the next day. Then, at the beginning of the third week when they came to his door for their quarter he told them they were welcome to play in his yard but he wasn't going to pay them any longer. They would have to do it without compensation.

 

They never played in his yard again...

[Jugginator]

There's a classic story of an old geezer who would always chase the neighborhood boys away from from playing on his front lawn to no avail. For whatever reason they loved playing in his yard. One night he came outside and the boys got ready to run away but he called them over and said, "Boys, tomorrow I actually want you to play in my yard and I'm going to pay you a quarter right now to do it"

 

The boys were overjoyed and for two weeks straight the old man paid them a quarter every night to play in his yard the next day. Then, at the beginning of the third week when they came to his door for their quarter he told them they were welcome to play in his yard but he wasn't going to pay them any longer. They would have to do it without compensation.

 

They never played in his yard again...

 

That was hilarious. +900 rep -- first good laugh since last week.

[Colin248]

There's a classic story of an old geezer who would always chase the neighborhood boys away from from playing on his front lawn to no avail. For whatever reason they loved playing in his yard. One night he came outside and the boys got ready to run away but he called them over and said, "Boys, tomorrow I actually want you to play in my yard and I'm going to pay you a quarter right now to do it"

 

The boys were overjoyed and for two weeks straight the old man paid them a quarter every night to play in his yard the next day. Then, at the beginning of the third week when they came to his door for their quarter he told them they were welcome to play in his yard but he wasn't going to pay them any longer. They would have to do it without compensation.

 

They never played in his yard again...

 

that is funny, il give you that. XD

 

but i feel this point is mute, as well as the people saying you shouldent be rewarded for slaying zeds. whilst i can understand to a point, its a zombie survival game.... yeh. your right. its a zombie survival GAME. if you want a sim, go play... *snirk* day z. that doesnt reward ya for killing zeds. altho i do hear the mod is still going strong. end of the day games are supposed to be fun. loot is fun. its why lootboxes are so bloody addictive. as is looting the hordes and slaying enemys in this game.

 

huh... perhaps thats more the problem. the addiction fo the random loot generator. looting corpses is always fun because you never know what you find.

[bloom_meister]

I voted to reserve judgement because there are too many unknowns right now.

 

I will say however that this is an excellent change for pvp!