samonoske Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 I understand your point but i dont think making progression of scavanging faster is on the agenda and more likely the opposite. I think you already decribe the extra effort you have to put in to make sure you get full loot respawn and i know from my experience after a real long loot session it gets tedious but there is no fix for that. You will just loot more pushing your loot levels up and then the loot containers will need to placed more sparcely it will be never ending adjustment. I am not sure about how to improve the looting experience but i suppose if you have to make too many trips or a location has too much to loot in one go then more bases are needed. I understand PVP that it doesnt work the same but the element of someone looting an area before you and leaving you garbage or even better a candy tin is part of the competivness. Not trying to be negative but i believe the exponantial slope of progression needs to be tough otherwise the game loses its challenge but i understand tedious is not fun for gameplay so tough choices. This is just my view it would be good to hear what others think. I also think there needs to be a way to clear the loot people leave behind cause in my case nothing is trash and I'm basically getting twice the loot and only half the scavenging xp when stuff is left behind. just about everything in this game has a use and I take it all. so either have the loot container reset when new loot spawns or make it so no new loot will spawn until it has been empty for the full loot respawn time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moldy Bread Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Scope Creep. Neither of those things were ever mentioned in the kickstarter or any stretch goals. The devs experimented with them a bit and created a mock up of both. But as with anything as they started digging in to see what issues would have to be solved to make them a reality it was deemed too expensive in terms of time and money to fully pursue. This wasn't a sudden decision as it seemed by Joel's sudden announcement. They have been looking for ways to cut the fat so that they can get the game they promised to gold. There are important features that were originally promised and those have to take priority. Why go down an uncertain road with the Behemoth when you still need to develop and implement the Duke of Navezgane and his bandits which were original promises. The ziplines were a whim and an experiment. Problems having to do with animation, collision, chunk loading and unloading, and more were not even begun when Joel showed that rudimentary video of the concept. Surmounting those problems would take a lot of time and money for a whimsical side project. Believe me, I was disappointed when I found out but I also understand that they need to be focused and not spending weeks trying to solve problems associated with two ideas that were born late in the development cycle. The good news is that they DO have these concepts and the beginnings of these features in rough form and who knows but they might fit in well with their next game and be stated as one of the goals from the beginning. Sorry to double post but... To be quite frank that sounds like bull... There is no reason not to add the Behemoth and Zip lines to the game, you talk about money, but just how much have the Fun Pimps made? This is no longer a lowly project, they have the team and funds, I fail to see how modelling a new enemy and adding it to the game is so expensive, if modders can do that for free then why can't the Fun Pimps? This game has been in Alpha for over 4 years, why are we suddenly worried about time? You say "whimsical side project" I say "content" There is no reason to not add content at a later date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menace312 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Sorry to double post but... To be quite frank that sounds like bull... There is no reason not to add the Behemoth and Zip lines to the game, you talk about money, but just how much have the Fun Pimps made? This is no longer a lowly project, they have the team and funds, I fail to see how modelling a new enemy and adding it to the game is so expensive, if modders can do that for free then why can't the Fun Pimps? This game has been in Alpha for over 4 years, why are we suddenly worried about time? You say "whimsical side project" I say "content" There is no reason to not add content at a later date. So your one of TFP staff then? How else could you possibly know what it takes to implement ANYTHING in this game... You mention modders... Well they also use a very long time on their mods, and they dont have to worry about adding new stuff or changing physics. They just take the game as-is, and work with it... You mention money that they made... How do you know anything about this? Do you have access to their bank accounts? It's not even that interesting... What if the dev's made 10million each... What would that change??? All I see here, is another bitching post... Sorry... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moldy Bread Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 So your one of TFP staff then? How else could you possibly know what it takes to implement ANYTHING in this game... You mention modders... Well they also use a very long time on their mods, and they dont have to worry about adding new stuff or changing physics. They just take the game as-is, and work with it... You mention money that they made... How do you know anything about this? Do you have access to their bank accounts? It's not even that interesting... What if the dev's made 10million each... What would that change??? All I see here, is another bitching post... Sorry... How frighting... So pointing out that there is no reason not to add content at a later date is bitching, though any criticism is bitching I guess. First off, how much money they have made. According to SteamSpy around 2,520,587 copies have been sold at around $24.00 so that's around $60,494,088. Of course this is without taxes or Steam fee's but I imagine the actual number is still quite high. Yea, I get it, things cost money and time. But just saying, "well we don't want to prolong things" after the game has been in Alpha for 4 years + is kind of silly. Unless they plan to add it as DLC which I am sure will irritate a lot of people. As I said, what reason is there not to add more content at a later date once everything has been fleshed out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doombringer101 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 How frighting... So pointing out that there is no reason not to add content at a later date is bitching, though any criticism is bitching I guess. First off, how much money they have made. According to SteamSpy around 2,520,587 copies have been sold at around $24.00 so that's around $60,494,088. Of course this is without taxes or Steam fee's but I imagine the actual number is still quite high. Yea, I get it, things cost money and time. But just saying, "well we don't want to prolong things" after the game has been in Alpha for 4 years + is kind of silly. Unless they plan to add it as DLC which I am sure will irritate a lot of people. As I said, what reason is there not to add more content at a later date once everything has been fleshed out? Its scope creep, there are kickstarter goals yet to be implemented, logically these take precedence over 'additional content'. The time the project has been running up to this point is not relevant, I assume they are firming up the end date and working towards this. If things like the behemoth and zip lines become part of future DLC then players have the choice to purchase them or not, I don't see a problem here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moldy Bread Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 I understand all that, but going from "We are thinking of adding these things anyway" to "well now you gotta pay for them because... You do" isn't the best thing ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graphite Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Thanks Roland for expanding and reiterirating the focus of the game it has been helpful in a clearer understanding the direction it is taking. I have never heard the term scope creep but i understand it now. I have read a few replys and it seems that some people believe that the TFP on not focusing 99.9% on the game. Well this is more than likely true as there is a bigger picture of there development company which involves the future's of real people (humans). There has to be some planning for what happens after the alpha cycle ends if TFP want to continue as a group and pooling everything into 1 game and starting again from nothing doesnt make sense. Balanced people who play the game wouldnt act so recklessly with there lifes. Saying that i beleive TFP are putting in 98.1000000000000066600000000000001% effort in making this game as they set out to do in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yisiscreise Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Love the new bike! =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meganoth Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 To be quite frank that sounds like bull... There is no reason not to add the Behemoth and Zip lines to the game, you talk about money, but just how much have the Fun Pimps made? Not exactly, he talks about the value for money/time relation. Even though their time has no value for you, it has value to them. They might simply want to see the light at the end of the tunnel. They might simply want to avoid being called the project that ended up forever in development hell or the neverending EA game. They simply might not want to work on this game for more than x years but do something new eventually. They own the company, you don't. They promised to deliver a game with features A,C,D,E,F,G for the price, anything else, like H,I,J and especially B and Z is a bonus that can't be demanded. If you think different, ask Disney to give you a free lunch, they make enough money to afford it. I fail to see how modelling a new enemy and adding it to the game is so expensive, if modders can do that for free then why can't the Fun Pimps? This game has been in Alpha for over 4 years, why are we suddenly worried about time? If modders already did it, why are you protesting. Use the mod. What, you maybe say the mod has problems, the behemoth doesn't work like the behemoth should? Well, in that case that might be the other much more difficult and extensive part of the work to get the behemoth really into the game. There is an old tongue-in-cheek rule in computer programming https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ninety-ninety_rule "The first 90 percent of the code accounts for the first 90 percent of the development time. The remaining 10 percent of the code accounts for the other 90 percent of the development time.". Adding a bullet sponge with lots of damage to blocks that looks big is really no problem, I grant you that (see the big mamma, maybe call her behemoth-er and your already set). But do you really just want a bullet sponge? A behemoth has to fit the game play, must be special in more ways than its hitpoints. Maybe that is where the work is hidden that just wasn't justified. Or they simply had no good idea how to fit the behemoth into the game without making it just a boring bullet sponge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stallionsden Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 I know I'm likely on the lower end of the popularity scale with this opinion but I say it anyway: Why do we need NPCs trying to raid and steal our stuff? Whoever wants that can play on a PvP server or not? The 'bandits' there have already better pathfinding and much less predictable behavior patterns^^ Seems to me it might get overly complicated programming those specific NPCs, they wouldn't be just mindless zeds, they'd need to at least appear as believeable humans – and we don't even have proper zed AI/pathfinding yet. And somehow I can already smell the introduction of a buttload of new bugs, exploits and additional lags on multiplayer servers... I wouldn't mind having human NPCs including some baddies that have their own camps or that you encounter in the wilds, just don't like the whole raiding idea. I hope they will be coming with some options in the settings menu, like "bandit encountes on/off" and "raiding bandits on/off". Simply put it was a kick starter goal. One of the promises and a big part of the game they advertised aka the duke and his bandits. People would be up in arms if this wasnt delivered. Its exacty what roland stated a page or 2 ago. They need to implement their stretch goals. 1 being bandits and npcs. So no matter how many times the few pipe up and state they dont want npcs etc they are gonna be in the game. Guess what you don't want em in then mod em out....thats the beauty tfp have given us this ability to. but i for 1 and as well as many others want npcs bandits and colonies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal Deluxe Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 if modders can do that for free then why can't the Fun Pimps? Because even a small mod can need over 200 Hours of work Means over a month of full time work. Wage + taxes + additional costs and suddenly a Behemoth costs 20 000+ Euro Never underestimate how much you get free from modders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamBake Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Because even a small mod can need over 200 Hours of work Means over a month of full time work. Wage + taxes + additional costs and suddenly a Behemoth costs 20 000+ Euro Never underestimate how much you get free from modders ^This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacepiggio Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 That is why this is a Steam Workshop Game, the 7DTD player comun. will take over as far as modding & future features goes after Gold & DLC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kam R. Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Simply put it was a kick starter goal. One of the promises and a big part of the game they advertised aka the duke and his bandits. People would be up in arms if this wasnt delivered. Its exacty what roland stated a page or 2 ago. They need to implement their stretch goals. 1 being bandits and npcs. So no matter how many times the few pipe up and state they dont want npcs etc they are gonna be in the game. Guess what you don't want em in then mod em out....thats the beauty tfp have given us this ability to. but i for 1 and as well as many others want npcs bandits and colonies... Got it, didn't know. Fairly new to this sometimes hard to crack community, haven't been around since the kickstarter days and admittedly never bothered to read about the original/stretch goals. And like I said I have nothing against NPCs – heck yeah, more content is always nice. I just find NPC raiding ones stuff somewhat redundant, given that a properly regulated PVP game will in my opinion always be better in terms of creating more sense of danger than any NPC could. Other players can be the true horror -and fun in this game, if you manage to find a decent server is my experience there. I gathered as much to know that PvP or even co-op multiplayer wasn't even planned originally – But it's here now and shouldn't be completely disregarded in almost every discussion about a game feature imo. (I play both game types btw, not one of those "hardcore" advocates for PvP) I have to say I'm kinda tired of the way too often uttered phrase "just mod it". Guess what, maybe I don't want to have to learn how to mod and many other players don't as well, which is why I suggest that a feature like that comes with as many OPTIONS as possible by default in the vanilla build, so I don't have to wait for a modder to do it. Especially with an option that the appearent majority wouldn't care about as much. If I were forced to name only one aspect of the game that I really like (and there's a lot) then I'd choose how flexible it is with offering many different approaches how to play it. And that's talking about vanilla, not modded. So hopefully the further development will stay in that spirit and give the average non modding-educated player lots of sliders and buttons for everything in the options menu:) Anyway, whatever we'll get in the end I will try it out of course and maybe I'll be positively surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser502 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Here Here Simply put it was a kick starter goal. One of the promises and a big part of the game they advertised aka the duke and his bandits. People would be up in arms if this wasnt delivered. Its exacty what roland stated a page or 2 ago. They need to implement their stretch goals. 1 being bandits and npcs. So no matter how many times the few pipe up and state they dont want npcs etc they are gonna be in the game. Guess what you don't want em in then mod em out....thats the beauty tfp have given us this ability to. but i for 1 and as well as many others want npcs bandits and colonies... Agreed, I am using Drkstarsdragon's npc bandit mod with valmers mod. He made it for vanila but I requested val ver and bam there it was. Its works and it adds a little more, that 1k travel boom you just got shot from nowhere, A little diferent when they shot back. I say add all you can. Easier to take away than add. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser502 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 You did a good job, I use you mixers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackelmyer Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Simply put it was a kick starter goal. One of the promises and a big part of the game they advertised aka the duke and his bandits. People would be up in arms if this wasnt delivered. Its exacty what roland stated a page or 2 ago. They need to implement their stretch goals. 1 being bandits and npcs. So no matter how many times the few pipe up and state they dont want npcs etc they are gonna be in the game. Guess what you don't want em in then mod em out....thats the beauty tfp have given us this ability to. but i for 1 and as well as many others want npcs bandits and colonies... Agreed. And my hope is that Roland isn't completely accurate that RWG is as is. That these make it into RWG and things like the Duke can their own sockets in the RWG socket system. Bringing colonies and some questing to RWG without a full story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krotos Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Is it going to be possible that they will add saved character profiles in any upcoming patches? I mean, I really enjoy this game, but I don’t care for having to reset all the hard work I do in leveling my avatars skills each time a patch comes out. I don’t mind so much resetting the game map, or having to rebuild a new base, but in my opinion, we shouldn’t have to lose EVERYTHING that we worked so hard for each time the game updates in order to take advantage of the game updates. Some of these skills are hard enough to level once as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luzifer Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 @Roland To bring this thread ontopic again -(I am trying here really hard, as i tend to distract) Here a few questions that got stuck in my mind: How fast will the minibike be? Are there going to be different levels of speed, all using a Different amount of stamina? Will the Construction need as many items as the minibikes? Like chainsaw chains, mechanical parts, bike tires, handlebars, Lock, occasional basket with less capacity(?) Please get this on the right track again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob the big blob of goo Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 What would be really cool is a feature where by you can move from server to server and your profile goes with you. That means your levels, perks, belt and back pack inventory traverse servers. But, your buildings, bed rolls, land claims, etc. are server unique. That way you can take a leveled player and jump from server 1 to server 2 and start exploring the new world but have no base or stash. It also means you could go back and forth bringing items across worlds if you spent the time. Like a mini bike or some building materials. It might be interesting to implement in a server admin tool like CBSM or something like that if you have the ability to copy and write out the player profiles. I expect you would have to have a command that migrated/teleported you between servers to cause a profile synch so you didn't have to have a central repository. Anyways, just off the cuff thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazz Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 I asked a simple question. "What would you define as continued development of RWG?" One or more developers investing time in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graphite Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 One or more developers investing time in it. A straight to the point answer to a very simple question. Didnt think it was in your programming. Have you been hacked is the arbiter compromised ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharin Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 One or more developers investing time in it. What about 1/2 of a developer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharin Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 No offense taken! Oh my gosh is it that much?! Why I could be at a video arcade spending $60 AN HOUR! I was hoping it would be somewhat obvious I was utilizing sarcasm without having to use '(/sarcasm off)'. IMHO: You shouldn't be able to complain about spending $20-$50 after having spent over 100 hours on a game. (1000+ = you really need to stop 'listening to sound of your own voice'.) I didn't exactly include a serious face with my post, either. - - - Updated - - - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7DaysSurviver Posted October 11, 2017 Share Posted October 11, 2017 Hellos developer and the team from Fun Pimps, is it possible to make an option for an MOTD (Message On The Day) without using 3rd programms? Maybe a simple additional textfile, what can be easily changed by server-admins. Thank you for reading this, regards.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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