Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[Bubo]

Well I want to be clear that I’m not against a story line or main quest chain. My only point is that it can come after gold. The game can ship complete as a sandbox survival game and then a story mode can be added, a horde mode can be added, a Battle Royale mode can be added. The game could go beta after A17. Heck, they could call the next release Beta 1.0 instead of Alpha 17 making the current A16 the last alpha.

 

[Roland]

Whoa, let’s not get carried away here. The way I see it, there are two kinds of non-Beta things left to do.

 

snip

 

That’s why talk of leaving Alpha imminently alarms me. Everybody may disagree on what goes in that second list of things to do, but I don’t think anybody expects that list to be empty after this Alpha.

 

The list won't be empty but everyone will disagree on what should or should not be on that list. To me, the game is good enough (including what I know about A17) to move into beta and then gold with WHATEVER is left undone being finished up afterwards. It's not your fault but you are assessing beta readiness by what you have with A16 and what you know from the short list of whats been announced-- and even those one liners don't convey the depth of some of the changes.

 

I'll go ahead and confirm it since Joel did say it. Joel wasn't joking. Does that mean that it could be the story, or water, or bandits, or something else that will be completed after gold? Could be. But no matter what feature gets pushed to after gold release there will be some who agree that that particular feature wasn't critical and some who will see it as a deal breaker and will rant and weep that TFP betrayed us all by releasing an unfinished game and fill up the internet with all the salt they can muster.

 

And, as Guppy pointed out, I like MineCraft, but 'Story Mode' is not an imperative. I might try it sometime, just to see what it's like and to have an informed opinion. Although I'll wait for a really good sale...

 

You can download the first episode of story mode for free on Steam. If you're waiting for them to pay you to try it out it will be a long wait indeed. Telltale would never let that kind of a sale happen....

[Tin]

The list won't be empty but everyone will disagree on what should or should not be on that list. To me, the game is good enough (including what I know about A17) to move into beta and then gold with WHATEVER is left undone being finished up afterwards. It's not your fault but you are assessing beta readiness by what you have with A16 and what you know from the short list of whats been announced-- and even those one liners don't convey the depth of some of the changes.

 

I'll go ahead and confirm it since Joel did say it. Joel wasn't joking. Does that mean that it could be the story, or water, or bandits, or something else that will be completed after gold? Could be. But no matter what feature gets pushed to after gold release there will be some who agree that that particular feature wasn't critical and some who will see it as a deal breaker and will rant and weep that TFP betrayed us all by releasing an unfinished game and fill up the internet with all the salt they can muster.

 

 

 

You can download the first episode of story mode for free on Steam. If you're waiting for them to pay you to try it out it will be a long wait indeed. Telltale would never let that kind of a sale happen....

 

I'm good either way. A17 beta? cool with me but I really really hope the pathing at the VERY least is good and not pushed to an after beta thing but I already think MM said they have the pathing better in A17.. so yep! good!

[fragtzack]

As the Romans used to say..

 

Opinions are like ♥♥♥♥, everyone has one and thinks theirs don't stink.

[meganoth]

A17 beta?

 

I would guess Madmole and Roland are saying beta is directly after A17, so A18=beta is more like it.

[Roland]

I'm good either way. A17 beta? cool with me but I really really hope the pathing at the VERY least is good and not pushed to an after beta thing but I already think MM said they have the pathing better in A17.. so yep! good!

 

Fixing the pathing would be a during beta thing at the latest in my opinion.

[Tin]

As the Romans used to say..

 

Opinions are like ♥♥♥♥, everyone has one and thinks theirs don't stink.

 

Yeah and then there are those who don't want to allow ppl to have an opinion.. I rather everyone get to have one

[Guppycur]

@Roland

 

So if they do push bandits to dlc, will that be free dlc or will they be charging?

[DeadMole]

But the big reason for TFP to not put parts of the story in any alpha- or beta-version is that they want the option to finish the story after release.

 

Except, there's already a part of the story in the game, as I pointed out. But I do understand the need for NPCs before the main quest can continue. You needed traders in the first place so the quest can lead you there.

 

You can download the first episode of story mode for free on Steam.

 

That's how Telltale is getting players caught into their series. Chances are if you do enjoy it then you will play further episodes. I actually thought this might get me caught into Minecraft. Try the story first and dig the game (pun intended) and then even get the regular sandbox game afterwards. And that was my whole point all along: most players will get caught into the solo story in the first place. Not online co-op, not PVP, not RWG, not whatever else. They will start a new game in Navezgane to try it out. Now I'm truly done posting about Minecraft haha.

[Karma]

That's actually going to cause The Pimps a big problem with the current users. Because the game is so polished, when it is released, people will not have that wow factor. It will just be... Over.

 

Agreed. It's odd that doing a good job can be a drawback...but yeah.

[Maharin]

That's actually going to cause The Pimps a big problem with the current users. Because the game is so polished, when it is released, people will not have that wow factor. It will just be... Over.

 

CC illustrates that through concern.

 

Except once it is released ("gold") the mod community could explode into action since changes should be minor from that point on. The people that will suffer most are the ones that refuse to play a modded game.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

Agreed. It's odd that doing a good job can be a drawback...but yeah.

 

No good deed goes unpunished?

[Ajbass]

@Roland

 

So if they do push bandits to dlc, will that be free dlc or will they be charging?

 

Surely it'd have to be paid DLC, otherwise, what would be the point of TFP "finishing" the game just to add in extra features after for free?

 

I'm genuinely asking - assuming any features/DLC left for post-release will be free, what is to be gained by TFP by going Gold without them already in?

[Roland]

@Roland

 

So if they do push bandits to dlc, will that be free dlc or will they be charging?

 

I'm not going to ignore the possibility of the green-eyed monster completely so I will say I am 99.9% sure that any dlc that covers things that they were trying to get into the base game before release but got pushed to post release will be absolutely free. In Pimps We Trust.

[beerfly]

I'm not going to ignore the possibility of the green-eyed monster completely so I will say I am 99.9% sure that any dlc that covers things that they were trying to get into the base game before release but got pushed to post release will be absolutely free. In Pimps We Trust.

 

Because Pimps worked hard and they are going to complete their new systems in a way, to be able to add what they have in the hidden list much faster and better than before. I agree beta is showing the evolution we wait for. And I bet the best is yet to come. Thanks R

[Roland]

Surely it'd have to be paid DLC, otherwise, what would be the point of TFP "finishing" the game just to add in extra features after for free?

 

I'm genuinely asking - assuming any features/DLC left for post-release will be free, what is to be gained by TFP by going Gold without them already in?

 

Going gold frees them to start on their Next Big Thing. It would also get the game optimized and balanced which is sorely needed. They aren't going to charge extra for things that were promised for the base game. When they launch the kickstarter for their next game they won't be thinking about any lost funds they could have gotten for DLCs for this game.

 

I will be as close to the front of the line as possible to join that kickstarter.

[Laz Man]

I'm not going to ignore the possibility of the green-eyed monster completely so I will say I am 99.9% sure that any dlc that covers things that they were trying to get into the base game before release but got pushed to post release will be absolutely free. In Pimps We Trust.

 

Maybe rusts departure from EA recently will inspire them in some way or fashion.

[Guest Rust Buddy]

Maybe rusts departure from EA recently will inspire them in some way or fashion.

 

You ain't kidding! Inspiring Madmole is my raison d'être.

[ParaSyt]

And that was my whole point all along: most players will get caught into the solo story in the first place. Not online co-op, not PVP, not RWG, not whatever else. They will start a new game in Navezgane to try it out. Now I'm truly done posting about Minecraft haha.

 

Fortnite added PvP without finishing their story and became the most played game as of now with 3.4 million concurrent players. Single player games are struggling more than any other type of game out on the market right now. So if you want TFP to get people to try 7D2D then statistically the best method would be to work on a quick PvP mode and abandon the story. The opposite of what you are saying.

 

Now personally I would love a story over a new PvP mode, but if TFP want to draw more people to the game they should add more PvP game modes to reach different types of players. The data shows most people play PvP. Don't let what you like be an assumption for what "most player" like.

[Ouch Quit It]

You ain't kidding! Inspiring Madmole is my raison d'être.

 

I don't think he like raisins!!

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

Going gold frees them to start on their Next Big Thing. It would also get the game optimized and balanced which is sorely needed. They aren't going to charge extra for things that were promised for the base game. When they launch the kickstarter for their next game they won't be thinking about any lost funds they could have gotten for DLCs for this game.

 

I will be as close to the front of the line as possible to join that kickstarter.

 

Coughs * Kiss Ass * Coughs

[Ouch Quit It]

Anyone see this game SCUM...they are doing a lot of interesting stuff with player characters....Environmental factors affect you. Weather, weight , armor, etc affects character proficiency.

 

Vaulting/Climbing

 

Wetness

 

Awareness

[Karma]

Anyone see this game SCUM...they are doing a lot of interesting stuff with player characters....Environmental factors affect you. Weather, weight , armor, etc affects character proficiency.

 

Vaulting/Climbing

 

Wetness

 

Awareness

 

I watched a video about that...looks very in depth and pretty cool.

[fragtzack]

I wouldn't mind paying for new content DLC.

 

But

 

What I want to know is if this is just Roland speculating or is Joel firmly saying A17 is the last of new content before beta polish.

 

Joel posted once "Guess we could do away with a fully destructible world so we can jack up the zombie count to have true hordes". Just throwing around ideas to see what folks think.

 

Throwing an idea out there and firmly following a path forward are the not the same.

 

Until I hear that A17 is "it' from the bearded one, just seems speculative. While Roland does have more insight into the Pimps grand plan, I would think if this beta next path is firm the Pimps(Joel) would say so directly.

[rdunham3]

I wouldn't mind paying for new content DLC.

 

But

 

What I want to know is if this is just Roland speculating or is Joel firmly saying A17 is the last of new content before beta polish.

 

Joel posted once "Guess we could do away with a fully destructible world so we can jack up the zombie count to have true hordes". Just throwing around ideas to see what folks think.

 

Throwing an idea out there and firmly following a path forward are the not the same.

 

Until I hear that A17 is "it' from the bearded one, just seems speculative. While Roland does have more insight into the Pimps grand plan, I would think if this beta next path is firm the Pimps(Joel) would say so directly.

 

We're all speculating until MM says we're not. Full stop. Roland's extra insights mesh nicely with what several of the long-time forum dwellers have also been speculating, to wit, beta phase is near. The big systems are getting overhauls and that smooths the way for smaller features, no matter how visible (bandits, extra vehicles) to suddenly get much more "done-ish" because the things they were bubble-gummed in with before have their proper foundations now.

 

The appearance of the horde size option told me quite a bit about the underpinnings being able to handle much higher z counts than before, for instance. It wouldn't have surfaced as an in-game option if they weren't very sure their engine could now handle such quantity. We probably don't yet have the code to make it reasonable on average hardware, but they do, and they're confident in it. That'll go a long way towards mid-to-end game 7th's being more dangerous.

 

Water isn't broken. Ugly-ish and boring, but not broken. They could easily do a post-gold water overhaul that adds a rowboat and fishing and only the EA supporters would have any inkling that it hadn't been planned that way from the start.

[chaosterone]

Going gold frees them to start on their Next Big Thing. It would also get the game optimized and balanced which is sorely needed. They aren't going to charge extra for things that were promised for the base game. When they launch the kickstarter for their next game they won't be thinking about any lost funds they could have gotten for DLCs for this game.

 

I will be as close to the front of the line as possible to join that kickstarter.

 

Just curious, will they announce the kickstarter here right before they go gold? I would definitely back their next venture.

[meganoth]

Except, there's already a part of the story in the game, as I pointed out. But I do understand the need for NPCs before the main quest can continue. You needed traders in the first place so the quest can lead you there.

 

The first few quests to make a bedroll up to the trader is what I would call an intro tutorial, except maybe for the text introducing the trader there is absolutely no story there as far as I recall.

 

TFP could even expand a little on it and it wouldn't raise any eyebrows, it' pretty much is a standard, especially for open-world games.

 

Until I hear that A17 is "it' from the bearded one, just seems speculative. While Roland does have more insight into the Pimps grand plan, I would think if this beta next path is firm the Pimps(Joel) would say so directly.

 

"I'll go ahead and confirm it since Joel did say it.". Roland makes a lot of jokes, but he is very careful about not making any false statements about the information he gets from TFPs. Joel said it in a post, Roland now confirms it. There is nothing speculative about it now.