Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow

[Fanatical_Meat]

5 hours ago, Jost Amman said:

Empyrion's world is not block-based, only building.

I do not claim to be an expert, Empyrion uses Unity and it allows pretty much everything to be destroyed with similar exceptions to 7D2D like certain POIs and place holder asteroids. Seems pretty similar to 7D2D to me.

[Andrew Eddie]

On 3/1/2023 at 7:06 AM, Roland said:

 

EDIT: To clarify this post I am simply asking @IzPrebuilt why they would want to linger in a place that brings them nothing but bitterness.

I think this is missing the point of IzPrebuilt's comment. If he didn't still care a bit, he wouldn't bother saying anything on the forum. My supposition is he's hoping attitudes exemplified by they way you, Roland, and by implication TFP, replied would change. He's not the only content creator with many, many runs on the board (cricket term you you US guys) to do this.

 

You make the comment further along that the baseline usage settles down to about 30K (users?). It is rather obvious that content creators like IzPrebuilt have contributed to that number being so high. Whichever way you slice it, Roland, you represent the ethos of TFP. I'm personally not impressed that this is the way that content creators are responded to (that is: "oh, it's all your fault you are feeling this way") by TFP staff.

 

It's pretty obvious to me that a lot of the content creators were expecting A21 to be out by now to be able to freshen their content. Several of them actively in diversification mode, while others are just trying fresh takes on stuff that has already been done (my immediate reaction is I feel so, so sorry for them). While it won't happen overnight, some of 7 Days' present success is due to those content creators. Treating them as "why are you still here then" won't affect you overnight, but my goodness it's the wrong way to treat people in the here and now.

[Roland]

33 minutes ago, Andrew Eddie said:

I think this is missing the point of IzPrebuilt's comment. If he didn't still care a bit, he wouldn't bother saying anything on the forum.

 

His point was impossible to miss. He literally said he hasn't enjoyed playing the game for some time now and only plays because he is trapped by his business which is built entirely on 7 Days to Die. He further stated that he fully intends to transition away from this game and not play it any longer. You can speculate that he might secretly care because he's posting but A) He directly stated that he doesn't any longer and B) His posts have recently been entirely composed of sarcastic snipes at the developers.

 

33 minutes ago, Andrew Eddie said:

My supposition is he's hoping attitudes exemplified by they way you, Roland, and by implication TFP, replied would change.

 

Without any supposition on my part I simply read what he wrote which was that he was done with it all. He was basically saying goodbye but taking a few moments to leave a few jabs with his departure all of which is against forum rules anyway. I don't mind people musing that they would like to hear more information or posting questions--especially while a developer is actively on. What I do mind is someone going on a rant because they aren't getting what they want when they want it and oh by the way, as soon as I can stop playing your game I will because I've hated it for a year or more now...

 

33 minutes ago, Andrew Eddie said:

He's not the only content creator with many, many runs on the board (cricket term you you US guys) to do this.

 

True, and I never challenged any of the others to explain why they keep posting here like I did him and its only because he is the only one to outright admit he hates the game and plans to have no part of it in the future. Its only his desire for subscribers that is chaining him unwillingly to the game. 

 

33 minutes ago, Andrew Eddie said:

You make the comment further along that the baseline usage settles down to about 30K (users?). It is rather obvious that content creators like IzPrebuilt have contributed to that number being so high. Whichever way you slice it, Roland, you represent the ethos of TFP. I'm personally not impressed that this is the way that content creators are responded to (that is: "oh, it's all your fault you are feeling this way") by TFP staff.

 

It's not the way I respond to pretty much any other content creator. I've been their guy at TFP over the past 5 years of Pre-update Streamer Weekends. I don't think any of them has ever had a problem with how I conducted myself with them. It is a mutually beneficial relationship anyway. Its not like the game doesn't help them out as well. I don't doubt that the efforts of content creators brought many people to an awareness of the game. What does any of that have to do with someone who admits they hate the game and are done with it continuing to post purely sarcastic ranty posts that aren't helpful in any fashion?

 

33 minutes ago, Andrew Eddie said:

It's pretty obvious to me that a lot of the content creators were expecting A21 to be out by now to be able to freshen their content. Several of them actively in diversification mode, while others are just trying fresh takes on stuff that has already been done (my immediate reaction is I feel so, so sorry for them). While it won't happen overnight, some of 7 Days' present success is due to those content creators. Treating them as "why are you still here then" won't affect you overnight, but my goodness it's the wrong way to treat people in the here and now.

 

IzPreBuilt is not all content creators. Just because I confronted him about his attitude and asked him to explain his desire to post in a forum for a game he hates doesn't mean that is the norm for how all content creators are treated. Nobody is tumbling down a slippery slope here. As for several of them being in active diversification mode....so what? I have always encouraged content creators to diversify. Its better for them and its better for us. Content creators who are streaming exclusive 7 Days to Die material pretty much cater to existing fans. Content creators who diversify bring in fans of other games who might be tempted to watch "their guy" on his 7 Days to Die night in addition to the night he's playing "their game". If we have more content creators diversifying with 7 Days as one of the games in their rotation then that is great news!

 

If my direct questions challenging IzPreBuilt's motives for posting here in the way he was in the context of his own statements of how he feels about the game were offensive to you then I'm sorry that they made you uncomfortable. Iz and I had a longer private conversation and came to a better understanding and ended on a mutually respectful note.

Edited March 4, 2023 by Roland (see edit history)

[Jost Amman]

5 hours ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

I do not claim to be an expert, Empyrion uses Unity and it allows pretty much everything to be destroyed with similar exceptions to 7D2D like certain POIs and place holder asteroids. Seems pretty similar to 7D2D to me.

As far as I know, Empyrion doesn't have terrain physics.

The terrain is handled in a "granular"(?) way and you can dig however you want and terrain will never collapse on you (like in Minecrap).

[Druid_Koldun]

Ребята, скажите, пожалуйста, планируется ли добавить анимацию скручивания на пальце револьвера, когда вы его достаете и убираете в ковбойском стиле вестерна. А также несколько крутых анимаций при вытаскивании другого оружия? Очень хотелось бы видеть такие крутые анимации в игре

19 часов назад Фаатал сказал:

Это проблема генерации сетки столкновений с местностью. Может быть тайминг и/или комбинация значений плотности или просто ошибка кода. Я никогда не видел, чтобы кто-то падал в мире, копаясь вниз.

Здравствуйте, молодой человек, скажите, пожалуйста, если у вас есть планы добавить показ одежды, перчаток, доспехов от 1-го лица. Я буду очень рад, если вы мне ответите

[Guppycur]

5 hours ago, Laz Man said:

 

Coincidently, I asked faatal about this today and it was a complicated discussion.  Essentially, we may be able to make terrain blocks look like their snapped to cubes using density manipulation when in reality they are actually bleeding through them.

 

With that said, I have seen density values cause all sorts of havoc with terrain (e.g. holes in the world), so understand why it's not a simple thing.

 

Yeah fracking it up causes the Dorito look on some occasions, but there are consistent numbers you can use that just feel and look right without causing any issues.  I used to use it back when using either pilles or maybe even hals prefab editor, but I don't remember the number.  -92?  Anyway... Test it thoroughly and don't give up that goal, because it's worth doing imo.

[Ouch Quit It]

2 minutes ago, Ouch Quit It said:

Soooo why cant we have terrain blocks snap to placed blocks...........ohhhhhh ok ...that makes more sense

 

 

 

 

5 hours ago, Druid_Koldun said:

Ребята, скажите, пожалуйста, планируется ли добавить анимацию скручивания на пальце револьвера, когда вы его достаете и убираете в ковбойском стиле вестерна. А также несколько крутых анимаций при вытаскивании другого оружия? Очень хотелось бы видеть такие крутые анимации в игре

Здравствуйте, молодой человек, скажите, пожалуйста, если у вас есть планы добавить показ одежды, перчаток, доспехов от 1-го лица. Я буду очень рад, если вы мне ответите

 

Edited March 4, 2023 by Ouch Quit It (see edit history)

[Annihilatorza]

On 3/3/2023 at 12:39 AM, Beelzebubs Ghost said:

 

 

Suggestion: Crowd fund a migration to a new engine - even if that were to be handled by other people while you work on the next game.

 

I think plenty people would appreciate that - and unlocking more potential for this would ensure more unrestricted updates and development instead of having your game as a symbolic anachronism in a few more years, frozen in an outdated and restricted capacity.

This has been suggested many many times before and the answer is still the same, it will take to long to start again.

 

The issue with 7d2d is that's unique and I do mean unique, there is not a single other game trying to do what they are doing.

 

Space Engineers, Empyrion, Minecraft are all voxels games and I have played all of them a lot but none of them have roving hordes of zombies, full blocks physics on every block, massive city's that can be destroyed, mining everything, build anything you want to build. 

 

All the other games have AI and things but they don't have everything in one package.

 

SE gets massive lag with bases get big, Minecraft has a lot of static blocks and no massive city's that can be blown up and are very detailed.

 

GTA 6 has a budget of 2 billion dollars and is still static landscape.

 

Unreal engine 5 is still a static landscape.

 

There is not a single game like 7d2d or in development that is doing what they are doing because it's stupidly hard to do and far far easier to do it in a game that you can't change the landscape or blown up the  buildings .

 

The sons of the forest has one of best building systems I have seen in a while but is still a static system.

 

The fun pumps have 3 new games in development and I would not bet against 7d2d2 been one of them.

 

Just my two cents

[GoofMcGee]

23 hours ago, Roland said:

I did retire....meaning I only do as much as I want when I want and its all free. I traded my company pants for a kilt and I'm feeling the breeze.

 

[Annihilatorza]

My guess is would also be governed by finding books or magazines, find 10 unlock bacon and eggs, find 20 unlock pies, find 40 stews ect.

 

[Annihilatorza]

 It would great to have some actual survival changes made

 

Food decay and food preservation, salt and refrigeration, also gives cold water

 

Getting wet and cold in the snow makes you lose health due to hypothermia, your hands become more unsteady the colder you get

Need warm drinks, cold drinks will make it worse

 

Wearing to much in the desert leads to hyperthermia, loss of vision, health loss, need yucca juice and cold water and correct clothing

 

Wasteland constant health loss due to radiation and or bio toxins in the air need suit

 

Killing a bear gives a decent amount of food, I mean it's bear ffs but as the same time a bear will kill you in one shot unless in heavy armour head to toe

 

Return farming to the land it makes 0 sense to have it boxes but it needs water and fertilizer to work and you have to have hoe the land as well,  zombie and animals can destroy the crops by walking through them so they have to be defended 

[Guppycur]

1 hour ago, Annihilatorza said:

 It would great to have some actual survival changes made

 

Food decay and food preservation, salt and refrigeration, also gives cold water

 

Getting wet and cold in the snow makes you lose health due to hypothermia, your hands become more unsteady the colder you get

Need warm drinks, cold drinks will make it worse

 

Wearing to much in the desert leads to hyperthermia, loss of vision, health loss, need yucca juice and cold water and correct clothing

 

Wasteland constant health loss due to radiation and or bio toxins in the air need suit

 

Killing a bear gives a decent amount of food, I mean it's bear ffs but as the same time a bear will kill you in one shot unless in heavy armour head to toe

 

Return farming to the land it makes 0 sense to have it boxes but it needs water and fertilizer to work and you have to have hoe the land as well,  zombie and animals can destroy the crops by walking through them so they have to be defended 

Are you crazy? 

 

You can't have survival aspects in this conso... Er, survival game!

 

Think of the casuals!  The rust buddies!

 

... If you add those survival elements, you are basically saying that players can play more than 25 minutes!

 

(Fantastic ideas and I support them)

Edited March 4, 2023 by Guppycur (see edit history)

[Riamus]

4 hours ago, Annihilatorza said:

 It would great to have some actual survival changes made

 

Food decay and food preservation, salt and refrigeration, also gives cold water

 

Getting wet and cold in the snow makes you lose health due to hypothermia, your hands become more unsteady the colder you get

Need warm drinks, cold drinks will make it worse

 

Wearing to much in the desert leads to hyperthermia, loss of vision, health loss, need yucca juice and cold water and correct clothing

 

Wasteland constant health loss due to radiation and or bio toxins in the air need suit

 

Killing a bear gives a decent amount of food, I mean it's bear ffs but as the same time a bear will kill you in one shot unless in heavy armour head to toe

 

Return farming to the land it makes 0 sense to have it boxes but it needs water and fertilizer to work and you have to have hoe the land as well,  zombie and animals can destroy the crops by walking through them so they have to be defended 

Personally not a fan of these.  They would be fine as part of higher difficulties perhaps, but not as the normal way things are.

 

Food decay becomes problematic on a server that is always running.  If you aren't playing every day, your food will always spoil.  This isn't even realistic because in real life, you are always "playing" so spoilage makes sense.  In the game, even if you say it takes a month to spoil, at 60 minute days, that's only a little over one real day, so if you aren't playing very regularly your food will never last until you are able to build whatever is necessary to stop it.  That wouldn't be enjoyable to most players.

 

Cold and heat having more effect on you is okay, depending on what it is.  Keep in mind some players want to start in the desert or wasteland or snow biomes and you aren't going to be able to do so if you don't have appropriate clothing with those effects added.  It isn't like real life where you are likely to have clothing already.  In the game, you start with none and can't make much or find/buy much for at least a little while depending on how much scavenging you do.  And some players hate scavenging and having to do so just so they can be in another biome while mining or building would upset them.

 

Wasteland radiation is problematic to require a suit because you need armor.  And with the new changes to clothing/armor, you wouldn't even be able to essentially wear a suit over armor.  You could have some kind of armor mod for radiation resistance, but that doesn't really make sense.

 

Making bears stronger is fine, though doesn't really matter all that much. By the time you are likely dealing with bears, you will probably be shooting them and never getting hit in the first place.  Especially if you know they can one shot you.

 

For farming, is there some reason boxes make zero sense?  Even though most farms are in the ground, personal farming is often done in boxes as it is easier to maintain good soil, especially in certain parts of the world.  And making farming a sim is not really necessary.  If you think it needs to be harder, that can be done without the need to make it a sim.  Farming sims are for people who want to farm in a more realistic way.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Riamus (see edit history)

[KenGross]

47 minutes ago, Riamus said:

Personally not a fan of these.  They would be fine as part of higher difficulties perhaps, but not as the normal way things are.

 

Food decay becomes problematic on a server that is always running.  If you aren't playing every day, your food will always spoil.  This isn't even realistic because in real life, you are always "playing" so spoilage makes sense.  In the game, even if you say it takes a month to spoil, at 60 minute days, that's only a little over one real day, so if you aren't playing very regularly your food will never last until you are able to build whatever is necessary to stop it.  That wouldn't be enjoyable to most players.

 

Cold and heat having more effect on you is okay, depending on what it is.  Keep in mind some players want to start in the desert or wasteland or snow biomes and you aren't going to be able to do so if you don't have appropriate clothing with those effects added.  It isn't like real life where you are likely to have clothing already.  In the game, you start with none and can't make much or find/buy much for at least a little while depending on how much scavenging you do.  And some players hate scavenging and having to do so just so they can be in another biome while mining or building would upset them.

 

Wasteland radiation is problematic to require a suit because you need armor.  And with the new changes to clothing/armor, you wouldn't even be able to essentially wear a suit over armor.  You could have asked kind of arbor mod for radiation resistance, but that doesn't really make sense.

 

Making bears stronger is fine, though didn't really matter all that much. By the time you are likely dealing with bears, you will probably be sitting then and never getting hit in the first place.  Especially if you know they can one shot you.

 

For farming, is there some reason boxes make zero sense?  Even though most deaths are in the ground, personal farming is often done in boxes as it is easier to maintain good soil, especially in certain parts of the world.  And making farming a sim is not really necessary.  If you think it needs to be harder, that can be done without the need to make it a sim.  Farming sims are for people who want to farm in a more realistic way.

i agree with you, to be honest i gave up having a garden in real life bending over to pull weeds tilling the ground every year the location sucks so my plants are in buckets in a rack now,  the planters in 7d2d make perfect sense to me especially if you have a roof garden lol

[RipClaw]

9 hours ago, Annihilatorza said:

My guess is would also be governed by finding books or magazines, find 10 unlock bacon and eggs, find 20 unlock pies, find 40 stews ect.

That will definitely be the case. From what I've read on the forum so far, the magazines will be found mainly in Shamway crates and kitchen cupboards.

That means to get bacon and eggs fast you will have to loot some residential buildings first.

 

Edited March 5, 2023 by RipClaw (see edit history)

[Fanatical_Meat]

14 hours ago, Guppycur said:

Are you crazy? 

 

You can't have survival aspects in this conso... Er, survival game!

 

Think of the casuals!  The rust buddies!

 

... If you add those survival elements, you are basically saying that players can play more than 25 minutes!

 

(Fantastic ideas and I support them)

I agree.

Survival is only challenging on days one to three after that it is trivial.

bring some need to continually hunt as in food spoils, crap allow snow to be packed into a freezer to slow decay use the snow like a fire uses wood.

I used to enjoy farming & cooking aspect but now it’s just a waste of points to focus on those things. Bacon & eggs is all you ever need. Once you have several crops planted farming becomes irrelevant.

Bring back watering plants, bring back zombies “attacking” plants. Making stuff not so permanent brings back purpose.

This is a big change but I’d like to see food work like it does in Valheim. Meals give boosts to health or stamina or a mix of both. Eat in a way that matches your play style.

[Jost Amman]

15 minutes ago, Fanatical_Meat said:

I agree.

Survival is only challenging on days one to three after that it is trivial.

bring some need to continually hunt as in food spoils, crap allow snow to be packed into a freezer to slow decay use the snow like a fire uses wood.

I used to enjoy farming & cooking aspect but now it’s just a waste of points to focus on those things. Bacon & eggs is all you ever need. Once you have several crops planted farming becomes irrelevant.

Bring back watering plants, bring back zombies “attacking” plants. Making stuff not so permanent brings back purpose.

This is a big change but I’d like to see food work like it does in Valheim. Meals give boosts to health or stamina or a mix of both. Eat in a way that matches your play style.

I too, would like more survival aspects in the game, but I must disagree, in part, on food becoming irrelevant later.

I think The Fun Pimps wanted to give food a different "role" than what we're arguing on.

 

We are focusing completely on the survival aspect of food, but, as far as I can understand, the current iteration of food is more focused on giving food a "boosting" role if you invest in the relevant perks. What I'm saying is that we're only discussing the "fill the food bar" aspect of food, but the game currently points you towards a more advanced use of food which could be comparable to a perk-effect of sorts. With the higher level recipes, for example, you can boost your stamina and other attributes, for some time. That has to account for something.

 

In that regard, I can understand the choice TFP made: making early game not so hard on new or casual players, but at the same time, giving veteran or hard-core players a way to use food in middle to later game as a source of improvement / boost / bonuses.

[Annihilatorza]

19 hours ago, Riamus said:

Personally not a fan of these.  They would be fine as part of higher difficulties perhaps, but not as the normal way things are.

 

Food decay becomes problematic on a server that is always running.  If you aren't playing every day, your food will always spoil.  This isn't even realistic because in real life, you are always "playing" so spoilage makes sense.  In the game, even if you say it takes a month to spoil, at 60 minute days, that's only a little over one real day, so if you aren't playing very regularly your food will never last until you are able to build whatever is necessary to stop it.  That wouldn't be enjoyable to most players.

 

Cold and heat having more effect on you is okay, depending on what it is.  Keep in mind some players want to start in the desert or wasteland or snow biomes and you aren't going to be able to do so if you don't have appropriate clothing with those effects added.  It isn't like real life where you are likely to have clothing already.  In the game, you start with none and can't make much or find/buy much for at least a little while depending on how much scavenging you do.  And some players hate scavenging and having to do so just so they can be in another biome while mining or building would upset them.

 

Wasteland radiation is problematic to require a suit because you need armor.  And with the new changes to clothing/armor, you wouldn't even be able to essentially wear a suit over armor.  You could have some kind of armor mod for radiation resistance, but that doesn't really make sense.

 

Making bears stronger is fine, though doesn't really matter all that much. By the time you are likely dealing with bears, you will probably be shooting them and never getting hit in the first place.  Especially if you know they can one shot you.

 

For farming, is there some reason boxes make zero sense?  Even though most farms are in the ground, personal farming is often done in boxes as it is easier to maintain good soil, especially in certain parts of the world.  And making farming a sim is not really necessary.  If you think it needs to be harder, that can be done without the need to make it a sim.  Farming sims are for people who want to farm in a more realistic way.

Food decay is one aspect and you could turn it in on and off in MP, but you could also say In a freezer it will keep for 3 in game months without spoiling, same with the salt, salt cured meat biltong/jerky lasts a long time.

 

If you want to start in those biomes, which not the way game is currently designed to be played more power to you but as it's stands cold and hot are mild annoyance and thats all they do, they don't do much else.

 

We will have to wait and see what they do with new armour and clothing system but I agree armour would do very little to block ionising radiation,  magic pills ala fallout or a Geiger counter or a rad suit but you can only wear that or the new system lets you wear different layers. 

 

For me what's easier in the apocalypse, hoeing the ground and planting seeds or building a special box with nails and precious straight cut lumber and then filling it with soil and fertilizer.

 

I go with option a much easier to just plant it, not trying to make a sim on farming just certain things in games bug me, like spending all the time to make a box to plant a single ear or corn or doing planting a field full.

 

Like fallouts 4 glowing sea bugs the living snot out of me since it's not even close to how a nuke and liquefaction works, still love the game though.

[HB_H4wk]

On 3/4/2023 at 5:18 PM, Guppycur said:

Are you crazy? 

 

You can't have survival aspects in this conso... Er, survival game!

 

Think of the casuals!  The rust buddies!

 

... If you add those survival elements, you are basically saying that players can play more than 25 minutes!

 

(Fantastic ideas and I support them)

Isn't this a Hording game? my base is soo full of stuff that 1-800 Junk won't return my calls.

 

Edited March 6, 2023 by HB_H4wk (see edit history)

[Bobby Lee 298]

3 hours ago, GoofMcGee said:

So how is the Thick44 Magnum coming?  Asking for millions of frens.

 

Maybe it could Thick people and give them a bleed.  Who knows. 

Debuff list says "Thicked" bleed damage.

 

Ya'll live in imaginationland, I just go there from time to time.

 

 

 

That's most likely not gonna happen.... Maybe 

[Old Crow]

On 3/4/2023 at 5:37 PM, unholyjoe said:

more or less yes... as both i and roland have given lots of hints towards that.

 

 

Hey in my defense, there's a LOT of posts in this thread. XD

[Bobby Lee 298]

14 hours ago, GoofMcGee said:

So how is the Thick44 Magnum coming?  Asking for millions of frens.

 

Maybe it could Thick people and give them a bleed.  Who knows. 

Debuff list says "Thicked" bleed damage.

 

Ya'll live in imaginationland, I just go there from time to time.

 

 

 

Im gonna make a mod for that, ill be on nexus sometime today

[Jost Amman]

1 hour ago, Druid_Koldun said:

Ребята, скажите, пожалуйста, будет ли новая модель в alpha 21 с новыми качественными текстурами? или новая модель символов была портирована на alpha 22?

A22

[Roland]

1 hour ago, Druid_Koldun said:

Guys, please tell me, will there be a new model in alpha 21 with new high-quality textures? or has the new character model been ported to alpha 22? And tell us more, please, are there any plans to introduce a raft or boats with new water? I hope so. Please, who knows, if possible, answer me

 

If a raft is added at all it might not happen until after the game goes gold. New character models will be in A22

[Fanatical_Meat]

1 minute ago, Roland said:

 

If a raft is added at all it might not happen until after the game goes gold. New character models will be in A22

Why would you need a raft other than to hand out in a lake to avoid a horde?