It just seems broken to me

[TypicallyDrunk]

I guess certain games arn't for everyone so maybe this is just me, as a new player, with about 2-3 months experience. Is it better to post the reasons I probably wont play this much or just go silently into the distance? Since I am not a long time player this is just a fresh perspective on my thoughts.

 

What I played of Alpha 16 seemed too easy. Still it was fun and somewhat rewarding. Of course this wasn't after years like many of you so it was still fresh to me. I struggled at the start of 17 as it was a bit harder. Watching Znation really taught me how to work the night and to farm screamer hoards for levels by the end of day 2. Overall the game really isn't hard once you understand the mechanics but I would consider it annoying compared to 16. Certain aspects just don't make it harder but instead make it very tedious.

 

Stamina just seems to be a broken mechanic that isn't fun. Food and water drain just add to the frustration. Just by completing the starting quest tonight I had lost over 30% food and water? This seems like it's really absurd and out of balance regardless of how much you can find. Traveling without a vehicle is just horrible because of this. This mechanic just does nothing for me and now it's a long portion of the game. I don't find any enjoyment in a aspect that just seems to nag you every few minutes.

 

The melee combat is wonky and feels very unrefined for a game of this age. It seems like there would be an arc when swinging and not a pin point mechanic. Not sure how many times I went to hit a z on the ground only to swing through them and hit the ground under them. Better yet, a z slightly moves his head causing a total miss. So I dont have a lot of real life experience swinging a bat at someones head. I do think I could make more then 2 swings before becoming exhausted and do it in a manner that would greatly increase my chances of hitting someone mindlessly walking towards me. It's overcome by switching to the bow but just adds another annoying aspect that doesn't bring enjoyment. 16 seemed to be much more enjoyable while still not letting it be endless.

 

The ranged mechanic feels pretty good although some aspects of aiming seem to be silly. It's not a major thing but just something that didn't seem to have a lot of thought put into it. Another chip you might say?

 

The loot system just seems so much less rewarding now. Mods seem empty when compared to building something with better parts throughout the game. I would have loved to see a mix of the two where it was somewhat combined. It would have added so much to the game and not made it feel rushed. Same with the bicycle being a welcomed addition but the other 3 really don't add much from one another except storage. As far as I can tell they all move at about the same speed and loose durability at the same rate. The durability loss is also a bit silly.

 

I understand that 17 is welcomed by the long term players as it changes things up on a 5 year old early access game. I just can't taste the koolade with this new release. It did make it harder in a few aspects but introduced so much more in annoyance that I don't find it as enjoyable. There are certainly harder games out there and I find it disappointing that they couldn't see the good from 16 and integrate it with 17. Instead it almost feels like they just started from scratch which is mind boggling. Anyway hope I didnt offend anyone too much. Im sure I will try it out once it goes stable but this version just doesn't suit my tastes so far. Happy Holidays to the Pimps and support. Remember to take some off and enjoy the season!

[Noompsie]

I guess certain games arn't for everyone so maybe this is just me, as a new player, with about 2-3 months experience. Is it better to post the reasons I probably wont play this much or just go silently into the distance? Since I am not a long time player this is just a fresh perspective on my thoughts.

 

What I played of Alpha 16 seemed too easy. Still it was fun and somewhat rewarding. Of course this wasn't after years like many of you so it was still fresh to me. I struggled at the start of 17 as it was a bit harder. Watching Znation really taught me how to work the night and to farm screamer hoards for levels by the end of day 2. Overall the game really isn't hard once you understand the mechanics but I would consider it annoying compared to 16. Certain aspects just don't make it harder but instead make it very tedious.

 

Stamina just seems to be a broken mechanic that isn't fun. Food and water drain just add to the frustration. Just by completing the starting quest tonight I had lost over 30% food and water? This seems like it's really absurd and out of balance regardless of how much you can find. Traveling without a vehicle is just horrible because of this. This mechanic just does nothing for me and now it's a long portion of the game. I don't find any enjoyment in a aspect that just seems to nag you every few minutes.

 

The melee combat is wonky and feels very unrefined for a game of this age. It seems like there would be an arc when swinging and not a pin point mechanic. Not sure how many times I went to hit a z on the ground only to swing through them and hit the ground under them. Better yet, a z slightly moves his head causing a total miss. So I dont have a lot of real life experience swinging a bat at someones head. I do think I could make more then 2 swings before becoming exhausted and do it in a manner that would greatly increase my chances of hitting someone mindlessly walking towards me. It's overcome by switching to the bow but just adds another annoying aspect that doesn't bring enjoyment. 16 seemed to be much more enjoyable while still not letting it be endless.

 

The ranged mechanic feels pretty good although some aspects of aiming seem to be silly. It's not a major thing but just something that didn't seem to have a lot of thought put into it. Another chip you might say?

 

The loot system just seems so much less rewarding now. Mods seem empty when compared to building something with better parts throughout the game. I would have loved to see a mix of the two where it was somewhat combined. It would have added so much to the game and not made it feel rushed. Same with the bicycle being a welcomed addition but the other 3 really don't add much from one another except storage. As far as I can tell they all move at about the same speed and loose durability at the same rate. The durability loss is also a bit silly.

 

I understand that 17 is welcomed by the long term players as it changes things up on a 5 year old early access game. I just can't taste the koolade with this new release. It did make it harder in a few aspects but introduced so much more in annoyance that I don't find it as enjoyable. There are certainly harder games out there and I find it disappointing that they couldn't see the good from 16 and integrate it with 17. Instead it almost feels like they just started from scratch which is mind boggling. Anyway hope I didnt offend anyone too much. Im sure I will try it out once it goes stable but this version just doesn't suit my tastes so far. Happy Holidays to the Pimps and support. Remember to take some off and enjoy the season!

 

Whether you have been playing for 3 hours or 3,000 hours, your opinion is just as valid as anyone elses.

 

I have at least 3,500 hours, possibly more, and my opinion matches yours perfectly. You took the words right out of my mouth.

[Ghostlight]

I understand that 17 is welcomed by the long term players as it changes things up on a 5 year old early access game.

 

Assume nothing. I have been playing since very early on, with the same co-op group of 4 people. 2000+ hours each. All of us agree this is worst alpha for some time, and by quite a margin. It just reeks of the devs simply not having a clue about what players wanted or what they would enjoy.

 

It has great things it: the POIs (when not overused), the new graphics, the vehicles; but almost everything else added in A17 was a joke and a huge step backwards in terms of fun factor and player satisfaction. The new perk and leveling system being especially bad....shoot zombies all day so you can become a better....swimmer!!

 

This alpha dropped the overall FUN we were having with the game by a lot, it has become an extremely tedious grind fest. And I say this despite being the sort of person who always enojyed the earliest stages of a play-through the most. Now it's just a chore and very very boring. And each build of A17 seems to manage to squeeze just a little more fun out of it as well. Soon a joyless husk catering to only very casual players is all that will remain of what was once my favorite video game of all time (I'm 52 now).

[Jedo]

"It just seems broken to me"

 

It is...for now. Cheers!

[Bhaaltazar]

As a player with almost 3k hours in it, playing since A10, I would say some new A17 aspects of the game are great as an idea but realization of them is a bit wonky. I agree pretty much on everything you wrote.

 

Just did a dungeon house stealting towards the roof and beware!!! A LITTLE STONE UNDER SMALL EDGE!! I drop for 5 inches over that little pebble and I make a sound like a hippo just landed on the roof and shook the whole building LOL. ( they decreased the stealth for some reason - like I wasn't the clumsy elephant already )

 

I don't know either TFP are overburned or something but they keep changing things that were OK and mess it up again just so the game would "feel harder and longer" ?

[Viktoriusiii]

The loot system just seems so much less rewarding now. Mods seem empty when compared to building something with better parts throughout the game. I would have loved to see a mix of the two where it was somewhat combined. It would have added so much to the game and not made it feel rushed. Same with the bicycle being a welcomed addition but the other 3 really don't add much from one another except storage. As far as I can tell they all move at about the same speed and loose durability at the same rate. The durability loss is also a bit silly.

 

I agree with everything you just said (player since day 1 of steam release), but this part is SO TRUE!!!

When they first talked about quality beeing reduced to 6, I thought it was a joke!

Its like saying "we think that building in fortnite overcomplicates it for new players so we removed it".

Or "we think driving out of bounds of the mario cart rainbow is too hard for new players so we added bourndries to every part of the race!"

 

Just... NO! So much no! I like the mods! But the oversimplyfication is ridicolous and sad, as well as unnecessary! Yes some players didn't like to micromanage... but it was never necessary... and for a lot of players this was the only endgame goal... so yeah... less endgame now!!! WEEEEHHHH!!! So happy!

[jdifran]

I trust that the Pimps continue to read feedback like this and continue to balance the new systems until they feel right. But right now, early game is WAY too tedious and grindy. I fundamentally like the design of the new stamina and health system, but the balance is just off. While some of this can be addressed by buying perks, in the early game you suck at everything and don't get enough points quickly enough to ease the pain.

 

It's just not fun - being constantly encumbered, constantly low on max stamina, quickly draining stamina trying to do anything meaningful, and knowing that you have to invest many hours of gameplay just to get to the point that it's no longer tedious. And God forbid the RWG screws you and your first trader is 3km away...

 

Yes, the early game should be challenging so that you appreciate your gains in mid-game and end-game. But right now I feel like the early game (up to and including the first horde) is just excruciating. I'm thinking about increasing the initial starter quest point award and/or increasing the number of points per level you gain to try to ease the pain. But I'd rather the Pimps fix this in vanilla. I have a hard time seeing new players enjoying the early game (and sticking with it) as it currently stands.

[Vexingcat]

I have 3,700 hours in this game 97 of those hours trying out A17. I agrea with nearly everything you said.

 

All I can say is that it has taken most of my enjoyment out of the game. It has become tedious and unbearably disheartening experience.

 

I love the new POI's and the dungeon crawl feeling of them.

 

However the skill system, the stamina, constant hunger and thirst make this game unenjoyable to play at this time.

[JCrook1028]

I'll say one thing. Take it for what it's worth. If you're seriously thinking of leaving the game, at least wait for stable before making a decision. What you're seeing now IS a buggy mess, intentionally as they work on it.

[Frotus]

Experimental is like taking a set of Proof of Concept ideas with production quality assets and flighting them with a group to get feedback on what the Stable version should be like. Some core things are stable and production ready and then they dress that with POC ideas and tuning to get feedback for Alpha 17 Release.

 

 

If you keep that in mind, it makes more sense.

[LuckyStar]

I just want to know,

 

.... was the OP drunk when they make this thread?'

[if not I'll be slightly disappointed.]

[Randomdude]

It just seems broken to me

 

Many of us feel the same way... but It'll get better. (HOPE)

[Viktoriusiii]

I just want to know,

 

.... was the OP drunk when they make this thread?'

[if not I'll be slightly disappointed.]

Nice try at banter, sadly not warranted, since what he said had a lot of truth in it.

Or am I underestimating you and it was meant this way, as drunks tell the truth?

[Punchdrunk]

I'll add my voice to the chorus of agreement. I love the new graphics, the POI (mostly) and the vehicles. But as you said, nearly all the other changes are for the worse.

 

I'm currently modding out most of the encumbrance, adding essential functionality to the UI (how are we STILL not shown hunger/thirst level in A17!!??!), and with the constant new tweaks Ive taken to giving myself 20 or so levels when I reset to reduce the massively tedious grind of the early levels.

 

I want A16, with the new graphics, POI and vehicles. Really hope someone can mod that, I have neither the time nor skill unfortunately.

[Kattla]

 

I understand that 17 is welcomed by the long term players as it changes things up on a 5 year old early access game. I just can't taste the koolade with this new release. It did make it harder in a few aspects but introduced so much more in annoyance that I don't find it as enjoyable. There are certainly harder games out there and I find it disappointing that they couldn't see the good from 16 and integrate it with 17. Instead it almost feels like they just started from scratch which is mind boggling. Anyway hope I didnt offend anyone too much. Im sure I will try it out once it goes stable but this version just doesn't suit my tastes so far. Happy Holidays to the Pimps and support. Remember to take some off and enjoy the season!

 

From what little i've read, they started almost from scratch with A17 to make it work with the

new version of the engine. For what they made so far, i think they worked quite fast and done

a reasonable good job at it too.

 

Not saying it is perfectly balanced, at the moment lots and lots seem way out of reason, but

through various feedbacks, your own included, A17 might end up playable.

[Razorpony]

Nice try at banter, sadly not warranted, since what he said had a lot of truth in it.

Or am I underestimating you and it was meant this way, as drunks tell the truth?

 

Did you miss OP's username by chance?

[Greymantle]

Then there is those that think this is the best version ever and we love it. Lucky for you it's easy to grab some modlets and make it how you like it.

[LuckyStar]

Nice try at banter, sadly not warranted, since what he said had a lot of truth in it.

Or am I underestimating you and it was meant this way, as drunks tell the truth?

 

Shall I bring back that Gif that's both an Altar and a High Horse for you Vik?

[AtomicUs5000]

I think that the pin-point strikes should only apply to head shots. If a wider hit zone results in a hit on the head when not aiming at it, then no head bonus.

[Thorne]

Absolutely agree with the topic. I'll add that removing interchangeable vehicle components hurts in the same way as with the weapons, IMO. Upgrading was part of the fun!

 

And I thought it was going to be awesome to be able to craft weapons, but in the end it just feels cheaper. Gun manufacturers are gone in the apocalypse, so these guns should be scavenge only. Building a production firearm is not something anyone can do. Maybe broaden the selection of custom survivor weapons you can craft?

 

Then there is those that think this is the best version ever and we love it. Lucky for you it's easy to grab some modlets and make it how you like it.

Or maybe that'll end up being lucky for you?

[LuckyStar]

Gun manufacturers are gone in the apocalypse, so these guns should be scavenge only. Building a production firearm is not something anyone can do.

 

I suspect this was a decision focusing on game play rather than realism.

 

It was a good choice imo.

 

Didn't like the old system.

Wasted far too many hours putting parts together to make a 600Q weapon to sell to Traders.

No thanks!

 

Is it a perfect system? Not by any means.

Is it better? Yeah... at least I feel it is.

[SenpaiThatIngnoresYou]

Absolutely agree with the topic. I'll add that removing interchangeable vehicle components hurts in the same way as with the weapons, IMO. Upgrading was part of the fun!

 

And I thought it was going to be awesome to be able to craft weapons, but in the end it just feels cheaper. Gun manufacturers are gone in the apocalypse, so these guns should be scavenge only. Building a production firearm is not something anyone can do. Maybe broaden the selection of custom survivor weapons you can craft?

 

 

Or maybe that'll end up being lucky for you?

 

My uncle was a gunsmith. I suspect that the reason why he was so damn crazy was due to the heavy metal poisoning from all the machining he did, as well as bluing pistols on the stove top.

 

I knew a guy in college who was a mechanical engineering major who sold firing pins for 5 bucks apiece. I never bought any from him, but if i was desperate for a firing pin that would have been the guy to go to.

 

Making firearms in a post apocalyptic setting is not far fetched, the reason why we are not drowned in home made guns in the US is because of the tax stamp that the ATF requires. They had some serious problems with crazy weapons back in the 1920s.

 

Personally, i would rather the crafted guns be limited to more primitive guns, like a repeating rifle, shotgun, a six shooter, and the AK. I also think that they should be limited to a new crafting bench like a lathe or end mill. Maybe add a machine shop poi that is filled with bikers and workers.

 

And instead of a color quality, it should be brand names. That would be a cool thing.

[stupid]

Cmon guys, it's alpha.

[Ghostlight]

I trust that the Pimps continue to read feedback like this and continue to balance the new systems until they feel right. .

 

You really think that? Given the changes the Forge has underwent in the last few builds? They obviously haven't a clue, and if A17 turns out satisfying, it'll be a fluke.

[Ghostlight]

I suspect this was a decision focusing on game play rather than realism.

 

It was a good choice imo.

 

Didn't like the old system..

 

So what are you going to out exploring and looting for once your main base is up? Glue and gunpowder is the answer because you will have everything else. I hope you enjoy it.