"Trap" rooms are getting tiresome

[Limdood]

I mean "trap" rooms in both senses of it.

 

It gets really annoying to fall through the floors on 40% or so of all the POIs I go into.

 

But, more importantly, Stealth is something that doesn't work during blood moons - what it IS supposed to do, is make looting, questing and clearing POIs safer and easier.  

Its bad enough that all the zombies are somehow standing up on top of shelves or HVAC vents or all decided to hang out in the closet.  That already feels incredibly obnoxious and a big level of "false difficulty."

But at least those can be snuck up on and killed before they wake up - if you can find them or already know where they are.

 

No, I'm talking about the scripted wake-ups.

You're walking into a room with 4/5 sneaking, cloth armor, and pitch black, all the while avoiding garbage piles, but the MOMENT you get to a certain point in the room, all the zombies instantly wake up.  

 

In A19 there were a few of these...the T4 business strip that goes through a dance studio and ends in a loot room with the loot on a stage was one of them.  No level of stealth would avoid all the zombies, as a group, waking up together as you crossed toward the stage.  But now in A20, with the new POIs, it seems even more common, and not even just in "final" rooms.

 

It weakens sneaking even further and frankly screws with any sort of risk mitigation while moving through POIs

 

[DEADFACE]

it would help if one of the perks of skilling into stealth would be to be able to walk over false floors without them breaking.

[Darthjake]

Infiltrator delays the breakage, 1/2 second, 1 second then 2 seconds, plus at 3 you can pick up land mines.

[warmer]

today I hopped down the elevator shaft in Butcher Pete's into a place I could not retreat from and immediately thought, I should really build an escape route, "just in case."

 

I got wrecked from 6 zeds 15 seconds later as they all burst out from hiding.

 

Without these style rooms my stealth/bow build would make looting POI seem incredibly boring after a while. The ONLY threat I faced was due to my lack of planning. If I had built an escape route like my 40 years of gaming instincts told me to do, I wouldn't be here right now explaining why we need these types of rooms to keep the game challenging.

 

I want things like this to keep my desired builds from becoming over powered. Trap rooms are one of the few things that truly make this game exciting after 900hrs.

 

Also... experienced players know to stick to room perimeters or watch the floors for damage. After the 1st few times you encounter this, you only have yourself to blame for not learning to expect it.

 

AND

 

ALWAYS carry a dozen frames on you. Easy escape route. I made the dumb mistake of not listening to my intuition, and I am thankful after 900hrs TFP are still finding ways to wreck me.

 

[canadianbluebeer]

Trap rooms. Piffle.

 

Climbing the final ladder of the Construction tower, step on the top, and BOOM! Landmine blows you OFF the top of the skyscraper.

*SPLAT*

 

(the mine wasn't right at the edge of the ladder, but rushing in thinking the final area would be clear.... umm... oops!)

 

Once you know where the trap floors are,  it's either hop about the edges, run right across, or the one POI with 4 traps in the same room,

dance about setting them off, and balance beam across the framing.

 

Mind you, being a heavy armor, mg or brawler, sometimes it's "oh, frackit! Lets Dance!"  

 

[Viktoriusiii]

Trap rooms are fine.

the breaking of floors CAN be slowed down with stealthperks.
So this is totally fine.

What is NOT fine is the "no counterplay" version, where they WILL wake up, no matter how low your sneak is. All of them. 100% of the time.
This NEEDS to be fixed.

Maybe make it % based.
Maybe make it so they walk around, but have not noticed you yet (this would be cool!)
Maybe make it dependant on a trigger (a trashpile or a lockpickable tripwire).

We NEED a way to avoid this danger. This is all that stealth is about.
If this is not there, there is NO POINT to a stealthbuild. 0.
It is fun, but why would I chose something if I could also just go in with an m60 guns blazing and have just as much fun?

Imagine if in skyrim, there was something like in Cyberpunk77, where if oyu killed/stole something, a guard would suddenly, without warning pop up right next to you.

Stealth/Thieving/Sniper all would be completely pointless.

This needs to be changed. Yes for everyone not just in a mod.

As I have said millions of times before (and yes getting more every time I say it :D):
EVERYTHING needs to be fair, by having strengths and weaknesses. If you take away the only strength of stealthbuilds (aka "risk-free" POI looting), you have completely devalued this perk and the only time you take it is as a secondary

[Scyris]

12 hours ago, Viktoriusiii said:

Trap rooms are fine.

the breaking of floors CAN be slowed down with stealthperks.
So this is totally fine.

What is NOT fine is the "no counterplay" version, where they WILL wake up, no matter how low your sneak is. All of them. 100% of the time.
This NEEDS to be fixed.

Maybe make it % based.
Maybe make it so they walk around, but have not noticed you yet (this would be cool!)
Maybe make it dependant on a trigger (a trashpile or a lockpickable tripwire).

We NEED a way to avoid this danger. This is all that stealth is about.
If this is not there, there is NO POINT to a stealthbuild. 0.
It is fun, but why would I chose something if I could also just go in with an m60 guns blazing and have just as much fun?

Imagine if in skyrim, there was something like in Cyberpunk77, where if oyu killed/stole something, a guard would suddenly, without warning pop up right next to you.

Stealth/Thieving/Sniper all would be completely pointless.

This needs to be changed. Yes for everyone not just in a mod.

As I have said millions of times before (and yes getting more every time I say it :D):
EVERYTHING needs to be fair, by having strengths and weaknesses. If you take away the only strength of stealthbuilds (aka "risk-free" POI looting), you have completely devalued this perk and the only time you take it is as a secondary

 

I agree, the ambush rooms should ONLY maybe be in the loot room or near it. Office_04 poi is just ugh, EVERY single room is a ambush where second you walk in every single zombie wakes up, every room just about has random zombies fallign down from the cieling, the loot room has a zombie sleeper that literally spawns right beside you as you walk in out of thin air and immedatly ambushes you with the 2-3 others in the small room. You WILL get hit by the one right by the door as it literally spawns soon as you walk in out of thin air and is pretty much hugging your char.

 

Like I said in a thread I made, they might as well just remove stealth perks entirely if they are going to keep this stuff up, as there is noi way to avoid causing the ambush. Its bad enough every damn zombie is smart enough to hide behind an object so you cannot shoot it from the door way. I mean stealth clearing is already and always was slower than just going in guns blazing, I felt that was more than enough of a downside in a game where you need to prepare for the horde nights.

 

Like I am fine with ambushes inside the loot rooms, I'd expect it, but it shouldn't be in every other damn random room in the poi too.

[Kosmic Kerman]

I would definitely avoid the new Cracker Book Skycraper. It's just a mass of zombies that swarm you on each level. It was a fun experience but I don't see how that POI could be stealthed. The loot also seemed pretty lackluster. 

[Ramethzer0]

Trap rooms catch first timers.

After that, they cease to surprise people anymore.

Experience and mistakes are the best teacher.

 

 

[DEADFACE]

On 12/12/2021 at 10:37 AM, Viktoriusiii said:

the breaking of floors CAN be slowed down with stealthperks.
So this is totally fine.

Hard disagree from me. Delaying the breaking 1. Isn't much of an advantage (not worth a skill point anyway) 2. the breaking still occurs and still causes noise which wakes up zombies 3. being able to walk over trap tiles can yield a stealth player better positioning for sneak kills for more play-style choices

 

To be clear, I think skilling into stealth should lengthen the time for trap tiles to break when walking over them, but prevent breaking entirely if sneaking over them.

[Viktoriusiii]

34 minutes ago, DEADFACE said:

To be clear, I think skilling into stealth should lengthen the time for trap tiles to break when walking over them, but prevent breaking entirely if sneaking over them.

What stealth player WALKS inside a poi? o_o

I think it is fine as it is right now.
Maybe give us a book like the one that makes mines not explode at all.
But otherwise, I am fine with these falling floors!

[DEADFACE]

9 minutes ago, Viktoriusiii said:

What stealth player WALKS inside a poi? o_o

Ones that just screwed up and need to vacate the room quickly. I'm sure you're now going to be pedantic and say they run, but the point is about breaking floors

 

I think it's funny how books are getting cool/useful abilities while actual skill trees remain a poor investment of points.

[meganoth]

9 minutes ago, DEADFACE said:

Ones that just screwed up and need to vacate the room quickly. I'm sure you're now going to be pedantic and say they run, but the point is about breaking floors

 

I think it's funny how books are getting cool/useful abilities while actual skill trees remain a poor investment of points.

 

But when running you go fast enough over the breaking floors so they don't matter. And if you are fast enough while stealth-running you also should be able to cross such tiles even stealthed, at least with a point in the delay.breakage perk. And there it may be, the hidden value of that perk. Besides, not everyone has shooter-reflexes or 500 training hours for that sound, that perk can be the difference between live or death which automatically might make it valuable for some.

 

[Reckis]

While I can see the arguments on both sides of this debate, and agree with some of them to one degree or another. I think the real problem is the frequency of both "trap" rooms and trap floors, they both need to be balanced a bit IMHO.

 

And while we are on the subject . . . in what world does trash/glass/debris ALWAYS come to rest in front of a doorway or at the top of stairs? Does the world of 7DtD contain some kind of mysterious weather phenomenon that causes a low pressure zone in those locations or what? I realize that the trash piles also appear in other locations, but it seems like 95% of the time they are in those two locations in every single structure.

[doughphunghus]

14 minutes ago, Reckis said:

in what world does trash/glass/debris ALWAYS come to rest in front of a doorway or at the top of stairs?

yeah

I've seen some mods ( gnamod for example) that add more "stuff" that can be in place of debris. In gnamod It seemed to always be land mines but even that is a bit more fun than just "always trash" as its possible someone put a mine in a doorway.  IT really keeps you on your toes, and mines can actually be used to make zeds walk into them while chasing you vs "oh I see they also made a crinkling sound!"