Roland Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Despite my last poll being called the dumbest poll ever it resulted in a lot of conversation and even gave he who shall not be named a few more excuses to bloat his post count by several more... So here is another knife fight in a telephone booth* between two big features. This one is a bit different than the last one as we've been told that they are mutually exclusive. If this one turns out to be as dumb as the last one I shall be pleased. *Millenials, think Tardis except its not bigger on the inside than it is on the outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Well you can't have two dumbest polls ever, so I guess you're safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 18, 2018 Author Share Posted February 18, 2018 That's true!!! I'm interested to see how many would be willing to give up voxel terrain in favor of truly massive hordes of zombies. I'm torn, myself, and will wait to vote to see how people respond and hopefully my own view will solidify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombie4hire Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I want a destructible world that theoretically I could totally destroy down the bedrock, leaving my sleeping bag the only block in existence, save my tired out self. I would like more zombies than there are now though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RestInPieces Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Despite my last poll being called the dumbest poll ever Well it seems they were wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crater Creator Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I like this poll better than the last, because the two options actually are related. One can’t just say “why not both?” and call it a day. One zombie can overwhelm the player, given the stats of a hundred zombies combined. More zombies would just feel better: more zombie-like than fantasy monster-like. But there’d be little if any functional difference as it is now. Huge quantities of zombies won’t solve any limitations in the AI, for instance, barring a fluke like zombies inadvertently pushing each other around into better positions. In fact AI could suffer, since there’s proportionally less time per zombie to devote to AI calculations every frame. And I will still argue you can’t split your attention between more than ~8 zombies at a time, anyway, so these extras would be more for ambiance than anything. Distant zombies, if you will. But the fully destructible, re-constructable world? That’s arguably the biggest thing this game has over similar zombie games. Cutting that down would potentially hurt mining, base building, treasure hunting, and random world generation. In other words, a sizable portion of the gameplay would take a hit, just to multiply the number of zombies spinning in circles. This is assuming horde ‘loopholes’ are going to be addressed. If the underground can’t be made engaging, challenging, and balanced, then I guess you might as well fill it up with bedrock and put the savings towards more zombies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RestInPieces Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Maybe I misunderstood then. Second choice is huge numbers of zombies as opposed to the number of zombies we have now or no zombies at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 18, 2018 Author Share Posted February 18, 2018 @CC: I’m just glad I was quick enough to “Part Two” one of my polls before you did. @Rest: yes. Assuming 64 zombies is the limit with voxel terrain what if 300 were the limit with static terrain. Would you trade voxels for significantly larger numbers that definitely couldn’t be done (as far as we know) with voxels standing in the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crater Creator Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Maybe I misunderstood then. Second choice is huge numbers of zombies as opposed to the number of zombies we have now or no zombies at all? I can tell you the majority opinion is we don’t have huge numbers of zombies right now. At least in Alpha 16 you can enjoy up to the full 64 zombie limit even in single player. Roland: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RestInPieces Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Thanks for clarifying One zombie can overwhelm the player, given the stats of a hundred zombies combined. More zombies would just feel better: more zombie-like than fantasy monster-like. But there’d be little if any functional difference as it is now. Huge quantities of zombies won’t solve any limitations in the AI, for instance, barring a fluke like zombies inadvertently pushing each other around into better positions. In fact AI could suffer, since there’s proportionally less time per zombie to devote to AI calculations every frame. And I will still argue you can’t split your attention between more than ~8 zombies at a time, anyway, so these extras would be more for ambiance than anything. Distant zombies, if you will. But the fully destructible, re-constructable world? That’s arguably the biggest thing this game has over similar zombie games. Cutting that down would potentially hurt mining, base building, treasure hunting, and random world generation. In other words, a sizable portion of the gameplay would take a hit, just to multiply the number of zombies spinning in circles. This is assuming horde ‘loopholes’ are going to be addressed. If the underground can’t be made engaging, challenging, and balanced, then I guess you might as well fill it up with bedrock and put the savings towards more zombies. Well, couldn't have said it better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadMole Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Despite my last poll being called the dumbest poll ever it resulted in a lot of conversation and even gave he who shall not be named a few more excuses to bloat his post count by several more... Ah, I'm not looking for "excuses" to boost my post count, since I don't even care about it. Quality over quantity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gipothegip Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I find this poll odd, at least if taken as absolutes; one option is a primary feature of the game, and the other is icing on the cake. If you want number 2 at the expense of number 1, I would argue it'd be a different game. That being said, there was a time where Tin experimented by making the world shallower with the RWGMixer. This actually did cut down on CPU usage and I was capable of having more zombies in my game. I attempted to lower the world height via DLL hacks, but couldn't figure out how, so I have no idea if that would've helped further with performance. Anyway, one could argue that TFP could make the world less deep and lower world height in order to free up resources for more zombies. In this sense, we wouldn't have to sacrifice option 1 for option 2, and they wouldn't be mutually exclusive. The question then becomes whether one would want to cut down on the world depth & height in order to have more zombies, and what would be optimal if any changes were to be made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toores Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 It's unfair! I WANT BOTH! I WANT BOTH! If it turns out that the systems can't handle mores zombies then we have in A16, i'm in favour of making the terrain indestructible. I'm fine if i can destroy the rest. 2nd dumbest poll, because: why not both? (greetings to Crater Creator ) Edit: I voted for destructible world btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toores Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 One zombie can overwhelm the player, given the stats of a hundred zombies combined. More zombies would just feel better: more zombie-like than fantasy monster-like. But there’d be little if any functional difference as it is now. Huge quantities of zombies won’t solve any limitations in the AI, for instance, barring a fluke like zombies inadvertently pushing each other around into better positions. In fact AI could suffer, since there’s proportionally less time per zombie to devote to AI calculations every frame. And I will still argue you can’t split your attention between more than ~8 zombies at a time, anyway, so these extras would be more for ambiance than anything. Distant zombies, if you will. I guess it all depends how the AI is coded. Can the AI be coded so it has a horde mode where their actions are simplified and take less computing power until "x" happens? Those ambient zombies would provide much more gameplay value then you're suggesting. *Shooting your gun has serious consequences, atm it doesn't. *Kiting the "8 zombies you can pay attention to" is very easy, having "ambient" zombies means you'll draw much more in by running around. *Stealth gets a totally new perspective, it would actually be easier at times. *You would have to plan and work hard to reach some POIs instead of just walking there. *Real challenge and reward for bigger cities. Lots of zombies and lots of loot. *Manipulating with a horde would become a thing. Can't kill them all, lure them away! *Using high ground to move around has advantages. Moving from rooftop to rooftop. Just some example off the top of my head.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guppycur Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Ah, I'm not looking for "excuses" to boost my post count, since I don't even care about it. Quality over quantity. Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotallyNotABot Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I voted zombies on accident Although it DOES sound like an amazing thing that the game needs, the world must come first. But please add in the massive zombie sizes once the game can handle it effectively!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurelius Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Ah, I'm not looking for "excuses" to boost my post count, since I don't even care about it. Quality over quantity. He wasn't referring to you... -A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyris Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Umm like I said in the last thread, we need both. As the game will be boring if its was just one or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadMole Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 7D = FO+MC and voxel is the core of MC. Remove voxel, and you take MC out of the equation. Now though, allow me to point out as a side note that... nope. I'm done. That was it, right there. Miracles does exist. He wasn't referring to you... -A Good to know then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotallyNotABot Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Why make us choose? We NEED both. Voxels are what make this game what it is and idk bout y'all but a max of 64 zombies is not hard enough for me. A man can dream of 250 zombies instead of 64 one day....unlikely anytime soon because lag but still a dream... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadMole Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Why make us choose? We NEED both. Voxels are what make this game what it is and idk bout y'all but a max of 64 zombies is not hard enough for me. A man can dream of 250 zombies instead of 64 one day....unlikely anytime soon because lag but still a dream... Just a question of picking the most valuable feature. Or just stronger zombies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamida Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Before I vote, how would the more zombie thing work? Would it be like 10 zombies would have 100 hp each and if it was 1000 zombies would they have 1 hp each? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Nice Cup of Tea Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 @CC: I’m just glad I was quick enough to “Part Two” one of my polls before you did. @Rest: yes. Assuming 64 zombies is the limit with voxel terrain what if 300 were the limit with static terrain. Would you trade voxels for significantly larger numbers that definitely couldn’t be done (as far as we know) with voxels standing in the way. I voted for more zombies and no fully voxel terrain, but I do have a caveat on that. I wouldn't want to see the voxel terrain completely disappear, but I'd be happy if the buildings and topsoil remained voxel based while the rock underneath was solid. Basically, "bedrock" would follow the contours of the land, and be about ten blocks down. That would probably mean no more mining (no skin off my nose - I never mine anyway) but would leave the buildings destroyable and mean you could still do minor landscaping of the soil (e.g. flattening places out or digging small holes to put spikes in). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaosterone Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I don't know if this is even a possibility, and likely not.... But can the world be fully destructible except for on Blood Moons? Is there a way for the game to shut off the distructabilty and all of those calculations (except for the world surface and buildings) and convert that processing power for zombies? I am not a programmer, just asking. Edit: I know this would prohibit mining during the 7 day horde. It would just be a short term inconvenience for more zombies above ground, and ground dwellers could craft the whole time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamida Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 How much of the world would have to be non-destroyable to have a major increase in zombies? As A Nice Cup of Tea mentioned, could bedrock be at -27 (for example) following the contour of the land and that would allow zombies to be increased? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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