Don't like a17

[RestInPieces]

It's not about being instantly gratified, at least for me.

 

I wouldn't suggest that you play on creative - I understand your point. I was of the opinion that essential recipe perks shouldn't be tied to leveling myself, but still, you don't have to wait for the death debuff doing nothing. Also try to raise attributes a bit before spreading points (the strict level requirements should be lessened though for specialization), so that the penalty is not that severe. The death penalty also diminishes with time before it expires. Lack of death penalty in A16 and before made death trivial, which is anything but good for any survival game.

[ubai]

I am a bit concerned that TFP only tests or plays in MP. Many of the things that seem trivial in a group are a terrible slog in SP. Base defense is especially dull and frustrating. Don't get me wrong, I like many of the new things in A17, but it feels as if the game is becoming less SP friendly, perhaps due to unbalanced testing.

[ricp]

That's a bit of a leap.

You can't come to any statistical conclusion from forum posts.

 

Perhaps not as much as you'd think. Obviously I don't have statistics to back it up, but anecdotally that seems to be the case. Further weight can be added via the numerous streams over the release weekend. These are guys and girls who stream for a living so their kit in general tends to favour "high end" specs. All of the ones I've seen (and without counting I'd list maybe 10 or so well known 7DtD streamers) commented on frame rate issues in comparison to A16.

 

Now don't get me wrong, if you have the kit that gets you that sweet spot, then I am genuinely happy for you. I really am, but I'd say from all the corroborating evidence that will not be the case for the majority of people.

 

I disagree with your loud voices analogy, as can be seen within any community there are always detractors and fan boys (or girls). Although I have no great desire to get into a big discussion about that.

[badgerpns]

Yeah co-op was always more efficient and easier than SP for obvious reasons, but that has taken a significant leap now w/ the new party system that allows shared XP gains.

[Saera]

I am loving A17 so far. It is so much harder, and I am forced to actually pay attention to the game, and am scared when I hear a noise. In A16 it was "well theres a mini horde outside, I am gonna finish what I am doing and go deal with them because they make annoying sounds." Now we are always on edge and actually immersed in the game play.

 

That said, there are a few things I dislike so far such as:

 

The stamina and food issue. I feel there needs to be some tweaking there. The depletion seems off, too much too fast.

 

The level gating for crafting stuff....ehhh theres so much required elsewhere in the skills, that there is no need to make it THAT difficult. No matter what we have to spend our points in a smart fashion, throw us a bone here Pimps.

 

 

I would like to say I dislike how hard the zombies are and how they get me no matter what but honestly, I like it. Maybe tone down their hearing some, as they should not hear me sneak walking from across the road while in a basement, but other than that I enjoy that there is a hungry zombie or 12 on my tail at any given time.

[KeiraR]

Just for some perspective, the developers love playing at every stage of the game. They love the primitive stage<snip>

 

Nobody on the dev team rushes to try and skip "the boring early stuff" so they can get all the best things in the first week or two.

 

 

Yet there is a huge bug with the trader 0,0 location indication.

That is the basic quest but nobody found it?

It is stuff like that which makes me not able to take them seriously as game devs, sorry.

I could go on but I won't because it would border slagging them off. =)

[HIREDGUN]

Like everyone else that does not like the update you are trying to play 17 like itwas 16 stop..........it is a new game you never played before. Forget your old habits. Forget going straight to the city and looting. Forget a forge in the first hour of play. Also forget how bored you are by day 14 because you are set with everything you could want. That game is gone. No matter who or how many complain it is what it is. Nothing is going to change that. So as a community ban together and relearn the game. Leveling is easy. Work with a friend keep the target between you and keep hitting it with arrows. Feathers are everywhere. Deer go down one shot. Use that learn to eat off the land not out of the can. Scrap everything down instead of carrying crap around. Think about how you do things. Your inventory expands in time. Points come to you faster as you put in the EFFORT. Game is not all as hard as you make it to be. Difficulty 4 I leveled to 9 in about 3 hrs.

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

Well if people want to ruin the game by changing things that is their right. I would not expect TFP to do that for you. This team has a vision for their game and this update was carefully done. These are the changes here to stay learn to work with them it is hard if you stop looking for the fast way out of everything the game would advance. Or you can just use admin cheats and say you are a winner and not a cheater. It is a survival game so SURVIVE.

 

Just for some perspective, the developers love playing at every stage of the game. They love the primitive stage and then spending time with iron tools and being weak and vulnerable and then becoming more powerful through perks, armor, weapons, and bases. The developers love the idea that unless actively defended there is a risk that a base can be breached and you have to fall back and perhaps abandon.

 

Nobody on the dev team rushes to try and skip "the boring early stuff" so they can get all the best things in the first week or two.

 

So if your play preference is to quickly progress because you can't stand the grind of the using brown stone tools for more than a day and you like to rush to the top stuff, then you are going to have mod out the level gates, and increase the xp gains, and increase the loot % from zombies, and whatever else you want to have fun because it's not so much that they are transitioning to an rpg froma survival sandbox as they are very interested in making every stage of the game they have designed signficant and something to be experienced rather than skipped.

 

Exactly. I Wanted A17 to be a challenge again At ALL LEVELS... and it finally is.

A16 was fun but after lvl40 you were just repeating tasks it to hit lvl200. it got boring quick and players would just hit lvl 200 and then build a huge base then hop to another server... to get the "thrill" of lvls 1-40 again.

 

The only thing I would adjust is set zombie drop rate to 5%-10% from 2% because after 150 kills I have yet to see a drop bag from them.

Maybe i'm just unlucky, but dropping a bag every 25-50 zombie is what I would call reasonable.

 

Also the restriction at the traders in MP could fill up quickly with spent Guns as players shoot off the rounds and sell them to the traders and the fact traders buy only 3 stacks of any item... 3 pistols...3 shotguns... 3 etc.

[insanetoast]

I suggest you get a better toaster 10-30 frames is pretty bad they should outlaw potatoes as computers.

 

i have this right now and the biggest differance came from upgrading my ram to 16gb i used to only have a gtx 650 boost 2gb video card and a i3 2100

 

https://www.passmark.com/baselines/V9/display.php?id=108527943032

 

this gets me stable play on higest settings some lag but barely even while i record.

 

I have 64 GB RAM and average 30-45 FPS. It's Experimental build and poorly optimized bc it's Experimental. Swing your e-peen elsewhere.

[Vaeliorin]

I wouldn't suggest that you play on creative - I understand your point. I was of the opinion that essential recipe perks shouldn't be tied to leveling myself, but still, you don't have to wait for the death debuff doing nothing. Also try to raise attributes a bit before spreading points (the strict level requirements should be lessened though for specialization), so that the penalty is not that severe. The death penalty also diminishes with time before it expires. Lack of death penalty in A16 and before made death trivial, which is anything but good for any survival game.

You misunderstand me, I'm afraid. I have no real problem with the death debuff. It's annoying (mostly because of encumbrance in my personal estimation) but not a huge deal. What annoys me and makes me not want to play is having to spend so long in the "hit a boulder 5 times, wait 10 seconds, repeat" stage of the game. It's not hard, it's just boring. Stamina in combat I'm fine with. Running would be okay too, if walking was at a reasonable speed (it's better in A17, but still annoyingly slow. If the 8192X8192 random map is 8km across it should take < 2 in game hours to walk entirely across. That's only walking 2.5 miles an hour, which is not at all fast.)

 

The new stealth system compounds this, with the "hit something, wait 3-4 seconds for the noise to decay, repeat" mechanic.

 

The real killer, though, is the max stamina mechanic and the seeming rarity of food. That wolf that I mentioned in my previous post as being happy to see because it would mean I had decent food attacked me when my max stamina cap was at 30. That wasn't from repeated deaths, either, it was simply from trying to play the game and not being able to find any food that didn't keep giving me food poisoning.

 

Now, while that may be something that you enjoy, it isn't something that I do. Hence why I haven't been saying that I think A17 is bad (I think a lot of it's really good, honestly) but that it simply isn't enjoyable for me.

[RestInPieces]

e and makes me not want to play is having to spend so long in the "hit a boulder 5 times, wait 10 seconds, repeat" stage of the game. It's not hard, it's just boring.

 

Between crafting, looking over my shoulder, looting and building, I never had to wait doing nothing. And it's certainly not "5 times" you can get enough work done when satiated. Stamina regen also works between actions. By what you say below I'd wager that you neglect keeping your character hydrated/satiated.

 

The new stealth system compounds this, with the "hit something, wait 3-4 seconds for the noise to decay, repeat" mechanic.

 

Why even do that? You can harvest anything and move a little further to continue if something hears you. If dogs hear you yes, it will be a problem (dogs are overtuned) but if anything else hears you you just avoid it and go somewhere else.

 

The real killer, though, is the max stamina mechanic and the seeming rarity of food. That wolf that I mentioned in my previous post as being happy to see because it would mean I had decent food attacked me when my max stamina cap was at 30. That wasn't from repeated deaths, either, it was simply from trying to play the game and not being able to find any food that didn't keep giving me food poisoning.

 

30 max stamina? O.o The lowest I've feel in my playthrough was min ~75 stamina. You are doing something wrong. If you neglect eating like you could in A16 it's not the game's fault. Hunt. You will easily gather enough good quality food to get by and keep your stamina at max levels.

 

Now, while that may be something that you enjoy, it isn't something that I do. Hence why I haven't been saying that I think A17 is bad (I think a lot of it's really good, honestly) but that it simply isn't enjoyable for me.

 

From my understanding you play A17 like it's A16, which is understandable at first until you adapt.

[hristian991]

HOW ???? i have GT740m it's slightly slower to yours http://gpuboss.com/gpus/Radeon-R7-360-vs-GeForce-GT-740M

[Vaeliorin]

Between crafting, looking over my shoulder, looting and building, I never had to wait doing nothing. And it's certainly not "5 times" you can get enough work done when satiated. Stamina regen also works between actions. By what you say below I'd wager that you neglect keeping your character hydrated/satiated.

It wasn't neglect, I spawned in a desert and the only food I had was yucca, and I didn't find water for over a day, not that my hydration was every particularly low. Also, 5 times was obviously something of a hyperbole, but I seriously find I have to stop and regen stamina around 4-5 times to finish harvesting a boulder, even with 100 stamina.

 

Why even do that? You can harvest anything and move a little further to continue if something hears you. If dogs hear you yes, it will be a problem (dogs are overtuned) but if anything else hears you you just avoid it and go somewhere else.

Because I was trying not to draw extra zombies/wake up sleepers trying to get into a POI. As far as dogs...I've found them massively easier than in A16.

 

30 max stamina? O.o The lowest I've feel in my playthrough was min ~75 stamina. You are doing something wrong. If you neglect eating like you could in A16 it's not the game's fault. Hunt. You will easily gather enough good quality food to get by and keep your stamina at max levels.

I was eating...but all I had was yucca, which was constantly giving me food poisoning. That wolf that I was happy to see because I finally had food was the first animal I'd seen in A17. Maybe I've just had terrible luck with map spawns and loot, but I've found food to be super rare.

 

I also ate constantly in A16. Pretty much as soon as I could eat or drink, I would.

 

From my understanding you play A17 like it's A16, which is understandable at first until you adapt.

If trying to gather resources to make a POI safe to stay in overnight is the wrong way to play, I'm not sure what the right way is (unless it's all nomad-like, in which case, not something I enjoy.)

[Fatal]

don't get me wrong but for EA some of the stuff are getting worse

1 poor performance 10~30 fps lowest settings 800x600 (USED TO PLAY AT `50~120 FPS)

2 Vultures are deadly as dogs

3 zombies too smart ignoring the spikes in the front of the door and they go hitting the side walls instead of the door which is wooden

4 it's hard to hit the head of the zombie (sometimes)

5 FOV option is missing

6 no looting the zombies (WHY)

7 no XP for upgrading and digging (this is not realistic)

8 Forge at level 20 (WHY)

9 items like feather and seed's can slow you if placed in the black places in your inventory (WHAT?)

 

1.check and update graphics card, also check your resolution.. that will help

6. One line of code will change this. go into the enityclasses.xml look up zombiemale. see where it says <property name="LootDropProb" value=".75"/> <!-- Whether it drops a loot bag on death or not. -->

i changed mine to .75 they dont drop each time but its more frequent now..

7. same with this., this can all be mod coded.. not hard to do. Ive already changed it on my server, stamina, loot, put back in recipes they took out

8. also changed in code

9. I took out stamina on items altogether so everything runs as normal..

 

 

all code changes are server side so nothing to download. If you are playing personal and not server you can still change everything I mentioned. I would suggest you hang out in the mod area also.Hit me up with a PM if you need help.. I dont mind answering any questions you may have.

[RestInPieces]

It wasn't neglect, I spawned in a desert and the only food I had was yucca, and I didn't find water for over a day, not that my hydration was every particularly low. Also, 5 times was obviously something of a hyperbole, but I seriously find I have to stop and regen stamina around 4-5 times to finish harvesting a boulder, even with 100 stamina.

 

Because I was trying not to draw extra zombies/wake up sleepers trying to get into a POI. As far as dogs...I've found them massively easier than in A16.

 

I was eating...but all I had was yucca, which was constantly giving me food poisoning. That wolf that I was happy to see because I finally had food was the first animal I'd seen in A17. Maybe I've just had terrible luck with map spawns and loot, but I've found food to be super rare.

 

I also ate constantly in A16. Pretty much as soon as I could eat or drink, I would.

 

 

If trying to gather resources to make a POI safe to stay in overnight is the wrong way to play, I'm not sure what the right way is (unless it's all nomad-like, in which case, not something I enjoy.)

 

Maybe - I never had a problem finding enough animals to sustain me. Haven't played in a desert yet, don't know if something was changed when it comes to animals. Finding water and a pot is very easy in general. Keep the yucas to make yuca juice when you find water instead of eating them. If you spawn in a desert, focus on basic needs before harvesting materials for anything else. And you can easily get out of the desert before losing much satiation/hydration to find a more friendly biome and move back in when you gather the basics.

[MetroDetroitGaming]

Where is the file to change the gate for the forge and other items? I looked in progression but didnt see it.

[Feycat]

Just for some perspective, the developers love playing at every stage of the game.

 

Ehhhh.... maybe get someone who isn't Joel to make the dev videos then? Because watching him, it's easier to believe that the devs don't even know HOW to play the game, let alone that they love all the stages.

[Kattla]

Nobody on the dev team rushes to try and skip "the boring early stuff" so they can get all the best things in the first week or two.

 

That explains quite more then i think was intended...

[pavichokche]

Just for some perspective, the developers love playing at every stage of the game. They love the primitive stage and then spending time with iron tools and being weak and vulnerable and then becoming more powerful through perks, armor, weapons, and bases. The developers love the idea that unless actively defended there is a risk that a base can be breached and you have to fall back and perhaps abandon.

 

Nobody on the dev team rushes to try and skip "the boring early stuff" so they can get all the best things in the first week or two.

 

So if your play preference is to quickly progress because you can't stand the grind of the using brown stone tools for more than a day and you like to rush to the top stuff, then you are going to have mod out the level gates, and increase the xp gains, and increase the loot % from zombies, and whatever else you want to have fun because it's not so much that they are transitioning to an rpg froma survival sandbox as they are very interested in making every stage of the game they have designed signficant and something to be experienced rather than skipped.

 

Oh, well, good thing the devs are making a game that only they like. I guess it doesn't matter what the players enjoy.

[Roland]

Ehhhh.... maybe get someone who isn't Joel to make the dev videos then? Because watching him, it's easier to believe that the devs don't even know HOW to play the game, let alone that they love all the stages.

 

Did that feel good. You feeling a bit higher now because you made Joel out to be a bit lower? I hope so because this statement has nothing to to do with the topic so it would be nice if it served some sort of purpose for you.

[Roland]

Oh, well, good thing the devs are making a game that only they like. I guess it doesn't matter what the players enjoy.

 

They are making a game they like. If you think it is one that only they like, you are dreaming. If you think they have you personally in mind when they make design decisions then you're still dreaming. If you think you can influence them into doing the opposite of what they want to do....well, that's MY nightmare...

[Damocles]

I like sandbox games with a slow progression, so being weak for a longer stretch is something positive.

(I dont like being told what FOV to use!)

 

The POIs are much more refined. But I think its taking the wrong approach:

they feel very gamy and staged. The positioned lights make absolutely no sense in this setting. (fire, flashlight etc.. this is a silly choice, who placed them there hours ago?)

Those lights are there probably to get some more variation in lighting into the indoor environment, wich have more flat light levels now.

Artificial lights should be plausible and few. Such as solar powered street lamps. Or solar powered lights from recent deceased survivors. Indoor light variation should come naturally from the sunlight though windows and cracked walls.

 

More Walking Dead atmosphere, less Borderlands sillyness.

It should really feel like a place that was abandoned several months to years ago.

 

A more fitting approach to "apocalypse content" would be offering a lot more different POIs. Since this is time intensive to make manually, the game should rather use a procedural approach (created out of sub-section that get mixed togeather randomly)

Procedural buildings could generate lots of variation out of a limited set of manually crafted subsections.

There can still be some manual POIs nevertheless..

 

That would make the random gen world way more interesting in the long run, as static POIs will repeat necessarily.

[Deceiver101]

Did that feel good. You feeling a bit higher now because you made Joel out to be a bit lower? I hope so because this statement has nothing to to do with the topic so it would be nice if it served some sort of purpose for you.

 

Well, his tone was rude, but then you do the exact same thing to make someone else feel "lower" right in your next post.

 

 

They are making a game they like. If you think it is one that only they like, you are dreaming. If you think they have you personally in mind when they make design decisions then you're still dreaming. If you think you can influence them into doing the opposite of what they want to do....well, that's MY nightmare...

 

Yeah the guy is exaggerating about no one liking A17, but you seem to be doing the exact same thing that you just criticized someone else for.

[Roland]

Well, his tone was rude, but then you do the exact same thing to make someone else feel "lower" right in your next post.

 

Not at all. My point was that my preferences don't align with pav's. It would be my nightmare if he was able to influence the developers to do the opposite of what they are doing because then I wouldn't enjoy the game as much. Read again what I wrote and you'll see that in no way did I do to Pav what Feycat did in her post. I was being clever about how I said what I did to Pav but how does me saying that if he gets the changes in that he wants make the game worse for me make him lower to make myself feel higher?

[Feycat]

Did that feel good. You feeling a bit higher now because you made Joel out to be a bit lower? I hope so because this statement has nothing to to do with the topic so it would be nice if it served some sort of purpose for you.

 

No, it was a serious suggestion, actually. Presentation is important. I assume that's why you guys had a group of LPers and streamers showcasing A16 for you. If someone is presenting new content, they should be doing that in a manner that SHOWCASES it, especially if it is an official dev video. It's much easier to actually see the new features while watching the streamers who are showing it now than it is to watch Joel's videos because he rambles and isn't very good at the game. At one point he even said he hadn't played it in a while, so okay.

 

Sorry you feel like you need to bite my head off for it, bro.

[Roland]

No, it was a serious suggestion, actually. Presentation is important. I assume that's why you guys had a group of LPers and streamers showcasing A16 for you. If someone is presenting new content, they should be doing that in a manner that SHOWCASES it, especially if it is an official dev video. It's much easier to actually see the new features while watching the streamers who are showing it now than it is to watch Joel's videos because he rambles and isn't very good at the game. At one point he even said he hadn't played it in a while, so okay.

 

Sorry you feel like you need to bite my head off for it, bro.

 

That wasn't close to biting your head off.

 

Since you were making a serious suggestion, thanks for the feedback. Glad you enjoyed the streamer event.