love all the complaining

[jemriah]

I just love how many complaints I've seen about the new alpha.. you can literally keep A20 if you want and play that to your heart's content. or you can play A21 and the changes and challenges it brings. TFP is giving away a new game with every update, that is what you have paid for with a single purchase and it just blows me away that they haven't made it DLC and tried to make people pay for it but somehow there are still people whining about things. keep it up pimps, love your work

[AtomicUs5000]

I don't want to hear it either. They think they have it bad, but try surviving a transition from A16 to A17.

[Maxwar]

I've been playing this game since A12. Played every Alpha versions since and it is the same story every time. I can't remember an Alpha release that did not have a vocal minority complaining how this or that change is ruining the game.  

 

 

[Survior]

Having no opinion on what is good, lacking the urge or ability to share that opinion or deferring to other's idea of what is good is just lazy. 😘

[ijese]

2 hours ago, jemriah said:

I just love how many complaints I've seen about the new alpha.. you can literally keep A20 if you want and play that to your heart's content. or you can play A21 and the changes and challenges it brings. TFP is giving away a new game with every update, that is what you have paid for with a single purchase and it just blows me away that they haven't made it DLC and tried to make people pay for it but somehow there are still people whining about things. keep it up pimps, love your work

+1

 

If they keep updating the game, I wouldn't even mind paying for DLCs. Maybe similar to Stellaris, each DLC brings substantial free updates to base game, but that way they can continue working on already released game for years.

[Riamus]

They want to hear what people think of each alpha.  They don't want a bunch of people keeping their mouths shut about their experiences.  The game cannot get better if no one voices their opinions, both good and bad.  Every alpha needs tweaked and those tweaks come from what people express about how the game is working for them.  Don't dismiss people's opinions as being invalid just because they don't agree with your opinions.  Everyone's opinion is just as valid as your own.

 

Now, it was different when people were complaining before ever playing A21.  At that point, they had no experience with it and their complaints were baseless.  But once people started playing A21, their complaints as well as praises are valid and valuable for TFP.

[pApA^LeGBa]

I have a few complaints too. But that doesn´t mean i like A20 more than A21.

 

Like the empty jars. Totally fine for SP. No problems at all. But in MP Coop trying to craft things for everyone we have a serious shortage of duct tape due to not enough water.

 

Or the new sounds. The Lumberjack. It´s really bad, like really really badly made. And some others aswell. Give me back all the A20 sounds. Like what´s up with those notification sounds? It´s like someone tried to find sounds that break the immersion the most.

 

Talking about immersion. The POI popup and the dangermeter. They look like they where either done last minute or by someone who doesn´t care. And they also break immersion and are simply annoying.

 

The magazines are a immersion breaker aswell. I mean the books already where, but finding everything as a readable is a bit too much. No problems balance wise or how fast we get the ability to craft things. It´s actually challenging in MP Coop to bring back all of them to the people who need them. Never have i been encumbered that quickly before.

 

But those things aren´t enough to go back to A20.

Edited June 14, 2023 by pApA^LeGBa (see edit history)

[Urban Blackbear]

I wonder if I'm the only one who is waiting on the first stable version of A21? I also find the complaints hilarious. Reminds me of when my dad used to threaten to give me something to really complain about.

[Greymantle]

13 hours ago, jemriah said:

I just love how many complaints I've seen about the new alpha.. you can literally keep A20 if you want and play that to your heart's content. or you can play A21 and the changes and challenges it brings. TFP is giving away a new game with every update, that is what you have paid for with a single purchase and it just blows me away that they haven't made it DLC and tried to make people pay for it but somehow there are still people whining about things. keep it up pimps, love your work

 

I agree, if I want tedium and boring game-play loop, I play 21. If I want a sandbox survival/crafting game, I have to play 19? or earlier.

[zombiehunter]

6 hours ago, Urban Blackbear said:

I wonder if I'm the only one who is waiting on the first stable version of A21? I also find the complaints hilarious. Reminds me of when my dad used to threaten to give me something to really complain about.

No, I'm waiting for the stable version too.  I have no complaints obviously because I haven't played it but based on some of these complaints I do have a few concerns but will not have any judgements until I play it myself.  I've watched some of the content creators play some and so far I have seen nothing that causes concern in those.  So, we'll see!

[Scyris]

19 hours ago, AtomicUs5000 said:

I don't want to hear it either. They think they have it bad, but try surviving a transition from A16 to A17.

 

That was brutal, people who haven't played a16.4 don't know how much of a downgrade a17 was as a whole to the game.

[AtomicUs5000]

1 hour ago, Scyris said:

 

That was brutal, people who haven't played a16.4 don't know how much of a downgrade a17 was as a whole to the game.

 
Yeah, at least at first until they resolved some bigger issues over a few builds and straightened out the skills a little bit in A18. They also had to redo a lot since they hadn't kept the game updated with the latest engine for a long time. Random gen was almost completely broken at first, then it improved a bit but you would get occasional ridges carved across the map like a giant fork was run through mashed potatoes. Overall it was a big shift away from the survival aspects of the game and it attempted to bring in more looter-shooter action, but the melee and the stamina was all out of whack. Zombies didn't drop anything until they brought back some loot with the occasional bag. The weapon upgrading system was completely changed (which was probably good, but the replacement system wasn't tuned and tested to the point where it is at now). Swimming was the slowest it had ever been. Wooden spikes got a huge nerf since zombies would simply avoid them in pathing. Digging zombies was reintroduced, of which I was happy with but it caused a huge stir in the community. We got more vehicles which was great, but they came without the mechanics they have now, so the attempts they made at providing a challenging horde with the digging were nullified by being able to drive around for the entirety of a blood moon. The biggest stir was the removal of learn by doing.
 
It was a lot to handle. 
 
While I don't particularly like some of the decisions made for A21, I don't think that the changes are enough to be concerned that the game is going to suffer from this point forward. I do think that the introduction of bandits soon could change things significantly to the point where it will feel like a completely different game. It might be good or it might be bad, but it will be different. It will be interesting to see the reactions.

 

Edited June 15, 2023 by AtomicUs5000
I wanted to (see edit history)

[Scyris]

9 minutes ago, AtomicUs5000 said:

 
Yeah, at least at first until they resolved some bigger issues over a few builds and straightened out the skills a little bit in A18. They also had to redo a lot since they hadn't kept the game updated with the latest engine for a long time. Random gen was almost completely broken at first, then it improved a bit but you would get occasional ridges carved across the map like a giant fork was run through mashed potatoes. Overall it was a big shift away from the survival aspects of the game and it attempted to bring in more looter-shooter action, but the melee and the stamina was all out of whack. Zombies didn't drop anything until they brought back some loot with the occasional bag. The weapon upgrading system was completely changed (which was probably good, but the replacement system wasn't tuned and tested to the point where it is at now). We got more vehicles which was great, but they came without the mechanics they have now, so the attempts they made at providing a challenging horde with the digging were nullified by being able to drive around for the entirety of a blood moon. Swimming was the slowest it had ever been. Wooden spikes got a huge nerf since zombies would simply avoid them in pathing. Digging zombies was reintroduced, of which I was happy with but it caused a huge stir in the community. The biggest stir was the removal of learn by doing.
 
It was a lot to handle. 
 
While I don't particularly like some of the decisions made for A21, I don't think that the changes are enough to be concerned that the game is going to suffer from this point forward. I do think that the introduction of bandits soon could change things significantly to the point where it will feel like a completely different game. It might be good or it might be bad, but it will be different. It will be interesting to see the reactions.

 

Biggest thing I hate is the sex t-rex change, I'd like sex t-rex to be put back into str but also keep it in the weapon lines (whichever gives the highestr stam reduction is what applys) Because even maxing 1 weapon which also requires 10 in the stat costs way more perk points than just getting 4-5 str and maxing sex t-rex its just horribly inefficent. I'd always rather get the str no matter what weap I am using as sex t-rex there applied to all melee/tools, instead of spending way more perk points and it only applys to a single thing. I also dislike the stat system as a whole as we went from a single level gate in a16.4 to 5 in a17+ due to the stats. I play single player mostly, so I don't have others to do the mining etc for me, I have to do it all, and single player is where the sex t-rex and stats change hurts the most.

[AttilaThePunn]

This update was a year in the half in the making for a game that's still in Alpha. It's also the only game this studio makes; they need feedback. No one wants to feel like they're making compromises by playing on a new version, it should be an easy choice, but it's not. For A21 the art team has outdone themselves, but the gameplay changes are awful. It's a shame.

[AtomicUs5000]

12 minutes ago, AttilaThePunn said:

This update was a year in the half in the making for a game that's still in Alpha. It's also the only game this studio makes; they need feedback.

 
Absolutely. My first post in this thread might seem dismissive of feedback. Sarcasm doesn't translate well in text.

Complaints can too easily be seen with a negative light, but this is how they find out if their game is going in a good direction. TFP, I think, are pretty good at looking at the feedback (or complaints if you want) and adjusting accordingly. Of course, those adjustments can come much later after people forget the complaints so that they can pretend that it was their idea to revert or change something again.... but whatever. They do listen to the community well.

[Ramethzer0]

It's absolutely mind boggling how many people that come here complaining have massive preconceived notions about how one is supposed to play.

And then when they are confronted with a problem, instead of trying something different, it turns into a madness induced series of salt posts.

Every iteration of this game has been pretty cool for me thus far.  I don't always agree with everything that has changed, but at least I understand why

the change(s) had to happen.  And not all of the reasons for change were readily understandable just at an in game glance.  Sometimes TFP had to change something due to a coding issue or as a way to optimize something.  Sometimes that step back meant a huge step forward.

 

But some folks just have no patience.  Straight to the forums, zero experience, very little perspective, sometimes even desperately immature, but mostly? Just effing lazy or entirely lacking in problem solving skills.

 

Most folks don't even bother to try to understand how the RWG selection system works.  Many problems can be solved just by trimming these settings.

 

EDIT:  Yeah I'm really regretting reading the forum now, as most of these issues are (at least what I consider to be) people being the architects of their own sorrows.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Ramethzer0 (see edit history)

[pApA^LeGBa]

@Ramethzer0 RWG is borked somehow tough. I set snow and wasteland to the same size at 12% Wasteland was tiny and snow was huge. Wilderness POI settings don´t show any difference between default and many. Lakes don´t show up at all or at a max of 3 when set to many.

[Ramethzer0]

6 hours ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

@Ramethzer0 RWG is borked somehow tough. I set snow and wasteland to the same size at 12% Wasteland was tiny and snow was huge. Wilderness POI settings don´t show any difference between default and many. Lakes don´t show up at all or at a max of 3 when set to many.

Allow me a bit of clarification on this particular point.   I am specifically addressing the posts that include too much loot, too little loot, zombies hitting so hard at the beginning of the game, zombies becoming bullet sponges, people posting bad luck looting after a gazillion days but do not post how long their in game days are, too many resources, too little resources, et al.   The list of complaints is exhaustive in this relation.  As for world generation, I have less experience in this as I typically make about a hundred maps before deciding which one I like best for convenience reasons.   If I had a beef with map generation in terms of biomes, I'd posit that I dislike having mass expanses of empty space that isn't interesting in any way.

 

 

[Apocalipservice]

12 hours ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

@Ramethzer0 RWG is borked somehow tough. I set snow and wasteland to the same size at 12% Wasteland was tiny and snow was huge. Wilderness POI settings don´t show any difference between default and many. Lakes don´t show up at all or at a max of 3 when set to many.

I'm loving that RWG is so quick now and that there are POIs for those long roads but yeah, it seems to be struggling a little bit. I managed to make a map that is like 60% pine and 40% desert but 30% was supposed to be snow and wasteland. I do love that the seed is OhTheHorrorOfIt, lol. It's just for bumbling around and relearning vanilla and seeing what 21 is about so it's OK but yeesh, what happened to the 30% of Not pine/desert? (I guess that I forgot to tweak lakes in rwgmixer but not sure.)