doughphunghus

@Haidrgna I’ve been playing your core + UI mods on a19 (latest stable) and I just felt the need to say: Thanks for making such a great set of mods! I’ve really been enjoying how much they change up the look/feel/style of the game and make it much more challenging. At first I really didn’t like the UI changes (which are optional to load) but I figured “why not learn something new” and after a few hours I ended up liking that a lot as well im not going to mention much more as I don’t want to give away any of the “welcome surprises” I’ve seen in game. So far Ive made it to morning on day 14 and have died a lot (yay). My personal favorite changes are the “general increase in clutter” as well as the weather modifications.

They took the turd out of the game, it just took a bit to remove it from the forums. Your turd record is now forged in forum history and should be engraved on something as it now appears to be immutable. I do with the turd would come back in game though. On a related note about a cookie icon: maybe the forum reaction icons could all be switched to be using the same icons as in the game

Since darkness falls was mentioned, I’m also going to throw in trying Gnamod. I’ve been enjoying it as it changes up quite a lot on how the game is played, and just has a different “look” than most of the overhauls. additionally: I’ve seen other people replay the game with “a self declared challenge” like “no crafting” or “punching only”. additionally: there are a few special built maps that can be fun. Specificallly the “spencer mansion” challenge (where you replay a resident evil location) as well as the “Dishong tower challenge” there are more options involving modding with individual mods, which may be too much work for some people, but the above are the easiest to do and are unique/fun on their own.

Maybe for steam itself, for keeping track of game settings/locations? yeah, we’re gonna need to see those *specific* settings or registry keys/paths or *something* OP.

It would be nice if POIs could be “clustered” or tagged in some way so the rwg mapper could put them close together or touching in a predefined way. Then you could make several small similar themed POIs and link them all together. Maybe have a limit of like 4-16 to a cluster (2x2, up to 4x4) For something like a carnival/prison it would then randomly place those POIs in the cluster, so all the mega POIs” would be somewhat different, and “adding to the list” could be done by anyone. It could also make for some cool underground or “dense city” POIs (no roads between buildings, etc) additionally: you wouldn’t have to put a little bit of land around it, it would literally join the blocks together and then add a little strip of land and a road for you. Maybe auto put a parking lot or two against it

Personally, I have played this game enough to find the vanilla, “all defaults” game way too easy. From what I read on these forums: - this happens to a lot of people. - this is by design, per TFP there are some global pre game defaults to change to make the game “harder” and I usually change some. I personally find that I don’t enjoy putting the game to “insane” setting because the zeds become bullet sponges. I like zeds to go down in a way that feels “better”. I also like finding loot though, so I don’t normally turn down the loot percentage, but I believe this is a good idea (as mentioned above) personally, the solution I have come up with to make the game feel more “survival” and less “dungeon crawler” is to do everything in my power to make the “early game” last as long as possible. So I play modded games. to do this, I have found this kind of works: - load in as many mods as you can that cripple the player (high infection rates, small backpack size, increase darkness of nighttime, punish punish punish!) - load in as many mods as you can to add as much content as possible. The point of this is to break the “I know how everything works” concept as well as to dilute the loot tables a lot. - load in as many zed mods as possible to make them faster, more dangerous, more numerous. Snufkins zed mods, all the creature packs, telrics, etc. - feel free to add as many weapon mods as possible. - load up the compbopack - generate a random map. then play some test games. Maybe to the first horde. Anything that seems to make you “OP”, you either remove that mod or hand tune the mods XML as you see fit. Usually this is just lowering a loot value or dropping a single number. I find if I do this “to make me happy” I have a game so hard (for me) that I literally cannot enter most POI’s for DAYS without the real possibility of dying. I can take on a zed or two, but 3? Likely to die unless I can get high ground. Eventually I am able to take over a POI and build a base and things are a tiny bit easier. And then it’s more survival grind just to take over more POIs. Then horde night hits and I have no ammo, etc. usually in these games I finally get 1 item (like a bicycle/car) and it’s like YESSSs! All over again. Sure, the POIs are all mostly dungeon crawlers, bits it’s much more fun now as they are very dangerous, but I can still kill a “normal” zed with 3-4 well paced hits with a club. But not all zeds are “normal” on day 1, so it’s easy to get hit and suffer. and when I see a “not normal looking vanilla zed”, I usually try to avoid it as it likely is OP and will wipe me out as I literally cannot defeat it with early game weapons. anyway, just throwing this out there. The only other option i can see is to load up any of the mod overhauls and play them, as they are generally harder and more varied, and I recommend this to most people as hand tuning a modded game takes some time.

Since there's no logs posted yet...I'll add some fuel to the fire: I've been playing for years and sometimes I've had weird issues with the game that were very similar to this (game loads then crashes). I'm not going to include all of the issues I've seen as not all of them match OP's situatio/description perfectly, but the culprit in one case ended up being: The OS/Auto patching loaded a slightly newer graphics driver. The graphics driver update had something weird about it that caused issues like this. "Nothing changed"... except yeah the system patched and apparently I got that new graphics driver. I'm using NVIDIA. The solution was to reinstall a slightly older graphics driver and turn off auto-update. After a few months an even newer graphics driver came out and I haven't had issues since. So, it was literally a single patch/version of the driver that caused issues.

As someone from Oklahoma, the flannel over the shirt and the smile both marks him as Canadian. The horse (also obviously Canadian) is even smiling,

From what I’ve heard, there will be no zombie kids, per decision/design so the game will be more sellable (or not be banned in some places?). I’ve tried making the normal zeds smaller with scaling and it looks bad, like it doesn’t look right (face is too adult, they”re all wearing adult clothes) You can scale them down a little but not even teenager size. They all start looking like they’re dressed up for Halloween :). The rotted corpses/crawlers may be the only exception to this rule for scaling them down and looking ok, IMHO. for “corpses laying around”, yeah, they are not “everywhere” (which would be cool, IMHO, as land decor, like rocks are today, but they are here and there in POIs. I would actually love to see some POi’s that are just big corpse piles, and some burn pits (one exists in a military poi with body bags... but I mean bigger. Like a corpse dump maze). Anyway, this leads to the real point of my post: I have seen in the XML files (so it can be modded) but I forget which file (spawning.xml?) a config that appears to be a setting for spawning volumes and “corpse chance”. It appears today to all be set to “0” , meaning no corpses, I guess? I have not tested it but I wonder if it were set to a higher number you would get either more “regular corpses” spawning in a POi spawn volume or (probably more likely?) some zeds would spawn in “already dead”? maybe I’m completely wrong, just some setting I think I remember seeing in a19.4 when Going through the XML. Maybe spawning.xml? I’m not at my pc right now to check or test

None of these are very likely not going to be in the vanilla game, but there are several "games" using mods and server side add ons: - I have a mod with checkers, soduku, tic tac toe? (I forget ) and chess. All of mine use containers as the board. All were just for fun and also to "collect them all" - I've seen like... 3? other "chess" mods, and I think a checkers mod as well. Some of these use special game blocks, and you have to create the board out of blocks. - There's some gambling machines (A Snufkins mod?). literally putting in tokens and pulling the lever, with payout chances. - For server side, it seems a lot of servers have a "lotto" of sorts, where they do item giveaways, or for in game currency ( separate from Duke casino tokens). This is not the standard "gimmie" command on servers to just give you an item every now and then. I believe some of these require you to be a paying player on the server though, but you could always run your own via a server manager. - For "larger games" Gnamod "horde mode" has you defend a beacon, and Snufkin has a mod that's kinda like Fortnite.

If you can’t fill in the gap, make a ramp And jump over the gap! Bridge repair: complete.

So let it be written. So let it be done. Ohmmmmmmmm......

AH HA! well, not so much, but I was able to load all your mods and replicate your indexOutOfRangerException after a bit of fighting with it, and saw something really weird that might explain the "negative amounts" but I could mot replicate the negative amounts. But what I see is enough I think, to form a hypothesis...or a wild ass guess anyways... and thanks for providing screenshots! Short answer: I will remove/decom/deactivate the 1Million forge mod for a19, and no one should use it or attempt to make another . There are oddities beyond my understanding and I do not want to have a mod capable of causing issues like this on its own. Until someone can explain what is happening, its going to have to be put aside. If you're going to remove the mod from an existing game (probably a good idea, unless you can start the game over without the mod), I *highly suggest* doing these FIRST: 1. Make a backup of your game files. 2. Any forge that has (or had?) > 30,000 of resources in a slot, dump the forge resources to get it under 30,000 3. Maybe even safer? If the forge block is "bugged" (hard to say if its isolated to the forge block), it may be even safer to completely dump the contents of all resources in the forge, then *destroy* the forge. you could likely just craft a lot of forged iron, etc, then dump whatever extra is in there. 4. Exit the game, all the way to Steam. 5. Then remove the MeanCloud__ForgesHold1M mod I have not tested trying to remove this mod, just this is what I would try personally! Longer answer/thoughts (should anyone want my thoughts): 1. The mod is a 1 line mod, just changing the "stack size" of the base "unit_iron" from 30,000 to 1,000,000. all other forge unit materials extend from this. Its so simple, there's really nothing to "fix" in it even if I could. 2. Because #1, the issue likely resides inside the game not liking a number higher than 30,000 3. Delving deeper, for whatever reason, in vanilla TFP has 2 forge slots, and the stack size of the forge "units" is hardcoded to 30,000. 30,000 is not a special number, but ....its awfully close (under it specifically) to the positive standard or "short" signed integer value of 32,767. There are 2 slots... which turns into 60,000...and the unsigned integer value closest to that is of 65,535.... so maybe TFP make the hardcoded value 30,000 because its a nice round value AND a. 2x of this (because of 2 forge slots) fits under (inside) an unsigned integer value of 65,535. b. Maybe not "a". Maybe because each individual slot fits under 32,767. 4. Its impossible to tell or imagine at this point... but anyways... a. You were able to get a negative value in your forge. b. I was testing and added > 32,767 of clay to my forge...and it works fine (Appears to work fine). I logged out, shut down the game. Started game back up and ... my forge had some weird value less than what I put in (like 23,343....but it was not negative!). But this does show that that game is capable of "removing" forge contents after a restart....maybe something was trying to store a larger number and some bits got cut off/rounded in the process... I then added > 65,535 clay to my forge ( like ~100k), and repeated the shutdown/restart process...I got the indexOutOfRangerException AND my forge had completely disappeared! So: My *complete and utter guess* is that inside the game somewhere, TFP has allocated an integer (signed or unsigned) to store a forge slot value or to do some math with it. Normally its not an issue because they hardcoded the value to be allow no more than 30,000. Then, somewhere else, either a different data type is used that allows it to go "higher"... maybe.. or something is happening to cast the value back and forth between the internals of the game and the UI... or maybe its part of the "saving the player map" process that shrinks/corrupts the value.... I have literally no idea, but for whatever reason, you can put in "a lot" (like 1 million) in the forge, and something, somewhere does not expect this and it appears it doesn't show up until the game is saved + restarted (from my testing). Maybe in multiplayer it causes other issues or behaves differently. The end result is: The max forge units for whatever reason, may cause "unstability" to go above a certain number, at least in a19. This mod was developed for a18 originally (maybe earlier?) so maybe things have changed inside the game since then and it is no longer suitable for a19+. I have tested it before and didn't get these results, but then again, I wasn't doing testing this deeply nor had specific mods to mimic the system having issues. Special thanks to @cereza1985for bringing this to my attention, and providing more information to replicate! There have been some earlier reports of issues with this mod and I was unable to replicate at that time on my system, and the game versions have changed as well (and mods, etc) so it appears the earlier reports may also have been valid for earlier a19 game versions.

Here's a forge with ~1,000,00 clay (it smelts the fastest), below one with ~450,000 iron as well. - When I try to add more clay, it just blinks and doesnt go to 1million - I'm getting nor console errors, or other in game issues besides "when smelting with teh super bellows it hangs badly and I cannot do anything until its done" My guess: This might be something related to multiplayer, and the faster bellows, and everyone's PC power. Maybe something isn't' syncing well. Another recommendation: start a new game (yeah, I know) and DO NOT load the 1M Forge mod. See if you have issues smelting with the other mods. I'm almost betting its the faster bellows+everything else pushing something over the tipping point, or some other mod that's not obvious causing an issue. The game does appear to allow going up to ~1.000.000 smelted units, and does not crash/error when more is attempted to be added. I know this isn't probably what you were hoping, but I'm not easily able to reproduce your console error and other issues (besides forge causing severe lag) so can't really figure out what it could be Another idea: go into your saved game files, into the specific save game, then into "ConfigsDump" folder. Look in the "items.xml" file and search for an XML node/block named this: <item name="unit_iron"> and post that XML block here )a block is everything in between the <item name="unit_iron"> .... post everything here....</item> Then, do the same thing with "blocks.xml" except search for <block name="forge"> Also: Looking in the XML, it appears there may be a "Buff" called "CraftingSmeltTime", which I'm taking to mean "any mod can add an item that will buff the Crafting Smelt Time, usually when you wear or hold the item, or eat something to add that buff". This might ramp up the effect of the bellows... so maybe its >1 mod you have loaded that's "super fast smelting time" doing something in addition to the bellows?

Update: With the "bellows multiplier" turned up higher, I find some resources (like 6k iron stacks, loaded in all 3 slots) really make my system, freeze up for awhile. Others, like clay, or forged iron (smaller stacks?) do not seem to be as bad. Anyway, removing the bellows from the forge solves the "game freeze" issue while teh forge is processing all those resources Update: FPS drops (down to 1 FPS, from ~50FPS before the forge was turned on) only occur if I'm watching the forge menus as it smelts

Update: I changed the "faster bellows" to be "even faster" as I'm not going to wait forever to get to 1,000,000 iron. The bellows mod makes the multiplier -.777, and I changed it to -.999 When I did this, the forge gobbles up a full 6k stack in like 3 seconds, and during that time I cannot interact with the forge ( can't even add more iron ion another slot). I turned the forge off, added 3, 6k stacks and turned it back on and the game froze a bit, but it DID keep working, just really janky and erratic, until it was all smelted So, maybe a mod made the multiplier "higher" (in some place) than the faster bellows allows OR the load on your PC is high and the current "extra smelt time" is too much for your system to handle? There is a way to check some of this. Maybe in mulitplayer if this load happens it causes other issues? Another thing to test would be to remove the bellows from the forge (removing the modded speed multiple effect), leaving all mods installed and alone. Anyway, still testing,.

I'll keep testing on my side and see what happens when i get around that, and go higher. -18k is weird... also: I updated my post I think as you were posting so there's some more info in there

@cereza1985I added all 3 mods (and looked at the mods) and I'm not seeing an obvious conflict. Additionally, in a test game, with just these 3 mods in singleplayer, I can use the forge normally while its smelting clay and iron, and I get no red console errors either. Do you have any idea "about how much" clay/iron you had in the forge? I do worry that TFP may have put some internal limit on how much can go in the forge, and 1 Million units goes past that limit. I believe I've tested it to ~300k If there is an issue, it may only be in multiplayer only as well, especially if everyone doesn't have the exact same mods loaded on all their systems (if you are not running a server. These appear all to be server side safe mods, but I'm not sure if you run the game on your desktop as a client, if everyone needs to have the mods loaded). If you can, I would first test removing the faster bellows mod as all it does if speed up smelt time it likely can be removed without issue (make a backup of your game first just in case!). If you're still having issues, it might still be another mod causing collisions. Troubleshooting past this gets difficult. You can try posting your error logs (the last one modified named "output_log..." in the game folder/7DaysToDie_Data), but I cannot guarantee I can look at it and understand anything Also: a page back, I was troubleshooting this same mod (it wasn't smelting past 30,000 units) and it turned out another mod was conflicting. I suggested to make some changes to get this mod to load *after* that conflicting mod and the forge bugged out when smelting clay and like destroyed/corrupted the map/chunk. I never got it figured out, but maybe 1 million units is just too high a number OR some mods, when colliding with something as base an "element" as the "unit_iron" in the game, can cause bad and unintended consequences. There may be a reason TFP capped the limit on how much you can smelt! If I can figure out whats happening, I may have to decom this mod or lower the smelting limit. I'd rather not have weird mods that cause issues with peoples games

Thanks for the input! I'll load them up and test.

I have a few questions;) - What version of the game are you running? - Are you loading any other mods (if so, can you list them)? - How much resources are in your forge? FYI: I have had several people indicate there is an issue with this mod, and not just what you are reporting. I’ve been tracking the issues on GitHub and planned to attempt a fix for all of them in a20, but there are enough reports now that I might try to fix most/all of them for whatever game version most people are running. It seems that some recent updates to the game broke more than this mod, and I have a lot of mods and it’s not easy to test them all every time the game updates. EDIT: I just tested MeanCloud__ForgesHold1M mod on a19.4 b7 (as the only mod loaded) and was unable to reproduce this issue. Forge accessible while smelting iron/clay/etc, no console errors, etc. I did not try to smelt 1,000,000 items with a secondary mod, just noting "basic mod" appears functional. The last major issue with this mod was because another person loaded another forge mod and they did not play together.

I do agree with this, as I really like having “too much to think about” when playing, meaning: so I go get water now, or craft xyz? I’m going to need xyz for something things, but I also need to mine abc for coal.... I like having a ton of stuff to have to manage and find and sell/hoard. Just like I like a lot of crafting stations in order to need to build more rooms/area for a base to handle them. But that’s just my fun way, I know. I kinda wish there were a few more tiers of stuff above what we have today, that were not lootable, and could only be attained after clearing some hurdle/gate in the game. Not just “more powerful gun” but like special traps, or even blocks, recipes, etc. to craft special/niche items. ive never really played sandbox mode in any game besides Factorio, as ... there was so much to try to figure out I actually needed to use it to plan stuff out! Of course, some would argue “but that’s the fun of factorio! Time and resource management under threat of enemy hordes coming at your factory! Don’t use sandbox mode to prebuild blueprints and just and import them”(this would be like making an awesome base in the prefab editor and placing it down on day 1.... which kinda ruins the beginning of the game, IMHO). yeah, there’s so much to do that keeps the fun going after the game has been “won” that I do go back and play factorio quite a bit. I really hope 7d2d is like that when it goes gold: lots of stuff to do so you can play it many times over in different ways/goals and still enjoy it. I think it is/has/will but having “less” (blocks/items/etc) in vanilla than we have today seems hard to imagine right now. I also personally want “more” unique vanilla stuff than we have today. Maybe the TFP goal is to have a lot of simple “mechanics” worked out, just enough content for a normal game, and then hope modders will fill in a lot of unique content. If this is true, I really wish that things like icons/models would be sent to the clients, and several other things were done to beef up modding capabilities. I’ve heard steam workshop might fix these issues a bit.

I wrote up a post on valheim vs 7d2d and chose not to post it, but the gist of it was to (as a 7d2d player who tried valheim) see what 7d2d could improve to make the game more fun/neat. the short answer: not much. Sure there’s a lot of little things that valheim does well (like making chopping down trees fun again) but trying to translate that to something 7d2d could actually (practically? From a non developer perspective) improve upon was not easy. For the tree chopping example, all I could come up with was “7d2d should probably take a branch or two off of the trees and use the triangles to put a bottom/roots on the trees , or leave stumps like valheim does, and make chopping down stumps kinda worthless (like valheim does) so the landscape looks not so flat when you’re done. another example: valheim has “lush looking landscape”. The only possible 7d2d improvement I could come up with was maybe make the grass blocks “scaleable” via mods (so no new blocks) So all the grass isn’t the same height. If you cannot scale it, then add a few taller grass blocks. Maybe add some trees that could spawn “in a fallen state”, at least in the deeper forest. lots of little Stuff, nothing big. I think the love for valheim (other than being new) is that it’s like 7d2d but the graphics are very nostalgic/fun, and it’s fun to build in. Another item is that in valheim, time doesn’t matter. You can take as much time as you want to do whatever, or just hang out and build. In 7d2d, time matters, you can’t easily just do nothing all the time. I think people who love valheim like the grind, or at least “I can pace myself and just enjoy doing my thing”. Of course, you can simply turn off zeds/blood moons in 7d, so it’s kinda a wash. also: one is about Vikings and has really hypnotic music. The other is not about Vikings, and having a music track would be wrong. I personally like the “comes and goes” music in 7d, though I wish it didn’t tell me before I was aware that I was in danger, only triggered after I was being attacked. also: valheims “water” is awesome, and using the boat(s) are their ways of handling grinding/atmosphere. It’s like they wanted you to have to sit on a boat for a long time to bask in peacefulness/danger. But even then, I see all sorts of posts for “why can’t we teleport ores! Sigh! It’s so annoying!” So it’s “good gaming mechanics to make it unique” are just like 7d2d as well , as some players just want to become gods immediately and win the game as fast as possible, choosing to not “become absorbed in the game” and just “get it over with”. I hope both games do not cater to these people, at least in their vanilla version.

Love the beehive mod! Its saved me several times for infection woes on hard games with little antibiotics available.

@ztensity question about the paintings (on my phone, cannot look): are they (or can they) be put into the random vanilla painting helper group, so on a new RWG world they would appear in all the POi’s? I would assume this would work, or maybe something about “painting block rotation” would mess this up. curious if you knew the answer already. I can test this weekend for you if it’s not immediately known. I’m not super big on crafting art for my (always ramshackle and crap) base but I dislike having the same 4-5 art pieces in every POi

Actually... this got me thinking... I've seen younger (e.g under 18) kids try to play games I recommend to them and I’ve seen them give up immediately when things turn out they are not OP immediately. Of course, these are family/relatives, and I’m trying to keep them from being bored, and I’m the older person, and these are not “gamer” kids.... but yeah, I think the basic phone games taught them that that’s all games are, and they never get immersed or spend time on anything that takes up any time. Games are for 5 min distractions, not days of playing the same game. It is likely also because of the huge game variety these days, everyone just jumps around barely playing anything (“li have 1 hour to burn, let’s try 7d2d!... man, that was boring nothing happened. How about rocket league!”) and rarely “gets pulled in” to a game they personally love. Yeah, not everyone likes every game type, or has time, etc. ... anyway, this reminded me of Diablo 3? Where when you start out, you can see this “locked” massive progression tree of “this makes the game harder”. It’s not like 3 levels, it’s like 10+... and it keeps going! Maybe, instead of having “nomad” and “adventurer” and the few obvious difficulty settings, the “default” is actually the easiest/lowest, And then add more default difficulty settings. Maybe 6-8 total? this would make the “first time player” (more importantly, the “non or super casual gamer”) feel like they are not going to have to set it to “boring baby mode” to play/learn (and might just walk away without trying) as the default will actually be a super low difficulty bar, and everyone can see “there’s a lot of levels to ramp this up to”, so maybe experienced players will immediately sett it off of the low default, and pick “something in the middle, as I am already a master player” but also won’t easily be able to jack it up to “insane” when they start playing because it will literally be insane, vs now it seems a lot of streamers can play this mode. I think “insane” should almost be unplayable unless you learn to run and hide a lot, fighting 1 zed at a time.