12 years and THIS is the big 1.0?

[Orclover]

9 hours ago, Outlaw_187 said:

I want the topless stripper RETURNED.........

 

 

Honestly I was more annoyed by the removal of the topless strippers than water jars.  But jars was a close second.  Welcome to the end of the world, we took away all the containers to hold water "MWYAHAHAHAHA"

[Catdaddy]

What we need is topless water jars. Then we will spill half of it on the way back home. For immersion.😜

[Roland]

5 hours ago, CVenton said:

"big 1.0" was supposed to include a Launch Party and some sort of VIP thing and we obviously didnt back those tiers but my friend is asking about the map he did pay for it was a long time ago so maybe they canceled it?

I don’t know much about the Kickstarter pledges as I got involved after the game came to Steam. I can only assume that the map isn’t finalized yet. The map is supposed to be of Navezgane and they won’t finalize it until the story is done. The Duke’s HQ and Noah’s HQ haven’t been added yet and there will surely be some rearranging of POIs and even possibly cities. They could have sent out a poster map years back and then people would complain that it doesn’t match the final version and accuse TFP of taking the lazy way out. 
 

This is just conjecture though. The best way is to contact them directly by email or through the help desk. 

Edited July 26 by Roland (see edit history)

[rateds2k]

19 hours ago, Verdigriss said:

"Oh, this place looks safe."
   "No, the zombies will tear through brick walls and steel doors with their bare hands on horde night.  You need to construct a maze with an open path to you and fill it with traps."

 

You can stand on top of almost any small poi and even last out the Day 21 horde.

"Oh, a lake, that'll be a good source of water."
    "No, bodies of water have nothing to do with ...water, you need to build dew collectors using a part only provided by the local trader."

Don't need anything from the trader.

"I need to buy a part to collect basic survival resources?"
    "Yes."
No
 

 

[Riamus]

3 hours ago, Cr0wst0rm said:

Then why calling it 1.0 and not alpha 22?

Hey, I complained about the change when they first announced it, too.  Heh.  The most likely reason (they aren't going to confirm or deny it) is that either Microsoft or Sony (or both) required them to have it out of early access in order to publish to console.  So 1.0 is most likely just a sticker for console but it's still really A22.  It isn't gold and won't be gold for about 2 years when they finish the roadmap.

[Scyris]

4 hours ago, Adam the Waster said:

Probably just so they can sell it on consoles

 

Thats exactly why actually, some red tape with sony/ms ceritifcation required them to place a false 1.0 sticker on it so it can come out on consoles. As usual consoles ruin things as alot of the dumbing down and poor gameplay decisions were most likely done for console players.

[Ncredible1201]

Mining helmet doesn't work as a light without a mod? No glass jars anymore to fill with water? What kind of survival game are y'all making here? What numb nut in your team is saying "remove all the survival features and make this an arcade game. @%$#ing trash development here.

[BFT2020]

On 7/26/2024 at 4:20 PM, Scyris said:

 

Thats exactly why actually, some red tape with sony/ms ceritifcation required them to place a false 1.0 sticker on it so it can come out on consoles. As usual consoles ruin things as alot of the dumbing down and poor gameplay decisions were most likely done for console players.

 

TFP is a PC gaming company so 7 Days to Die is made for the PC.  Porting to console is only possible if the hardware allows it.  They have done some optimization performance wise to improve both the PC game and the console, but I haven't seen a single decision made that was solely for console players.

[REDDEV1L24]

Can we not forget though that this game isn't the height of realism anyway. Remember, you can carry a 4x4, Gyrocopter, motorbike minibike and bicycle plus multiple stacks of 8000 rocks, iron, lead etc and make ak47s out of duct tape and carry it all around in your backpack. 

[Riamus]

On 7/28/2024 at 10:02 AM, Ncredible1201 said:

Mining helmet doesn't work as a light without a mod?

A mining helmet that doesn't have a light installed in it will not work as a light in real life either. 

[BFT2020]

2 hours ago, Riamus said:

A mining helmet that doesn't have a light installed in it will not work as a light in real life either. 

Yeah imagine that, you actually have to purchase the mounting kit and light separately……

[Riamus]

5 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

Yeah imagine that, you actually have to purchase the mounting kit and light separately……

The helmet light mod could also simply be a light bulb. 

[pahbi]

I had hoped 1.0 would at least have the story elements.

 

 

[InfiniteWarrior]

On 7/25/2024 at 5:28 PM, Verdigriss said:

The devs indeed make the game they want...

Controversial and touchy subject, I know, but I picked the game back up with A21 and immediately noticed the division in the community over old and new systems. I wasn't familiar with the water bottle collection system, etc. as I hadn't played it since it first hit Steam. It soon became obvious that there was a tug of war going on between the devs and a minority of players who "exploit" systems the very same as a minority "exploited" Skyrim's systems by spending their precious lifetime crafting hundreds of iron daggers to artificially inlfate their smithing skill.

Well, originally, I'm sure it was a pretty creative feedback loop. Players would come up with some creative solution to a problem and TFP would institute a way to thwart it, e.g. tunneling zombies, likely making the game a much better game in the process. Players inspiring devs and vice versa. Lately though, I get the impression its become highly detrimental, someone actually describing it as a "death spiral" for the game. Honestly, I'd have to go along with that. Far too much attention is being paid to coming up with ways to minimize resources to practically nothing, imo, supposedly to make the game more challenging or difficult when my experience with it since picking it up with A21 has been tedium and drudgery for the most part, especially early game.

I've extensively tested it with and without mods such as the jar mod that reinstitutes the bottle collection system and, now that I've tried that mod out, guaranteed I wouldn't play the game at all without it myself, not so that I could have an infinite supply of glue but because it's way more fun and immersive, for lack of a better term, than the dew collector system, which now requires yet more expensive mods to produce a decent supply even of drinking and cooking water. The reason for the change is obvious, but the simple fact is the vast majority of players won't be playing it to "exploit" its systems. Speaking of exploits, speed runners accomplish their speed runs by learning, knowing inside-out and "exploiting" a game's systems and bugs. By the same token, players who choose to craft hundreds of iron daggers to artificially inflate their smithing skill will find ways to turn any kind of system TFP chooses to implement to their advantage. Meanwhile, people who just want to just kick back, relax and enjoy the game are being penalized for what said minority is doing.

They'll change the systems. They'll change the systems again. In fact, I imagine they'll be changing the systems for the duration of the game's lifetime because I honestly don't think they get that. Rather, I get the distinct impression, they're watching how streamers and YouTubers min-max the game and are designing the game around those min-max playstyles, which harms its appeal to the wider audience they might otherwise have aboard.

 

[n2n1]

On 7/26/2024 at 12:20 AM, Riamus said:

/// And developers make the game they want.  ///

 

Don 't be ridiculous . Joel and the people who "had a light burning in their chest" are no longer working on the game. They themselves said that they want the game to be understandable and accessible to "everyone" - that is, there is a  justification/stupefying of the gameplay. They just do what is in demand.

[gamerpaddy]

anyone remember making rebar frames, covering them with wood and pouring concrete then wait til it solidifies before it became stable?

or farm plots on soil which you can fertilize for more yield

or dead zombie corpses you need to get rid of to stop others from climbing ontop or slow you down

 

its way too simplified since the first console port, let alone today.

 

 

[Suxar]

2 hours ago, InfiniteWarrior said:

I wasn't familiar with the water bottle collection system, etc. as I hadn't played it since it first hit Steam.

The game has been on Steam for quite some time.

[Krougal]

3 hours ago, n2n1 said:

Don 't be ridiculous . Joel and the people who "had a light burning in their chest" are no longer working on the game. They themselves said that they want the game to be understandable and accessible to "everyone" - that is, there is a  justification/stupefying of the gameplay. They just do what is in demand.

Yeah, it is an overused argument by whiteknighters.

The fact is anybody who is in this to make a living is making the game they think the consumers want.

There is a name for the guy who makes the game HE wants; starving artist.

 

I don't understand the people who feel the need to try to shut down people giving feedback just because they disagree and feel like everyone needs to be nice to everyone else all the time. To me they are ruder douchebags than the person they are criticizing and hypocrites to boot. Part of the early access agreement is that the devs are supposed to take feedback from players. Good or bad.

 

Yes, most of us who have been around a while have gotten a lot of hours of enjoyment out of the game. It is still under development. That means it should still be open to feedback. We will stop complaining when we stop caring.

 

Anyway, being an early dew collector hater (and I still think it is stupid that we can't get dirty water from water sources) I have to say in 1.0 with all the upgrades it is quite nice. I only even have 1 and I haven't made use of my ability to get water from modlet since the first week. I haven't looked at the recipes lately, but I suspect they got a balancing pass and use less glue now, will see when I start cranking out T3 QL6 gear.

Edited August 5 by Krougal (see edit history)

[InfiniteWarrior]

3 hours ago, Suxar said:

The game has been on Steam for quite some time.

Yes, I know. It was gifted me by a friend on Steam. I played it for few hours and uninstalled it. Just struck me as impossible without friends also playing it with you and that particular friend was more into WoW at the time. Heard good things about A21 and decide to give it another try. I started and restarted the game, essentially due to the tedium and drudgery experience. Then I realized, "Hey. This is an alpha so test it like its an alpha" and have derived most of my own "fun" with the game doing just that: testing the vanilla experience with and without mods and, especially, testing community complaints about it trying to figure out what the big foofaraw is all about when it's a video game for heaven's sake, not a global crisis.

It gets fun for me personally when most of that tedium and drudgery are out of the way and I'm into the fun stuff, which just doesn't even show up until much later in the game. It's not at all surprising to me that everyone I've seen play it blitzes through those teir 1 odd jobs (I refuse to call them "quests") just to get their hands on the bicycle when it doesn't take long to unlock if you're just invested in the vehicle skill, for example. There are so many incrementally increasing skills in the trees, though, it makes no sense to spread your points out thinly enough to cover all that are required just to start having a little fun with the many toys. (And does anyone know why Master Chef is in the strength tree, btw?)

All those timers that can be sped up by spending points in the skill tree have eaten up too much of my own real and precious lifetime. 16 real life minutes to boil a few bottles of virtual tea? Really? Sure, you can do other things if you have the workbenches and skills to do them in the meantime, provided RNG is magically on your side, but early game has involved an awful lot of just drumming my fingers on the desk and rolling my eyes.

If TFP really want to appeal to a wider audience, they'll streamline those skill trees so overspecialization isn't a concern. Otherwise, mods, mods and more mods and/or don't play the game at all are the way to go, afic. There is no in between. I think there's a great, bare gameplay loop there, but that's about it thus far. Ergo, I can't and don't in good conscience recommend it to anyone else, though I honestly hope it succeeds beyond TFP's wildest expectations because there's an old school charm to it I find immensely appealing myself.

Edited August 5 by InfiniteWarrior (see edit history)

[InfiniteWarrior]

46 minutes ago, Krougal said:

being an early dew collector hater (and I still think it is stupid that we can't get dirty water from water sources) I have to say in 1.0 with all the upgrades it is quite nice.

I can envision those particular systems working side by side. It'd take a good deal of balancing, but most of the balancing is already in place, methinks, considering how hard it is to come by the mods for them. I'd eliminate the possibility of crafting jars. Players who choose to use them will wind up with enough just getting them back after the avatar drinks. They're consumed when making glue, which makes sense. Why would anyone want to drink from a water bottle with glue residue in it?  There should be more ways than just the vendors to get those mods, though. I think I've surprisingly picked up a filter looting a destroyed dew collector only once in hundreds of hours of gameplay, so that's probably a little too rare an occurence. Some prominent players are talking about making a mod to craft the mods for the dew collector. Provided the necessary items are sufficiently scarce, that would make jar collection more viable in the meantime and both camps of the controversy would be satisfied.

[n2n1]

1 hour ago, Krougal said:

///

The fact is anybody who is in this to make a living is making the game they think the consumers want.

There is a name for the guy who makes the game HE wants; starving artist.

////

 

Well, at least decide - what are they doing?
Are "developers make the game they want" (as he put it earlier) or are trying to make money?

Edited August 5 by n2n1 (see edit history)

[meganoth]

If we compare with the movie industry: 3rd rate directors and actors need to take every job they get offered to make a living. But Kubrick, Spielberg, Villeneuve, Cameron or actors like Tom Cruise or Tom Hanks, they do movies they want. Sure, they all want their movie to be liked and successful, and they might even make compromises for that, or not.

 

I would guess this here is similar. 7D2D was successful enough that they could continue to make the game they want. Obviously they for example implemented features to make it easier for new players, like the intro quests, but intro quests can be ignored. They made default difficulty quite easy, but there are other difficulty settings they themselves might find right.

 

On the whole they still could be making the game they want to play themselves but also compromise to make the game more appealing to everyone. Not all questions have a clear answer of yes and no.

 

 

Edited August 5 by meganoth (see edit history)

[Krougal]

2 hours ago, meganoth said:

On the whole they still could be making the game they want to play themselves but also compromise to make the game more appealing to everyone. Not all questions have a clear answer of yes and no.

It's generally a compromise. My point though was that it shouldn't matter one way or another when we are sharing our feedback on games. I am sick of hearing "well it's the devs game and they will make it how they want and not to suit you" yeah, yeah, we all know that. It is a really pointless statement.  Those same people still tend to think their opinions are always somehow more valid than everyone elses.

 

Here isn't so bad compared to some other games on Steam,  where the rabid fanbois will jump on you in a heartbeat "How dare you make a suggestion that the devs precious time might be taken away from something I consider more important. "

 

[meganoth]

14 minutes ago, Krougal said:

It's generally a compromise. My point though was that it shouldn't matter one way or another when we are sharing our feedback on games. I am sick of hearing "well it's the devs game and they will make it how they want and not to suit you" yeah, yeah, we all know that. It is a really pointless statement.  Those same people still tend to think their opinions are always somehow more valid than everyone elses.

 

Here isn't so bad compared to some other games on Steam,  where the rabid fanbois will jump on you in a heartbeat "How dare you make a suggestion that the devs precious time might be taken away from something I consider more important. "

 

 

I agree this is too simple an answer. Though I think if something is eventually a dead-horse topic maybe nobody has the energy anymore to cite reasons why a chance has been made or why it could be beneficial to the game. Sometimes bringing up reasons is ignored anyway even though words like "There was absolutely no reason to..." started the discussion. Mistakes and tempers flaring happen on both sides of the divide.

 

 

[Riamus]

8 hours ago, n2n1 said:

Don 't be ridiculous . Joel and the people who "had a light burning in their chest" are no longer working on the game. They themselves said that they want the game to be understandable and accessible to "everyone" - that is, there is a  justification/stupefying of the gameplay. They just do what is in demand.

 

Not sure what you're even trying to say here.  "The developers" in what I said include anyone in charge of the development process and even though Joel isn't still doing the active development, I'm sure he still says yes or no to things.  Also, developing the game that they want can include being accessible to everyone or being something players will like while still sticking to an overall design goal that they like.  Just about every design choice (like removing LBD) will have people who like it and people who don't.  They aren't going to please everyone and shouldn't try.  They can either just stick to what they want, or they can compromise some, or they can make something they feel more people will want.  But each of these is a choice based on how they want to develop the game.  I didn't say they will make the game the same way they originally envisioned it.  Plans change.  They'll see how people play and adjust their plans accordingly.  But in each case, they will still make decisions based on what they want to do (even if it's a compromise or a change based on feedback).  They aren't required to make a game that any given player wants.

 

4 hours ago, Krougal said:

I don't understand the people who feel the need to try to shut down people giving feedback just because they disagree and feel like everyone needs to be nice to everyone else all the time. To me they are ruder douchebags than the person they are criticizing and hypocrites to boot. Part of the early access agreement is that the devs are supposed to take feedback from players. Good or bad.

 

It may sound like that and maybe even some posts do that, but it goes both ways and more often in the direction of the person who hates something shutting down the person who likes it rather than in the way you're meaning.  I just recently had a reply to my thoughts about a topic that complained because I was giving an opinion.  Of course I was giving an opinion.  But because I disagreed, they complained about it because they didn't want to hear a different opinion.  Just because someone disagrees doesn't mean they are "shutting down" anyone.  Do some posts go too far?  Sure.  But the majority are just giving peoples thoughts on a topic.  And just because someone supports a particular design choice or change doesn't invalidate their opinion.    Am I wrong because I think that the changes for 1.0 are overall good changes?  Am I wrong because I hate LBD or think magazines are at least okay, though they could use some more work?  Am I wrong because I was happy jars were removed?  Of course not.  And neither is the person who has the opposite opinions.