The game should become more hardcore

[pregnable]

Yeah, I do not get the OP, and some of what they said is incorrect. 

 

I now play on insane, always nightmare run speed, horde every night and 64 zombies... it is like a completely different game.  Only bad thing is now its kinda hard to go back lel. 

 

The only problem is that you need to either go with a no base build(eventually), exploit the zombie ai/pathfinding, find some way to limit base damage, or you use your quest locations as bases for the night.  Otherwise you are just spending all your time farming for the next horde instead of playing the game.

 

You can already make the game pretty hard, heh. 

[uselessjunkaccount]

I question how much the OP has messed with game settings (let alone custom rulesets or mods) if they think the blunderbus is useless and that the bow is all you need early game. 

 

But I would like to see the game become more hardcore. It'd be great if the game's meta would still be constantly evolving like it used to. But this was always going to happen at some point, wasn't it? That the game was just going to get refined and little things added and removed to bring a polished product? Personally I wish TFP would get to gold at some point and start work on another game because I really like their style but am burnt out on this one. Been seven years now, the vast vast majority of games would have gone gold already and we're still in alpha. 

[SylenThunder]

On 10/30/2020 at 1:13 PM, IDNeon said:

I've been running continuous insane hordes for 30 minutes straight, albeit right now I'm only GS 34 in my new base build design.

but 0 deaths so far.

We have changed it now to keeping only the toolbelt.

 

[babspsol]

Hilarious thing about this thread is a lot of people claiming to be awesome hardcore players still use the trader. The trader is the most OP broken thing in this game to the point that if you using one, you are not playing a survival game and have no right to talk about how hardcore you are, but go ahead, enjoy your faceroll RPG. If I wanted to increase difficulty, the first thing I would do is to remove the trader. It is just crazy that the trader removes the need to find food, weapons and vehicles and completely bypasses the gamescore gating. All you gotta do is keep grinding those quests and wait for the RNG every 3 days to gift you nice stuff, unlock more traders and you got even more RNG coming out of Trader Loot Pinada, insane.

[Aldranon]

Well, a person cant argue very convincingly against success. 

That 7D2D is up so high on the charts proves that its not a bad game for many people.  At the very least.

 

So the only valid question is what, if anything, can be improved?  If in fact, it IS an improvement.

 

Problem? #1

Currently, after game options are set, the games level of difficulty for each individual player usually stays the same throughout the game.  Getting key weapons and skills changes the games difficulty somewhat.  As does the introduction of stronger opponents.

 

Possible improvements:

-Being able to have a curve to the current flat-ish difficulty arc as the game progresses.  One possible solution would be to disconnect Game-Stage from the quality of loot. 

 

[FranticDan]

I wanted the game to be more hardcore and have more survival, so I decided to make an overhaul mod where I nerfed everything but stay true to the vanilla experience. Now I can't go back to pure vanilla.

[Aldranon]

Problem? #2

Currently, sealed loot containers can have an extreme variance of quality, due in part to the prolific placement of them.  This makes finding one less exciting than they should be.

 

Possible improvements: 

-Sealed loot containers should never appear in tier 1 or 2 POI's and rarely in Tier 3 POI's.

-This would include having "polymorphic" loot locations that have a possibility of being several loot containers, rubbish heaps or the rare sealed loot container..

-Finding a sealed loot container should have a celebratory feeling associated with them as the loot should be always good. 

[Maharin]

On 12/9/2020 at 2:03 AM, Aldranon said:

Problem? #2

Currently, sealed loot containers can have an extreme variance of quality, due in part to the prolific placement of them.  This makes finding one less exciting than they should be.

 

Possible improvements: 

-Sealed loot containers should never appear in tier 1 or 2 POI's and rarely in Tier 3 POI's.

-This would include having "polymorphic" loot locations that have a possibility of being several loot containers, rubbish heaps or the rare sealed loot container..

-Finding a sealed loot container should have a celebratory feeling associated with them as the loot should be always good. 

 

I'm pretty sure #2 already happens (sort of), at least with substitutes for trader satchels.

 

As for #3... you'll find a whole lot of different opinions as to what loot is "good" and when.

[Aldranon]

3 hours ago, Maharin said:

 

As for #3... you'll find a whole lot of different opinions as to what loot is "good" and when.

True, but I was thinking about stone tools and exactly what is in a sealed loot container.  Early game, to me they are so bad, I feel a bit trolled by the Devs.  Some people will find even contrary concepts enjoyable, but one should look at what a sane person might think is reasonable.  Otherwise ANY discourse is pointless. 

 

Edit: Then again, if they were level 6 stone tools, I'd  be pretty happy early game!

 

[meganoth]

9 hours ago, Aldranon said:

True, but I was thinking about stone tools and exactly what is in a sealed loot container.  Early game, to me they are so bad, I feel a bit trolled by the Devs.  Some people will find even contrary concepts enjoyable, but one should look at what a sane person might think is reasonable.  Otherwise ANY discourse is pointless. 

 

Edit: Then again, if they were level 6 stone tools, I'd  be pretty happy early game!

 

You mean a sane person who rejoices at finding a tactical assault rifle that does 57 damage when the current one only does 56. But scoffs at a stone axe that does 15 damage instead of his old one that does 13? 😉

 

[Aldranon]

47 minutes ago, meganoth said:

You mean a sane person who rejoices at finding a tactical assault rifle that does 57 damage when the current one only does 56. But scoffs at a stone axe that does 15 damage instead of his old one that does 13? 😉

 

Well, you're missing the point.

Someone sealed a container after putting something in it and then shipped it off.

Would they do that with a stone axe that, apparently, anyone can make? Or something that's more valuable? 

 

It is about a game reality that is very inconsistent right now.  Unless the player is "actually" in a coma throughout 7D2D part 1 and then in Part2 wakes up to... almost anything.  That could be interesting.   But so far, I'm concerned that the game will remain somewhat vapid.

 

[meganoth]

31 minutes ago, Aldranon said:

Well, you're missing the point.

Someone sealed a container after putting something in it and then shipped it off.

Would they do that with a stone axe that, apparently, anyone can make? Or something that's more valuable? 

 

It is about a game reality that is very inconsistent right now.  Unless the player is "actually" in a coma throughout 7D2D part 1 and then in Part2 wakes up to... almost anything.  That could be interesting.   But so far, I'm concerned that the game will remain somewhat vapid.

 

Granted it might be a very conspicuous inconsistency to many people, but there are hundreds of other inconsistencies that you either just accept ore are used to from other games.

 

Just one example: Isn't it strange that you can never loot armor from armored zombies? We can craft gasoline but not remove bits of zombie brain from a helmet? Except if they drop a lot bag in which you might find ... a duster. Huh? I'll leave it at that, we can find lots of similar inconsistencies we just accept as lore now, maybe after some initial fuss

 

But lets get back to the inconsistency we are talking about: Once upon a time in a far away land a TFP developer called the sealed containers shipping containers and offered the narrative that that was stuff that was shipped to homes before the apocalypse.

 

How come there are so many shipped but unopened containers? Did the whole country simultaneously buy weapons, tools, car parts on day X-1, get it delivered on day X, and before anyone could open them, Arizona was completely overrun by zombies? THERE IS A ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE AND NOBODY OPENS THE FRESHLY DELIVERED WEAPON BOXES??? That just doesn't work in so many ways. But you would prefer that because it would make sense?

 

Let me answer that: No, it doesn't. Loot in this game (as in most other games) does not really make sense, but you have to accept it as neccessary ingredient to have fun with lots of looting. Don't think about the sealed containers or who sealed them, there is no explanation for those sealed containers that ultimately makes sense.

 

 

[Maharin]

12 hours ago, Aldranon said:

Edit: Then again, if they were level 6 stone tools, I'd  be pretty happy early game!

 

They should at least be level 3 stone tools and above in the early game stages.  Finding a level 2 stone tool isn't exactly a point of celebration by anyone, ever.  Honestly, I think level 1 iron tools should be more of a possibility early on, too.