My issue(s) with Farm Plots

[dex314]

I searched the forums and didn't see another post, so here's my take on farm plots. It's unnecessary gate-keeping. In the early game sometimes finding a few seeds is a godsend when setting up your first shack. Requiring nitrate (25 each plot when u only find it 5 at a time in houses) and rotten meat just means you can't plant the first seeds you find. It's a nuisance. Furthermore it decreases the granularity of the game where you can plant a few seeds in random patches of dirt you find on a cliffside, or what not. Early survival is meant to be scrappy--a few scraggly crops here, a random pig there. But, if you can only plant seeds once you hit another gateway, even though there is dirt EVERYWHERE, by the time you can actually do it that sense of desperation has already passed.

 

Why don't we make farm plots for specific special crops, like drug plants etc? It makes no sense not to be able to take a seed and shove it in the ground where seeds have been rumored to grow for the last 11 million years.

[Maynard69]

Just going to respond to the gameplay part, as I dont believe realism is an argument in this instance. (I will try to refrain from pointing out that everything I have ever tried to plant in my fertile looking yard has always died and I have always lost the seed)

 

There is no gate. You can start day 1 run down the road all over the map collecting rotten meat. While you are doing that you can chop down a couple trees, and harvest any nitrate boulders you see. By the end of the day (or two) you will be ready for farming.

 

Or you can go search towns for POI's with up to 20 pre-intalled farm plots, take them over and start planting with no gathering needed.

[dex314]

Just going to respond to the gameplay part, as I dont believe realism is an argument in this instance. (I will try to refrain from pointing out that everything I have ever tried to plant in my fertile looking yard has always died and I have always lost the seed)

 

There is no gate. You can start day 1 run down the road all over the map collecting rotten meat. While you are doing that you can chop down a couple trees, and harvest any nitrate boulders you see. By the end of the day (or two) you will be ready for farming.

 

Or you can go search towns for POI's with up to 20 pre-intalled farm plots, take them over and start planting with no gathering needed.

 

It's not that I am using realism as an argument, it's more a matter of immersion. There has to be some proximity to real life elements otherwise the game is too detached from human experience (obviously im not talking about zombies etc). That said, it's good to hear you feel that way. My experience so far after 2 days of playing is I only have 30 nitrate (compared to lvl 2 steel tools, some military armor and a lvl 6 AK). It's possible my area has 0 nitrate boulders, and since I have only been able to loot it, the process has been slow. If I cannot plant more than 1 seed because my area has 0 nitrate but 10000000 blocks of dirt, something is very awry. This is really a perfect example of gate-keeping.

[Synvastian]

nitrate is in every gore pile, is fairly common in trash and loot, boulders are common, bodybags in military camps, hospitals and funeral homes

 

rotten meat is super abundant

 

(I dare say I could have some farm plots, and not just 2 or 3, faster than I could have ever found a hoe in A17)

[dex314]

nitrate is in every gore pile, is fairly common in trash and loot, boulders are common, bodybags in military camps, hospitals and funeral homes

 

rotten meat is super abundant

 

(I dare say I could have some farm plots, and not just 2 or 3, faster than I could have ever found a hoe in A17)

 

Thanks for the tips Synvastian! I still feel pretty strongly about this, but I'll give it a closer look and see if I can be convinced.

[Maynard69]

It's not that I am using realism as an argument, it's more a matter of immersion. There has to be some proximity to real life elements otherwise the game is too detached from human experience (obviously im not talking about zombies etc). That said, it's good to hear you feel that way. My experience so far after 2 days of playing is I only have 30 nitrate (compared to lvl 2 steel tools, some military armor and a lvl 6 AK). It's possible my area has 0 nitrate boulders, and since I have only been able to loot it, the process has been slow. If I cannot plant more than 1 seed because my area has 0 nitrate but 10000000 blocks of dirt, something is very awry. This is really a perfect example of gate-keeping.

 

Even if your area had zero nitrate boulders (which I doubt but check desert/snow), it is still possible with effort. I dont believe that it naturally happening no matter what you do in every playthrough would be a good thing. It does only take finding 1 nitrate vein to have enough to make an immense farm.

 

However if farming immediately is important to you there is certainly nothing stopping you accomplishing it.

[JaxTeller718]

It's not that I am using realism as an argument, it's more a matter of immersion. There has to be some proximity to real life elements otherwise the game is too detached from human experience (obviously im not talking about zombies etc). That said, it's good to hear you feel that way. My experience so far after 2 days of playing is I only have 30 nitrate (compared to lvl 2 steel tools, some military armor and a lvl 6 AK). It's possible my area has 0 nitrate boulders, and since I have only been able to loot it, the process has been slow. If I cannot plant more than 1 seed because my area has 0 nitrate but 10000000 blocks of dirt, something is very awry. This is really a perfect example of gate-keeping.

 

This game has been moving towards detachment from human experiences since 17. Its easier to assimilate and try to mod it back in then change their minds. The experience is more action oriented and will most likely keep moving in this direction. Crafting and cultivating is no longer a main priority, which works to some degree. I DO miss what we have lost but I have the power to bring it back so i am not that concerned.

[Whorhay]

I'm pretty sure there are PoI's that have farm plots where you could setup your farming. My holdup personally has been finding seeds because I also haven't managed to find the seed recipes, and I'm definitely not perking into Fort just to make seeds. On the up side at least you only ever need to plant your seeds once and then just harvest from it every few days forever.

[Synvastian]

I'm pretty sure there are PoI's that have farm plots where you could setup your farming. My holdup personally has been finding seeds because I also haven't managed to find the seed recipes, and I'm definitely not perking into Fort just to make seeds. On the up side at least you only ever need to plant your seeds once and then just harvest from it every few days forever.

 

buried supplies commonly has seed recipes or food recipes for me, not too hard since I pound through those on days 1 and 2 as many as possible so I have coin and food for a few days so I can loot a town for metals/tools

[Maynard69]

buried supplies commonly has seed recipes or food recipes for me, not too hard since I pound through those on days 1 and 2 as many as possible so I have coin and food for a few days so I can loot a town for metals/tools

 

Trash, cabinets, and other kitchen type boxes too sometimes

[Whorhay]

I did a lot of buried supplies quests early in my game and didn't get much in the way of seeds. Just RNG I guess. Then as I leveled up the traders quests he stopped offering buried supplies quests.

[Limdood]

I did a lot of buried supplies quests early in my game and didn't get much in the way of seeds. Just RNG I guess. Then as I leveled up the traders quests he stopped offering buried supplies quests.

 

Every level 1 buried treasure quest, the treasure will have a random food or seed recipe, guaranteed.

[dex314]

Even if your area had zero nitrate boulders (which I doubt but check desert/snow), it is still possible with effort. I dont believe that it naturally happening no matter what you do in every playthrough would be a good thing. It does only take finding 1 nitrate vein to have enough to make an immense farm.

 

However if farming immediately is important to you there is certainly nothing stopping you accomplishing it.

 

So I checked the entire area and yea definitely no nitrate boulders. The issue might be I'm on a large PVE server, so the nitrate things on the surface may have been mined out already. Even more so now it doesn't make sense that with all the dirt around us, only a few people can plant seeds.

[Synvastian]

well to be honest, normal dirt couldn't sustain a crop to full growth (its why fertilizer companies make bank) the soil is usually depleted of some nutrient (nitrates being the common one, its why farmers plant in rotations with 1 rotation being something like alfalfa...it ADDS nitrates to the soil)

 

so unless they bring back fertilizer, the plots at least mimic a little bit, standard planting

 

(I wouldn't mind getting fertilizer from gore piles instead of nitrate and keep nitrate an ore only/loot only option...heck we could use fertilizer in a chem station to get nitrate)

[FilthyCasual]

I have made a harvestable zombie mod if anyone's interested. Gives bones, fat, rotting flesh and nitrates.

 

https://www.nexusmods.com/7daystodie/mods/510

[dex314]

well to be honest, normal dirt couldn't sustain a crop to full growth (its why fertilizer companies make bank) the soil is usually depleted of some nutrient (nitrates being the common one, its why farmers plant in rotations with 1 rotation being something like alfalfa...it ADDS nitrates to the soil)

 

so unless they bring back fertilizer, the plots at least mimic a little bit, standard planting

 

(I wouldn't mind getting fertilizer from gore piles instead of nitrate and keep nitrate an ore only/loot only option...heck we could use fertilizer in a chem station to get nitrate)

 

Yea I mean untreated dirt isn't ideal, but outside of a city it should still support crops just fine. But I agree if we were allowed to farm on normal dirt, I'd be fine having reduced yield compared to the plots.

[RayneAngelus]

That "Harvestable Zombies" mod will help a lot.

 

I've got a whack-ton of Nitrate ore in the desert, but it's really scarce elsewhere, and I still have a ♥♥♥♥ens of a time with rotten meat (though as noted I could just go nuts looking for roadkill). I've also never found a Farm Plot in the world and I'm on my 4th game since A18 released to the Experimental branch.

 

Mostly I'm okay with the existence of Farm Plots, but I think their cost in Rotten Flesh and Nitrates needs to go down. While (as also noted previously) you generally have an easier time getting into farming now without needing to find a hoe, the rate at which you can lay down plots is seriously nerfed compared to A16/17, since you're no longer restricted by a tool, but by resources.

 

And yes, seeds, although Fort is worth so much more than just farming. 3 ranks in Healing Factor is a huge deal.

[FilthyCasual]

That "Harvestable Zombies" mod will help a lot.

 

I've got a whack-ton of Nitrate ore in the desert, but it's really scarce elsewhere, and I still have a ♥♥♥♥ens of a time with rotten meat (though as noted I could just go nuts looking for roadkill). I've also never found a Farm Plot in the world and I'm on my 4th game since A18 released to the Experimental branch.

 

Mostly I'm okay with the existence of Farm Plots, but I think their cost in Rotten Flesh and Nitrates needs to go down. While (as also noted previously) you generally have an easier time getting into farming now without needing to find a hoe, the rate at which you can lay down plots is seriously nerfed compared to A16/17, since you're no longer restricted by a tool, but by resources.

 

And yes, seeds, although Fort is worth so much more than just farming. 3 ranks in Healing Factor is a huge deal.

 

Glad the mod is useful. I find it a must in my own gameplay.

[Sjustus548]

Or you can go search towns for POI's with up to 20 pre-intalled farm plots, take them over and start planting with no gathering needed.

 

Why did I never think to check if I could plant on any of the farms? That would have made getting my farm started a lot easier lol.

[Maynard69]

Why did I never think to check if I could plant on any of the farms? That would have made getting my farm started a lot easier lol.

 

Idk about the farms, I dont think those are plots.

 

But there is the redesigned Military base (walled and chainlink fence in the front i think) has a bunch. I have been meaning to check some of the random farm type places but I keep forgetting. But there is probably a few other POIs that have them though.

[Gazz]

So I checked the entire area and yea definitely no nitrate boulders. The issue might be I'm on a large PVE server, so the nitrate things on the surface may have been mined out already.

Well, we can't magically make players play nice.

Every single boulder leads down to an ore vein. Players who only take out all the boulders at the top are just making sure no one else can easily find those. They surely have map markers for the spots. =)

[Feycat]

Quite a few POIs also have farm plots already in them. We've planted them in the front "flower boxes" in the RV park early on, works great. There's a couple others too.

[Ghostlight]

I searched the forums and didn't see another post, so here's my take on farm plots. It's unnecessary gate-keeping. In the early game sometimes finding a few seeds is a godsend when setting up your first shack. Requiring nitrate (25 each plot when u only find it 5 at a time in houses) and rotten meat just means you can't plant the first seeds you find. It's a nuisance.

 

Heh. I had built a half-dozen Farm Plots before I had found a single seed. Just saying.

[Ghostlight]

Well, we can't magically make players play nice.

Every single boulder leads down to an ore vein. Players who only take out all the boulders at the top are just making sure no one else can easily find those. They surely have map markers for the spots. =)

 

No excuse for bad design. You can't make players play nice, true, but you can design things so it is difficult for them to play naughty.

 

In this particular example....let's see if I can think of a good idea.....oh....this is a hard one....how to make it so players on large MP servers do not get shafted for Nitrate by other players selfishly removing the surface nodes....give me a few minutes....OK! I've got a brilliant idea....out of left field mind you....I have no idea if this would actually work it's so "out there" and crazy!! But here goes....

 

What if surface boulders gave a small amount of Nitrate (and Coal?) as well as Stone when you mined them? Mind blown?

[AtomicUs5000]

I think node removal to make sure your enemies find less is a completely valid strategy against your enemies. There should be more things like that.

 

I personally like the farming. Every couple of days I add another plot to my farm. I accept that I cannot have a massive farm during the first week. It's rewarding to slowly build it up to that point... like how most things should work in this game.