[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

16 minutes ago, Zombiepoptard said:

For the environmental hazards we should be able to interact with these hazards not only as a level obstacle but as a gameplay feature that is more dynamic and manipulatable. You should be able to turn the valve back on if you think that zombies will be running through the doorway that the flames would be blocking off. If you find a red pipe you should be able to shoot it and make a hazard yourself. These are just an example but I think applying intractability to a lot of deco would play to this games sandbox strengths. I mean heck lights can't even be shot out for stealth gameplay. You have to destroy the whole lamp to shut it off. Light switch, one tap and that's all I'm going to say.  

That would be great. But I already see some issues for the devs. To ensure the gas leak is coming from "somewhere" you'd need to be sure that the pipe you're shooting is connected to some source. Otherwise, you can have a single "pipe block" that can become a hazard even without being connected to a source of gas.

 

As you can see, this can easily become a can of worms... how would you solve this issue?

[Alpha 21 Dev Diary]

2 hours ago, Roland said:

They have not been added to the test trunk yet. @faatal is being stingy with them.

I can understand why...

As soon as the cat is out of the bag it'll be prod, poked, dissected, burned, ground and analyzed until they find each and every issue/bug/shortcoming. 

[This game needs better terrain smoothing tools]

44 minutes ago, Apocalyptical Survivor said:

I don't get any results when I search for "sheet". In the Wiki, I get a reference to Iron Trussing Sheets, is that what you're describing? Nothing with the word "sheet" comes up in my Forge or Workbench menu. Does it go by some other name?

No @%$#!

[Alpha 21 Dev Diary]

14 minutes ago, AtomicUs5000 said:

You went back to 17? That's just messed up.

We've already established that about Roland... 

[Alpha 21 Dev Diary]

4 minutes ago, Beelzebubs Ghost said:

You fail again, sir.

I knew it! Always thought Roland was a failure!

Finally, we have proof! 

 

Spoiler

Com'on, seriously? 

 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

7 hours ago, Laz Man said:

If snowballs ever get removed it's no big loss since we can throw rocks at our friends lol...

Although, I would fully support poop being re added to the game to fling at our friends.  Maybe give it the sticky property like c4....😅

Hopefully people won't expect to turn poop into murky water > boiled water, etc. for realism sake...😅

Ehrm... fortunately, you're a gentleman, so my joke just completely passed over your head... now I feel embarrassed.

But for the sake of clarity, I'll explain.

 

POCKET951 replied to Roland like this:

9 hours ago, POCKET951 said:

9 hours ago, Roland said:

He is totally aware of the holes left by moving crafting over to magazines. We will have to wait and see how he decides to fill them.

If you say stuff like this you might arouse @SnowDog1942 from his sleep. tread carefully Roland

So, the only way to avoid @SnowDog1942 to become "aroused", is to remove the "snow balls" from the snow dog. (ok, ok, it's a terrible joke I admit...) 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

57 minutes ago, POCKET951 said:

If you say stuff like this you might arouse @SnowDog1942 from his sleep. tread carefully Roland

The only solution is to not only remove empty jars, but also remove snowballs from the game...  

[Alpha 21 Dev Diary]

18 minutes ago, unholyjoe said:

no you most likely will not see a difference as the water appearance itself was not changed. most work is to affect performance.

 

i have a screen shot from both alphas and the difference you see is environmental lighting and shader tweaks/adjustments.

 

also... water is still WIP and no there are no fish, no large sea monsters or crocodiles.

 

nothing revealing in the a21 screen shot so no need to dissect it

 

Wait! What's that shadow lurking just under the water surface? 

[Alpha 21 Dev Diary]

45 minutes ago, Callum123456789 said:

I heard before that molotovs aren't affected by the demolitions expert damage increases are there plans to change that so it does in a21 or are they being left the same?

+1 to this!

 

What you ask has always made sense, but for some reason it's been always left alone.  I remember someone saying that you already put your expertise in the crafting, but IMO a "demo-man" should also know how to better use explosives to get better/maximum results.

[Save the game is gone. Load Failed]

@OP: I don't know if this still works... but there was a topic on the matter that could help you:

 

 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

19 minutes ago, DEADFACE said:

I'd like to see a deadzone around the dew collector so that they cannot just be crammed into a cluster.

I would agree, but the way a dew collector works doesn't depend much on how much space there is around it (it's not a tree).

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

12 minutes ago, Red Eagle LXIX said:

The dangers to most water after any type of nuclear explosion is the particles of fallout/exposed matter that can be absorbed/suspended into the water.  Those particles will be held in the clouds for quite some time and also deposited into nearby water sources that are open to the air outside the blast radius.  Those can be filtered out using a clay earth filter.

Quote

How Do I Treat Radioactive Water?

If you are concerned about the levels of radioactivity in your water, then you will need to put a treatment plan into place. Unfortunately, there is no simple answer for removing radiation from the water. In many cases, a combination of treatment methods, including carbon filtration, ion-exchange water softening, and reverse osmosis, is most effective. Call the Certified Water Specialists at US Water Systems for assistance. High levels of radiation in water may not be treatable.

A bit more complicated than you're assuming... but, ok, for gaming purposes we could have a suspension of disbelief i guess.

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

2 hours ago, Guppycur said:

You seem to have some sort of internal balance struggle that you may need to work out, because you're projecting.  Projecting is when you feel something but can't process the emotion so you put it onto others.  I'm quite fine with change.  In fact, modding *is* change so you don't even make sense.  Either I don't like change or I mod, it can't be both.  Keep working it out though, I'm proud of you.

 

I think I have the reason why you do it though.  You are the one who doesn't like the change, and that conflicts with your deep rooted need to simp to the pimps, so instead of acknowledging that you don't like the change, you fabricate a reality and apply your dislikes onto others.  It's really quite fascinating.  All of your posts are both simping AND letting out your own emotions.  It's a good start, I recommend starting a journal.

 

Take the "balance" comment for instance.  First you said "and then ask the devs why is the game not balanced to your way of playing the game", which is NOT something I asked, but now you acknowledge that you brought up balance.  Projecting.

 

...when you look back, all you will  see is me saying removing jars is weird, and that it won't make acquiring water any more difficult. 

 

But now you have created this reality where I'm a grumpy old man who's never happy about anything, even though I really like A20, it's still my favorite game, I enjoy the pimps and most players, and I appreciate the gift of the game, not to mention that I believe it's the most polished version of the game since I started in a6 or a7.

 

I've noticed you tend to do that a lot though.  Someone will say something, then you will fabricate what they said into something else and argue against that fabrication.  That's called a strawman argument.

 

Hell, after Schwartz said that getitem is staying in, I'm actually cool with the removal because it won't affect me.  You on the other hand, keep defending it against any and everyone who has an opinion, all the while making up their arguments for them.

 

I'm thinking they are YOUR arguments.  Good, this is growth.  Slow, but that's to be expected.  

 

You know, it IS okay to not like something TFP does.  I pinky promise that they don't care. 😃

 

Traders are a dumb path to take, because you get caught in a loop.  Go to trader, get quest, do quest, get trivial object, repeat.  You end up spending your days performing menial tasks that don't net you anything decent, when simple looting can net you TONS more resources that will get you to a more comfortable place come horde night.

 

Going to traders creates a false need that you *have* to have something, when you do not.  I suppose it's your social media generation, where you end up believing that you need things (like your need for tfp validation as an example) when you don't, I dunno.

 

By using traders, you make it harder on yourself because you are constantly putting your player in danger for very little reward while spending time doing quests instead of preparing your base, farm, meat collection, etc.

 

Then there is the flip side of traders.  All of that loot you got by looting and NOT doing trader quests is easily spendable *at* the trader so you can easily purchase what you need early on, and yes, I choose not to do that as well.

 

I know you don't read or comprehend the posts you respond to, but if you were able to, you'd see that a large number of the complaints is that the survival aspect of the game is trivial.  I think part of the reason it's not trivial for YOU, is that you follow the way TFP wants you to play, but that's exactly what makes it artificial.  Me, I prefer free play.  Do what I want and how I want to do it.  The game used to be billed as "An open world, voxel-based, sandbox game blending the best elements of FPS, Survival Horror, Tower Defense and Role Playing Games."  That's on their kickstarter.

 

In video games, an open world is a game mechanic of using a virtual world that the player can explore and approach objectives freely, as opposed to a world with more linear and structured gameplay.

 

But you keep arguing for playing it the TFP way.  Well, agree to disagree then.

 

When I play single player I rarely make it past the bow stage crafting wise.  Because I don't need to.  TFP has been kind enough to make wood into concrete in a lot of poi's which make them super suitable for horde nights.  Why fight a feral radiated behemoth demolisher that can fly and spit nuclear acid when I don't have to.  It just seems silly.  I prefer to take the tower defense approach and make it though the night that way.

 

Wow! For someone who's accusing me of "projecting" you're doing a lot of that your self!

I've never been aware you were behind my chair whenever I was playing (that's creepy, BTW, stop it!).

 

Anyway, I'm not trying to project anything here, I just read too much in your reply, and for that I apologize.

 

The way you write makes me think you're a psychologist, maybe?

I'm humbled you've dedicated so much time to that huge reply... since you're there, can you write me a custom mod?

 

Thanks Grumpycur!  

2 hours ago, Red Eagle LXIX said:

After reading all of this, I am not much bothered by the water change myself. 

My biggest complaint is the use of Dew Collectors instead of making it a more multi-staged process that would be a bit more realistic.

Dew and rain water collection in a fallout zone is a bad idea due to the pickup of micro particles that have been irradiated (as would drinking from any water source open to the air).  Such water still needs to be treated.

 

One could build a clay earth filter to clear out the radioactive fallout and micro particulates from the water.  These are very simple to make and can be made with primitive materials (cloth, clay, earth, pipe).

Such a filter can clear about 2-3 quarts of water per hour and is usually good for about 40-50 quarts of water before you need to construct a new one due to the build up of the radioactive materials.

Such filtered water would then still need to be boiled to clear any microorganisms.

 

Overall though, based on the above realities vs game universe, getting 3 water per day from a device that never breaks and just pretending the above process was done will be an easy suspension of disbelief IMO.  Might need to up tweak the values if going for more realism.

Since you're talking about realism... I don't think that filtering radioactive water with dirt will remove the radioactivity. 

1 hour ago, Games'n'Grumble said:

washing dirty dishes in dirty water? I'm not sure  No need to attack me, I'm on your side, just trying to find a compromise to stop this endless stream of discussion and the opportunity to focus on something more interesting and important 

What made you think I was attacking you? 

Dang! Must be the propaganda of that nasty old Grumpycur! 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

12 hours ago, Roland said:

Sorry but I’m on team Milkshake!

 

plus it would be hilarious and right in line with Pimp humor for Big Mama to have a 100% chance of having a jar of milk in any loot bag she drops… 😂

 

Nobody asked for Big Mama to not drop milk!!!

Spoiler

 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

4 hours ago, Games'n'Grumble said:

and become dirty, will not be able to return to their original "clean" appearance.

Until you unlock... TA DA! ... the DISHWASHER! 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

2 hours ago, Blake_ said:

@Roland have you tested water survival? If so, How does it feel for you in early-mid game? (Well, mid game is a bit of a stretch for testing in a flash, but I'm curious still).

He's already answered to this... I'll point you to a Steam topic where I collected some of his replies together:

https://steamcommunity.com/app/251570/discussions/0/6278597937792226288/

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

3 hours ago, Blake_ said:

I do like everything that has been done to water. But, what about food? I have a few questions that you might be able to answer, both watery and filling ones:

 

1. How much more expensive are drinks now in the vending machines/traders?

 

2. Are there plans for nerfing food on wheels on the snow biome ?

The reason for the question is this:

 

Chickens and rabbits from the forest are fair game, as they can be a bit tough to find and capture, but what about the HUGE amount of food in the snow biome? Predators (cougars/bears) are big targets, easy to exploit (they go straight towards you when called, killable at day 1 with  around 50-100 stone arrows and a 3x6x3 wooden tower,  fact that gets almost instantaneous with firearms) and give tons of meat. The snow biome feels like a butcher's shop. A white rabbit could do for most of the territory, honestly lol. I do hate those agile rabbits, but they are rewarding to kill.

 

3. Can we pick up the dew collector like any other work station? 

 

4. What is the capacity of the Dew Collector? (How many units of water can it hold?)

 

Thanks in advance.

After all that he has shared with you, you already abandoned poor @faatal for "the new guy"... you @%$#! 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

6 hours ago, Guppycur said:

No, it's not a self imposed rule, it's just something I don't enjoy doing.

 

I also don't jump off of roofs and go about my day with a broken leg either.

 

I also haven't brought up balance.

 

...but nice try.  Keep at it, you may get it one day. 

I replied because you always sound like a grumpy old man who's never happy about anything.

"It was better in the ol' days", you simply can't accept change and come up with "reasons" to justify that.

 

I understand that changing the game will mess up your mods and makes your work harder, I do, but as you very well know TFP have always been keen on changing things until what they see in the game "feels right", so you shouldn't be surprised or disappointed or grumpy about that. You "signed" into it.

 

Traders are an integral part of gameplay: if you purposefully don't use them, you'll miss some stuff the devs have balanced (that's why I brought up balance) to also be available from them or their quests. So your blank statement about not using traders after they explained you can find murky water also in quest locations, means you were unhappy about not having the option.

 

Nice try.

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

13 minutes ago, Guppycur said:

Some of us don't even use traders.  So no.

So basically you're saying that first you put on yourself a handicap or a self-imposed rule, and then ask the devs why is the game not balanced to your way of playing the game... yeah, I can see how that'd @%$# you off.

[Alpha 21 Dev Diary]

34 minutes ago, schwanz9000 said:

The dew collector is not the only way to get jars of water. Do you guys not quest or loot POI's? There is plenty of murky water out there to be found.

Are dew collectors movable? Someone mentioned nomadic play style, but IMO those huge collectors shouldn't be movable at all.

What's the difference between a nomadic life and a stationary play style, if nomads can get their "base" with them?

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

33 minutes ago, RipClaw said:

Really ? My guy complains all the time that he is dehydrated and his stamina goes down.

That's why I always have to carry a stack of tea around with me so that my character doesn't run out of steam.

I don't think he meant it that way... he means everyone agrees that it's currently very easy to have enough water/drinks to hydrate yourself. 

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

1 hour ago, KhaineGB said:

Have you seen how much I re-write the loot file???

HELL NO! It'd be worse actually

Ok, so... the new water system is finally approved! 

[Alpha 21 Dev Diary]

I believe that, as any new feature, this new water system will surely need to find its balance.

I'm confident the devs will get there, eventually.

 

But what I really like about the dew collector is that "apocalypse survival feel" that right now is missing because we can just scoop water from wherever, and be done.

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

1 hour ago, Guppycur said:

I'd have thought that by now you'd have realized that the dev diary *is for* speculation.  Hell, Roland makes a game out of it.

I suppose by your standards, this should be a read-only thread, or maybe only allow suck up posts?

Well, yes and no.

 

You know, by my standards, you speculate when you don't know much about something. But with the new water system, for the first time, we have a very detailed explanation of both features and gameplay "feel", from the people who are testing it. Now, I know you're not someone who trusts random people like the devs, but personally if they straight out give you a detailed report of what the new water system will be, I at least give them the benefit of the doubt and believe what they say.

 

So, basically, you and several other people (specifically the more mod-talented ones) tend to overthink the matter and/or start going in overdrive mode with your own modded solution to the game issue the devs have been trying to assess. It really looks just like a spitting contest this way.

 

To each his own I guess.

[Alpha 21 Discussion Overflow]

All I see here are speculations... I have a proposal for The Fun Pimps: please give a courtesy copy of the current A21 revision to both @Guppycur and @KhaineGB and let them give you feedback about how they feel the water change is by actually testing it.

 

At least after that, if they trash the changes, they'll do it knowledgeably.