Jost Amman
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Posts posted by Jost Amman
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1 hour ago, ktr said:
I have also informed my opinion by what the devs have explained.
2 hours ago, ktr said:I now have to read x number of books to craft y.... but still don't have enough parts to it. Sounds fun.
Dude, drop it. You got it wrong, and I explained why.
I understand now you're one of those types who think facts and truth don't exist, because everyone can make up their own.
There's no point discussing with people with such a mindset. Now please, make up more random stuff to explain why "your truth" is better than facts and what the developers of this game know because of hands-on experience. Please, make my day.
1 hour ago, ktr said:Here we go. "Clearly misunderstood". You have absolutely no basis to make this claim, but you do it anyway.
1 hour ago, ktr said:The difference is that I disagree with their conclusions and you do not. I am willing to allow your lack of disagreement while you are not willing to even entertain my disagreement. People can be wrong. I am willing to admit that I can be wrong. You are not willing to entertain the idea that the devs and testers can be. BTW testers look for bugs, things that aren't working up to specs. (Hint: I know this because I do software and config testing every other week) that doesn't mean they're 'experts' on gameplay.
You're clearly twisting my words... I didn't say you're wrong about how you'd feel about A21, I said you're wrong about what the devs said about the new features, and/or you misunderstood them.
You're hunting for a fallacy in my statements so that you can blame me of being arrogant and biased, but you actually didn't even understand what I was referring to, so you defaulted to "you don't accept my opinion".
If your opinion is that water is dry, you're wrong.
If your opinion is that you won't have enough parts to craft with the new system, you're wrong, because the devs told you that perking into something will have you find more magazines AND parts of that specialization. So, no, that's not an opinion, it is a fact.
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5 minutes ago, ktr said:
You haven't clarified anything except perhaps your bias for the Alpha, but props to you for the unnecessary aggression.
I don't see how that was aggressive. I was just clarifying something about the new "Learn by Looting" system that you clearly misunderstood.
If you feel offended because you don't want to be corrected on something you clearly got wrong, that's on you.
7 minutes ago, ktr said:Then if you do not have informed opinion, you cannot tell me what this Alpha will contain, right?
I have an informed opinion about everything the devs have explained about the new features, and I can correct you on that when you're wrong.
I don't know how A21 will play out, but as said, I choose to trust what some QA testers and some devs have said about how they feel A21 gameplay is.
You, on the contrary, don't even have an indirect account of how A21 gameplay is, so my A21 gameplay opinion is at least a bit more informed than yours.
8 minutes ago, ktr said:I don't care about min-maxers because that can mean a breadth of things in games like this. I'm an accountant. I run numbers.
Well, as an accountant you should know that, when your numbers are wrong, there's no shame having to correct them.
But I see that, as many other players who come here and pretend to want a discussion, you already made up your mind about me, so I'll leave you to your thoughts.
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8 minutes ago, ktr said:
What we are all doing here is discussing our opinions. You choice to place your trust and that's fine. I choose to express my dissent. The difference is that you choose to poo poo any opinion as not rational, which you cannot in good faith say one way or another.
I have to apologize. I used the wrong word there... I should have said "uninformed" opinion.
Meaning that no matter how many games you've played or for how long, neither you, nor I, have played or tested A21 to have an informed opinion on its gameplay.
2 minutes ago, ktr said:If you're getting "all high-end stuff" by week 2, I can only ask what settings are you playing?? Never had that happen in SP or MP except maybe in the days of LBD in a large-ish group.
Min-maxers (not me), do that all the time and come on the forums (on Steam mainly) to brag about that!
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27 minutes ago, ktr said:
New progression because people where skipping steps? I mean, yes, I skipped steps because the loot tables gave me no other choice. I always found better stuff WAY WAY WAY before I had the parts to craft them. That's a loot table problem, not a progression system problem. A problem that the new progression system doesn't address. I now have to read x number of books to craft y.... but still don't have enough parts to it. Sounds fun.
You're missing the point.
Firstly, they're ALSO adjusting loot tables in A21 and balancing them to follow your progression more naturally.
Second, the new crafting system DOES address those problems:
- BEFORE: you had to heavily perk into an attribute if also wanted to craft higher quality and tier stuff connected to that attribute (e.g.: strength->shotguns)
- NOW (A21): you can craft stuff from ANY attribute tree, as long as you learn from magazines, without having to perk into that attribute.
- NOW (A21): you'll find MORE magazines, but ALSO parts, if you specialize into something (e.g.: Perk into shotguns and you'll find more shotgun magazines).
Hope this clarifies some things you got wrong on the new features.
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22 minutes ago, ktr said:
That bears repeating - unlike the majority of other survival games out there, the player cannot collect and refine water from water sources. Might as well remove bodies of water from the game entirely except as decorative objects. Yes, yes, I know, you can get the water refiner mod and drink from any body of water at will. Was this change made just to give that mod relevance? That would be a poor choice.
There's also vitamins that render you immune to dysentery for a while.
24 minutes ago, ktr said:Water was fine as it was. Easy to get, but provided no real benefits. This game is not Green Hell where the basic need for food and water is the central gameplay. Central game play is dealing with the zombies and the zombie hordes. Which means that food and water will always have to be easy enough to get for the player to have time to prepare for horde night.
Water was not "easy", it was (is in A20) ridiculous! You could literally solve the water problem forever on day 1/2.
Is that the survival gameplay you want? I don't.
26 minutes ago, ktr said:New progression system - why? Literally WHY? From what I can tell, it boils down to 'well, people were skipping over progression steps'. To that I say, so what? Stone tools are a pain in the ass. Their lower stamina use does not replace time spent using them. The fun of base tools and weapons for me in SP was having to make decisions about how to use better things that found effectively when I couldn't make them. Now, I'll have a harder time finding better things and making them is even..... harder? Sound like fun.
Because having all high-end stuff in the game by week 2 sounds fun to you?
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11 minutes ago, ktr said:
There is some validity in the point that maybe bandits are the only thing new or exciting to come.
Yes. But that's the point of the *facepalm* IMO. When I read/hear that I think "Duh!? Of course! The game is nearly finished... what do you expect??"
13 minutes ago, ktr said:Oh, we're re-doing water again because apparently water became too easy to get. Okay. There was a simpler solution to that problem than essentially creating another problem with the water collectors. People will simply make enough water collectors to suit SP or group needs. It adds nothing to this game than an arbitrary step that is exciting on the first play through, but redundant and boring on subsequent play throughs. Awesome, for a group of 4, we now have to look at collecting enough materials to build 8 water collectors ASAP so we can do the other things in the game that we want to do. Bodies of water are now even more meaningless than they were before because you cannot collect water from a river.
Except that, this is your personal opinion... and why would that count more than a thought through, discussed, analyzed and balanced assessment from the devs of this game?
You say this new water system adds nothing, but how many hours of A21 did you play? None. QA testers and devs, instead, are currently playing and experimenting A21 gameplay and can see what's working and what's not. They're doing their best (hopefully) to make it interesting and fun.
At this point, it boils down to those who trust TFP will do a good job, and those who don't trust them.
But that's opinions, it's not a "rational" argument, so everyone's opinion counts zero, and we need to wait for A21 to be released and see.
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1 hour ago, Matt115 said:
Looks so good. I hope there will be new body props as well ^^
Here's a "body prop" for you!
Spoiler
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@Quantum Blue made me think about something...
I think it would be great if each different crop had a different % chance for returning a seed. We all know that IRL there are crops that are more resilient and bountiful, versus crops which are more difficult to tend. So a 50% flat chance for every crop could be instead improved based on the crop type. That would also give more depth to farming IMO.
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5 minutes ago, Quantum Blue said:
150 data points per set is not 'anecdotal'.
Sorry, but it's not clear for me... how many reloads did you do for the test?
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2 hours ago, Quantum Blue said:
Conclusions:
Farming is really not productive unless you invest at least 1 perk point. (You could get really lucky - as I did with potatoes, but...)
I appreciate the effort, really... but you can't draw conclusions based on ONE anecdotal result. It's simply not how "statistics" work.
As you said yourself, there could be too much RNG involved into such a small number of samples.
That's also true for what that player said... unless you plant A LOT of crops at once, you may be put down by RNG on your first try and think farming is useless.
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Guys, please stop! Or I'll need to go out and buy diapers!
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3 hours ago, Khalagar said:15 hours ago, Jost Amman said:
So now you want to NERF other people's enjoyment of one part of the game, only so that you can better enjoy YOUR preferred part of the game?
No? Where did any part of my post say that? The part you quoted was about them changing it from *the current* system which screws over one play style for no real reason
17 hours ago, Khalagar said:Someone has all the mining perks and can craft a sick pickaxe? I bet they have the best one you can get!!! Well actually no, their friend with 0 perks put into mining stuff does, because he just found one in a boss chest that's better than anything the mining dude can craft. The new system doesn't change that issue either, it only further punishes the people who *aren't* ADHD run and gun chain questing.
From this part, I thought you implied that you want TFP to NERF the looting rewards for the "looter guy", otherwise the "miner guy" would be "punished" for just mining.
Did I get it right?
P.S.: I won't reply to the other stuff because I don't want to "overload" you with too many replies (since you said you don't have much time to answer).
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39 minutes ago, Matt115 said:
Experimentation is good but... lack of visiual vision is big mistake. TFP just focused on " fully destroyable voxel game with zombies and survival" so gameplay stuff but they didn't create sure vision.
I don't know if what you said sounds wrong because of the "language barrier", but vision is exactly what TFP always had.
What they always lacked, has been a Roadmap, maybe that's what you wanted to say?
They've never had doubts about content (what features the game should have), in fact we have proof in the original Kickstarter page: everything they ever worked on was already in the 2013 Kickstarter goals. They've changed several times HOW they implemented that content, true, but it was never about WHAT to put in the game.
It was always about HOW that content should be added, in what FORM (e.g.: LBD vs. Perks or Crafting Grid vs. Crafting List), so in that regard they were doing exactly what someone with time and money should do: experiment with something, if they don't feel it's the right choice, change it or scrap it.
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1 hour ago, Khalagar said:
My stance is just that the person with the most investment towards a specific thing should have the best version of that specific thing, but that isn't how 7 Days works.
So you're saying that if I invest a lot of time into looting, I should have the best loot?
1 hour ago, Khalagar said:Someone has all the mining perks and can craft a sick pickaxe? I bet they have the best one you can get!!! Well actually no, their friend with 0 perks put into mining stuff does, because he just found one in a boss chest that's better than anything the mining dude can craft. The new system doesn't change that issue either, it only further punishes the people who *aren't* ADHD run and gun chain questing.
So now you want to NERF other people's enjoyment of one part of the game, only so that you can better enjoy YOUR preferred part of the game?
1 hour ago, Khalagar said:I'm not saying the devs have to balance around it entirely, but it would be nice for them to least have it so your perk investment means you will actually be the best at something, since it increases build diversity.
That's how it works now and will work even better in A21. If you invest your points in shotguns, you'll get better at shooting with shotguns.
If you invest your efforts into learning how to CRAFT shotguns, you'll be better at CRAFTING shotguns.
Your logic is flawed, sorry. If someone is a great blacksmith, he doesn't necessarily get to be a great swordsman!
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@faatal : by accident, I found out something about the A20 AI that could be improved in A21 if you got the time... when I place ladders going up, and then at some point I switch to the side one block, and I go up again from there, even if I can travel the ladders easily, the AI will stop at the first ladder "sequence", making the whole thing exploitable IMO.
SpoilerSo basically, I'm saying that something like this...
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...will make the AI stop at the top of the first ladder, instead of trying to navigate sideways to the adjacent one.
Hope this helps.
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2 hours ago, Khalagar said:
Dunno if you've watched any streamers play, but every group I've seen where there's more than 1 or 2 people, has one person who basically always stays home as the den mother role and just cooks / crafts / builds etc and only rare goes out looting and instead just gathers iron and wood and stone etc.
I'm talking about Single Players who force themselves to play that way. I already said in a previous post that IMO, multiplayer and SP gameplay should have separate balance rules, otherwise it'll always be a war between SP and MP players on how the game should be balanced.
I hope the devs will consider this.
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1 hour ago, Melange said:
Dunno how to respond except for "Doh, I should have known"
It's ok, you're not "required" to know anything about TFP team. I honestly was just trying to help with some info I gathered here... I hope I didn't come through as condescending. As you may have seen from previous posts, it's difficult to convey the intended attitude with just text.
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5 minutes ago, Melange said:
Only asking: Have you been given access to the current rendition of A21, and are you playing it?
He should be... he's part of the QA team!
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1 hour ago, Melange said:
There was a bit of a misunderstanding, I'm not upset or anything like that... I understand your frustration.
However, that has nothing to do with lack of improvements for builders gameplay (which was RipClaw's initial argument), that's why I replied like I did.
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2 hours ago, RipClaw said:
Is it a balanced way when people spend all their time looting? For my part, I think it is just as unnatural and unbalanced.
I completely agree... and if you only play by looting, you won't have a wonderful base to live in, and you'll be stuck out in the rain!
Ok, maybe they'll just cut and place a few blocks in a POI and be done, but still...
2 hours ago, RipClaw said:Don't get me wrong, I'm thankful that I can use these shapes now but what do you think happens when 99% of the players only loot and only 1% build a base at all? Do you think the developers would still invest time and work to improve building?
I don't think that will ever happen (and I don't need statistics to know!).
19 minutes ago, Melange said:I like to build. I am happy I have more shapes to use that in my SP game no one will ever see in my fortress (sarcasm in case it wasn't obvious)
Yeah, and the same people won't see you winning against a huge horde or admire your great outfit.
Single player games have always been like this, and now you put that on The Fun Pimps?
And by the way, I can enjoy my single player made base anyway even if I don't get the approval from someone else... but if I really, REALLY need to show off, then I take a few pictures and show them on Steam in the right discussion.
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43 minutes ago, RipClaw said:
As long as the developers don't forget that building still exists and don't throw it out of the game because nobody builds anymore anyway.
That's always my fear when aspects of the game are neglected. The developers might feel that it is unnecessary and can be removed.Sure, they were neglecting the building part so much that they just added 1K shapes for building in A20!
Where the heck did you get that?
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4 hours ago, Matt115 said:
This is paradox Roland because 1. IF crafting is buffed this mean looting is less effective or 2. If looting is buffed that mean crafting is even less effective. There is not other options. LBL will forced players to scavengig even more - why to waste time to make workbench etc. if you can do quest to get candy and have better chance to find good eq.
It's only a paradox for people who play in an "unbalanced" (or should I say "unnatural") way.
I don't want the game to be tailored and balanced over people who choose to ignore the (integral) looting part of the game. It's their problem, not the dev's or ours.
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23 minutes ago, Khalagar said:
Yeah meant Q6. And the issue is there is no progression because you will find a Q6 almost as fast / faster than you will be able to craft one. I've tested it many times actually by going either full crafting focus or going full quest focus, or going craft focused while my friend is loot and shoot. Because it takes parts to craft something, and you can't craft the parts, and the higher quality versions take more parts, it stalls crafting tiers out while you have to go loot anyway. Just chain running quests will power level you into the higher loot tiers quickly and the quest reward perks and vendor perks will have them selling Q6 t1 weapons and armor extremely quickly.
It definitely does feel like a waste of resources to waste all your duct tape and springs etc to craft a quality 5 only to have a Q6 as a reward or from the loot box an hour later.
You mean... you tested A20, right? Or are you a QA tester on A21? Because, as far as I understand, A21 will be heavily rebalanced around the new crafting system. Don't lose hope!
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9 minutes ago, JamesKirk said:
I wish there would be an option, where arrows fired and stuck in earth are glowing like the spear, so you can pick them up more easily!
I wish they allowed us to collect fired arrows just by proximity: I don't like pixel hunting.
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This is the kind of point of view that makes me go facepalm about some reviewers.
in General Discussion
Posted
To follow up on your example (even if I don't really know the game/context)... in the case of the water changes in A21, you don't even know if there are any anti-vampires factions AT ALL. Those who are testing A21 (QA and some devs) do.