USSF06 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Replies in the Zombie AI thread made me think about how much bandits can bring to this game. If any of you have played the Starvation mod, you have already seen how deadly hostile humans can be, as well as seen special bosses like the monsters who destroy structures with ease. This made me re-imagine what bandits can bring to 7DTD. Why care about zombie AI? They're mindless monsters. Make numbers and relentless stamina their focus. Feed the AI development to bandits. I know TFP has been working on bandits for awhile, but I love the idea of bandits with specialties: Saboteur Bandit - Purposefully leads hordes of zombies to your location. Functionally, this bandit would work as a screamer. Once he sees you, a horde of zombies follows shortly behind him. Demolition Bandit - Zombies shouldn't have the ability to break most structures, but humans are more than capable. This bandit brings weapons of mass destruction (in the form of rockets, augers, chainsaws, etc.) to destroy your establishments. Boss Bandit - Give him what he asks for (dukes, materials) or choose to fight him and his gang (a mix of regular bandits and special bandits). Anyone else like the idea of stuff like this? I know bandits are in the works and are probably awhile out, but I'm starting to feel like too much is being invested into zombie AI when they aren't suppose to be that smart to begin with. Edit: I'm going to add any ideas commented to the list below. If anything, it would be something worth trying to mod in during free time. If you don't like me adding your stuff to the list with my paraphrased version, just let me know. AtomicUs5000's Ideas: Trapper Bandit - booby traps your most common paths. Beast Master Bandit - hunts you with tamed wolves and/or bears. Scavenger Bandit - steals from you if you don't adequately protect/secure your stuff. Dimpy's Idea: Player Bandit - mimics a real player by spam crafting, nerd poling, and bunny hopping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicUs5000 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 There are endless possibilities. Bandits that lay mines down around your most common paths. Bandits that hunt you with a pack of dogs. Bandits that steal your vehicles or from your chests. Of course bandits have their bases and you can return the favor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimpy Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Bandits that spam craft, nerd pole, and bunny hop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicUs5000 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Bandits that spam craft, nerd pole, and bunny hop. I would be in hysterics if a bandit nerd-poled to get into my base. You see a bunch of trees falling down in the distance and you know someone's getting frames ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kam R. Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Discussions a while ago: "PvPers are all just a bunch of griefing a-holes! This game should never be for PvP!" ... Other discussion today: "Let's program in some a-holes, that lay mines and steal our stuff and grief us." Love it. Hope NPC bandits become just as optional (separately from Zs!) as their human counterparts are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicUs5000 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 The A in AI takes on new meaning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 They should add Bandits that use the new intelligent pathing AI. And return the zombies to the ... duhhhhh walk straight version that makes more sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USSF06 Posted December 11, 2018 Author Share Posted December 11, 2018 There are endless possibilities. Bandits that lay mines down around your most common paths. Bandits that hunt you with a pack of dogs. Bandits that steal your vehicles or from your chests. Of course bandits have their bases and you can return the favor. For my own amusement, I'm adding your ideas to the main post with made up applicable titles. Discussions a while ago: "PvPers are all just a bunch of griefing a-holes! This game should never be for PvP!" ... Other discussion today: "Let's program in some a-holes, that lay mines and steal our stuff and grief us." Love it. Hope NPC bandits become just as optional (separately from Zs!) as their human counterparts are now. I agree; if everything in this game could be optional and/or able to be customized it would be amazing. They should add Bandits that use the new intelligent pathing AI. And return the zombies to the ... duhhhhh walk straight version that makes more sense. I have faith they are working on AI for both; let's hope lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 I'd like to see crops attract bandits! Don't know how that would play out but I think the idea has promise. Also I think having a Boss Bandit is kind of ubiquitous. We're pretty much all expecting to see some kind of Boss. Hope it's really tough!! Maybe not really powerful weapons but some stupid amount of HP would be fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USSF06 Posted December 11, 2018 Author Share Posted December 11, 2018 I'd like to see crops attract bandits! Don't know how that would play out but I think the idea has promise. Also I think having a Boss Bandit is kind of ubiquitous. We're pretty much all expecting to see some kind of Boss. Hope it's really tough!! Maybe not really powerful weapons but some stupid amount of HP would be fun. Fallout 4 had a system where the more water and food your settlement produced the higher chance you had of being attacked by raiders. The same concept could be applied to 7DTD food and water using a system similar to the heat map, except instead of attracting screamers we would be attracting bandits. I think that’d be awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calebelt Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 The game is clearly not enough NPC. It would be great to appear on the map of the city with NPC, which give quests and have different professions. The game now has Department stores that sell everything at once. Such stores are clean, and the NPC in town will sell things of their profession. Some things should only appear after completing quests for these NPCs. For example, you cannot buy just the steel. The logical explanation is: "The people of the city don't trust you, maybe you're a bandit and use steel against them." Now unfortunately you can find a few shops, sell different stuff and fill the chests with weapons, ammunition, armor, traps. Do not even need to dig and mine ore, all you can do from steel is sold in stores. Again, it would be very interesting to defend the city with an NPC from bandits. Bandits attacked, robbed NPC and a few days they have no goods. Zombies attacked the city and the NPC has no ammunition and medicines for several days. NPC is still needed, because without them, the world is boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scyris Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 I just hope they balance bandits, because if they give bandits guns with the exact same damage as the player guns, you'll be dead before you can even find them to shoot back. Played a few mods with bandits and the gun ones were bascally aimbots that never missed and never have to reload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrrah Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Discussions a while ago: "PvPers are all just a bunch of griefing a-holes! This game should never be for PvP!" ... Other discussion today: "Let's program in some a-holes, that lay mines and steal our stuff and grief us." Love it. Hope NPC bandits become just as optional (separately from Zs!) as their human counterparts are now. haha! that is just what i was thinking "sounds like why i hate pvp" Griefing isn't so much a challenge as it is an extreme annoyance. If i want to be annoyed like that i'll just go tell the neighbors they are free to go back to spinning cookies in my driveway on their 4 wheelers and they can go through our stuff again. We don't mind. Its a fun challenge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beHypE Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 I hate to be that guy but I've come to accept the fact that bandits will probably not be as fleshed out as you guys all imagine them to be. The game is already too resource consuming for them to increase the numbers of zombies, I don't see bandits coming in hot with demolition machines and wagons full of "tamed" zombies to be unleashed at your doorstep. I really hope i'm wrong, but I have that feeling it got postponed so much for a reason, and that the idea will eventually get dropped or implemented and released in a way simpler version than the one we all dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricp Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 One of 7DtD's weaknesses is the mid to late gameplay. Once you have everything you need (and like others I am still not entirely sold on level gates) then what reason is to continue playing - unless it MP which I suppose is a little different. This was the same in A15, A16 as it is in A17. If we could get set of factions that play off each other, offering a dynamic progression of the world based on your actions, I think that would change the late game quite a bit and allay the fears of those who feel the game has "lost something" in it's progression to A17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 One of 7DtD's weaknesses is the mid to late gameplay. Once you have everything you need (and like others I am still not entirely sold on level gates) then what reason is to continue playing - unless it MP which I suppose is a little different. This was the same in A15, A16 as it is in A17. If we could get set of factions that play off each other, offering a dynamic progression of the world based on your actions, I think that would change the late game quite a bit and allay the fears of those who feel the game has "lost something" in it's progression to A17. Agreed. Bandits, Colonies and a story line progression are what's missing from the End game. With a "cure" or something to research, a colony to keep fed and safe, and rival factions to deal with.... ...we'd have a winner! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USSF06 Posted December 11, 2018 Author Share Posted December 11, 2018 I hate to be that guy but I've come to accept the fact that bandits will probably not be as fleshed out as you guys all imagine them to be. The game is already too resource consuming for them to increase the numbers of zombies, I don't see bandits coming in hot with demolition machines and wagons full of "tamed" zombies to be unleashed at your doorstep. I really hope i'm wrong, but I have that feeling it got postponed so much for a reason, and that the idea will eventually get dropped or implemented and released in a way simpler version than the one we all dream of. Have you played Starvation mod? It already has the basics fleshed out. All of these bandit ideas mentioned pretty much already exist on Starvation mod in the form of boss zombies or pests. There are boss zombies that obliterate structures, boss zombies that spawn beasts (scorpions, maybe others that I cant recall), boss zombies that revive fallen zombies, and finally, pests/rodents that obliterate crops if you don't have a way to protect them. Oh, and let's not forget that starvation already has bandits and numerous NPCs with quests in the game as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoppaTot Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 We have bandits? They are just structural engineers with Master's Degrees that happen to be zombies now, and they know how to just look at your base and pinpoint with exact science where the weakest spot is. Just kidding, in all honesty, bandits (if done well) would be a great addition to this game imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzHawkeye Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Agreed. Bandits, Colonies and a story line progression are what's missing from the End game. With a "cure" or something to research, a colony to keep fed and safe, and rival factions to deal with.... ...we'd have a winner! Colonies a colony to keep fed and safe, ...we'd have a winner! Yes, Colonies is something I really hope the base game one day has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 I just hope they balance bandits, because if they give bandits guns with the exact same damage as the player guns, you'll be dead before you can even find them to shoot back. Played a few mods with bandits and the gun ones were bascally aimbots that never missed and never have to reload. Yeah I had the same experience. I'd say Bandits should: - Aim a little like James Bond bad guys. [Can hit you but bad aim.] - Have high Hit Points and low Damage. [Difficulty level should increase Bandit HP not damage. That won't make it more fun.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicUs5000 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Yeah I had the same experience. I'd say Bandits should: - Aim a little like James Bond bad guys. [Can hit you but bad aim.] - Have high Hit Points and low Damage. [Difficulty level should increase Bandit HP not damage. That won't make it more fun.] Here is where I am worried about the AI... but not so much for the zombies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyStar Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 Here is where I am worried about the AI... but not so much for the zombies. Yeah having zombies do stupid things isn't too immersion breaking. It's kind of expected a little. Watching Bandits run in circles or pathing through your "Death Maze" would not be good. I wonder how TFP are going to tackle this. I think having mostly range-type bandits is going to help. Coming to your base and standing around shooting at you isn't too bad. [Can't really see them coding in a bandit hiding behind cover. That's ... well I mean... they could.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicUs5000 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 They shouldn't always be on the offense like zombies. If they get hurt enough, they should consider their own survival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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