18b152: I hope you guys are proud of yourselves

[quyxkh]

Honestly, i was looking forward to crafting T6 gear. It makes sense that you should be able to make the best stuff.

 

For most things that _doesn't_ make sense to me. Technology needs an industrial base. High tech gear needs a civilization-spanning industrial base. Those things are gone and there's only what you can find left. Even medieval technology is a stretch for tribal society, and that's the most 7dtd players can aspire to. Top-quality medieval gear? I think that "should" be craftable at the limits, but meh.

 

The game's not attempting to be a rebuilding-society sim, or even a fighting sim, not really. There's no blocking. The zeds do the head motion and general aggressive stomping really really well, there's risk-reward tradeoffs everywhere you turn, the world's gorgeous, inviting, and there's lots to do while you gauge your readiness for the next battle, they've still got plenty of teamwork-matters-a-lot in the perk structure so PvE co-op has new ground to explore and the performance is starting to really come on line.

 

But unless they want to build an entirely new game on top of this, it seems off track to obsess about realism or anything but a fun and engrossing plausible-enough-if-you-squint game loop. I remember having to dynamite a nephew out of his turtling in CnC, it's attractive but in the end it's stultifying and loses badly against competent aggression. TFP nerfing the top end, hanging a big ol' "don't even try turtling" sign, I like that.

[Darthjake]

Yeah, but now I have these nifty military stealth boots that I found a schematic for, and I can only craft them to 5, and then watch all the grade 6 regular military boots that I'm looting go to the stockpile, because I can't bring myself to scrap a purple item.

[M.C.]

t5 is pretty close to t6....

 

Crafting now results in random stats so a crafted t5 item may very well be better than a looted or purchased t6 item.

 

I am sorry, but you are wrong. Q6 is a massive upgrade over Q5 because of the additional mod slot and the damage bonus that you get simply by filling it -- more so if the mod you are adding provides additional benefits.

[Katitof]

And there is RNG again. Apparently the Fun Pimps love RNG. I hope at least they don't make their decisions by flipping a coin.

 

You'd rather never have any kind of incentive to ever get out to loot once you get purple for each slot?

That would get boring extremely fast, you know, like in previous alphas, where looting was pretty much exclusively early game activity, after which everyone focused on building and mining.

[camelCase]

You'd rather never have any kind of incentive to ever get out to loot once you get purple for each slot?

That would get boring extremely fast, you know, like in previous alphas, where looting was pretty much exclusively early game activity, after which everyone focused on building and mining.

And where's the incentive to go out and loot when you've got purple for each slot? The solution is to provide good end-game content (very rare legendary items perhaps, or awesome quests) not artificially inflate the importance of one aspect of the game by screwing up the others.

[aptalley]

A lot of claims only based on A17 history on here. A17 AND A18 (to me) are the same thing with systems jumbled around. We used to have a system, back in the good old days where you had to scavenge for gun parts, you could then combine them to make the best guns in the game, OR (you will not believe this) you could ALSO loot the best guns in the game. You HAD to scavenge for at least the gun parts. But crafting was actually relevant.

 

How in the world we devolved to this, I have no clue.

 

Also, to clarify. Something just changed with A17 that sent it down some strange path away from gathering, crafting and adventure, and in search of more frantic action gameplay. It just took another path at that moment. It has not been the same since.

[aptalley]

Not sure how anyone could think that there was no incentive to loot in A17 either, really, unless you liked rolling around with t6 gear and no mods. I spent real life days looking for certain mods for my gear in A17.

 

Honestly I don't think we should be able to endlessly craft the mods. The t6 should be craftable as a base piece of gear, and if you want it modded out to be a badass piece of gear, you loot for either the mods or the single use schematics like in A17.

[tricorius]

Why can’t it be fun to craft and loot? Why does one seem to always have to suffer for the other?

 

It seemed to me that balance would be pretty close when they added T6 craftable in the previous release.

 

You still had to:

 

- perk into a skill or loot a schematic

- loot a metric crap ton of things for materials

- craft all the prerequisite parts

- dump all this materials into the RNG to try for a decent stat spread

 

It wasn’t like you can just sit on a roof and craft a full set of gear, looking down and chuckling at the zombies.

 

Also, it added a perfect slot for “legendary” equipment to fill. Now, if they add it, any craftable gear will be two tiers lower.

[camelCase]

Honestly I don't think we should be able to endlessly craft the mods. The t6 should be craftable as a base piece of gear, and if you want it modded out to be a badass piece of gear, you loot for either the mods or the single use schematics like in A17.

I actually really like this idea. There's too much RnG with the weapons themselves and the mods... if it were restricted to RnG on just the mods the crafters would have little to complain about. Not sure if I prefer it to legendary super rare items (not in trader/quests) though.

[Ghostlight]

LBD should come back in the way Darkness Falls mod had it, it had action skills for things that made sense: Weapons, Athletics (running/jumping), Armor use (getting hit). Crafting was all perk related with no LBD aspect to it. To raise a weapons perk you have to actually use the weapon

 

I'd love this.

[SickPuppy]

Yer I miss LBD too but devs were pretty clear they're not interested in that anymore. Shame as I found it way more immersive progressing my character that way. Ppl have said a daily diminishing returns on xp so players can't abuse it but yer if the DF mod has it I'll definitely check it out.

[SickPuppy]

Throw a dozen of those dirty whore eggs on the ground!

 

Fight the power!

 

You know what? You're right, I'm the gatekeeper to my own destiny, get away from me dam eggs, here take these filthy dukes too. I have restored the balance, I am survival purist once more and empowered....oooh look a birds nest.

 

 

 

I'll tell you the same filthy casuals get told, "Change your settings".

 

OK for the record I've never called casuals filthy. A bit funny looking but not filthy.

[RipClaw]

You'd rather never have any kind of incentive to ever get out to loot once you get purple for each slot?

That would get boring extremely fast, you know, like in previous alphas, where looting was pretty much exclusively early game activity, after which everyone focused on building and mining.

 

Why should everyone loot all the time? What's wrong with building and mining ?

 

I guess you like scavenging but I consider scavenging boring. It's basically always the same. You drive somewhere, kill a few zombies and search everything that is searchable.

 

Building, on the other hand, is fun for me.

[quyxkh]

Why should everyone loot all the time? What's wrong with building and mining ?

 

I guess you like scavenging but I consider scavenging boring. It's basically always the same. You drive somewhere, kill a few zombies and search everything that is searchable.

 

Building, on the other hand, is fun for me.

 

So build. You can make gear almost as good as the pre-apocalypse-gear-nobody-can-make-anymore stuff yourself, and on a really good day you might make gear better than almost anything you could possibly find.

[guardianangelmp]

So build. You can make gear almost as good as the pre-apocalypse-gear-nobody-can-make-anymore stuff yourself, and on a really good day you might make gear better than almost anything you could possibly find.

 

 

Except they can't make any weapons/armor/tools of any significant tier without getting the parts, which requires *gasp* SCAVENGING.

 

There should be interplay between the different aspects of the game, but don't spread the illusion that miners/builders will be able to progress the same/as fast (or at all) as looter/scavengers.

[Tristaris]

I think people are forgetting that you can't craft without scavenging in the first place. It's not like you can craft parts or anything, so I don't understand why it's one side at the others throat about it. If anything it's just easier for me to go scavenge than it ever is to craft.

 

I like that both systems feed into each other, even though scavenging, in my opinion, feels a little more powerful than crafting ever will if for only reason that it takes me a few minutes to loot and clear out a place versus repeating that process a huge number of times hoping RNG swings in my favor to loot multiple of the same things so I can break down in order to craft something. Not to mention the huge cost to max out the crafting in the first place via attribute points. I'm not complaining about it, as I've enjoyed it thus far, personally. I just fail to see how anyone can have some grudge against crafting when it takes a pretty big investment.

[FA_Q2]

If you cannot craft the best items, then why craft? This will become the primary problem with A18, there will be no reason to craft.

 

Once you have scavenged your T6 weapon, what will be your motivation to scavenge further?

Oh, a T6 weapon which has a chance of being a tiny margin better? I don't think so.

 

I'm not annoyed, though. It's merely shifting the method for obtaining reward from INT+mats to PER+RNG.

 

Because, if you actually are specializing, you are going to gain access to good T5 equipment FAR earlier than finding the same for your main combat style.

 

As an INT build, my baton and one of my turrets were crafted until around day 60. All my other items were found in loot. Seems like a fairly decent system thus far - crafting equipment has essentially been regulated to filling gaps and ensuring that RNG Jesus dies not determine what your character needs to main in.

[Shillen]

Going past 7 in an attribute is ridiculously not worth it. I don't get why the massive ramp up in point cost for attributes past 7 when the top level perks are nothing special.