[A17] Meat and Seeds

[Redlotus]

So I was just looking for threads that had discussions about the meat 5:1 ratio and the seeds 4:1 ratio and thought I'd comment on them.

 

Meat

I modded out the meat 5:1 and changed it to a 1:1 ratio and find that it is overkill because of the amount of meat you get per kill.

 

The reason I modded it out to begin with was because to me if you are getting a piece single piece of meat from an animal that should be more than sufficient enough to make a piece of charred meat you can eat or bacon for bacon and eggs.

 

Now that I have tried it I realize that a 1:1 meat ratio just produces too much. I think maybe either making it a 2:1 ratio or just lowering the amount of meat you get from animals may be more balanced.

 

Seeds

Seeds, while it seems odd that it would take 4 corn to make 1 corn seed, lowering this to 1 corn for 1 seed is also overkill if you run into a town that has a farm in it and you get a ton of corn/potatoes/blueberries etc. I also found gating the ability to make seeds kind of silly, but I kept it in for testing. I wound up with some much corn and potatoes after I got the skill unlocked that I could semi-understand why they set it to 4:1 and also why they gated the seed making ability. Does it make sense ....no.

 

In the real world 1 meat should make 1 meat and while 1 corn should make more than 1 seed in the real world...I think 4 corn making 1 seeds is beyond silly.

 

EDIT: I do realize it's a game...and not the real world ... hah

[JaxTeller718]

So I was just looking for threads that had discussions about the meat 5:1 ratio and the seeds 4:1 ratio and thought I'd comment on them.

 

Meat

I modded out the meat 5:1 and changed it to a 1:1 ratio and find that it is overkill because of the amount of meat you get per kill.

 

The reason I modded it out to begin with was because to me if you are getting a piece single piece of meat from an animal that should be more than sufficient enough to make a piece of charred meat you can eat or bacon for bacon and eggs.

 

Now that I have tried it I realize that a 1:1 meat ratio just produces too much. I think maybe either making it a 2:1 ratio or just lowering the amount of meat you get from animals may be more balanced.

 

Seeds

Seeds, while it seems odd that it would take 4 corn to make 1 corn seed, lowering this to 1 corn for 1 seed is also overkill if you run into a town that has a farm in it and you get a ton of corn/potatoes/blueberries etc. I also found gating the ability to make seeds kind of silly, but I kept it in for testing. I wound up with some much corn and potatoes after I got the skill unlocked that I could semi-understand why they set it to 4:1 and also why they gated the seed making ability. Does it make sense ....no.

 

In the real world 1 meat should make 1 meat and while 1 corn should make more than 1 seed in the real world...I think 4 corn making 1 seeds is beyond silly.

 

Seeds: Considering once you plant one, you never ever need to plant another one again Id say it is more than fair. For every 5 corn you punch, you make a seed. In a few weeks you will have a HUGE garden, and that is NOT taking into account the corn that's found in the world which is in NO short supply so all this seed complaining is silly to me. By making it one for one you're actually giving yourself a 4x advantage. Make sure you mod out the regrowable plant too to keep it fair.

 

Meat: On the surface it seems like 5 is a lot but considering a green pig can give you over 100 and normal ones can give you 10 or more it is also very fair. Hopefully you remember to lower the harvest on the pigs. I mean getting 12 meat and then cooking 12 grilled meat... that's kinda overpowered don't you think?

 

Always remember to keep that balance

[Redlotus]

Seeds: Considering once you plant one, you never ever need to plant another one again Id say it is more than fair. For every 5 corn you punch, you make a seed. In a few weeks you will have a HUGE garden, and that is NOT taking into account the corn that's found in the world which is in NO short supply so all this seed complaining is silly to me. By making it one for one you're actually giving yourself a 4x advantage. Make sure you mod out the regrowable plant too to keep it fair.

 

Meat: On the surface it seems like 5 is a lot but considering a green pig can give you over 100 and normal ones can give you 10 or more it is also very fair. Hopefully you remember to lower the harvest on the pigs. I mean getting 12 meat and then cooking 12 grilled meat... that's kinda overpowered don't you think?

 

Always remember to keep that balance

 

Well that was the point, I wasn't complaining about it so much as just found it a little too unrealistic, but of course that's the issue game realism versus game balance. Gotta find the balance

[HerrKingsley]

I was thinking abut this. First I was like WTF!!!

 

But then I thought about planting IRL and it's rare that you have 100% of a healty plant from every seed. So I can live with that.

 

But the meat ratio i don't like. So I looked through the XML and was planning on having 1 to 1 meat ratio in cocking but lowering the amount of good meat you harvest.

 

ex. you get 30 meat in total from a pig with a bone shiv.

But since you have no knowledge of butchering, and you do it with a dirty bone shiv chances are that you get a lot of inedible meat (rotten flesh)

So you get maybe 5 flesh meat and 25 rotten flesh.

 

Leveling The Huntsman skill and using a hunting knife will gain more fresh meat and less rotten meat.

 

I haven't had time to see if its even possible to mod but that is my plan.

[ggoblin]

One thing is balance. The other is... I just feel. I feel that putting a piece of meat on the grill should result in a piece of grilled meat. Using an ear of corn should result in, say, 100 seeds. I would much rather see things like "this one didn't sprout because (whatever - real reason or RNG)", "rats ate these" or anything like that. I'm all in for a small mini-game of farming (needing to tend the field, weed it, water it...) to make farming more entertaining and challenging at the same time.

Then you can either sow thin (one seed in one place, kinda Walking Dead style, praying that it will sprout) or thick (say 5 seeds sown až once, making the change bigger. Because right now, whatever you sow, you reap - unless you throw a pipe bomb that way.

 

Just my two cents.

[Khulkhuum]

Concerning using the bone shiv - it's similar with the hunting knife and machete. One minute you're using it to hit zombies, the next you're cutting down animals with it. In overall it would require a mechanism for cleaning the blade in order to not get like 50% of meat as rotten (i would call it tainted meat, which gives some higher level sickness, but can be cleaned).

 

Concerning seeds, i find the idea of growing crops and having to tend to them as interesting, but at the same time see how it can be tedious. Imagine you have to tend all by yourself to a big garden full of cotton, goldenrod, chrisantenum, potatoes, corn, yucca, aloe, mushrooms and anything else they will add in the future, where each plant has a row of 20-30 plants (because up to 50% will not grow and you want as much as possible). Even if you have 10 plants each of each type, that's quite a big field you got there. Now check every plant if it's okay...

 

Unless there's any additions to stop the weeds/bugs from destroying your harvest or any automation for such things, this will mostly appeal to the hardcore gamers. Mods will surely use it in some way, but i don't see it in vanilla.

[Weazelsun]

Hm, I actually find the ratio to be fair, since cooked food does give a lot of stamina + health, also gives an incentive to be out and about in the world.

[PoppaTot]

This was one of the most perplexing things to me when A17 came out. Why up the meat harvest amount and the meat needed for cooking amount. Seems like the old way was fine to me. Looks like a change for change sake only unless I'm missing something?

[Aerial]

This was one of the most perplexing things to me when A17 came out. Why up the meat harvest amount and the meat needed for cooking amount. Seems like the old way was fine to me. Looks like a change for change sake only unless I'm missing something?

 

The reason is to provide better granularity. If a recipe uses one meat, then you can't have a perk that lets you use 20% less meat per recipe. But if that recipe takes 5 meat, your 20% reduction perk means you only need 4.

[Krougal]

People need to let go of realism, some things are just better left abstract.

 

So as a couple people brought up about not being professional butchers, dirty knife...kinda already factored in in a way; 1 properly butchered pig or deer would feed you for a very long time. It isn't practical in the game because we would all hunt 1 and be done unless they added spoilage. Having to deal with spoilage isn't a fun game mechanic(try Empyrion). I don't think having to find some way to wash the knife in game would be fun either. So yeah, I accept that I'm only going to get a few meals out of an animal in the game, and that unless I have 5 pieces of bacon and 2 eggs it just isn't worth being arsed to cook breakfast.

 

Having still not really gotten around to farming, if we don't need to replant now the whole perkline and amount of seeds needed makes more sense. My initial mis-impression it didn't make any sense at all to farm, certainly not before maxing the perkline. As said above, gardening is a very time consuming chore and I don't want to spend all my time in game doing it, and there are farm simulators if I did want to. So I accept my crappy half-tended garden output isn't optimal.

 

A16 there was too much for sure. In the end, I was throwing down 100 corn on unfertilized plots and keep about 20 fertilized plots that I just rotated whatever I was running short on, and I couldn't even be bothered to harvest that half the time. And that is with biofuel and mass booze production being worthwhile.

 

The reason is to provide better granularity. If a recipe uses one meat, then you can't have a perk that lets you use 20% less meat per recipe. But if that recipe takes 5 meat, your 20% reduction perk means you only need 4.

 

Yeah, this too. Even though they don't do it, they've left the backdoor there for themselves or modders.

 

[PoppaTot]

The reason is to provide better granularity. If a recipe uses one meat, then you can't have a perk that lets you use 20% less meat per recipe. But if that recipe takes 5 meat, your 20% reduction perk means you only need 4.

 

That makes sense, guess I was missing something haha.

 

EDIT: In all honesty, I never do any food farms at all or perks except to suppress metabolism. I always use bacon and eggs now, or charred meat. I have a guy on the server that does a farm lol.

[vonstorm]

I always hoped that the zombies would "thrash" through crops, meaning you needed to keep them out. But with the new block damage, Im glad it isnt a thing.

[Redlotus]

People need to let go of realism, some things are just better left abstract.

 

I could agree with this it's one of those things I just find odd is all. I mean I think with Huntsman perk and that ability to gather more meat from animals is great, but really they should just leave it at 1:1, lower the amount you harvest.... and then let the perk do it's thing. It's a personal choice really and that's why I love the ability to mod things and do testing and see what works best for myself and the players on my server.