An orphenage - new POI

[Robson82]

I have an idea for a new POI - an orphanage.
I'm not sure what the law or political correctness says about including non-adult NPCs in the game as zombies. But I'm 99% sure is not allowed.

These NPCs should be very fast and extremely creepy and unpredictible.

Just imagine the sound of crying or sometimes laughing children in the background of a very dark house... F..g nightmare. 😛 
What do you think?

[Roland]

The Zombies of Penzance?

 

 

ChatGPT came through!

 

(Verse 1) Oh, we are the Zombie orphans of Penzance, lost souls of the night,

In the world of 7 Days to Die, where there's no end in sight.

No families to call our own, no homes where we reside,

Just a band of forsaken souls, in the darkness, we confide.

 

(Chorus) The Zombie orphans of Penzance, we roam the land so free,

In a post-apocalyptic world, where the living fear to be.

With rotting limbs and vacant stares, we march in endless trance,

Oh, we are the Zombie orphans of Penzance!

 

(Verse 2) Abandoned and forsaken, in this desolate terrain,

No love, no warmth, no tender care, only hunger, fear, and pain.

We may be undead, but we yearn for a family's sweet embrace,

In this eternal night, we seek a more compassionate place.

 

(Chorus)

 

(Verse 3) In the ruins of Penzance, we found each other's kin,

Our hearts may not beat, but they are capable of feeling within.

Together we'll endure, in this world so dark and bleak,

As the Zombie orphans of Penzance, our bond is what we seek.

 

(Chorus)

 

[OneManStanding]

They have an abandoned day care, so an abandoned orphanage building wouldn't be a bother. But the Pimps have said before they will not add zombie kids to the game. Modders, maybe.

[pApA^LeGBa]

I am pretty sure there was or is an orphanage POI in the files. From somewhere around A14 or A15. Never made it to the game but someone made a custom POI out of it, think i saw it in compopack. 

But yeah, kids will never happen in vanilla. Age of Oblivion mod has the scout girl.

[Matt115]

On 11/5/2023 at 9:57 PM, Roland said:

The Zombies of Penzance?

 

 

ChatGPT came through!

 

(Verse 1) Oh, we are the Zombie orphans of Penzance, lost souls of the night,

In the world of 7 Days to Die, where there's no end in sight.

No families to call our own, no homes where we reside,

Just a band of forsaken souls, in the darkness, we confide.

 

(Chorus) The Zombie orphans of Penzance, we roam the land so free,

In a post-apocalyptic world, where the living fear to be.

With rotting limbs and vacant stares, we march in endless trance,

Oh, we are the Zombie orphans of Penzance!

 

(Verse 2) Abandoned and forsaken, in this desolate terrain,

No love, no warmth, no tender care, only hunger, fear, and pain.

We may be undead, but we yearn for a family's sweet embrace,

In this eternal night, we seek a more compassionate place.

 

(Chorus)

 

(Verse 3) In the ruins of Penzance, we found each other's kin,

Our hearts may not beat, but they are capable of feeling within.

Together we'll endure, in this world so dark and bleak,

As the Zombie orphans of Penzance, our bond is what we seek.

 

(Chorus)

 

It's pretty good peom after all XD

Well while zombie kids would have sense that orphange not at all. Well,... orphanages in USA don't exist anymore

On 11/6/2023 at 7:22 PM, OneManStanding said:

They have an abandoned day care, so an abandoned orphanage building wouldn't be a bother. But the Pimps have said before they will not add zombie kids to the game. Modders, maybe.

nah. It would be already  added. They prefere to add demons and aliens xd

On 11/8/2023 at 1:05 PM, pApA^LeGBa said:

But yeah, kids will never happen in vanilla. Age of Oblivion mod has the scout girl.

this is so often used model in many assets flips.  I remember one person used Alma too. 

I wish TFP made something more serious in days gone or  nmrih2 style instead put goofy stuff like new armors design etc.

[4sheetzngeegles]

Here is an interesting comparison. Ever so often someone presents the Idea of child zombies
in the game, and why TFP doesn't have them.

 

Comparisons 

Writer Leigh Whannell  SAW           Budget:  $1,200,000.00      box office $103,880,027.00
Writer Leigh Whannell  INSIDIOUS Budget:  $1,500,000.00      box office $99,870,886.00
Writer Leigh Whannell  COOTIES    Budget:    unknown            box office $581,135.00     This one had Frodo hobbit as main character. They beat the living

"......" out of the kid zombies, dissected one, and blew them up for good measure. And the baby got eaten in the van, too.

 

Writers  Joo-Suk ParkSang-ho Yeon Budget: $16,000,000.00     box office $130,741,827.00 This one croaked the adults,teens, and old people
but the kid survived.

 

Writers  Patrick MeltonMarcus Dunstan  Feast budget: $3,200,000.00  Box office: $690,872.00 This is the antihero movie, you step up
and you get stepped on. The kid was the second one to get gobbled up by the creatures. Part 2 the baby got thrown up in the air and couldn't fly,

Well you know what happened after that.            This $$$total includes the two sequels.

 

Writers: The FunPimps  7 days to die Budget: Their own start up                                  steam box office: 16+ millions  copies sold
Hypothetical Writers: The FunPimps  The 7th day Zombie Orphanage Massacre         steam box office:  It'll never happen

Until the court public opinion becomes jaded enough to accept it, Adult men, the elderly, women, and teens, are acceptable candidates
for evisceration and mutilation. But kids are a nonstarter.

Although...... "It could happen"             not.  

The odds of success just ain't very favorable that's all.

[Matt115]

7 hours ago, 4sheetzngeegles said:

Here is an interesting comparison. Ever so often someone presents the Idea of child zombies
in the game, and why TFP doesn't have them.

 

Comparisons 

Writer Leigh Whannell  SAW           Budget:  $1,200,000.00      box office $103,880,027.00
Writer Leigh Whannell  INSIDIOUS Budget:  $1,500,000.00      box office $99,870,886.00
Writer Leigh Whannell  COOTIES    Budget:    unknown            box office $581,135.00     This one had Frodo hobbit as main character. They beat the living

"......" out of the kid zombies, dissected one, and blew them up for good measure. And the baby got eaten in the van, too.

 

Writers  Joo-Suk ParkSang-ho Yeon Budget: $16,000,000.00     box office $130,741,827.00 This one croaked the adults,teens, and old people
but the kid survived.

 

Writers  Patrick MeltonMarcus Dunstan  Feast budget: $3,200,000.00  Box office: $690,872.00 This is the antihero movie, you step up
and you get stepped on. The kid was the second one to get gobbled up by the creatures. Part 2 the baby got thrown up in the air and couldn't fly,

Well you know what happened after that.            This $$$total includes the two sequels.

 

Writers: The FunPimps  7 days to die Budget: Their own start up                                  steam box office: 16+ millions  copies sold
Hypothetical Writers: The FunPimps  The 7th day Zombie Orphanage Massacre         steam box office:  It'll never happen

Until the court public opinion becomes jaded enough to accept it, Adult men, the elderly, women, and teens, are acceptable candidates
for evisceration and mutilation. But kids are a nonstarter.

Although...... "It could happen"             not.  

The odds of success just ain't very favorable that's all.

 

First zombie movie had zombie kid 😜

[Matt115]

On 11/8/2023 at 1:05 PM, pApA^LeGBa said:

I am pretty sure there was or is an orphanage POI in the files. From somewhere around A14 or A15. Never made it to the game but someone made a custom POI out of it, think i saw it in compopack. 

But yeah, kids will never happen in vanilla. Age of Oblivion mod has the scout girl.

To be honest - it could be added like Total War Blood DLc Dlc ( many studios use DLC to exploit  countries law and PEGI) and everyone would be happy

[pApA^LeGBa]

43 minutes ago, Matt115 said:

To be honest - it could be added like Total War Blood DLc Dlc ( many studios use DLC to exploit  countries law and PEGI) and everyone would be happy

 

From what i know it´s not about laws and PEGI, i think they said they simply don´t want any controversy around it and also personal preference from them. It´s been a while since i read about that though.

[Matt115]

6 hours ago, pApA^LeGBa said:

 

From what i know it´s not about laws and PEGI, i think they said they simply don´t want any controversy around it and also personal preference from them. It´s been a while since i read about that though.

Well.. i don't see where is controversy here if it was since George Romeo movie. Like literaly first zombie movie had zombie kid as first special zombie type

[4sheetzngeegles]

History and a few things horror:  To paraphrase  GuppyCur "no visual proof and it didn't happen"
So here goes.

 

The first Vampire movie Nosferatu 1929,  No I was not born then, But i have watched it.

 

First Zombie movie: Was more of a voodoo created zombie: Bela Lugosi White Zombie 1932
He was the First "Dracula" character. But, was the second vampire movie and made it popular.

 

George Romero Night of the Living Dead October 1, 1968  Box office $30,087,064.00
George Romero Dawn of the dead  January 1, 1978         Box office $55,000,000.00
Based on his literary works, and, were proven lucrative in the theatre.

 

Over time people got use to seeing it and creators started to push the limits.

 

Hays Code The Motion Picture Production Code was a set of industry guidelines for the self-censorship
of content that was applied to most motion pictures released by major studios. followed by
Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) now just MPA To cover a wider scope, of regulatory opinion,
regarding Visual media to the public. Basically the big brother of what is sanctioned or non-sanctioned.

Life Before 1993

 

The first social media was 1978, It was made popular by AOL 1992, and entrenched in 2004 by Facebook

 

April 30, 1993
The World Wide Web became available to the broader public 30 years ago On April 30, 1993,
the World Wide Web was released into the public domain. It revolutionized the internet and
allowed users to create websites filled with graphics, audio and hyperlinks.

 

Activity began to explode in 2000, when Google became the client search engine for one of the Web's
most popular sites, Yahoo!. By 2004, when Yahoo! dispensed with Google's services, users were searching
on Google 200 million times a day.

 

2003 PEGI (Pan European Game Information) is the European age-rating system for video games.

 

So basically there are two courts, vying for control, public opinion and reputation.

 

The whole point of business is to make something that is accepted, and is financially positive.
Spock said it best "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the ONE". They have kept
that line in each reiteration of Star Trek, and so have the regulatory commissions stayed.

 

Thenumbers.com
***https://www.the-numbers.com/movies/year/1982***    Just change the four digit year to
get an overview of movie release from before and now. 1915 to the present.

Edited November 27, 2023 by 4sheetzngeegles (see edit history)

[meganoth]

On 11/26/2023 at 3:15 PM, Matt115 said:

 

First zombie movie had zombie kid 😜

 

Well, the zombie kid did the stabbing and eating but never got shot at, killed or mutilated with a chainsaw. Some people are fine with this in a movie, but may not be fine with a zombie kid getting killed by the player.

 

This is not the same but similar to big spiders in a game. Many people can't play with them in a game, some other people would like to have them, but it isn't an essential part of any game that isn't specifically about spiders so they usually do not get implemented in games.

 

[Syphon583]

On 11/26/2023 at 2:18 PM, Matt115 said:

Well.. i don't see where is controversy here if it was since George Romeo movie. Like literaly first zombie movie had zombie kid as first special zombie type

Just to add on to what meganoth is saying, you can't really compare elements of a movie to similar elements in a game. They're not apple-to-apples, so to speak. The main reason for this is due point of view. When you're watching a movie, no one cares that the bad terrorists are shooting up a crowded location. Maybe an impactful moment, but that's literally expected by the terrorist character - no controversy. Now, change your point of view to first person. You are playing a game and you are one of the terrorists shooting up a crowded airport. This is literally what happened with Call of Duty: MW2 and it caused tons of controversy because the game put the player-character in a position where they were causing harm to innocent people.

 

Now, is a zombie child the same thing? Certainly not. These two scenarios are not apples-to-apples, but the idea is the same. The game would be putting the player-character in a situation that might make the player feel uncomfortable. "But hey it's a zombie that's trying to eat you!" Very true, which is why many players feel it's a non-issue. However, it's not that outlandish to think that other players might feel uneasy with the idea of shooting an entity that looks like a child and I am completely fine with TFP making the decision to not include them based on their idea of what makes a game enjoyable for all players.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Syphon583 (see edit history)

[4sheetzngeegles]

That long post above, was only long because there is a lot that happened to govern the acceptability of

situations in media. "before 1993"  If you read the color coded excerpt it abridges it.

 

Things were not regulated as strictly or efficiently before the internet became mainstream.

 

Whether its public released movie, public released game, or public released literal media.

The common denominator is public. Which agreed with or not is regulated.

 

 

[Matt115]

33 minutes ago, meganoth said:

 

Well, the zombie kid did the stabbing and eating but never got shot at, killed or mutilated with a chainsaw. Some people are fine with this in a movie, but may not be fine with a zombie kid getting killed by the player.

 

This is not the same but similar to big spiders in a game. Many people can't play with them in a game, some other people would like to have them, but it isn't an essential part of any game that isn't specifically about spiders so they usually do not get implemented in games.

 

Never got a shot but... number of killed zombie in this movie is... realy low after all compare to let's say  Resident evil movies. But in sequel you have killed zombie kids - 

 

3:25

Yep again George Romero 

 

Okay if you take example about spiders : Agree that some people have anachrofobia yet spiders are pretty common enemy type  in games  that have many enemy types don't you think? 

Might and Magic Dark messiah, Skyrim,  Starfield,  King's Bounty , Final Fantasy,  Diablo,  Resident evil. ARK,  Conan , call of duty etc. 

and it's just example about big brands 

 

So it's realy common enemies like skeletons and orcs. Okay is cod game about spiders? nope. But it's was added and this spiders is pretty big ( if you don't believe check cod wiki). So this argument would have sense if not fact that big spiders are  realy popular in games except fact that some people are scared about them. and in most of this game you don't expect spiders right?  

 

 

10 minutes ago, Syphon583 said:

Just to add on to what meganoth is saying, you can't really compare elements of a movie to similar elements in a game. They're not apple-to-apples, so to speak. The main reason for this is due point of view. When you're watching a movie, no one cares that the bad terrorists are shooting up a crowded location. Maybe an impactful moment, but that's literally expected by the terrorist character - no controversy. Now, change your point of view to first person. You are playing a game and you are one of the terrorists shooting up a crowded airport. This is literally what happened with Call of Duty: MW2 and it caused tons of controversy because the game put the player-character in a position where they were causing harm to innocent people.

 

Now, is a zombie child the same thing? Certainly not. These two scenarios are not apples-to-apples, but the idea is the same. The game would be putting the player-character in a situation that might make the player feel uncomfortable. "But hey it's a zombie that's trying to eat you!" Very true, which is why many players feel it's a non-issue. However, it's not that outlandish to think that other players might feel uneasy with the idea of shooting an entity that looks like a child and I am completely fine with TFP making the decision to not include them based on their idea of what makes a game enjoyable for all players.

Well yep even in movies can make controversy. You know that in some countires { don't go into politic so i will write in general) such movies are pretty often banned because "don't repesent National's Value" - so typical propaganda situation. Well it caused controversy but problem is diffrent place. people should considering " what if things like this happens in our world, what if my country governament do such things of national buisness" which is realy problem not " killing civilians in video game" - it's pretty like "find out" false problem to cover true problem.

 

Feeling uncomfortable kinda is point of post apo -  it's place when you kill your  "ex neigbour" because he found can with tomatoes.  It's like exepect that Jason in friday 13 th nobody kill is kinda stupid. 

 

Remember - zombies are not human anymore. it's just walking corpse.  " 's not that outlandish to think that other players might feel uneasy with the idea of shooting an entity that looks like a child"  is pretty often trope in zombie movie { even i had something like that in two vampire movies ) -  there is someone and this person see zombie kid. this person is not able to kill it because " it's just a child😭" then is biten ( which usualy lead that everyone die because of this person behaviour) / is saved by "hardener" survivor who  then make this person open his/her eyes  by saying stuff like " listen fool. it wasn't child it was monster. If will bite off you face if you allow it so get up and use your brain or put yourself bullet into brain so at least you won't bite someone".

 

This same in  game - people can became this hardener survivor who care about survive and be baddas or end like this scared person aka left a game.

 

I woudn't be such " stubborn"  if not TFP behaviour. i will give you example -  dead rising 4 is typical goofy game from begining. so something like that cound't suit.

While 7dtd - CUT OFF YOUR VEINS USING GLASS! For me this option is much more edgy that  Zombie kid. so pretty erratic behaviour.  It's like mom was @%$# off that kid watch dragon ball because " VIOLENCE CARTOON" then spank this child using belt. 

And always sombody  will be uneasy - killing bandits? "NOOOO THEY ARE LIVING PEOPLE 😭"

 

7DTD is about postapo and zombies. So if action of zombie game take place in dunno - Secret base then lack of zombie kids have sense. in cities or civilian home nope.

 

This same like... Painkiller.  Action of this game is set in hell - but not demon focused like Doom but sinner focused. So... Can drunkers be sinners? yep that's why are in game. can Police be bad? yep. Can priests can go to hell? yeah. This same kids can be sinners/bad and go to hell. That's why you have few types of them... because it just have sense - many kids do realy bad things. This same like doctors, actors, soldiers, monks or ... nuclear plant workers.

 

So if "damned" kids have sense in game set in hell then  zombie kids have a lot of sense in zombie game set in mostly "civilian" places

 

 

 

 

[meganoth]

On 12/1/2023 at 6:56 PM, Matt115 said:

Okay if you take example about spiders : Agree that some people have anachrofobia yet spiders are pretty common enemy type  in games  that have many enemy types don't you think? 

Might and Magic Dark messiah, Skyrim,  Starfield,  King's Bounty , Final Fantasy,  Diablo,  Resident evil. ARK,  Conan , call of duty etc. 

and it's just example about big brands 

 

So it's realy common enemies like skeletons and orcs. Okay is cod game about spiders? nope. But it's was added and this spiders is pretty big ( if you don't believe check cod wiki). So this argument would have sense if not fact that big spiders are  realy popular in games except fact that some people are scared about them. and in most of this game you don't expect spiders right? 

 

And I could probably list even more games with many animal or enemy types that DON'T have spiders. Or have a switch to turn off spiders. There is no controversy around spiders like it is with zombie kids just the fear to lose some customers, so the incentive to avoid them is much less. I did say the two cases are not the same. They are not, they just have some similarities. 

 

Likewise you can and actually have listed games that include zombie kids, which proves nothing and doesn't invalidate the point that many game developers avoid implementing them.

 

And you are correct that even games not needing spiders thematically can have spiders included, but that wasn't my point. My point was that they are optional in most games, just like zombie kids are optional EVEN in zombie games.

 

Edited December 2, 2023 by meganoth (see edit history)

[BFT2020]

2 hours ago, Matt115 said:

Might and Magic Dark messiah, Skyrim,  Starfield,  King's Bounty , Final Fantasy,  Diablo,  Resident evil. ARK,  Conan , call of duty etc. 

and it's just example about big brands 

 

I thought this was interesting, but Skyrim and Fallout, they have it coded in the game that you can't kill kids.  AAA gaming development company that decided they are not going to give players the choice of killing kids, yet both franchises are very profitable for them.  No kids in Conan, and I don't think Call of Duty had kids in it to kill (though CoD with the airport attack mission, that was brutal.  I skipped over that one).

 

TFP doesn't want to include kid zombies in their game, that is their choice.  If you want to maim zombie kids in your game, then find a mod that allows you to do it.

[Matt115]

On 12/1/2023 at 7:49 PM, meganoth said:

 

And I could probably list even more games with many animal or enemy types that DON'T have spiders. Or have a switch to turn off spiders. There is no controversy around spiders like it is with zombie kids just the fear to lose some customers, so the incentive to avoid them is much less. I did say the two cases are not the same. They are not, they just have some similarities. 

 

Likewise you can and actually have listed games that include zombie kids, which proves nothing and doesn't invalidate the point that many game developers avoid implementing them.

 

And you are correct that even games not needing spiders thematically can have spiders included, but that wasn't my point. My point was that they are optional in most games, just like zombie kids are optional EVEN in zombie games.

 

And there is pretty many games without robots,  ninja and vampire. Yet they are realy common enemy types don't matter about setting and type of game right?

So - there TONS where spider enemies or variation about spiders are one of the enemy type. like maybe 80% fantasy type game have spider/bug enemy.

Well there was controversy about spiders in skyrim. People pretty demands to change into something else. that's why someone made mode when spiders are change into bears.  

source : The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim - mod dla cierpiących na arachnofobię – CD-Action (cdaction.pl)

 

And one of biggest thing that prove i'm right is.. Days gone and Dead Space. Both made by big companies who cares mostly about money not art etc. yet decided to implement it while it's pretty strange in Dead space 1 because.... mining ships with babies? anyway using this logic - every type of enemy is optional - do every fantasy game have orcs? nope. Undead? nope.  Werewolfs etc? nope.  

So you can expect some enemies - if you have indiana jones or tomb rider you can expect Living mumies in Egypt and undead  Pirates in  Tropical island. If you have WW2 set on east front  game - you expect at least few panzer IV. If you have human kingdom/empire/domion  set in kinda medieval like world you can expect knight riding on horses/deers etc. 

So - if 7dtd was set in for example : secret island gov then lack of zombie kids would have sense but lack of zombie sniper or officer don''

 

23 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

 

I thought this was interesting, but Skyrim and Fallout, they have it coded in the game that you can't kill kids.

mistake.  You can killing kids in Fallout 1 and 2. 

23 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

 

 AAA gaming development company that decided they are not going to give players the choice of killing kids, yet both franchises are very profitable for them. 

Okay living one or undead only ? examples

For living ones: 

MGS 5 but you can't kill children soldiers but your job is knock them down.  So still enemies

A plague tale  requiem - you have to kill your younger brother while he is 6 years old

Baldur's gate

 

undead ones :

Dante inferno - EA

Dead Space - Babies in 1 , babies and teens in 2 , infected alien version in 3 + human in dead space 3

Days gone - Sony 

dying light 1 - Techland

Prey 1 - Human head studio

Silent hill

i can't decided if alive or undead :

RE 7 and 8 - Capcome

Fatal frame- KOEI

Dark souls

 

23 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

  No kids in Conan, and I don't think Call of Duty had kids in it to kill (though CoD with the airport attack mission, that was brutal.  I skipped over that one).

Live kid and undead kid in both diffrent things.  I think kids bandits would be bad idea and personal don't like it. Zombie kids are fine if it's suitable to setting. 

 

Btw. why did you skip it?

 

23 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

 

TFP doesn't want to include kid zombies in their game, that is their choice.  If you want to maim zombie kids in your game, then find a mod that allows you to do it.

 

Well... there was mode for one time but is dead like many mods. Well - to be honest i want... realistic variants not just kids.

For example : police riot , much more civilian variants, more soliders type,  crap this mutants which looks just bad ( older spider and  screamer concept were much better).

Okay why zombie kids are so used by me ? simple - because grounded variants of enemies number is realy limited. Most zombie animals looks too goofy or not suitable to setting (elephans in USA? xd). so kinda NMRIH2 done only "walking dead " style enemy types. But if someone would made such mode i would appreciate that

[Syphon583]

On 12/2/2023 at 1:19 PM, Matt115 said:

Btw. why did you skip it?

Not trying to speak for BFT, but he literally said in the previous sentence, that mission was brutal. It sounds like it was a scenario which made him uncomfortable as a player. Every player is different and what is completely fine for one player might be uncomfortable for another. There is no judgement here, by the way. If you are the type of player who would not find it objectionable to have zombie kids in the game or play an undercover terrorist shooting up an airport full of people, that's fine. Other players might not like it.

 

As opposed to BFT, I chose to play that airport mission in COD. However I am also one of the players who do not want zombie kids in this game. TFP also appear to feel this way.

 

Mods are a great way to tailor the game to your liking. Use them.

[BFT2020]

On 12/2/2023 at 3:19 PM, Matt115 said:

mistake.  You can killing kids in Fallout 1 and 2. 

 

Btw. why did you skip it?

 

Not a mistake.  Note I said Skyrim and Fallout.  Bethesda published both of them.  Fallout 1 and 2 were from a different developer who was okay with kids being killed in their games.  Also note those games were not as graphically advanced as Fallout 3+ / Skyrim.  Would the the F1/2 developers be okay with kids being killed in their games if they had the same graphics / gore system?  We don't know, but it was their choice to have that option while Bethesda choose not to go that route.

 

Because I didn't feel that mission added anything to the game and the thought of mowing down innocent people (even though they are fictional and virtual) was too much.  I also don't put thralls on the wheel of pain and do any of the sorcerer sacrifices in Conan Exiles - I just admin that stuff in.

 

If TFP make a complete 180 and add zombie kids so you can maim them to your heart's delight, then that is a choice they can make.  If they do, I will promptly mod them out.  On the other hand, if they stay the course and not put them in the game, then that is also their choice.  For those that want zombie kids in the game, ask around and maybe someone will make a mod for you.

[meganoth]

On 12/2/2023 at 9:19 PM, Matt115 said:

And one of biggest thing that prove i'm right is.. Days gone and Dead Space. Both made by big companies who cares mostly about money not art etc. yet decided to implement it while it's pretty strange in Dead space 1 because.... mining ships with babies?

 

I can't judge the companies of DG and DS, but both surely have creative people in it who work differently than the money-grabbing managers and the managers know quite well they can't succeed without the creative people and a game-done-by-numbers. It isn't that simple.

 

Secondly, at least dead space looks like it was intended as horror for the 18-and-up crowd with no compromises. Once you go that way then a few taboo breaks won't cost you many customers and instead increase word-of-mouth and get you new customers. Case in point this quote from wikipedia: "Initially, Dead Space Community Manager Andrew Green stated that Germany, China and Japan banned the game. However, it was confirmed that this was a marketing ploy and that Dead Space was not banned in any country". Oh look, they tried to milk the market niche they were targeting to the fullest 😉

Now, what did it get them? Remember, as a few commenters here said, it is a niche. Quote Wikipedia: "The game, along with Mirror's Edge, was considered a commercial disappointment following its extensive marketing. ... In February 2009, Electronic Arts CFO Eric Brown confirmed that all versions of Dead Space had sold one million copies worldwide.". Okay, so extensive marketing and as we know fabulous reviews across the board and the game sold a measly million copies after 1.5 years! Maybe in this case, without the kid-horror, it would have been even less. But that doesn't mean other games not strictly targeting the extreme horror fringe would experience the same.

 

 

[Matt115]

On 12/5/2023 at 5:47 PM, Syphon583 said:

Not trying to speak for BFT, but he literally said in the previous sentence, that mission was brutal. It sounds like it was a scenario which made him uncomfortable as a player. Every player is different and what is completely fine for one player might be uncomfortable for another. There is no judgement here, by the way. If you are the type of player who would not find it objectionable to have zombie kids in the game or play an undercover terrorist shooting up an airport full of people, that's fine. Other players might not like it.

 

As opposed to BFT, I chose to play that airport mission in COD. However I am also one of the players who do not want zombie kids in this game. TFP also appear to feel this way.

 

Mods are a great way to tailor the game to your liking. Use them.

 

Not undercover terrorist but CIA agent that work undercover - this is totaly diffrent. To not explain all cod lore - in real life often police use undearcovers agents to deal with gangs that would be impossible to do in diffrent way. Yeah Cops have to do bad things but it's stop even worst things so...  well  you don't play there as terrorist

 

12 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

 

Not a mistake.  Note I said Skyrim and Fallout.  Bethesda published both of them.  Fallout 1 and 2 were from a different developer who was okay with kids being killed in their games.  Also note those games were not as graphically advanced as Fallout 3+ / Skyrim.  Would the the F1/2 developers be okay with kids being killed in their games if they had the same graphics / gore system?  We don't know, but it was their choice to have that option while Bethesda choose not to go that route.

 

Because I didn't feel that mission added anything to the game and the thought of mowing down innocent people (even though they are fictional and virtual) was too much.  I also don't put thralls on the wheel of pain and do any of the sorcerer sacrifices in Conan Exiles - I just admin that stuff in.

 

If TFP make a complete 180 and add zombie kids so you can maim them to your heart's delight, then that is a choice they can make.  If they do, I will promptly mod them out.  On the other hand, if they stay the course and not put them in the game, then that is also their choice.  For those that want zombie kids in the game, ask around and maybe someone will make a mod for you.

 

Well hard to say : in cod 1 &  2 you coudn't kill prisoners while in cod 5 you could decided : you prefer shot off them or burn alive.  Diffrent developers. So... agree hard to say "what if".  Yeah Bethesda is now in own of Fallout brand yet still F 1&2 exist so still count .

 

I undestand. that's okay everone have diffrent vibe

 

To be honest: If TFP done 180 realistic ( let's accept mutants but  toned - resident evil licker are fine but super power wesker don't) style zombie variants without kids would be.... WoW. i'm not joking. i would be realy realy shocked that they manage to make so many zombie types ( so 20 feets gigants, Youkais , Demons, Dune Worm go to bin). i would be realy happy and even care about kids. But because they limited how big can be enemies then would be realy problem.  i was thinking how many more variants would be suit here and it would be like... 10 variants more? because : we have screamer - so adding l4d2's like boomer would be a little bit pontiless because we have fat cop. we have modify splintter already etc. so: what variants could be? 

Something like l4d2 witch. armored zombies ( but then - melee bandits would pretty pointless), gun zombies (which is good idea like re 6 zombies  with guns. Yet here it would be just less accurate bandit.. so hard to balance + custom animations after all), Juggenog in dead trigger  style (would be great but.. well someone use it so it would be hard to something similiar without copypasting and law issues) , grabbing enemy (which would be realy cool to have QTE to deal with it). 

So it's hard here to make something new except : spider --> enchanted spider. which is already done 

 

 

5 minutes ago, meganoth said:

 

I can't judge the companies of DG and DS, but both surely have creative people in it who work differently than the money-grabbing managers and the managers know quite well they can't succeed without the creative people and a game-done-by-numbers. It isn't that simple.

 

Secondly, at least dead space looks like it was intended as horror for the 18-and-up crowd with no compromises. Once you go that way then a few taboo breaks won't cost you many customers and instead increase word-of-mouth and get you new customers. Case in point this quote from wikipedia: "Initially, Dead Space Community Manager Andrew Green stated that Germany, China and Japan banned the game. However, it was confirmed that this was a marketing ploy and that Dead Space was not banned in any country". Oh look, they tried to milk the market niche they were targeting to the fullest 😉

Now, what did it get them? Remember, as a few commenters here said, it is a niche. Quote Wikipedia: "The game, along with Mirror's Edge, was considered a commercial disappointment following its extensive marketing. ... In February 2009, Electronic Arts CFO Eric Brown confirmed that all versions of Dead Space had sold one million copies worldwide.". Okay, so extensive marketing and as we know fabulous reviews across the board and the game sold a measly million copies after 1.5 years! Maybe in this case, without the kid-horror, it would have been even less. But that doesn't mean other games not strictly targeting the extreme horror fringe would experience the same.

 

 

A lot of games were banned there. Well l4d2 now get "uncut" version of l4d2 after uhh... 10 years.  Unbanned in every country would be impossible consider what Russia consider as accetable what Iran etc. So it's like stars'  World Tour Concerts which usualy are just USA, West Europe countires {while not all of them ofc) , Australia and Japan. 

Mirrors's edge didn't have chance to be popular game. It's not about marketing but type of game - Rayman origins is realy good game but it was sure it will enerate less income that Assasin Creed or Far cry. EA done realy bad decisions about let's say... PR  - microtransations in Dead space 3 + coop focused was like nail to coffin.  So undead kids wasn't problem here but... greedy about monetisation.  Yet... Dead Space get remake which show that people loved Dead Space 1. While Mirror's Edge doesn't have chance of Remake because have competition know as Ghostrunner. 

 

 But returning to 7DTD: 

I'm not tech guy. I know that problem with behemot was connected that destroying builings caused by this such type of enemy would be problem for weaker PC + AI. okay Undestable yet limiting. Melee + guns zombie nope because bandits will be too similiar. Armored? nope again because bandits.  etc. So  number of variants is pretty limited,

 

I don't see option that modders community do custom good quality animation in resonable time ( 1 - 2 years) so good looking gun zombie can go to bin ( RE 6 like not just player animation but reskined model), Well l4d2 community make explosive cares take longer that for me finish middle school. So - well... good quality zombies suitable for setting will be made but... after realy long time

[4sheetzngeegles]

It's not just the what, it's the when and how.

 

Here are two examples a movie, and a game.

The movie, Dawn of the Dead 1978, is the what. The how and when is historically before Hays Code and MPA
gain enough influence to officially censor what by opinion, was\is publicly acceptable for distribution.  A for instance,
if one makes a movie about an attack on a potus, they make money. If you make a public statement, they make the
watch list.

 

release date Jan 2015
The game Dying light, Note: that it has a zombie child as requested above, and the graphical nature of the game is
making it impossible to "officially" distribute the game in European countries and also in Australia and New Zealand.
PEGI started 2003, It became officially supported July 30 2012. Other distribution organizations gained regulatory and

censorship traction before the game release.

 

People inherently push boundaries and look for missed exploits, as a HaHa, or a self validation . Then post a video, online

for bragging rights. Then the game devs post a patch to rectify it. The point being that if the boundary is breeched before

the patch certain things are allowed. It's basically the same with the games, before and after awareness changes point of

view and opinion on a subject.

 

Hey, I live in a country that parks in a driveway, drives on a parkway, and the expressway is nearly always jammed. So
what's written above can be accepted or taken with a grain of salt.

[Syphon583]

On 12/7/2023 at 10:44 AM, Matt115 said:

Not undercover terrorist but CIA agent that work undercover

Semantics, Matt. Obviously I wasn't saying your character was a terrorist who was undercover, but that your character was undercover as a terrorist.

 

On 12/7/2023 at 10:44 AM, Matt115 said:

in real life often police use undearcovers agents to deal with gangs that would be impossible to do in diffrent way.

We're not talking about real life, Matt. Real life sucks and people, even good people, might have to do hellish things as part of their jobs. My reason for using COD as an example was simply to state the difference between how the audience might feel watching a movie and how they might feel acting out the same situation while playing a game.

 

There's literally nothing else I can say. I actually couldn't care less whether TFP choose to put zombie children in the game. However, just like you have the option to mod them in, I will have the option to mod them out. There's absolutely no reason to continue beating this dead horse (ngl, zombie horses would be cool, though).

Edited December 8, 2023 by Syphon583 (see edit history)