NPCs rescue missions

[Matt115]

23 minutes ago, meganoth said:

 

I'm not sure. Your idea seems to include that the drone or NPC is the one dictating the path. But in RWG there could be arbitrarily big objects in the way that could prevent the drone/NPC from finding a path.

 

yeah that's why drone in theory could be better that npc because flying can let them ignore mines for example . but yeah buidling can be problem and will be a lot of work with this too so it would be forced to fly only in open area. so too much works to be worth enough to be added

[MIOLOmole]

I understand, all your attempts to justify that my idea is not easy to implement, what I can't understand is that knowing that none of you are programmers, are trying to justify technical details of that idea. Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only proves that the basics of my idea can also be done ... if ever, just wanted to ... ! Because that addition is too little, for everything that's ever been done. Now, if the motive is unwilling, I have no more arguments. Cheers !

I understand, all your attempts to justify that my idea is not easy to implement, what I can't understand is that knowing that none of you are programmers, are trying to justify technical details of that idea. Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only proves that the basics of my idea can also be done ... if ever, just wanted to ... ! Because that addition is too little, for everything that's ever been done. Now, if the motive is unwilling, I have no more arguments. Cheers !

[meganoth]

1 hour ago, MIOLOmole said:

I understand, all your attempts to justify that my idea is not easy to implement, what I can't understand is that knowing that none of you are programmers, are trying to justify technical details of that idea. Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only proves that the basics of my idea can also be done ... if ever, just wanted to ... ! Because that addition is too little, for everything that's ever been done. Now, if the motive is unwilling, I have no more arguments. Cheers !

I understand, all your attempts to justify that my idea is not easy to implement, what I can't understand is that knowing that none of you are programmers, are trying to justify technical details of that idea. Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only proves that the basics of my idea can also be done ... if ever, just wanted to ... ! Because that addition is too little, for everything that's ever been done. Now, if the motive is unwilling, I have no more arguments. Cheers !

 

Oh, how come you know? I studied computer science and have been programming for decades, so I have a theoretical understanding of the problems.

Also, this is a discussion forum and people like to discuss, whether they know a lot or just a little about some issue. You really shouldn't take it personal and go with the flow.

 

 

 

[MIOLOmole]

3 hours ago, meganoth said:

 

Oh, how come you know? I studied computer science and have been programming for decades, so I have a theoretical understanding of the problems.

Also, this is a discussion forum and people like to discuss, whether they know a lot or just a little about some issue. You really shouldn't take it personal and go with the flow.

 

 

 

" have been programming " doesn´t mean u meet the requirements/standards of the gaming industry ... if that was so important, pls point your portfolio, so that we can judge your professional skills. Discuss is what I'm being doing, since my first post. Where did I took it personal ?? I simply don't agree to your justifications. I stick to this : Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only proves that the basics of my idea can also be done ... and that should be the part to discuss. The only person taking it personal is u, since my first post. Cheers !!!

[BFT2020]

3 hours ago, MIOLOmole said:

" have been programming " doesn´t mean u meet the requirements/standards of the gaming industry ... if that was so important, pls point your portfolio, so that we can judge your professional skills. Discuss is what I'm being doing, since my first post. Where did I took it personal ?? I simply don't agree to your justifications. I stick to this : Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only proves that the basics of my idea can also be done ... and that should be the part to discuss. The only person taking it personal is u, since my first post. Cheers !!!

Have you done any programming?  If you have, you would understand that while computer languages change, the basic principles you learn via programming stay the same.  It is all about the process.  Once you strip down the differences of the computer languages, each language has the same thing:  Processes, steps, algorithms.   meganoth has experience in programming so he understands the process and what it would take. 

 

You do understand that there are other fields of programming, not just the gaming industry?  But to simply imply that the opinions of others doesn't matter because they don't meet your standards of programming is shortsightedness on your part.

 

meganoth has not been rude to you or been attacking you; he just has been discussing of what you requested, what he knows has been requested in the past, and what TFP are doing today that may affect what you asked for.  However, it seems like you are taking his discussion of this request as personal (as if anyone that doesn't fully agree with you is against you).

[Matt115]

7 hours ago, MIOLOmole said:

" have been programming " doesn´t mean u meet the requirements/standards of the gaming industry ... if that was so important, pls point your portfolio, so that we can judge your professional skills. Discuss is what I'm being doing, since my first post. Where did I took it personal ?? I simply don't agree to your justifications. I stick to this : Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only proves that the basics of my idea can also be done ... and that should be the part to discuss. The only person taking it personal is u, since my first post. Cheers !!!

honestly you know "standards" are  very diffrent for every game? Do you have any studies about programming or skills? you have make a mod. if not - trust what @meganoth say. i spend a lot of time reading. watching interview and honestly - sometime the "simple' thing are hard - like max speed for character ( this was big problem for long time in hl and hl2), a lot of ideas was offten cuted because they weren't  working good enought : cars in stalker, wall climbing in cyberpunk etc. so honestly - if meganoth say something is too complited to be added it mean it is rly too complicated. honestly maybe @faatal or @Laz Man will explain you better why it can't works good or why it will need to much money and time to be added

[Laz Man]

Npc rescue missions would certainly be a fun quest/activity.  Perhaps something similar will/can be added once bandits and other human npcs make it into the game.

 

It would be a shame if all we got quest wise were basic kill x, clear and fetch types.  I encourage you to attend one of the several a20 dev streams when they get started and ask for this feature live...😅

 

 

 

 

[MIOLOmole]

" meganoth has not been rude to you or been attacking you; " ... when he replied WHO CARES thats RUDE in every forum ! If u guys go along together for some time, are mates, I uderstand your protecting brotherwood system. " and what TFP are doing today that may affect what you asked for. " read my lips IT'S A SIDE MISSION, doesn't have to affect what have been done. STEVE JOBS didn't understood a thing about programming and still was STEVE JOBS. So using your words " who cares " of your school programming achievments !!! Its a matter of LOGIC. I stick to this : Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only PROVES that the basics of my idea can also be done ... and that should be the part to discuss. " However, it seems like you are taking his discussion of this request as personal (as if anyone that doesn't fully agree with you is against you)." ... WHO is anyone ?? Your brotherwood ?? Stick to  my adressed written LOGIC. Nothing else matters. How can I take that personal ? Will that ever change/affect my life or whatsoever ?? I simple don't agree with your justifications. Just that ! Cheers !!!

[meganoth]

4 hours ago, MIOLOmole said:

" meganoth has not been rude to you or been attacking you; " ... when he replied WHO CARES thats RUDE in every forum !

 

I'm sorry you took it that way, but it is only rude when you say something and I disregard it with "who cares!". It is not rude if I ASK the fundamental question who (of the typical players) would care if some NPC is called mayor and guess that it might not be very many. All that a typical player would probably care for is how much coin he would get for the quest, unless that NPC being "mayor" had some consequence outside the immediate quest. This is directly discussing how a specific feature in the game would be received by players and if it would have the hoped for result.

 

An idea here would be that it increases reputation with some faction to save a mayor (if reputation ever gets into this game) or that some area is safer for a while if a mayor is saved (if a variable area safety mechanism were added to the game). If this thread didn't devolve into a "he said she said" argument someone possibly would have posted those or similar ideas.

 

Now english isn't my mother language, I may be wrong about this. If some native english speaker wants to comment, this is what I said:

Spoiler

Rescue missions will get stale like any other mission once you have done a few dozen. Who cares if that NPC is called "mayor"? If the mayor then doesn't feature prominently in a story all it means is that "mayor" means a bit more money. A quest isn't suddenly more fun if you get twice the money out of it.

 

Edited August 15, 2021 by meganoth (see edit history)

[BFT2020]

58 minutes ago, meganoth said:

 

Now english isn't my mother language, I may be wrong about this. If some native english speaker wants to comment, this is what I said:

  Hide contents

Rescue missions will get stale like any other mission once you have done a few dozen. Who cares if that NPC is called "mayor"? If the mayor then doesn't feature prominently in a story all it means is that "mayor" means a bit more money. A quest isn't suddenly more fun if you get twice the money out of it.

 

What you said  was fine, it came out the way you intended.

5 hours ago, MIOLOmole said:

So using your words " who cares " of your school programming achievments !!! Its a matter of LOGIC. I stick to this : Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only PROVES that the basics of my idea can also be done ... and that should be the part to discuss. " However, it seems like you are taking his discussion of this request as personal (as if anyone that doesn't fully agree with you is against you)." ... WHO is anyone ?? Your brotherwood ??

Again, proving my point.  You are attacking others when you dismissed their opinions / comments as based on “school programming achievements.”  You don’t know mine or meganoth’s programming experience, so when we mentioned what would it take and where TFP is in regards to non-zombie AI, you immediately go after us with childish attacks on our credentials.

 

Anyone is anyone you would use the same tactic against, not a brotherhood or mates - I only know meganoth through the forums and is simply someone I have discusses with and against ideas.  I don’t like it when people use these tactics and willing to speak up about them when it is used on someone.

[BFT2020]

6 hours ago, Laz Man said:

Npc rescue missions would certainly be a fun quest/activity.  Perhaps something similar will/can be added once bandits and other human npcs make it into the game.

 

It would be a shame if all we got quest wise were basic kill x, clear and fetch types.  I encourage you to attend one of the several a20 dev streams when they get started and ask for this feature live...😅

 

I don’t mind a rescue mission, I just hope it would be executed correctly by TFP if they were to go this route.  Otherwise I would avoid it like the plague if it goes from a rescue mission to a babysitting mission.

 

The bandit AI will give us an idea if this can be pulled off correctly.

[Matt115]

8 hours ago, Laz Man said:

Npc rescue missions would certainly be a fun quest/activity.  Perhaps something similar will/can be added once bandits and other human npcs make it into the game.

 

It would be a shame if all we got quest wise were basic kill x, clear and fetch types.  I encourage you to attend one of the several a20 dev streams when they get started and ask for this feature live...😅

 

 

 

 

txh @Laz Man for answer. well i know you know something about game developening so you are "good source of intel" in this topic  

[Matt115]

2 hours ago, meganoth said:

 

I'm sorry you took it that way, but it is only rude when you say something and I disregard it with "who cares!". It is not rude if I ASK the fundamental question who (of the typical players) would care if some NPC is called mayor and guess that it might not be very many. All that a typical player would probably care for is how much coin he would get for the quest, unless that NPC being "mayor" had some consequence outside the immediate quest. This is directly discussing how a specific feature in the game would be received by players and if it would have the hoped for result.

 

An idea here would be that it increases reputation with some faction to save a mayor (if reputation ever gets into this game) or that some area is safer for a while if a mayor is saved (if a variable area safety mechanism were added to the game). If this thread didn't devolve into a "he said she said" argument someone possibly would have posted those or similar ideas.

 

Now english isn't my mother language, I may be wrong about this. If some native english speaker wants to comment, this is what I said:

  Hide contents

Rescue missions will get stale like any other mission once you have done a few dozen. Who cares if that NPC is called "mayor"? If the mayor then doesn't feature prominently in a story all it means is that "mayor" means a bit more money. A quest isn't suddenly more fun if you get twice the money out of it.

 

well i have problems even with polish - how? i have some mental issue XD this is annoying as hell - i just forget words or how to write something - like in english you have consider - in poland we have "rozważyć" and sometimes i wrote " rozwarzyć" and sometime correct form "rozważyc" why? idk

 

 

btw. we have "random quests" now - so names are pointless - maybe only diffrent models have sense- like sometimes this is some doc sometimes a normal civilian sometimes soldier.  

 

we don't know anything about have factions will work - if there will be "story mode" or story will be working in  mmo style etc. PVP make thing harder. so how TFP will do this? i think single story mode is easier that make pvp with story. so for now "names and models" only can  have influence on reward. for now ofc

[MIOLOmole]

" you immediately go after us with childish attacks on our credentials... " Why do you need so much credit for your programming skills? Did I ask for this information? Who are you in 7D2D programming? Why are you being the negativity advocate? You're being pretentious, vain and you weren't nominated to speak on behalf of the TFP. It's your attacks that are childish !!! Your opinion only counts whether you like my idea or not. If you like it, add contributions. Otherwise, just say no. Do you happen to know who you're talking to? Do you know what I do in life? Remit yourself to your insignificance. Who are you to say what can and cannot be done in the game? Everything you say is not validated by the TFP. That's why you're on my level in this forum. School programming knowledge does not classify you as apt. You are rude and stubborn. Cheers !!!

[MIOLOmole]

read my lips IT'S A SIDE MISSION, doesn't have to affect what have been done. Its a matter of LOGIC. I stick to this : Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only PROVES that the basics of my idea can also be done ... and that should be the part to discuss. Cheers !!!

[Matt115]

38 minutes ago, MIOLOmole said:

read my lips IT'S A SIDE MISSION, doesn't have to affect what have been done. Its a matter of LOGIC. I stick to this : Everything that has already been done in 7D2D only PROVES that the basics of my idea can also be done ... and that should be the part to discuss. Cheers !!!

well ... you know bandits was " in planes" a lot of years ago bu we don't have them yet? and they want to finish 7dtd "soon" ( in TFP meaning) so this idea need to much time and work to be added

[MIOLOmole]

20 minutes ago, Matt115 said:

well ... you know bandits was " in planes" a lot of years ago bu we don't have them yet? and they want to finish 7dtd "soon" ( in TFP meaning) so this idea need to much time and work to be added

ok, but what do you prefer? More villains, or something different in the game? Bandits or zombie hordes, what's the difference? If you want bandits, just go multiplayer and any player that loots your base is a bandit... More of the same, no thanks! Cheers!!!

[BFT2020]

2 hours ago, MIOLOmole said:

Remit yourself to your insignificance. Who are you to say what can and cannot be done in the game? Everything you say is not validated by the TFP. That's why you're on my level in this forum. School programming knowledge does not classify you as apt. You are rude and stubborn. Cheers !!!

again proving my point. 😁

[BFT2020]

 

13 hours ago, Laz Man said:

Npc rescue missions would certainly be a fun quest/activity.  Perhaps something similar will/can be added once bandits and other human npcs make it into the game.

 

It would be a shame if all we got quest wise were basic kill x, clear and fetch types.  I encourage you to attend one of the several a20 dev streams when they get started and ask for this feature live...😅

 

I would hope the a rescue mission be more than just transport Meat Sack 1 from Point A to Point B.  It would be great if they were a true rescue mission where you are rescuing a group that follows Noah that consists of civilians and guards.  Where they need rescue because the guards are critically low on ammo and members of the party are hurt which slows them down significantly.  Then you have a choice:  Do you distribute your supply of ammo and medical supplies to the group to improve the chances of getting them safely to their destination, or do you keep everything yourself and roll the dice to see if you can escort such a large group by yourself and doing all the work while slowly making your way to the safe zone.

[MIOLOmole]

2 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

again proving my point. 😁

 again proving my point. 😁

[Matt115]

4 hours ago, MIOLOmole said:

ok, but what do you prefer? More villains, or something different in the game? Bandits or zombie hordes, what's the difference? If you want bandits, just go multiplayer and any player that loots your base is a bandit... More of the same, no thanks! Cheers!!!

well you know bandits will be added because this was point about them in kickstarted ?

what's a diffrece? if zombie do something stupid- well he is zombie. but if survior or bandit fall from skyscraper by "mistake" it will be stupid

[BFT2020]

10 hours ago, meganoth said:

All that a typical player would probably care for is how much coin he would get for the quest, unless that NPC being "mayor" had some consequence outside the immediate quest. This is directly discussing how a specific feature in the game would be received by players and if it would have the hoped for result.

 

An idea here would be that it increases reputation with some faction to save a mayor (if reputation ever gets into this game) or that some area is safer for a while if a mayor is saved (if a variable area safety mechanism were added to the game).

I wish all missions could have a more direct influence on the game, like buried supplies missions would increase the amount of stock in the trader you completed it for; rather than just some items and dukes as a reward.  Then if you didn’t do the missions, the trader’s stock would not increase over time.

 

Then hour actions would influence how much help the traders would give you in the game.

[Laz Man]

3 hours ago, BFT2020 said:

 

I would hope the a rescue mission be more than just transport Meat Sack 1 from Point A to Point B.  It would be great if they were a true rescue mission where you are rescuing a group that follows Noah that consists of civilians and guards.  Where they need rescue because the guards are critically low on ammo and members of the party are hurt which slows them down significantly.  Then you have a choice:  Do you distribute your supply of ammo and medical supplies to the group to improve the chances of getting them safely to their destination, or do you keep everything yourself and roll the dice to see if you can escort such a large group by yourself and doing all the work while slowly making your way to the safe zone.

That would be cool.  Like....do you conserve ammo for the upcoming horde night or do you invest it into the npcs for a higher chance at survival / quest success.   Sounds like some trade off scenario for the player.

Edited August 15, 2021 by Laz Man (see edit history)

[Matt115]

1 hour ago, Laz Man said:

That would be cool.  Like....do you conserve ammo for the upcoming horde night or do you invest it into the npcs for a higher chance at survival / quest success.   Sounds like some trade off scenario for the player.

yeah but there is "ashley" problem. you don't know if npc will do something stupid. rover from cod in escort missions in outbreake don't have this problem. So maybe "junk drone" will be better for 7dtd that npc to escort in normal mode. in story mode npc can be good

[MIOLOmole]

The idea of not adding too much programming and making rescue missions NPCs easier to implement is for TFP to see something acceptable for rapid implementation in 7D2D. If we keep demanding already many details and complexity, they will easier reject it, because this translates into time = money spent. So I still insist that the approach to this idea has to be very basic to begin with. Improvements can be implemented as time goes by and availability time of TFP. In fact, the whole history of the development time of this game proves that. So let's take it easy on the level of demand of this idea. I prefer the basics to begin with. It's easier to accept. Now, a thousand times the idea of NPCs rescue missions, than the idea of the Bandits ! Cheers !!!