hiemfire Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 16 minutes ago, Boidster said: Both below ground and above ground, screamer spawns failed at about +/- 30m from the surface. 16 minutes ago, Boidster said: No reaction at -10m So have 30 blocks above your head if you don't want to be bothered at all, but anything over 10 blocks above your head should be fine if you don't mind the occasional screamer horde. Sound spikes in a short duration tend to combine (not sure if it is additive or some other manner) from what I've seen using stealth, did you do multiple rapid opening and closing of the containers or just opened and closed them once? The sounds levels are also different between the various container material types. Metal ones are louder than wood or cloth ones, though I don't know of any craftable cloth or metal containers (metal ones are purchaseable from the traders). Probably best just to have the base's ceiling 30 blocks underground and not fire weapons while in the base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boidster Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 26 minutes ago, hiemfire said: So have 30 blocks above your head if you don't want to be bothered at all, but anything over 10 blocks above your head should be fine if you don't mind the occasional screamer horde. Yes, if only opening/closing wooden chests and otherwise puttering around. I'll check upgrade sounds, since OP may want to upgrade his underground lair in peace. 26 minutes ago, hiemfire said: Sound spikes in a short duration tend to combine (not sure if it is additive or some other manner) from what I've seen using stealth, did you do multiple rapid opening and closing of the containers or just opened and closed them once? I'm not aware of any mechanic for sound to be additive, except as it applies to chunk "heat". In any case, I opened/closed the chests multiple times in rapid succession. 26 minutes ago, hiemfire said: The sounds levels are also different between the various container material types. I can spawn in the metal weapons boxes and try it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 16 hours ago, Kyonshi said: I wanna establish my hideout underground in my current game and i wanna be sure im not bothered by them anymore. I dont mind the heat signature from using workstations, because i think they have a too much large range anyway and i'll just deal with the Zs attracted to it. What im talking about is just simple noises that i produce when opening/closing my storage boxes or by simply walking and using ladders. Im getting quite annoyed that the slightest sound of going through my stuff triggers Zs and i wanna walk around by hideout without being in stealth mode. Also, if you decide to build a tall tower as an hideout, how high do you need it to be so you cant be detected? Is there a flat, specific distance at which you remain undetected and is it the same for when you're underground or high above street level? If there is, is it calculated in blocks? Edit: I dont plan to fight hordes underground, so dont bother reminding me they can dig down to you, i already know You cant really, experiments with upscaled spawnrates proved that in all sceniarios theres always a zombie set to home onto you. They might be standing above you without entering a true alerted state but they will be there slowly following your trail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyonshi Posted October 9, 2020 Author Share Posted October 9, 2020 14 minutes ago, Solomon said: You cant really, experiments with upscaled spawnrates proved that in all sceniarios theres always a zombie set to home onto you. They might be standing above you without entering a true alerted state but they will be there slowly following your trail. Check Boidster experiments above. 17 minutes ago, Boidster said: Yes, if only opening/closing wooden chests and otherwise puttering around. I'll check upgrade sounds, since OP may want to upgrade his underground lair in peace. I'm not aware of any mechanic for sound to be additive, except as it applies to chunk "heat". In any case, I opened/closed the chests multiple times in rapid succession. I can spawn in the metal weapons boxes and try it out. I wanna say an immense thank you Boidster, for that elaborate testing you just did. Im glad to had such concrete and limpid answer to my interrogations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiemfire Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 29 minutes ago, Boidster said: Yes, if only opening/closing wooden chests and otherwise puttering around. 1. I'll check upgrade sounds, since OP may want to upgrade his underground lair in peace. 2. I'm not aware of any mechanic for sound to be additive, except as it applies to chunk "heat". In any case, I opened/closed the chests multiple times in rapid succession. 3. I can spawn in the metal weapons boxes and try it out. 1. I spaced that too. 2. It's something I've observed while sneaking. Multiple actions that generate sound done in short succession or simultaneously cause a large increase in observability compared to doing them separately with a wait between them for the observability spike to fade. I did say I wasn't sure it was necessarily additive, but they definitely combine for a "louder" spike. That said you did cover that base. 3. Nice. Looking forwards to the results when/if you post them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boidster Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 44 minutes ago, hiemfire said: 2. It's something I've observed while sneaking. Multiple actions that generate sound done in short succession or simultaneously cause a large increase in observability compared to doing them separately with a wait between them for the observability spike to fade. I did say I wasn't sure it was necessarily additive, but they definitely combine for a "louder" spike. That said you did cover that base. That's an interesting point. I wasn't really looking into the stealth meter itself; in fact my character was not crouched at all during the experiments (OP stated he did not want to have to sneak around his own lair). I know the effect you're talking about, which causes your own detectability to spike up and it lingers for a second or two before falling back down. Assuming that the same general sound/detectability mechanism is being used whether sneaking or not (with sneaking just reducing the effects of sound and vision), then I guess whatever peak sound occurred due to multiple chest opens/closes (or the continuous fire of an M60) was not enough to trigger Arlene at the listed distance. I presume that the peak sound essentially equals "maximum possible volume and range" for whatever activity I was doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiemfire Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 5 minutes ago, Boidster said: That's an interesting point. I wasn't really looking into the stealth meter itself; in fact my character was not crouched at all during the experiments (OP stated he did not want to have to sneak around his own lair). I know the effect you're talking about, which causes your own detectability to spike up and it lingers for a second or two before falling back down. Assuming that the same general sound/detectability mechanism is being used whether sneaking or not (with sneaking just reducing the effects of sound and vision), then I guess whatever peak sound occurred due to multiple chest opens/closes (or the continuous fire of an M60) was not enough to trigger Arlene at the listed distance. I presume that the peak sound essentially equals "maximum possible volume and range" for whatever activity I was doing. It'd make sense that they're the same thing, just sneaking "muffles" it a bit compared to not sneaking and most cases people aren't really going to care about it while they aren't sneaking so no observability bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
th3s0n1c Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 3 hours ago, doughphunghus said: I'm not seeing anything obvious that indicates that a block or material the block is made from "deadens" or isolates the noise. Like I had stated.. I believe it was removed, since I couldnt find those data anymore. But I'm pretty sure it used to be a thing. Same as above for: 3 hours ago, doughphunghus said: - Are there actually any sound effect dampening from blocks or the base materials blocks are made of? And I dont know this for a fact, but I was always under the impression that terrain blocks have less "Sound occlusion" than player-manufactured blocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalen Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 12 minutes ago, th3s0n1c said: And I dont know this for a fact, but I was always under the impression that terrain blocks have less "Sound occlusion" than player-manufactured blocks. Faatal has pretty recently stated that there is no audio occlusion in the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 13 hours ago, Kyonshi said: Check Boidster experiments above. I read it thanks but i was not talking about those. Theres a POI mechanic what is only observable when you rise up spawns, namely the system essentially spawns an non-alerted zed what is programmed to go towards you essentially home on you. If i remember the thread right the guy who did the experiment opened a door to a POI, gone in, entered stealth and used the "killall" command to get rid of all zombies then waited while aboslutely doing nothing. He was out of sight and yet a zombie literally came into the room to find him. Now im not sure if this is a POI only type of spawning or its applied everywhere but i think it should be true for underground too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meganoth Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Solomon said: I read it thanks but i was not talking about those. Theres a POI mechanic what is only observable when you rise up spawns, namely the system essentially spawns an non-alerted zed what is programmed to go towards you essentially home on you. If i remember the thread right the guy who did the experiment opened a door to a POI, gone in, entered stealth and used the "killall" command to get rid of all zombies then waited while aboslutely doing nothing. He was out of sight and yet a zombie literally came into the room to find him. Now im not sure if this is a POI only type of spawning or its applied everywhere but i think it should be true for underground too. Good point, this is something that has to be taken into account. But "proved that in all sceniarios theres always a zombie set to home onto you"? Did he do this multiple times to make sure it wasn't just a coincidence? Did he convincingly show why this is happening and that no other interpretation is possible? I searched for "killall" and found what you are refering to, that is I found Sycris who said someone did some test (once? twice? We don't know). https://community.7daystodie.com/topic/21879-can-we-get-rid-of-the-gpsing-zombies-when-enteringinside-a-poi/?do=findComment&comment=399904 Boidster tried to recreate the experiment and did not see the same thing happeneing: https://community.7daystodie.com/topic/21879-can-we-get-rid-of-the-gpsing-zombies-when-enteringinside-a-poi/?do=findComment&comment=400190 Also read two of the answers to this: https://community.7daystodie.com/topic/21879-can-we-get-rid-of-the-gpsing-zombies-when-enteringinside-a-poi/?do=findComment&comment=399954 https://community.7daystodie.com/topic/21879-can-we-get-rid-of-the-gpsing-zombies-when-enteringinside-a-poi/?do=findComment&comment=400135 If Lazman is correct, the zombie is simply a result of using killall. If Atomic is right, it has nothing to do with POIs. There definitely is no unavoidable homing. The breadcrump path has a fixed length and should stop leading to you when you are moving stealthed for a bit. Still, if the OP wants to avoid this he needs traps at his bunker entrance or find out the length of the breadcrump path and make sure the path to his lair is longer than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 1 hour ago, meganoth said: I searched for "killall" and found what you are refering to, that is I found Sycris who said someone did some test (once? twice? We don't know). https://community.7daystodie.com/topic/21879-can-we-get-rid-of-the-gpsing-zombies-when-enteringinside-a-poi/?do=findComment&comment=399904 Thats it, i too tested it thought my game is heavily modded so im not quite sure if i actually found homing mechanics or blind luck with randomly moving zeds. As you said the best solution would be to find out the lenght of the following distance and trap up the entrance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boidster Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 18 hours ago, Kalen said: Faatal has pretty recently stated that there is no audio occlusion in the game Yeah, this is what I thought. I can't completely explain why in my gunfire test I had to be 45m above the Arlene before she couldn't detect me, but only 35m below her underground. I need to take a closer look at that. There might be 1m or 2m absolute distance difference just due to the arrangement of the pit vs the tower, but not 10m. Arlene did have some freedom of movement in her little cage; that might factor into it. I may have to use X,Y,Z and a little geometry to calculate actual straight-line distance. I don't want to be posting fake hypotenuse! #dadjokes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 But what about those auto-aggro volumes that exist in random areas underground....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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