My opinion on A20 and the pipe weapons. Also issues I noticed.

[Scyris]

Alright this will be a bit long.

 

So far A20 has been pretty good, the Art team did some amazing work with the new models and textures. Game runs better than it ever has for me. Skill system still sucks though as its too gated. Lowering it down to 3 stats with all weapons in 1, all defensive stuff in another and then a 3rd survival tree would be better. Love the new RWG both in how fast it is and the fact it creates towns that look like actual towns in RWG. Game still has a issue due to the stat system of basicaly forcing everyone to get high STR or else you'll mine slow as hell for very little resources, my Idea of splitting it into 3 stats would work better as you can access all weapons under 1 tree. Survival tree is stuff like cooking, armor skills, sneaking etc. Love the new trader system its nice not being locked to the highest tier you can do, and the tier up rewards are nice, apparently the bicycle for hitting t2 quests unlocked is static and is always offered, so Doing 10 t1 quests can get you a early bicycle. I also like how you can upgrade bars to steel now. it follows the usual path of wood->stone->concrete->steel, if your looking for it, its in the shape menu under catwalks. Overall I am pretty pleased with a20, other than the skill system not being made better/less gated anyway.

 

Moving on lets discuss the pipe weapons. This is what I think of them.

 

Pipe Pistol: Its damage per shot is fine, its fire rate is fine, but that reload needs to be made faster as it completly kills the weapon.

 

Pipe Rifle: This is basically the hunting rifle we used to have. good per shot damage semi-slow reload.

 

Pipe Shotgun: Ok this thing is just terrible, the damage per shot is really low, far to low for how long of a reload it has. It needs to hit much harder to warrant that reload speed.

 

Pipe Machine gun: This thing is amazing, Good per shot damage, good Mag size, decent accuarcy and a pretty fast reload on it too, not to mention the reload animation I feel looks really nice. Overall best pipe gun right here. Only downside is its ammo is rarer than the rest.

 

Pipe Baton: this thing is in a weird spot, a t6 pipe baton is weaker than a t3 baseball bat, so if your a str build by the time you find one you could make a baseball bat thats overall better.

 

Issues I have noticed: The vehicle disappear issue is back again, I had a bike parked outside by the road when I started a quest, when I was done the quest it was somehow buried 4-5 blocks underground inside the poi I was questing in and I had to dig my bicycle back up. Some of the animations are also glitchly especially the new zombie crouch, i've had one in a single player game hit me from across the room when they are crouched like that. Unsure if this is a bug or not, but enemies seem to have slightly randomized health pools now. I am going to guess its intended though, does keep you on your toes a bit more as you never know if that hit WILL be a 1 shot or not till you actually take it. I play on warrior diffculty, aparently on insane the health pool randomization is much worse. Some things also have weird hit boxes, like upgrading wood spikes to iron spikes for an example. Before you had to aim at the center, now its more near the bottom. Blocks were also supposed to now downgrade however some doors still do this and require you to swap back and fourth between tools to bust them down.

 

Personal issues: I wish you could set what the default base block is for the selectors. For example for the wood frame shapes, I'd prefer if it default to the wood frame you can see thru instead of the solid block. You can switch to it manually but each time you run out or something you have to redo it as it doesn't save the last shape used or lets you set a default selection. Another issue is still the lack of any real endgame, we need a tier higher than steel, steel has been the top tier for a very VERY long time, its time we get something above that which we have to work for, Maybe some sort of made up alloy you can only find in loot so you need to save any piece of it you find to make things with later.. Pimptanium sounds kinda good... sorry couldn't resist. Loot chests being locked in t3 and up poi's is also extremly annoying, it often takes me longer to open that thing than it does to clear the poi for a clear quest, needs to be some way or some trigger you can do that unlocks it, as you do the quest/explore the poi, if this does exist already please let me know how.

 

All in all other than the issues i've found and my personal issues, I have to say this is easly the best alpha yet, really all the game needs is a skill system tweak (lower stats from 5 to 3, with groupings for combat, defensive and survival for example) and then something for actual endgame that takes time to obtain due to rarity.

Edited December 10, 2021 by Scyris (see edit history)

[theFlu]

1 hour ago, Scyris said:

Pipe Baton: this thing is in a weird spot, a t6 pipe baton is weaker than a t3 baseball bat, so if your a str build by the time you find one you could make a baseball bat thats overall better.

The pipe baton is a pipe version of the stun baton, not a club, so comparing them like that is a little odd.

 

And if the Pipe Machine Gun is amazing.. I think it's the one that honestly needs a nerf.

 

Good post otherwise

[Darklegend222]

2 hours ago, Scyris said:

Alright this will be a bit long.

 

So far A20 has been pretty good, the Art team did some amazing work with the new models and textures. Game runs better than it ever has for me. Skill system still sucks though as its too gated. Lowering it down to 3 stats with all weapons in 1, all defensive stuff in another and then a 3rd survival tree would be better. Love the new RWG both in how fast it is and the fact it creates towns that look like actual towns in RWG. Game still has a issue due to the stat system of basicaly forcing everyone to get high STR or else you'll mine slow as hell for very little resources, my Idea of splitting it into 3 stats would work better as you can access all weapons under 1 tree. Survival tree is stuff like cooking, armor skills, sneaking etc. Love the new trader system its nice not being locked to the highest tier you can do, and the tier up rewards are nice, apparently the bicycle for hitting t2 quests unlocked is static and is always offered, so Doing 10 t1 quests can get you a early bicycle. I also like how you can upgrade bars to steel now. it follows the usual path of wood->stone->concrete->steel, if your looking for it, its in the shape menu under catwalks. Overall I am pretty pleased with a20, other than the skill system not being made better/less gated anyway.

 

Moving on lets discuss the pipe weapons. This is what I think of them.

 

Pipe Pistol: Its damage per shot is fine, its fire rate is fine, but that reload needs to be made faster as it completly kills the weapon.

 

Pipe Rifle: This is basically the hunting rifle we used to have. good per shot damage semi-slow reload.

 

Pipe Shotgun: Ok this thing is just terrible, the damage per shot is really low, far to low for how long of a reload it has. It needs to hit much harder to warrant that reload speed.

 

Pipe Machine gun: This thing is amazing, Good per shot damage, good Mag size, decent accuarcy and a pretty fast reload on it too, not to mention the reload animation I feel looks really nice. Overall best pipe gun right here. Only downside is its ammo is rarer than the rest.

 

Pipe Baton: this thing is in a weird spot, a t6 pipe baton is weaker than a t3 baseball bat, so if your a str build by the time you find one you could make a baseball bat thats overall better.

 

Issues I have noticed: The vehicle disappear issue is back again, I had a bike parked outside by the road when I started a quest, when I was done the quest it was somehow buried 4-5 blocks underground inside the poi I was questing in and I had to dig my bicycle back up. Some of the animations are also glitchly especially the new zombie crouch, i've had one in a single player game hit me from across the room when they are crouched like that. Unsure if this is a bug or not, but enemies seem to have slightly randomized health pools now. I am going to guess its intended though, does keep you on your toes a bit more as you never know if that hit WILL be a 1 shot or not till you actually take it. I play on warrior diffculty, aparently on insane the health pool randomization is much worse. Some things also have weird hit boxes, like upgrading wood spikes to iron spikes for an example. Before you had to aim at the center, now its more near the bottom. Blocks were also supposed to now downgrade however some doors still do this and require you to swap back and fourth between tools to bust them down.

 

Personal issues: I wish you could set what the default base block is for the selectors. For example for the wood frame shapes, I'd prefer if it default to the wood frame you can see thru instead of the solid block. You can switch to it manually but each time you run out or something you have to redo it as it doesn't save the last shape used or lets you set a default selection. Another issue is still the lack of any real endgame, we need a tier higher than steel, steel has been the top tier for a very VERY long time, its time we get something above that which we have to work for, Maybe some sort of made up alloy you can only find in loot so you need to save any piece of it you find to make things with later.. Pimptanium sounds kinda good... sorry couldn't resist. Loot chests being locked in t3 and up poi's is also extremly annoying, it often takes me longer to open that thing than it does to clear the poi for a clear quest, needs to be some way or some trigger you can do that unlocks it, as you do the quest/explore the poi, if this does exist already please let me know how.

 

All in all other than the issues i've found and my personal issues, I have to say this is easly the best alpha yet, really all the game needs is a skill system tweak (lower stats from 5 to 3, with groupings for combat, defensive and survival for example) and then something for actual endgame that takes time to obtain due to rarity.

You pretty much nailed it on the head. I've point blank shot a zombie dog in the face with the shotgun on warrior and it did literally nothing to stagger it. I always end up just pulling the pipe MG. As you've said it's the most powerful and I can assure you the ammo is not scarce enough.

 

Get a daring adventurer point and there's 60x7.62 bullets. Almost Everytime or every other time. In the end the pipe MG is just too powerful. It holds 3-4x more ammo than the rest, has about the same reload time as the pipe pistol, and does more damage than the pipe rifle. There's literally 1 reason to avoid making it or using it, and that reason is if you don't have 7.62 ammo.

[Slaasher]

For me, they need to put a cap on the ram used when you set up a random world. At 32 gb, the game uses all of it. Cant imagine trying to set up a game with only 8 or 12 GB

 

Also, I seem to be getting a ton of higher level stuff that I thought I wouldnt see now that they have integrated the pipe weapons. 

Both as drops and at the vendors. On day 6 I was able to purchase a T4 hunting rifle from the vendor. Cost a lot but it was there.......

Will there be more loot balancing?

[bachgaman]

Yes, pipe machingun is OP in combine with endless ammo from trader. They could add the chance of misfire, laughable precision, add mechanical parts to the recipes to somehow justify the homemade auto-reload mechanism. Now we can create a not bad machingun just with few pipes and a board without any tools, just using glue😂 I understand that realism is not a top priority for TFP, but is it really the most elegant solution to give newbies an arsenal on day one?

8 minutes ago, Slaasher said:

Also, I seem to be getting a ton of higher level stuff that I thought I wouldnt see now that they have integrated the pipe weapons. 

Both as drops and at the vendors. On day 6 I was able to purchase a T4 hunting rifle from the vendor. Cost a lot but it was there.......

Will there be more loot balancing?

Autoshotgun T3, auger T3, M60 T3 on day 7 😁

[Darklegend222]

21 minutes ago, Slaasher said:

For me, they need to put a cap on the ram used when you set up a random world. At 32 gb, the game uses all of it. Cant imagine trying to set up a game with only 8 or 12 GB

 

Also, I seem to be getting a ton of higher level stuff that I thought I wouldnt see now that they have integrated the pipe weapons. 

Both as drops and at the vendors. On day 6 I was able to purchase a T4 hunting rifle from the vendor. Cost a lot but it was there.......

Will there be more loot balancing?

There's currently a bug that causes newly made random gen worlds to not release ram after it's been created. The fix for now is to close the game after it's  generated. Then you can play freely!

 

There was talks of a loot slider, but it didn't go anywhere as of yet. So we're just gonna have to wait and see!

[Raptortwenty2]

No the pipe baton is or should be in between the wooden club and baseball bat it is nowhere near compares to the piece of @%$# stun baton. But you have to realize there’s a reason why they are homemade guns they are garbage and that’s good you’re not supposed to survive with a piece of duct tape and barrel. it just helps out. so the reload times are perfectly fine. I think the pipe machine gun almost does too much damage because you’d probably rather take a tier 5 over even a tier 2 AK because it does more damage

It would be nice if the pipe weapons had a chance to misfire or even break in your hands randomly requiring to be fixed. It looks like it took 5 minutes to make the gun(like not the model but realistically what it would look like) and it should be as reliable as the pipe weapons are

[BFT2020]

I started working on a modlet for myself regarding T0 equipment.  For me, I think they should:

 

• Not be repairable - you should have to build a new one since the whole idea about them is that they are thrown together out of common items
• Not be able to go above Q3 - same reason as above
• Not be able to utilize mods - same reason as above
• Right now, the stone axe uses slightly more stamina than the bone knife.  I think it should be more (not stone sledgehammer levels, but a bigger difference than bone knives right now)
• I think most of the pipe weapons are fine as is, they are not that great and more of a last ditch effort to save yourself
• The pipe machine gun is too good IMHO.  The only limiting factor is ammo for it (availability).  I am looking at either increasing the load time on it or increasing it damage debuff

 

Pipe Baton is a T0 weapon and should be comparable to the other T0 melee weapons (Club, bone knife, stone spear, stone sledgehammer).

 

Not sure if you can simulate an actual misfire.  It would be interesting if you could give it a chance for the durability to go to 0 and then you would have to repair it first (to simulate a misfire condition)