Underground building

[theFlu]

9 minutes ago, RLBiscuit said:

For the record, I'm not trying to have a "zero danger" zombie game. Something about underground bunkers has always fascinated me

Going off of that; you probably Can still build an underground base where the zombies won't dig to. The key is to give them a reasonable route to you, where they can get to you by bashing some defenses. If they can find a path where they don't need to dig, they will favor that pretty heavily, even bashing through concrete blocks.

 

Now, ladder pathing is wonky atm, and I'm assuming changes are coming - so you'll probably need a "door in mountain wall" type solution as the zombie entrance for a while. Or a staircase, but .. those have always been wonky...

 

The heat map you'll have to dissipate by some other means, separating your production from your living quarters somehow.

Edited December 30, 2021 by theFlu (see edit history)

[Roland]

6 hours ago, Jason Tamosiunis said:

no a bunch of whiny spoiled babies that are used to getting their way complained about something that didn taffect them one tiny little bit and no i dont wanna hear it from any moderators or TFP that it was for the better all it did was ruin the udnerground all together

It was for the better. 
 

I just built an underground base in my current game and have had zero problems. The people complaining right now seem to be basing their anger on hypotheticals instead of actual testing.

 

You’re whining about something that you have no actual experience with— just like babies!  And you’re mad and having a hard time coping with the change you didn’t want—just like someone used to always getting their own way and then being denied. 
 

Try it. Nothing is ruined. In fact you should try it soon because I’m tempted to let faatal know that the zombies seem to be ignoring players underground to such a degree that it might be a bug… 😜

[RLBiscuit]

11 minutes ago, Roland said:

It was for the better. 
 

I just built an underground base in my current game and have had zero problems. The people complaining right now seem to be basing their anger on hypotheticals instead of actual testing.

 

You’re whining about something that you have no actual experience with— just like babies!  And you’re mad and having a hard time coping with the change you didn’t want—just like someone used to always getting their own way and then being denied. 
 

Try it. Nothing is ruined. In fact you should try it soon because I’m tempted to let faatal know that the zombies seem to be ignoring players underground to such a degree that it might be a bug… 😜

I certainly hope you aren't taking my comments as complaining. I'm just commenting on the fact that the last time I dug a deep base, I had to spend a lot of time filling in what the zombies did to the surface when they really shouldn't have known I was there. To perhaps clarify a previous comment I made, I think the heat map thing should be a defined on all 3 axes, so that if I am deep enough, screamers shouldn't show up, for instance. If it is that way now, I apologize, I haven't had time to thoroughly test the current mechanics. I was simply making the point that if I want to take the time to dig deep with tools and skills, when the blood moon ends, I don't want to have to go fix the remarkable damage early game zombies can do with their bare hands. Early game I'd prefer to be able to dig deep, set up shop, first blood moon work to prep myself, and as the zombies get harder I have a well functioning workshop with which to build what I need to build to face them. Like I said, I haven't had time to test the current mechanics, and I'm not trying to "hide" from danger in a game based on danger, but it does seem to be the case that at some point the mechanics were changed to make it so that those of us that want to play the game by digging deep were, for lack of a better word, punished, for doing so. I don't play on servers, I play single player. I love the customization I am allowed, but the fact that digging deep isn't as secure as it once was or, in my humble opinion, as it should be, should be an "advanced option" rather than just strictly imposed if one wants to play current versions of the game.

 

I digress

[meganoth]

1 hour ago, RLBiscuit said:

I certainly hope you aren't taking my comments as complaining. I'm just commenting on the fact that the last time I dug a deep base, I had to spend a lot of time filling in what the zombies did to the surface when they really shouldn't have known I was there. To perhaps clarify a previous comment I made, I think the heat map thing should be a defined on all 3 axes, so that if I am deep enough, screamers shouldn't show up, for instance. If it is that way now, I apologize, I haven't had time to thoroughly test the current mechanics. I was simply making the point that if I want to take the time to dig deep with tools and skills, when the blood moon ends, I don't want to have to go fix the remarkable damage early game zombies can do with their bare hands. Early game I'd prefer to be able to dig deep, set up shop, first blood moon work to prep myself, and as the zombies get harder I have a well functioning workshop with which to build what I need to build to face them. Like I said, I haven't had time to test the current mechanics, and I'm not trying to "hide" from danger in a game based on danger, but it does seem to be the case that at some point the mechanics were changed to make it so that those of us that want to play the game by digging deep were, for lack of a better word, punished, for doing so. I don't play on servers, I play single player. I love the customization I am allowed, but the fact that digging deep isn't as secure as it once was or, in my humble opinion, as it should be, should be an "advanced option" rather than just strictly imposed if one wants to play current versions of the game.

 

I digress

 

Well, but in oh so many words you exactly want to "hide" from danger at times you want to be able to select (this is not an accusation, just a fact. And I hope you can reach it with some config options and modding). And in my opinion there are ways to reach that goal (even if imperfectly sometimes).

But the DEFAULT game is exactly how the developers want it according to the design principles they set up. One of those design principles is simply the exact opposite of what you want.

 

And it doesn't matter that the game once did it differently in its Early Access experimental phase. There never was a guarantee that specific details in this game will still exists in vanilla when this game goes gold. 

 

You ask for changing the way screamers work for example. Instead just remove screamers from the game and you get exactly what you want. Yes, you need modding for that, but very simple modding. Any modder can help you with that if you just ask in the relevant places or look for a mod that already does it. If it is only about screamers, consider it done. Test it and if you still have problems, maybe there are some other settings that can help

 

 

Edited December 30, 2021 by meganoth (see edit history)

[RipClaw]

1 hour ago, RLBiscuit said:

To perhaps clarify a previous comment I made, I think the heat map thing should be a defined on all 3 axes, so that if I am deep enough, screamers shouldn't show up, for instance.

Screamer won't show up when you are on the bedrock. They can't be spawned. I tested it in A20 with a bunch of campfires. All I get in the console is "AIDirector: Scout spawning failed".

[meganoth]

4 minutes ago, RipClaw said:

Screamer won't show up when you are on the bedrock. They can't be spawned. I tested it in A20 with a bunch of campfires. All I get in the console is "AIDirector: Scout spawning failed".

 

Even better then.

 

[Roland]

2 hours ago, RLBiscuit said:

I certainly hope you aren't taking my comments as complaining

Not simply as complaining— mostly as feedback based on unsubstantiated fears and speculation rather than feedback based on actual testing and experience which makes it much less compelling. 

As a comparison, here as an example of much more compelling feedback since it is based on actual gameplay results. 
 

1 hour ago, RipClaw said:

Screamer won't show up when you are on the bedrock. They can't be spawned. I tested it in A20 with a bunch of campfires. All I get in the console is "AIDirector: Scout spawning failed".

 

[Jason Tamosiunis]

4 hours ago, Roland said:

It was for the better. 
 

I just built an underground base in my current game and have had zero problems. The people complaining right now seem to be basing their anger on hypotheticals instead of actual testing.

 

You’re whining about something that you have no actual experience with— just like babies!  And you’re mad and having a hard time coping with the change you didn’t want—just like someone used to always getting their own way and then being denied. 
 

Try it. Nothing is ruined. In fact you should try it soon because I’m tempted to let faatal know that the zombies seem to be ignoring players underground to such a degree that it might be a bug… 😜

i have experience with it and have tested it zombies turn the ground into swiss cheese it makes having a work space underground impossible and OP is correct if i have forges and chemstations at bedrock over 40m underground zombies wouldnt know period how about we stick to zombie lore instead of making resident evil style zombies that are super smart

[Kosmic Kerman]

2 hours ago, RipClaw said:

Screamer won't show up when you are on the bedrock. They can't be spawned. I tested it in A20 with a bunch of campfires. All I get in the console is "AIDirector: Scout spawning failed".

I'm not sure this is entirely true. It may depend on your base design. In Jonah's stream yesterday (or the day before depending on your time zone), he had a horde base at bedrock and was able to summon multiple screamers by lighting around 14 campfires.  The entire point of his base was to have zombies path to him and so that could be the difference.  Here's a link: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1246760517?t=03h54m55s

Edited December 30, 2021 by Kosmic Kerman (see edit history)

[Kosmic Kerman]

Considering that everyone seems to be generating enormous amounts of heat due to crafting, what are you doing with all those resources?  The only time I have ever spawned a screamer in A20 or in later point releases of A19 was when using an auger to mine iron. A forge, cement mixer, and chem station crafting at the same time has yet to spawn a screamer for me.  And if you have all of those resources why not build a base for horde night or create a path to your bunker lined with traps? In A20, the turret schematics seem to drop fairly regularly and ammo is plentiful. So you could probably get away with building an entrance at the surface for zombies and placing a turret or two to pick them off.

[Roland]

1 hour ago, Kosmic Kerman said:

I'm not sure this is entirely true. It may depend on your base design. In Jonah's stream yesterday (or the day before depending on your time zone), he had a horde base at bedrock and was able to summon multiple screamers by lighting around 14 campfires.  The entire point of his base was to have zombies path to him and so that could be the difference.  Here's a link: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1246760517?t=03h54m55s

 

And this is where things get interesting for a developer.

[RipClaw]

9 minutes ago, Kosmic Kerman said:

I'm not sure this is entirely true. It may depend on your base design. In Jonah's stream yesterday (or the day before depending on your time zone), he had a horde base at bedrock and was able to summon multiple screamers by lighting around 14 campfires.  The entire point of his base was to have zombies path to him and so that could be the difference.  Here's a link: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1246760517?t=03h54m55s

 

I tested this again and even activated the Feral Sense. I also dug out a shaft like Jonah did and also put blocks on the walls so the zombies have a way to get to me.  Same result. 

 

I then tested with an M60 at different heights at what height I can spawn a screamer.

 

On the bedrock I am at a height of 3m. The surface is at 44m. Only when I climb up to 10m then I can spawn a screamer.  Below that I always get the error message. 

Jonah must have been at a height where there were less than 35 blocks between him and the surface.

 

1 hour ago, Kosmic Kerman said:

Considering that everyone seems to be generating enormous amounts of heat due to crafting, what are you doing with all those resources?  The only time I have ever spawned a screamer in A20 or in later point releases of A19 was when using an auger to mine iron. A forge, cement mixer, and chem station crafting at the same time has yet to spawn a screamer for me.

 

I have had the same experience. I am currently having my "base" on the roof of a fast food restaurant with 4 forges, 2 chemistry stations, 2 workbenches and 2 cement mixers. Even when I run everything at the same time, I haven't had any screamers yet.

 

However, when I mine iron or lead, it doesn't take me 2 minutes to get a screamer. Breaking metal blocks generate a lot of heat.

[Kosmic Kerman]

1 hour ago, RipClaw said:

On the bedrock I am at a height of 3m. The surface is at 44m. Only when I climb up to 10m then I can spawn a screamer.  Below that I always get the error message. 

Jonah must have been at a height where there were less than 35 blocks between him and the surface.

 

This is probably the case. He was standing about 5-6 blocks above bedrock and I don't think where he built the base was particularly deep.

[RLBiscuit]

Ladies and gentlemen, I have to get up really early in the morning and don't have much free time when I get home after work. I have other necessities I don't feel the need to explain here. I apologize if there has been a reduction in screamer spawnings since last I was able to build a significant base, but the last time I did I'd walk out to multiple screamers. If all the issues I've raised are no longer an issue then please feel free to disregard this entire post.

[Jason Tamosiunis]

15 hours ago, RLBiscuit said:

I certainly hope you aren't taking my comments as complaining. I'm just commenting on the fact that the last time I dug a deep base, I had to spend a lot of time filling in what the zombies did to the surface when they really shouldn't have known I was there. To perhaps clarify a previous comment I made, I think the heat map thing should be a defined on all 3 axes, so that if I am deep enough, screamers shouldn't show up, for instance. If it is that way now, I apologize, I haven't had time to thoroughly test the current mechanics. I was simply making the point that if I want to take the time to dig deep with tools and skills, when the blood moon ends, I don't want to have to go fix the remarkable damage early game zombies can do with their bare hands. Early game I'd prefer to be able to dig deep, set up shop, first blood moon work to prep myself, and as the zombies get harder I have a well functioning workshop with which to build what I need to build to face them. Like I said, I haven't had time to test the current mechanics, and I'm not trying to "hide" from danger in a game based on danger, but it does seem to be the case that at some point the mechanics were changed to make it so that those of us that want to play the game by digging deep were, for lack of a better word, punished, for doing so. I don't play on servers, I play single player. I love the customization I am allowed, but the fact that digging deep isn't as secure as it once was or, in my humble opinion, as it should be, should be an "advanced option" rather than just strictly imposed if one wants to play current versions of the game.

 

I digress

i think he is saying it to both of us

[Darthjake]

How about the other way?   Used to be either up or down, you could build so high or so low that the Z's could not detect the heat map, that seems to be no longer the case now, and just means that we have to be cautious until we're able to defend what our heat map brings us.  Dear Lord, let us be thankful for what we are about to receive, one player said as we saw the radiated screamer, lol.