Combat crafting and survival.

[Ghostlight]

We can hope but frankly I don't see it happening. Seems loot is king now. All else must bow, player choice be damned. It's loot or nothing these days.

 

In fairness, it's what we asked for. In A17 it was the other extreme. Crafting was king. You could make the top tier of everything from basic resources (no parts). Hence there was no need to loot at all. Very little reason to leave your base. The only barrier between the player and the top tier items in the game was attaining a high enough level to get the appropriate perk.

 

Everyone HATED it. Thread after thread we lamented that looting was no longer needed nor even profitable, in comparison to crafting.

 

In typical TFP fashion, they switched from one extreme to the other. Welcome to A18.

 

Personally, I like it like this. Looting being king means I have purpose beyond sitting in my base. I go out and explore and loot and bring the spoils home to my base at night. I use crafting only to fill in gaps for those items where I have not managed to loot a good one. AND I LIKE IT THAT WAY. It's what I imagine doing in a real zombie apocalypse and I find it a very satisfying gameplay loop indeed.

[RipClaw]

Personally, I like it like this. Looting being king means I have purpose beyond sitting in my base. I go out and explore and loot and bring the spoils home to my base at night. I use crafting only to fill in gaps for those items where I have not managed to loot a good one. AND I LIKE IT THAT WAY. It's what I imagine doing in a real zombie apocalypse and I find it a very satisfying gameplay loop indeed.

 

Not looting doesn't automatically mean you're sitting in your base. You can also build or mine or just explore.

 

I doubt you would loot a whole lot in a real zombie apocalypse. That would be suicide. Instead, you'd rather flee to where there are fewer zombies and try to build up self-sufficiency.

[Reth]

if you actually read madmole's post he only mentioned underground. above ground would still be destructable. stop trying to sabotage what madmole says for your own narrative.

 

Having actually read his comments in their entirety, I find it mind boggling that he equates mining and digging with "safe" underground bases. The allure of underground construction seems to be completely lost on him.

 

On the bright side, I can now understand the reasoning behind all the controversial changes that happened lately.

[Ghostlight]

Not looting doesn't automatically mean you're sitting in your base. You can also build or mine or just explore.

 

Why would you explore if you do not plan to loot the places you discover? Genuinely curious.

 

I doubt you would loot a whole lot in a real zombie apocalypse. That would be suicide. Instead, you'd rather flee to where there are fewer zombies and try to build up self-sufficiency.

 

No way man, I'd get out there and crack heads like a boss!

[RipClaw]

Why would you explore if you do not plan to loot the places you discover? Genuinely curious.

 

For example, because I am looking for a specific POI or want to get a general overview of the map. I often drive around to find new traders. I don't waste a lot of time looting all the POIs.

 

No way man, I'd get out there and crack heads like a boss!

 

Famous last words

[leaderdog]

I think madmole was mainly talking about the performance hit.

 

But I agree the game wouldn't have life for me if it was like Conan Exiles mining and other games like that. I bought it, played for a while, got so bored that I just haven't played it in about a year.

 

Underground could be fixed by having to have timbers put in place to brace the ground, make it more challenging in regards to what you would need to do to be safe. tunnels to surface for oxygen/co2 release (pipes you would bury from bottom to surface) etc. This was all discussed back when other people were complaining about how some one plays their game. Which was pretty silly for a game to be adjusted for a few people that liked to live underground. as I said then, I'll say now, Who cares how someone else plays their game. Enjoy it the way you want.

 

I'm losing interest in the game simply because melee combat is horrendously bad. a wimp swing and a blow all your energy swing is dumb, and if you want in close combat to be hard to swing a melee, because it would be, put a shove in. but nah let's have two swings because once you're more leveled up you don't use the wimp swing because... why would you?

 

baseball parts to make a baseball is ridiculous too. just sayin

 

I feel bad ragging on the pimps, but the game was amazing, I told everyone that would listen stories about the crazy adventures I was having in the game. But I get that they need to make more sales, so making it like other games helps to bring in those game players. I understand that. Unfortunately, instead of building on the strengths and uniqueness the game had, it's becoming a sad imitation of other games, I have no interest in playing.

 

as an analogy, it's like the original Simpsons tv show. Brilliant, hilarious, and clever in so many ways. after many seasons they hired all new staff to write it, now it's a sad, one joke, lame delivery that has no or little enjoyment in it at all any more. I quit watching many years ago because it wasn't funny at all.

 

sorry for the rant.

[JaxTeller718]

 

I feel bad ragging on the pimps, but the game was amazing, I told everyone that would listen stories about the crazy adventures I was having in the game. But I get that they need to make more sales, so making it like other games helps to bring in those game players. I understand that. Unfortunately, instead of building on the strengths and uniqueness the game had, it's becoming a sad imitation of other games, I have no interest in playing.

 

 

It didnt have to be that way. More sales are always a good thing, but why not move on now? A sequel would make WAY more than a redesigned Alpha. We already bought this game. We love it. So leave it as is, preserve our memories. Announce a sequel. THEN implement all these new ideas etc.

 

Whats better, trying to squeeze some fresh players to a new alpha, but alienating your original fans? Or announcing a new sequel and having ALL your fans buy THAT? Im pretty sure you cant get blood from a stone. If they continue to change dev teams and programmers and overhaul every system by the time the sequel is announced so many people will be jaded they wont even care. It is very short sighted.

[Bender]

This game is a gem and the only game I've ever recommended to my friends. I've played all those games MM listed in his post. I quit them all after a short time because of not being able to alter the terrain. It makes me sad to see MM say he wishes they had made a crappy cookie cutter game instead. Like seriously sad.

 

EDIT: Also tons of other game. I also don't play games like skyrim for the mining...

[Laz Man]

Decided to step away from this game for a while as too many things are changing for my tastes these days, understand this game in development so I have patience to wait until a18 gets to a polished state to play again.

 

As I step away for a bit, want to point out something 7D2D game direction:

 

What 7D2D does have that most other survival games don't is a fully destructible and buildable world.

 

Plenty of other games that do a lot of things better, the list of games and the aspects those games do better than 7D2D is huge. A destructible world (voxels) is what sets 7D2D apart and I suspect keeps most hard core fans still here and coming back.

 

I love the a18 direction and balancing, but am concerned that 7D2D is getting away from the thing that most drew me to this game in a15 years ago: A better minecraft with robust crafting and zombies. Turning 7D2D into a combat/loot fest focused game seems a non-win situation because there is other games that do this way better. Yes, I want zombies and to have challenging survival but not at the expense of crafting/building goodness.

 

You make good points. If I was driving, I would create a separate sandbox mode that has less restrictions (e.g. survival lite) if I cant mold the main game mode to satisfy both the crafting/sandbox crowd and the survival crowd...

[Boidster]

they must have added about a hundred new recipes that were of much greater significance than outside corner wood frame.

 

Now look what you've done, you MONSTER.

 

[Volstag]

You mean like "basebuilding is pointless," but when you ask them to elaborate they can't? *eye roll*

 

This is the one that I simply can't wrap my head around.

 

To me, base building is vastly more important in A18 than any prior alpha I've played (back to A8/A9 -- but note I never played A16 or A17). If you don't have a good base, you die and lose the base. It doesn't get much more important than that.

 

I was utterly amazed and elated when I lost my base to the day 21 horde on my very first A18 game. That represents, literally, the 2nd time that's ever happened to me since A8/A9. The game is finally living up to its name.

 

-V

[RipClaw]

This is the one that I simply can't wrap my head around.

 

To me, base building is vastly more important in A18 than any prior alpha I've played (back to A8/A9 -- but note I never played A16 or A17). If you don't have a good base, you die and lose the base. It doesn't get much more important than that.

 

I was utterly amazed and elated when I lost my base to the day 21 horde on my very first A18 game. That represents, literally, the 2nd time that's ever happened to me since A8/A9. The game is finally living up to its name.

 

-V

 

Whether you comprehend what players mean when they say " base building is pointless " depends probably on how you define base building and whether the loss of a base affects you. For me base building is when you build a base from scratch and not when you only reinforce a POI.

 

What I have observed so far is that players who have built their base from scratch in the past shifted towards modifying a POI instead. If you built something from scratch then you probably don't want it to be destroyed. I don't mean that there are just a few blocks missing but that the whole base is just a pile of rubble after the horde. With a POI that you only modified you don't care. Then you just use the next POI.

 

For example, I recently fought the day 35 horde at a gamestage of 100. For this I modified a big water tower. I reinforced the base with reinforced concrete and surrounded several layers of iron spikes and barbed wire. At the top of the water tower I put iron bars on which I can walk and shoot through.

 

If the water tower should collapse sometime I can simply look for a new water tower and feel no big loss. But if I lose a base that I have built from scratch then the loss is much greater.

 

Due to the high group block damage of the zombies since A17 and the demolisher in A18 it is more and more likely that you can lose your entire base when things go south. So players decide against building their own base and only reinforce POIs because their loss is bearable.

[Laz Man]

We can hope but frankly I don't see it happening. Seems loot is king now. All else must bow, player choice be damned. It's loot or nothing these days. The only way I see the tool weapon issue being balanced again is if nothing but lvl 1's and 2's drop til you hit high gamestage (350 or so?) then the lvl 6's appear. That way all the middle stuff gets crafted.

 

If the devs dont prioritize it I'm sure the modders will cook something up for now.

[Laz Man]

Whether you comprehend what players mean when they say " base building is pointless " depends probably on how you define base building and whether the loss of a base affects you. For me base building is when you build a base from scratch and not when you only reinforce a POI.

 

What I have observed so far is that players who have built their base from scratch in the past shifted towards modifying a POI instead. If you built something from scratch then you probably don't want it to be destroyed. I don't mean that there are just a few blocks missing but that the whole base is just a pile of rubble after the horde. With a POI that you only modified you don't care. Then you just use the next POI.

 

For example, I recently fought the day 35 horde at a gamestage of 100. For this I modified a big water tower. I reinforced the base with reinforced concrete and surrounded several layers of iron spikes and barbed wire. At the top of the water tower I put iron bars on which I can walk and shoot through.

 

If the water tower should collapse sometime I can simply look for a new water tower and feel no big loss. But if I lose a base that I have built from scratch then the loss is much greater.

 

Due to the high group block damage of the zombies since A17 and the demolisher in A18 it is more and more likely that you can lose your entire base when things go south. So players decide against building their own base and only reinforce POIs because their loss is bearable.

 

That's probably just a temporary condition until players come up with defenses that appeal to their sensibilities and/or can withstand the horde without too much damage. It's a good problem to have imo as it's a core part of the gameplay...figuring out how to defense against the reoccurring BM hordes. Without it, boredom just sets in until people are done playing barbies dream house. 😂