Shotgun shells VS shotgun slugs!

[FranticDan]

So I've noticed a possible oversight, regular shells so 12 x 8 damage (96), but the slugs which cost quite a lot of resources only do 80 damage.

 

Do the slugs have a greater chance to dismember or some other benefit for the lower damage or is it an oversight?

[Kalarro]

wiki description:

 

Unlike Shotgun Shells, Shotgun Slugs do not spread and inflict more damage.

 

So yeah, 12*8 is more, but I guess it's pretty hard to hit with all the shells

[Katitof]

Slugs are more effective at longer range, ragdoll Zs like mad and don't require any particular mod (choke) to be effective vs single target.

Its also much easier to OHK through head shot.

That being said, slugs do nothing that magnum wouldn't already, but then again, magnum has less bullets and reloads much longer.

[Deceptive Pastry]

I noticed this when they first changed it. Considering how tight the shotgun spread is in A17 that really isn't much of a factor. Only has 7 more max range than shotgun shells and the same damage fall-off range of ... 3. Considering how much more expensive they are to make than pretty much any other ammo, it makes no sense to me to use them over shells now.

[FranticDan]

I noticed this when they first changed it. Considering how tight the shotgun spread is in A17 that really isn't much of a factor. Only has 7 more max range than shotgun shells and the same damage fall-off range of ... 3. Considering how much more expensive they are to make than pretty much any other ammo, it makes no sense to me to use them over shells now.

 

I use the shotgun at very close range so having the extra range is meaningless to me, I attach a choke if i have one since it doubles for extra damage, I'd rather make 9mm with the resources needed for slugs. The slugs used to be 100 during experimental and even then I'm not sure that is worth the cost :/ *shrug*

[konrax]

From a PVP point of view, if all you run around with is a shotgun, taking a stack of 10-20 slugs with you gives you a quick to switch to option if you are pinned in a position and need something longer range than a standard shotgun round.

 

Most people however just carry around a basic hunting rifle unmodded with a stack of bullets so they have something to shoot long range with.

[Deceptive Pastry]

I use the shotgun at very close range so having the extra range is meaningless to me, I attach a choke if i have one since it doubles for extra damage, I'd rather make 9mm with the resources needed for slugs. The slugs used to be 100 during experimental and even then I'm not sure that is worth the cost :/ *shrug*

 

It was worth it when it was 64 vs. 100. Not even remotely worth now that it's 92 vs. 80. If it were still 100 with a damage falloff range of 7 then maybe.

[Scyris]

wiki description:

 

Unlike Shotgun Shells, Shotgun Slugs do not spread and inflict more damage.

 

So yeah, 12*8 is more, but I guess it's pretty hard to hit with all the shells

 

Slugs don't do more damage persay, its just 1 raycast insted of 8 that has to hit, so headshots expecally with slugs are pretty epic. But why use shotgun slugs in the first place? Magnum has same damage as shotgun slugs do, and the ammo costs less mats to make.

[Ranzera]

It was worth it when it was 64 vs. 100. Not even remotely worth now that it's 92 vs. 80. If it were still 100 with a damage falloff range of 7 then maybe.

 

96* vs. 80

[Deceptive Pastry]

96* vs. 80

 

Right right. I was wrong about 64 also, I was confused because I changed it to 8x8. It was actually 7x8 (56).

[CoolJ]

Right right. I was wrong about 64 also, I was confused because I changed it to 8x8. It was actually 7x8 (56).

 

Slugs are handy for stealth headshots. You generally don't want to get close enough to a radiated sleeper to ensure that all the buckshot from a standard shell will hit the head. I tend to carry a few slugs with me when I go to raid a shop these days just for that reason. They are a range extender for the shotgun. That is the purpose. Also, you have to have all the mods you want to use installed on a gun and then click the mod button to see the actual damage that you will do with a weapon. If you do that, you will see that slug damage is very much on par with standard buckshot. It also comes with the guarantee that all of that damage will be delivered to the head.

[LuckyStar]

Slugs are handy for stealth headshots. You generally don't want to get close enough to a radiated sleeper to ensure that all the buckshot from a standard shell will hit the head. I tend to carry a few slugs with me when I go to raid a shop these days just for that reason. They are a range extender for the shotgun. That is the purpose. Also, you have to have all the mods you want to use installed on a gun and then click the mod button to see the actual damage that you will do with a weapon. If you do that, you will see that slug damage is very much on par with standard buckshot. It also comes with the guarantee that all of that damage will be delivered to the head.

 

Yeah this.

 

You don't need to use Slugs but if your play style is like what's described here then they are most certainly worth it.

[Deceptive Pastry]

The numbers just don't work.

 

Consider that both have a measly damage fall-off range of 3. For comparison the fireaxe has a range of 2.9. Shells max range = 18, slugs = 25.

 

I believe it works as a linear drop-off of 100% - 0% damage from damage fall-off range - max range. Correct me if anyone knows otherwise. Edit: Corrected in next post

 

Given that, shotgun slugs begin out-damaging shells if all pellets hit (and again that spread is fairly tight) at a range of 9 at which slugs do 58 damage to the shells 57.

 

But here is the main issue...at a range of 9.7 slugs drop to the same damage as the hunting rifle, and at 11 to same damage as the sniper rifle. The rifles don't even begin losing damage till range 60/70 respectively. So you have a very small zone at range 9 - 9.7 where slugs should out-damage both...

 

I mean if you find them in the wild, cool, use them. But especially in terms of crafting, shells do more damage at close range and 7.62 does more damage at medium-long range for much fewer resources. Slugs are objectively just less efficient resource wise. I would concede that at close range aiming for headshot you may miss a pellet or two, but it still isn't enough damage to justify the roughly 3x higher resource cost.

 

At a bare minimum, they need to increase the effective range or the damage of slugs for me to ever use them over shells or a rifle.

[Deceptive Pastry]

So just for fun/curiosity of how the game works I looked in the .dll. The calculation doesn't seem to be linear, it uses squared values. Calculation in files is:

 

itemActionDataRanged.damageFalloffPercent = 1f - (worldRayHitInfo.hit.distanceSq - value * value) / (range * range - value * value)

 

Or more plainly,

 

damageFalloffPercent = 1 - (distance squared - DamageFalloffRange squared) / (MaxRange squared - DamageFalloffRange squared)

 

So using that caclulation at range 10.3 slugs outdamage shells 67 to 66. Matches hunting rifle damage at range 14 and sniper rifle at 15.3. Better...but still not worth resource cost imo.

[BobTheBard]

Slugs are handy for stealth headshots.

 

For some reason the idea of 'stealth' + 'shotgun' doesn't make much sense to me. Just saying.