choose 1. Fore grip mod or retracting stock mod for hunting rifle

[ElCabong]

It has 8x scope. Muzzle brake. And I can put a fore grip or the retracting stock  on. If you think the muzzle brake should go, please discuss.

[Darthjake]

1 hour ago, ElCabong said:

It has 8x scope. Muzzle brake. And I can put a fore grip or the retracting stock  on. If you think the muzzle brake should go, please discuss.

 

If you've got an 8x scope on it I'd go for the bipod and extended barrel, fore grip and retracting stock are more for hip fire, or close up shots, ofc if that's your only or best weapon at the moment and you need it for close up shots then either of those options work, I'd read the description and see which one suits you more.

 

[meganoth]

As it is a long range weapon muzzle brake is a must as it plays to the hunting rifles strengths.

 

Using the hunting rifle while running or in close combat is generally a bad idea but may happen hopefully very seldom.

 

Then (according to the XMLs, so spoilers ahead) the fore grip seems to offer a lot more benefits (even some that help for long range shooting too!!) while the retracting stock only increases hip firing accuracy (to the point I am considering whether it might be a bug). And that is even though the fore grip is tier 1 and the retracting stock is tier2. I assume the stock is supposed to be a small supplement to the fore grip.

 

 

 

[Uncle Al]

I'm assuming these are the only mods you have available, so having anything on for extra damage is a plus. As others have noted, bipods and barrel extensions are more generally useful mods for rifles.

 

I'd go with retracting stock over fore grip. Both improve hipfire accuracy but the stock has no drawbacks whereas the grip will reduce aim handing.

 

Reducing recoil is pretty useless on a hunting rifle, as you're reloading between every shot anyway. The muzzle brake does give a small general handling buff though, so better than nothing. Equally the foregrip recoil reduction is wasted, another reason to lean towards the folding stock.

[Darthjake]

2 minutes ago, meganoth said:

As it is a long range weapon muzzle brake is a must as it plays to the hunting rifles strengths.

 

Using the hunting rifle while running or in close combat is generally a bad idea but may happen hopefully very seldom.

 

Then (according to the XMLs, so spoilers ahead) the fore grip seems to offer a lot more benefits (even some that help for long range shooting too!!) while the retracting stock only increases hip firing accuracy (to the point I am considering whether it might be a bug). And that is even though the fore grip is tier 1 and the retracting stock is tier2. I assume the stock is supposed to be a small supplement to the fore grip.

 

 

 

 

For some reason I was thinking the muzzle brake was a shotgun item.

 

That is a nice bit of info about the fore grip!  Thanks!

[Uncle Al]

4 minutes ago, meganoth said:

As it is a long range weapon muzzle brake is a must as it plays to the hunting rifles strengths.

 

What's your thinking here?

 

My understanding, it may have changed, is a muzzle brake gives -25% V recoil, -15% H recoil and +8% handling

 

Most of that is useless on a hunting rifle, as the need to reload between shots makes recoil irrelevant. You'll need to start aiming again once you've reloaded, by which time the recoil effect has disappeared.  I'd only put a muzzle brake on a hunting rifle if, as here, he didn't have anything better.

[meganoth]

25 minutes ago, Uncle Al said:

What's your thinking here?

 

My understanding, it may have changed, is a muzzle brake gives -25% V recoil, -15% H recoil and +8% handling

 

Most of that is useless on a hunting rifle, as the need to reload between shots makes recoil irrelevant. You'll need to start aiming again once you've reloaded, by which time the recoil effect has disappeared.  I'd only put a muzzle brake on a hunting rifle if, as here, he didn't have anything better.

 

My rationale is that after reloading the game will probably have you look at the exact spot again (+- random recoil) unlike reality. But I haven't tested it and not checked XML whether reload does add another random "recoil" and how big that is. Or even resets the view completely

 

Apart from that I notice in the xml now that it reduces damagefallofrange by 5. So it has a disadvantage for long range too.

 

 

 

29 minutes ago, Uncle Al said:

I'm assuming these are the only mods you have available, so having anything on for extra damage is a plus. As others have noted, bipods and barrel extensions are more generally useful mods for rifles.

 

I'd go with retracting stock over fore grip. Both improve hipfire accuracy but the stock has no drawbacks whereas the grip will reduce aim handing.

 

Reducing recoil is pretty useless on a hunting rifle, as you're reloading between every shot anyway. The muzzle brake does give a small general handling buff though, so better than nothing. Equally the foregrip recoil reduction is wasted, another reason to lean towards the folding stock.

 

 

Grip reducing aim handling, that is where I am reading the xml differently:

                       <passive_effect name="WeaponHandling" operation="perc_add" value=".13"/>
                        <passive_effect name="WeaponHandling" operation="perc_add" value="-.08">
                                <requirement name="HasBuff" buff="buffHoldBreathAiming01"/>
                        </passive_effect>

 

To me it looks like the first line adds 13% to weapon handling, but then reduces that again when you are aiming by 8%. 13-8 is stll a positive 5% while aiming.

 

And those two lines should be added and not replace each other because in other places of the xml "perc_add" does add up, see for example with guns:

 

                <passive_effect name="EntityDamage" operation="perc_add" value="-.15,.15" tags="perkGunslinger"/> <!-- random EntityDmg -->
                <passive_effect name="EntityDamage" operation="perc_add" value=".1,.5" tier="2,6" tags="perkGunslinger"/> <!-- tier bonus -->

 

Edited November 23, 2022 by meganoth (see edit history)

[Uncle Al]

4 hours ago, meganoth said:

 

My rationale is that after reloading the game will probably have you look at the exact spot again (+- random recoil) unlike reality. But I haven't tested it and not checked XML whether reload does add another random "recoil" and how big that is. Or even resets the view completely

 

Apart from that I notice in the xml now that it reduces damagefallofrange by 5. So it has a disadvantage for long range too.

 

 

 

 

 

Grip reducing aim handling, that is where I am reading the xml differently:

                       <passive_effect name="WeaponHandling" operation="perc_add" value=".13"/>
                        <passive_effect name="WeaponHandling" operation="perc_add" value="-.08">
                                <requirement name="HasBuff" buff="buffHoldBreathAiming01"/>
                        </passive_effect>

 

To me it looks like the first line adds 13% to weapon handling, but then reduces that again when you are aiming by 8%. 13-8 is stll a positive 5% while aiming.

 

And those two lines should be added and not replace each other because in other places of the xml "perc_add" does add up, see for example with guns:

 

                <passive_effect name="EntityDamage" operation="perc_add" value="-.15,.15" tags="perkGunslinger"/> <!-- random EntityDmg -->
                <passive_effect name="EntityDamage" operation="perc_add" value=".1,.5" tier="2,6" tags="perkGunslinger"/> <!-- tier bonus -->

 

OK, I see where you're going if you're shooting at a stationary target, but how often does that happen. The fact you have to reaim and reacquire your target anyway after reloading is why I don't think recoil is an issue on single shot weapons. In fact how much recoil matters is pretty much directly proportional to your rate of fire.

 

As for the grip, possibly it's changed or possibly "WeaponHandling" only adds to hipfire handling unless it has the additional requirement.  That would certainly match what's shown for the foregrip in Mem's accessory guide, which was very good but could be outdated:

 

 Positives: +15% Hipfire Accuracy, +15% Additional Hipfire Accuracy while Crouching, +13% Hipfire Handling, -5% V. Recoil, -5% H. Recoil
- Negatives: -8% Aim Handling

 

Certainly the foregrip makes more sense with those stats than adding 13% to ALL handling then reducing aim handling by 8%. I'm not sure if a difference of 13%  aim handling is enough to actually test reliably just by observation but I might give it a go.

 

Be interesting to see what the XML for the bipod it.  The guide entry is:

 

Positives: +8% Aim Accuracy, +35% Aim Handling
- Negatives: -5% Hipfire Accuracy, -5% Accuracy while Walking, -5% Hipfire Handling

 

For comparison.

 

I'm perfectly willing to believe Mem misread the XML, or it's changed, but equally willing to believe they knew something we don't about how XML entries affect actual handling.

[ElCabong]

Yes, these are only mods I have

[Ripflex]

M60 and lots of bullets ...

[Weazelsun]

I'd go with the fore grip mod for those cases when you might be in close combat.