P3rf3ctVZer0 Posted July 18, 2020 Share Posted July 18, 2020 Look I love this game and I can attest through hours etc but let me be frank - DEVS if you care about this game at all you need to focus solely on ram optimizations! Minecraft has really started realizing this and I can make the game run 130 mods 48000 blocks 1700 entities 450 biomes and 100000 chunks loaded with 50 players on a simple 6.5GB I understand fancy graphics but even crisis 3 borderlands 2 borderlands 3 can safely run on 4.5Gb so why does your game need 12GB?! Even on LOW? Stop Please STOP adding features and make the rest of a19 focus on optimization. Your game is starting to look like the scrap armor in terms of optimization! Most low end gaming pcs sell at 16GB of ram so your game now takes 12 leaving users to work with 4GB windows steals 2 leaving a user 2 left for discord and YouTube. Depending on browser or what you are doing on another monitor your ram starts screaming for death. When a user boots the game into the world you should slow the loading down so its not thirsting for ram 30 mins in. most low end laptops and pcs only offer 8gb and that is the starting point I know many people who would buy this if it didn't murder the ram usage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzHawkeye Posted July 18, 2020 Share Posted July 18, 2020 No, they don't need to focus "solely on RAM optimisations" in Alpha 19 (or any other Alpha for that matter). Let 'em finish the content push they want to do, get into Beta, and then, absolutely, make optimisation their highest (but not sole) concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SylenThunder Posted July 18, 2020 Share Posted July 18, 2020 Could you maybe compare a game that's fully 3D voxel with structural integrity and a complex AI? So far all you've listed are pretty basic games in comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3rf3ctVZer0 Posted July 21, 2020 Author Share Posted July 21, 2020 Give me a while as a gamer I am sure I have some 3d voxels. Hm as far as complex ai I mean I don't consider the ai in this game complex um how many sub routines per actor are there? I may be able to actually find something along those lines. I know ai can really impact things even older Minecraft had a great deal of ai issues ( still does actually but mods have made it so much less noticeable. ) I will respond again when I get examples Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FileMachete Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 Just responding to your question @SylenThunder I don't have a dog in this one :) The two games I play that at least somewhat fit are: Space Engineers & Empyrion Galactic Survival. I started playing all three (1st SE, then 7dtd, then EGS) when my pc had 8GB of RAM. Reason I upped it to 16GB was 7dtd started having issues. Back in a16 I think. The only benefit I noticed in the other 2 games was that I could play SE longer before needing to restart, but SE has had issues with mem leaks/not-offloading-bits for as long as I've had it. Though I have no idea what the mem cost of AI is in 7dtd, SE's physics, conveyor & manufacturing, large mining rigs, auto turret targetting, etc may be comparable. EGS's AI does handle some pathing possibly comparable to 7dtd. NPC foot soldiers attacking player made bases take out doors to gain entry and furher path to the Core to take over the base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SylenThunder Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 11 hours ago, FileMachete said: Just responding to your question @SylenThunder I don't have a dog in this one The two games I play that at least somewhat fit are: Space Engineers & Empyrion Galactic Survival. I started playing all three (1st SE, then 7dtd, then EGS) when my pc had 8GB of RAM. Reason I upped it to 16GB was 7dtd started having issues. Back in a16 I think. The only benefit I noticed in the other 2 games was that I could play SE longer before needing to restart, but SE has had issues with mem leaks/not-offloading-bits for as long as I've had it. Though I have no idea what the mem cost of AI is in 7dtd, SE's physics, conveyor & manufacturing, large mining rigs, auto turret targetting, etc may be comparable. EGS's AI does handle some pathing possibly comparable to 7dtd. NPC foot soldiers attacking player made bases take out doors to gain entry and furher path to the Core to take over the base. Of those two EGS is the closest, but they don't use a voxel landscape and SI is only minimally calculated on structures. Their AI needs a LOT of work too, but apparently they've decided they're leaving Alpha and going Gold in a couple of weeks. For me this is a huge disappointment as they just released a new Alpha with a lot of major changes. And before they're even finished stabilizing it, they're skipping beta entirely and going gold. It's hugely irresponsible, and will basically lead to a release as bad as No Man's Sky or Conan's was. A new "Alpha" build after only a month and a half, and it's going to be gold because it's been 5 years, and they think they're done adding features. (Sorry for the rant, I've worked with these guys for 5 years, and this announcement was quite shocking.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FileMachete Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 @SylenThunder, Shocking indeed. I had to shelve EGS when they implemented the insane "Mass limits top speed" bs. In case you haven't seen it they just posted a letter that clears a few things up; https://empyriononline.com/threads/leaving-alpha-early-access-some-clarifications.94900/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warmer Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 I find it really funny that someone takes their time to say how bad something is compared x,y,z and then makes you prove why it isn't. That's not how arguments work. You have the burden of proof. You are making the claim. Howling your displeasure into the forums, without constructive criticism, nearly always gets you nowhere. Show us why 7D2D doesn't need so much memory or you are just making claims without a precise point of reference. If you have a good enough point, maybe the devs will take your advice. Just my two cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liesel Weppen Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 Memory usage in 7d2d is quite... basic... and absolutely unoptimized. It seems like the voxel structure of the whole map is completely loaded into memory all the time. At least in A18 i observed that memory usage scales almost 1:1 on the mapsize. A 4K map only used ~3GB while a 8K map required indeed ~12GB and a nitrogen 10K map almost used up to 19GB. It seems not to load just chunks around the players location, like e.g. Minecraft does. Player count seems not to cause any higher memory usage even worth mentioning, but i only had max 7 players on my dedicated. Imho that's a basic mechanic that should not be left as optimization for final but should really been fixed in alpha stages already, especially because the streaming of chunks also requires testing and is a huge potential source of errors. But however, RAM is cheap, just buy more. And it's still alpha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SylenThunder Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 2 hours ago, FileMachete said: @SylenThunder, Shocking indeed. I had to shelve EGS when they implemented the insane "Mass limits top speed" bs. In case you haven't seen it they just posted a letter that clears a few things up; https://empyriononline.com/threads/leaving-alpha-early-access-some-clarifications.94900/ Yes, I was reading the message in the Discord when it came across this morning. They managed to say a lot without actually saying much at all. Basically they're going into Beta, but not actually calling it Beta. They're abandoning traditional development labels because reasons. More information to come. IMHO, they just want to ditch the EA status because it's been getting a lot of hate from people who have absolutely no clue how game development actually works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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