Dimpy Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 It seems there are two different playstyles involved with construction. One of them is two build a base entirely from scratch, and the other is to reinforce a preexisting building. Since perks are supposed to allow players to invest in a certain playstyle, maybe there should be perks for this too. Does anyone have any ideas for what a perk explicitly designed to encourage specialization in base-building vs base reinforcing would look like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cirion Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Here's one quick idea - Reduced material cost to build parts (start from scratch) vs - Reduced material cost to upgrade parts (reinforcement) You'd like both eventually, but can get by with just the second if taking over a POI. Really, I dunno why this isn't a thing already. Anyone who has played vanilla, on single player, knows how painful it is to upgrade to a steel base. yeah it's supposed to be end-game, but it's still ridiculous. Thanks for giving me this following new idea: If they ever wanted to bring back LBD (hint hint LOL!) then for crafting skill, instead of crafting skill "gating" you from unlocking stuff like people complained about, crafting skill would instead just reduce the costs of making and/or upgrading stuff, and you'd get crafting skill naturally by upgrading things primarily maybe. Then it would happen "naturally" while building your base and I can't think of a scenario where you would want to grind it in this scenario vs. the old A16 system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apostrophe Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 That's a good idea and really is surprising there aren't perks specific for building. I'd certainly go for the base-reinforcing one. I love turning houses and lodges into my own place. But, I feel the community's zeitgeist is not up for more perks. Plus, it would probably go into the Intellectual attribute right? There are already so many perks in there to choose and put points in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cirion Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 That's a good idea and really is surprising there aren't perks specific for building. I'd certainly go for the base-reinforcing one. I love turning houses and lodges into my own place. But, I feel the community's zeitgeist is not up for more perks. Plus, it would probably go into the Intellectual attribute right? There are already so many perks in there to choose and put points in. I hear ya, that's why I think bringing back at least some semblance of learning by doing would be really helpful. I think, keep A17 perks for "gating" certain skills perhaps like it is now, like being able to craft a forge or chem station, headshot damage bonus, etc. But add - learning by doing to increase damage done with certain weapon types, mining skill, athletics, and *improved crafting*. By improved crafting I mean reduced crafting time, perhaps less materials to make stuff, and less materials to upgrade (like just discussed). Crafting skill would go up either by making things, or upgrading blocks. Upgrading blocks should give a lot of points, to incentivize actually making bases instead of just spamming crafts to get points up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackelmyer Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Out of curiosity, what day are you guys on and how many zombies is your horde night set too? And do your forge(s) spawn a lot of screamers? Solo playing myself. By day 14 I had a full cobblestone 7x7 platform base with a wood frame ledge to fire from. Cobblestone/flagstone was upgraded too. I mine all night in game and build/scavenge in the day. Currently I'm easily loaded up on resources for building and have several thousand in made Concrete Mix waiting to upgrade my flagstone. I've heard people say they don't have resources to keep up. Though I suspect that's largely a difference in play style, build style, and game settings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skullpoker Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 That's a good idea and really is surprising there aren't perks specific for building. I'd certainly go for the base-reinforcing one. I love turning houses and lodges into my own place. But, I feel the community's zeitgeist is not up for more perks. Plus, it would probably go into the Intellectual attribute right? There are already so many perks in there to choose and put points in. The simple solution would be to combine some of the level gated crafting skills into one skill, and then make a new perk to decrease upgrade materials. This would be very likely to drastically reduce the hate for level gating, as one level gate enables a much broader range of blue-prints. How's that for zeitgeist, bruh? ---------------------------- Solo playing myself. By day 14 I had a full cobblestone 7x7 platform base with a wood frame ledge to fire from. Cobblestone/flagstone was upgraded too. I mine all night in game and build/scavenge in the day. Currently I'm easily loaded up on resources for building and have several thousand in made Concrete Mix waiting to upgrade my flagstone. I've heard people say they don't have resources to keep up. Though I suspect that's largely a difference in play style, build style, and game settings. FYI, even before you can build a cement mixer (or if you didn't bookmark one that you found) you can harvest cobblestone from blue tarp covered pallets, and cement mix from Cement Bag pallets/cement bags on ground. ------------------------------------------- My preferred style in a16 was to reinforce a POI, like the firehouse second floor after cutting out the stairs, then reinforcing every few blocks into a support pillar so the Z's would go for the weak spots and leave the pillars alone(exploit the Z's with engineering degrees since they are already a bitch ass exploit). Then mine to bedrock at 45° to set up forges and such, then build a base out of Iron Bars over a -barbed wire/camp fire pit- to kills jerks on horde night. Anything less would be uncivilized Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Flurry of Upgrading would be really nice..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PPanda0421 Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 It seems there are two different playstyles involved with construction. One of them is two build a base entirely from scratch, and the other is to reinforce a preexisting building. Since perks are supposed to allow players to invest in a certain playstyle, maybe there should be perks for this too. Does anyone have any ideas for what a perk explicitly designed to encourage specialization in base-building vs base reinforcing would look like? Some good ideas have been presented for building-type perks like requiring less resource for crafting blocks/upgrade or quicker upgrades. Another idea is adding a perk which allows pickup/placement of the unique blocks you cannot create in the normal (non-creative) world. With this perk you don't need LCB to pickup anything at all. Examples of unique blocks are: shotgun messiah sign, the 'Open' sign, those statics lights/flashlight that appear on the table/ground, etc. This perk might be OP early on but how about making it a level 100+ requirement since at that time you're pretty much OP and/or done with the game. With this building perk you'll truly have the ability to create your own 'realistic' world without having to go into creative mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimpy Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 - Reduced material cost to build parts (start from scratch) vs - Reduced material cost to upgrade parts (reinforcement) From what I understand, a large part of the "build from scratch" playstyle is spamming the block with the best ratio of time spent collecting resources to health ratio, and trying to outsmart the AI, while the reinforcement type is about relying mostly on the prebuilt walls to absorb damage, and sealing off weak spots. Both of them seem to use block upgrade vs block placement around the same amount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimpy Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 Flurry of Upgrading would be really nice..... "Every successive hit with a construction tool increases repair and upgrade speed by 5%, up to a total of 200% default speed" Probably isn't enough to stand as a perk on it's own, but it would be a nice quality of life addition if bundled with something else. Another idea is adding a perk which allows pickup/placement of the unique blocks you cannot create in the normal (non-creative) world. With this perk you don't need LCB to pickup anything at all. Examples of unique blocks are: shotgun messiah sign, the 'Open' sign, those statics lights/flashlight that appear on the table/ground, etc. This perk might be OP early on but how about making it a level 100+ requirement since at that time you're pretty much OP and/or done with the game. With this building perk you'll truly have the ability to create your own 'realistic' world without having to go into creative mode. Generally the perks are utilitarian, what you're suggesting is more of an aesthetic bonus. I think it would work better as a togglable option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PPanda0421 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 "Every successive hit with a construction tool increases repair and upgrade speed by 5%, up to a total of 200% default speed" Probably isn't enough to stand as a perk on it's own, but it would be a nice quality of life addition if bundled with something else. Generally the perks are utilitarian, what you're suggesting is more of an aesthetic bonus. I think it would work better as a togglable option. Yes it's more of an aesthetic bonus but for the artist/builder types (who don't want to play in creative mode) you'll play the game a bit longer. I think paint/paint brush allows you to 'draw' certain textures on blocks. This is a feature that is a step above it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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