Does Miner 69er...

[Gamida]

...lower the amount of resources you get the higher you go in it?

 

I sort of remember someone asking about it. If it increases block damage so you can break blocks faster does that mean you get less resources or does the amount you get increase also?

 

I mean if it takes 10 hits to break a boulder (or chop down a tree) and then it takes less hits as you increase your Miner 69er does that mean you get less back. Or do you get the same amount now but it just takes less time.

 

I can start a test game and try but figured by this time someone has already tested it.

[Endy Gainer]

My personal testing in 17.0 shows that block damage and resources gained don't scale linearly with one another, though it does increase slightly. The Lode skill completely overtakes the difference even with just one or two points.

[meganoth]

Since there is motherlode as a separate perk it would surprise me if miner69er would increase or decrease resources *per hit* in any serious fashion.

 

My guess is therefore that miner69er will keep resources per hit and therefore per time relatively constant but consequently decrease resources per block (since the block damage increases). This is what ghostrider has critizised in a separate thread.

 

If you want to dig long tunnels or huge caves (or just open lots of safes) miner69er is very beneficial. If you want to harvest surface blocks it is not helping at all. Underground it does not greatly change the resource gain, you would be faster at depleting ore veins but you also find them faster.

[Limdood]

miner69er:

Resources per time - higher (better)

resources per block - lower (worse)

time per block - lower (better)

 

motherlode:

resources per time - higher (better)

resources per block - higher (better)

time per block - unchanged

 

No matter what, buying miner69er and/or motherlode will SPEED UP the materials-gathering process. The only real concern i can see with grabbing miner69er is that boulders will yield less resources per boulder, which, after a LONG while, might mean you're roaming far and wide for more boulders. But you'll still have gotten more boulder resources in a shorter amount of time earlier in the game, so...

[Ghostlight]

Yes. In general, anything that increases block damage to boulders (Miner69er, mods into your pick, etc etc) will decrease the overall yield from that boulder.

 

This means that unless the change you make which increases your damage actually reduces the number of swings needed to clear the whole boulder, you are in fact better off NOT making that change.

 

However, even if the damage increase does decrease the number of swings, your overall yield per minute is still going to be less when mining boulders. UNLESS you manage to mine more boulders in a set time because of it. Which is generally unlikely since there are a finite number of boulders and they lie apart so you need to travel. [it would be different mining underground where you do not have to move between blocks].

 

It is fallacy to assume your resource per time figure is automatically improved by doing more damage / less swings - it generally isn't. This is because when you are boulder mining, a great deal of your time is spent looking around for the next boulder and travelling to it. Unless you have that activity so super-tuned that you simply could not do it any faster, shaving a swing off each boulder (at a cost of reduced resources) becomes irrelevant / detrimental.

 

It is important to say at this point that the reduction in resource from improving damage is not trivial, it is considerable. Here are some stats:

 

I was level 110, using a Steel pick.

Iron per boulder with no mods and no points in Miner69er: 46

Iron per boulder after adding Bunker Buster to my pick: 38

Iron per boulder after putting 2 points into Miner69er: 33

 

That is a resource loss of 28%. Even if those changes happened to reduce my number of swings per boulder by 1, this would not make up for 28% resource loss.

 

In short, if you are mining boulders, do not put points into Miner69er and do not put mods on your pick.

[Limdood]

It is fallacy to assume your resource per time figure is automatically improved by doing more damage / less swings - it generally isn't.

 

You're assuming that any time you lose is just spent standing around.

 

If boulders used to take 14 seconds to break and they now take 11, thats 3 seconds more of doing....something else. Whether moving on to your next task, or starting the run to the next boulder. If i start my run to the next boulder 3 seconds earlier, i'm saving time. I'll finish that boulder a net 6 seconds earlier, and after 4 boulders, no matter how far apart, i'll have saved the time for an entire boulder.

 

I what way is that not getting resources faster? factoring travel time in doesn't negate the benefit of reduced mining time.

[Ghostlight]

Because while the time you save hitting boulders means you can hit more boulders, you will not be able to hit sufficiently more boulders to compensate for the resource loss per boulder.

 

Did that make sense?

 

I will give some (completely fictitious) example numbers to illustrate what I mean (I have tested this a LOT btw). I will also use only Iron in my example but this is true for all resource types...

 

No Mods / No Points in Miner69er

I will spend 1 hour mining.

I get 40 Iron per boulder.

In one hour I can mine 100 boulders

Net Iron per hour = 4000

 

5 Mods / 5 Points in Miner69er

I will spend 1 hour mining.

I get 30 Iron per boulder.

In one hour I can mine 120 boulders

Net Iron per hour = 3600

[Gamida]

This it good...lots of feedback.

I was thinking that early game putting too many points into Miner 69er might not be the thing to do. Later game when you are more settled and are starting to get a stash of ores it may be better. It might be just me but I like getting more bang for my buck especially first starting off when you need it most.

Thanks all for responding.

[HungryZombie]

This it good...lots of feedback.

I was thinking that early game putting too many points into Miner 69er might not be the thing to do. Later game when you are more settled and are starting to get a stash of ores it may be better. It might be just me but I like getting more bang for my buck especially first starting off when you need it most.

Thanks all for responding.

 

The amount of ore you might lose is not that much imo. For me it's more important to clear obstacles, break safes and dig my pits and such early out so I like to get it.

 

Adding Strength points also increases block damage so if you are really worried about losing ore pay attention to that as well.

[Ghostlight]

Adding Strength points also increases block damage so if you are really worried about losing ore pay attention to that as well.

 

Correct but you need to do that to unlock Mother Lode, and the buff to resources from ML always trumps the loss of resource from increased strength.

[quyxkh]

Because while the time you save hitting boulders means you can hit more boulders, you will not be able to hit sufficiently more boulders to compensate for the resource loss per boulder.

Just a note, that doesn't happen for me with ore veins and non-godly tools, with a Q2 structural braced iron pickaxe going from just strength 3 to strength 5 69er 4 got me the same raw iron per ore node, 48. The game tells you the surface boulders show up near shallow-ish ore veins, that's been reliable for me (four, five mines now?), dig around a little, treat the boulders like treasure-map markers. Heh. I don't remember the journal note on mining being as explicit as the 17.1 one I just checked.

[MrVecetti]

Summary: no regular harvest on breaking a block. you only get the break block bonus.

Version:

Platform: (PC or Mac)

OS/Version: Windows/Linux/mac

Game mode, mp host/mp client/sp /client on dedi (RWG or NAV)

 

Did you wipe old saves? yes

Did you start a new game? yes

Did you validate your files? yes

Are you using any mods? no

EAC on

 

Status: NEW

 

Bug Description: When you break a block or worse 1 hit a block, you only get the resources for breaking the block and none for damaging the block

 

Reproduce steps: max strenght, max block damage perks. max harvest perks. with a shovel with 3 mods i hit gras 249 damage and get 40 clay total per block. with 4 mods i 1 hit the block and only get 20. with 2 mods i get 38.

 

Actual result: get 20 dirt from 1 block when 1 hitting it. I only get the break bonus, and no resources for the damage i deal.

 

Expected result: get 40 dirt from 1 block when 1 hitting it. Get the break bonus + resources for the damage i deal.

 

I assume this is what you are experiencing. Balance out your tool to get as close to 1 durability as possible before your last swing to get the most resources.

[Ghostlight]

Wow. That makes sense. Good find.