V1.1(b14) Trader Protection Zone Issues: Terrain Destruction and Block Placement Problems

[bachgaman]

Hi there. I want to point out a problem with the protected area around traders that causes inconsistent gameplay.

Current Problems with the Trader Area:

• You can destroy terrain blocks if they are more than 1 cell away from the trader's fence.
• You can place blocks if they are more than 3 cells away from the trader's fence.
• You can place a land claim block more than 36 cells away from the trader, even though its effective area is a square with a 20 cells from the center.

Consequences for Players:

• Players can ruin the landscape around the trader and can't fix it, because the area where you can destroy blocks is bigger than the area where placing blocks is protected.
• You can place blocks like turrets 3 cells away from the trader's fence, but you can't remove them because the land claim area only starts 16 cells away.

 

This inconsistency causes unnecessary problems, especially for players who want to build their base near a trader, who is an important part of the game.

Suggested Improvements:

To fix these issues, it would help to make all restrictions around the trader area consistent. The idea is to have the same distance from the trader's fence for destroying, placing, and managing blocks. This would get rid of the inconsistencies and make the gameplay more enjoyable.

 

[8_Hussars]

1) Ensure the LCB dead zone is set to zero (in settings).  This will eliminate most of the issues above.

2) Place a LCB so the LCB boundary is adjacent to the trader protected area.

3) This should allow building and retrieving placeables to the max extent possible.
 

After some game time and experience, reflect back on your OP and appreciate that 7d2d does not have to be trader centric and that for many players it's actually a better game experience without them (or quests at least).  Accept that its a big wide virtual world with 100's of POIs and open space to explore.  Enjoy exploring it, making mistakes, and learning from them.

Edited October 9 by 8_Hussars (see edit history)

[theFlu]

1 hour ago, bachgaman said:

• You can destroy terrain blocks if they are more than 1 cell away from the trader's fence.
• You can place blocks if they are more than 3 cells away from the trader's fence.

Ssshhh... you're giving more examples of the arms race by referring to that, and people already have their pitchforks out

 

It's obviously a countermeasure to bases where you dig down next to the trader and use the invincible stone to support a base hanging to the side of the pit

[bachgaman]

39 minutes ago, 8_Hussars said:

1) Ensure the LCB dead zone is set to zero (in settings).  This will eliminate most of the issues above.

2) Place a LCB so the LCB boundary is adjacent to the trader protected area.

3) This should allow building and retrieving placeables to the max extent possible.
 

After some game time and experience, reflect back on your OP and appreciate that 7d2d does not have to be trader centric and that for many players it's actually a better game experience without them (or quests at least).  Accept that its a big wide virtual world with 100's of POIs and open space to explore.  Enjoy exploring it, making mistakes, and learning from them.

 

This is my first big dive into the game since version 1.0, so I decided to test the trader rebalance. It’s a pity that there are still no checkboxes or sliders in the world settings that would allow influencing the trader’s spawn, quests, trading, or rewards (except for the new daily quest progression limit, which practically doesn't affect anything), but as you say, the trader isn't important. At least there are new trader bases and LCB settings (which is what really matters). I tried what you mentioned regarding the LCB deadzone, and it partially helped, at least solving the second issue regarding turrets. Thank you. The first problem is still unresolved, see the screenshot.

 

 

Spoiler

 

[SylenThunder]

[8_Hussars]

2 hours ago, theFlu said:

Ssshhh... you're giving more examples of the arms race by referring to that, and people already have their pitchforks out

 

It's obviously a countermeasure to bases where you dig down next to the trader and use the invincible stone to support a base hanging to the side of the pit

Not that the conversation needs to migrate here, but I think Cautious Pancake indicated that loophole was closed.  (with the trader teleport)

[theFlu]

4 minutes ago, 8_Hussars said:

I think Cautious Pancake indicated that loophole was closed.  (with the trader teleport)

Hmm... I haven't gotten teleported in A22.1 yet, but that'd require about a 10 meter extra TP range outside the protection zone. Possible, of course. I might check it out sometime, might make for other types of funny bases... as now you can teleport out of your death trap bunker

[Riamus]

I doubt many people are trying to build that close to the trader.  Why would you want to?  Not only are you getting a ton of extra heat from the trader that will lead to constant screamer attacks even when you're not using workstations, but it just looks bad being that close, imo.  I suppose you may be trying to protect one side of your base during horde night or something?  If so, you're just reducing your ability to attack things on that side because they'll still go that way and your aim at them will be restricted.

 

In any case, what you show is basically a one-time issue when learning the game.  You learn right away to place the land claim first so you know where your boundaries are.  And then you build.  If you aren't changing your land claim dead zone and you're building within the boundaries, you won't have any problems whatsoever.  If you do want to change the dead zone to 0, you learn right away not to dig in the outer block and so you never do it again.  Still, I see no reason why they can't make both dig and build areas equal since they are only 1 block different.

[bachgaman]

19 minutes ago, Riamus said:

I doubt many people are trying to build that close to the trader.  Why would you want to?  Not only are you getting a ton of extra heat from the trader that will lead to constant screamer attacks even when you're not using workstations, but it just looks bad being that close, imo.  I suppose you may be trying to protect one side of your base during horde night or something?  If so, you're just reducing your ability to attack things on that side because they'll still go that way and your aim at them will be restricted.

 

In any case, what you show is basically a one-time issue when learning the game.  You learn right away to place the land claim first so you know where your boundaries are.  And then you build.  If you aren't changing your land claim dead zone and you're building within the boundaries, you won't have any problems whatsoever.  If you do want to change the dead zone to 0, you learn right away not to dig in the outer block and so you never do it again.  Still, I see no reason why they can't make both dig and build areas equal since they are only 1 block different.

I build close to the trader to shorten the route, which is done 10 times per in-game day. This doesn't affect the defense of the base in any way

[Riamus]

And driving 20m vs 3m is going to make all that much difference, even at 10x per day?  Why would you even be going to the trader that often?  It is rare that I'll go to a trader more than a couple of times a day unless I am really focusing on questing.  And then it doesn't matter how close it is to the base because I'm going there from the quest. Besides, the amount of extra time spent dealing with screamers because of the extra heat from the trader will probably eat up any time savings from going back and forth to the trader.  At least until you have automated defenses.

 

Anyhow, it doesn't matter why you want to do it.  If you want to, there isn't anything wrong with that.  It just isn't something I'd ever want to do.  And it doesn't change that you learn immediately not to dig that close and so won't do so again.  A fix might help another player who doesn't yet know that, but it won't really impact you since you already know not to do that and so won't do it again.

[bachgaman]

2 hours ago, Riamus said:

And driving 20m vs 3m is going to make all that much difference, even at 10x per day?  Why would you even be going to the trader that often?  It is rare that I'll go to a trader more than a couple of times a day unless I am really focusing on questing.  And then it doesn't matter how close it is to the base because I'm going there from the quest. Besides, the amount of extra time spent dealing with screamers because of the extra heat from the trader will probably eat up any time savings from going back and forth to the trader.  At least until you have automated defenses.

 

Anyhow, it doesn't matter why you want to do it.  If you want to, there isn't anything wrong with that.  It just isn't something I'd ever want to do.  And it doesn't change that you learn immediately not to dig that close and so won't do so again.  A fix might help another player who doesn't yet know that, but it won't really impact you since you already know not to do that and so won't do it again.

The difference between 20 meters and 3 meters is not that big, but if I've decided to build my base near a trader, why should I build 20 meters away instead of 3 meters from the fence? Especially if I don’t know that for some reason the developers have imposed these strange restrictions for different activities?

 

I didn’t create this topic for myself — now that I know about this ridiculous restriction, I’ll build only at the distance allowed by the LCB if I continue playing near a trader. Obviously, this imperfection in the game is quite absurd and needs to be fixed since others might face the same issue. That's why I created the topic, not because I urgently need a hotfix to correct a few dug-out blocks near my base.

Edited October 9 by bachgaman (see edit history)