Is loot abundance bugged?

[Scyris]

I am wondering because when its on the default of 100%, small ammo piles and cars pretty much have something in them every time, I decided to play a game on 75% and i'm noticing that certan loot boxes are empty 95% of the time. Small ammo piles for example out of about 30-40 i've opened, only 2 have had anything in them. Cars is another one, looting 20+ cars all empty. Seems a bit extreme for only 25% less. I know rng plays a factor but even so, at least 50% of these things should have something in them.

[HungryZombie]

I've observed the same thing when testing out 75% loot. I wonder if the glitch is that if there supposed to be only 1 item in the container and you are using something less than 100% loot abundance, the game sees the container as being empty because it can only express any percentage less than 1 as being zero. Like it's rounding the number down. I dunno but something is off I think.

[mr.natural]

I already pointed this out in the feedback/balance thread too:

https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?131394-Alpha-18-feedback-and-balancing-thread&p=1059984#post1059984

[meganoth]

According to Gazz the game does a second RNG roll if it rolls only half an item in a chest. So if it wants to place 0.75 hunting rifles into a chest, it makes a secondary roll and in 3 of 4 cases a hunting rifle should be in the chest.

 

IN THEORY!! Whether that works in practice has to be tested. Make a proper bug report and a tester might have to really look into it

 

I had thought about making a poi full of loot boxes of the same type just to check out loot percentages in different situations (for example to really test the effect of Lucky Looter). The hurdle is that I never built a POI before.

[mr.natural]

According to Gazz the game does a second RNG roll if it rolls only half an item in a chest. So if it wants to place 0.75 hunting rifles into a chest, it makes a secondary roll and in 3 of 4 cases a hunting rifle should be in the chest.

 

IN THEORY!! Whether that works in practice has to be tested. Make a proper bug report and a tester might have to really look into it

 

I had thought about making a poi full of loot boxes of the same type just to check out loot percentages in different situations (for example to really test the effect of Lucky Looter). The hurdle is that I never built a POI before.

 

Simple, go to a pregenerated world or Navezgane turn on DM to fly and loot 50 trashbags, 50 desktops, etc.

[meganoth]

Simple, go to a pregenerated world or Navezgane turn on DM to fly and loot 50 trashbags, 50 desktops, etc.

 

Not so simple. Trashbags and desktops are often empty at 100% as well, desktops also have the non-lootable closed variant that complicates the question what to expect from it.

 

For desktops you also need to search the POIs, sure I could remember for many where the desktop is, but even the remembering takes time if you want to get reasonable numbers. And since desktops are empty a lot at 100% you would need more than 50 to make a statistically relevant claim.

 

That is why I like small ammo piles as test objects: Seemingly always something in them at 100% loot, so you can be sure there should be a lower limit of 75% finds at 75% loot abundance. It also means that a lot of loot is found making the numbers more significant: Comparing 900 to 800 items says more than comparing 9 to 8 items.

 

Not wanting to dissuade you from doing it, for me building a special POI sounds like less total time, especially if I want to test other things too, like Lucky Looter.

[mr.natural]

....

 

Not wanting to dissuade you from doing it, for me building a special POI sounds like less total time, especially if I want to test other things too, like Lucky Looter.

 

For testing the loot for Ravenhearst they have made such a special POI with all the loot possibilities in rows of 20

[meganoth]

For testing the loot for Ravenhearst they have made such a special POI with all the loot possibilities in rows of 20

 

Nice. Thank you for the info.

[Scyris]

Not so simple. Trashbags and desktops are often empty at 100% as well, desktops also have the non-lootable closed variant that complicates the question what to expect from it.

 

For desktops you also need to search the POIs, sure I could remember for many where the desktop is, but even the remembering takes time if you want to get reasonable numbers. And since desktops are empty a lot at 100% you would need more than 50 to make a statistically relevant claim.

 

That is why I like small ammo piles as test objects: Seemingly always something in them at 100% loot, so you can be sure there should be a lower limit of 75% finds at 75% loot abundance. It also means that a lot of loot is found making the numbers more significant: Comparing 900 to 800 items says more than comparing 9 to 8 items.

 

Not wanting to dissuade you from doing it, for me building a special POI sounds like less total time, especially if I want to test other things too, like Lucky Looter.

 

The the small ammo piles is why I noticed something weird was going on, on 75% loot over 95% of the ones I looted were empty, while at 100% loot every single one pretty much has something in it. Same applies for small med piles, small food piles, cars, boxes etc. For the setting being only 25% less, many of those mentioned loot sources were empty 95% of the time. I was expecting the small ammo piles to always have loot on all loot settings just less of it. Think i'll go back to 100%/default loot abundance for now till they fix it.

[meganoth]

Ok, I made a test now with latest experimental, with 30 small ammo piles looted at 100% and 75%. Results:

 

 

100% had 100% of loot crates filled

75% had 33% of lot crates filled

 

100% had a combined sell value of 722 dukes

75% had a combined sell value of 337 dukes

 

The stacks of ammo seem to be equally high per loot pile (with only 30 loot boxes that assertion is with some uncertainty). If we assume 75% of loot boxes would have be filled the combined sell value would have been 758, pretty similar to 722 dukes, so moneywise this looks ok as well

 

 

In conclusion, there simply are too many empty loot piles, 33% instead of 75%, the rest (loot amount and quality per pile) seems to be ok.

 

I will make a bug report, if not already confirmed the testers can replicate my test setup easily and confirm it

[Maxwar]

Do you have a link to your bug report ?

I tried setting abundance to 75% and noticed the same thing with Cars all being empty.

 

Bird nests are also affected regarding eggs. Egg harvesting is pretty much impossible.

Another major one is the Burried supplies quest from the trader. The chests are all empty now. They used to give a healthy supply of canned food, now they give you nothing but the quest item. That is a major deal breaker

[meganoth]

Link is https://7daystodie.com/forums/showthread.php?134531-A18-2-b2-EXP-bug-thread&p=1063732&viewfull=1#post1063732

 

Eggs are scarce even at 100% loot. But agree to the rest, it makes this setting very hard to use even when you know what to expect.